What happened to all of the doom and gloom economic threads?

[NeverEndingMe]

<<Quote:
Originally Posted by patrick1 View Post
Thanks for the economic analysis.

You are entirely mistaken.

Patrick
oh which part, that Europe is fucked or socialism is a sickness?
__________________
Merc has his head so far up his ass, he can see Russia

Obama is a dick

Merc/cebalrai - > wake up! those are not m&m, leaking from your ass >>

I'm intrigued that you think the remarks in your footer are useful.

1. Europe is going through an economic crisis. I did notice. But it's a wealthy capitalist set of countries, it will get over this, it's not 'fucked'. The eurozone countries got in a mess in trying to have a joint currency without a joint economic policy. So it goes.

2. Is socialiism a sickness? No it's a point of view you strongly disagree with. So it goes. Kindly don't confuse it with Communism or with my own belief, left-libertaranism.

Please don't be rude.

Patrick

where does a pure socialist system operate successfully?

 

[patrick1]

where does a pure socialist system operate successfully?

I'm a left-libertarian myself, not a socialist.

That word 'pure' - what is that there for?

For myself, I think most north American and European countries have a high degree of State capitalism, as I would call it.

The Scandinavian countries are interesting examples of social democracy in action. They enjoy for instance a higher average income, and a much greater life expectancy, than the United States.

Patrick

 

[NeverEndingMe]

I'm a left-libertarian myself, not a socialist.

That word 'pure' - what is that there for?

For myself, I think most north American and European countries have a high degree of State capitalism, as I would call it.

The Scandinavian countries are interesting examples of social democracy in action. They enjoy for instance a higher average income, and a much greater life expectancy, than the United States.

Patrick

one can't compare America to a Scandinavian country. that's like saying this apple taste like an orange. just not the same. we have too many sub cultures and enable too many ill people.

who was it that was trying to tell me how Scandinavian countries kicked our ass...hum, it will come to me

 

[RightField]

I'm a left-libertarian myself, not a socialist.

Patrick

That's like saying you're a right-leaning communist. Makes no sense.

 

[Sean Renaud]

one can't compare America to a Scandinavian country. that's like saying this apple taste like an orange. just not the same. we have too many sub cultures and enable too many ill people.

who was it that was trying to tell me how Scandinavian countries kicked our ass...hum, it will come to me

Of course you can compare America to a Scandinavian country. You can perhaps make an argument that solutions that work for them won't work for us and then give reasons but of course you can compare them.

 

[RightField]

The Scandinavian countries are interesting examples of social democracy in action. They enjoy for instance a higher average income, and a much greater life expectancy, than the United States.

Patrick

Interesting sentiment. Take a closer look though.

 

[NeverEndingMe]

Interesting sentiment. Take a closer look though.

and what's the personal income tax rate over there, isn't it over 60%?

 

[patrick1]

That's like saying you're a right-leaning communist. Makes no sense.

There is a long tradition of left libertarians.

Here's the wiki version of it, not great, but a start: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Left-libertarianism

It's an error by the right to fail to realize the history of libertarianism. But there you go.

Patrick

 

[Disgustipated]

There is a long tradition of left libertarians.

Here's the wiki version of it, not great, but a start: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Left-libertarianism

It's an error by the right to fail to realize the history of libertarianism. But there you go.

Patrick

Rightfield is only educated in things on the Con side. The other idiot you are responding to was educated in a mental hospital.

 

[patrick1]

and what's the personal income tax rate over there, isn't it over 60%?

That's right they pay quite a lot in tax. When they lose their jobs, then, or get old, they get an amazing amount of money. How disgusting is that?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/joepublic/2009/aug/05/scandinavia-recession-welfare-state

But their healthcare systems are much cheaper than the USA's, whose costs are bloated by insurance bureaucrats and the lack of a good primary health care system.

Or at least that's how it looks to me.

Patrick

 

[NeverEndingMe]

That's right they pay quite a lot in tax. When they lose their jobs, then, or get old, they get an amazing amount of money. How disgusting is that?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/joepublic/2009/aug/05/scandinavia-recession-welfare-state

But their healthcare systems are much cheaper than the USA's, whose costs are bloated by insurance bureaucrats and the lack of a good primary health care system.

Or at least that's how it looks to me.

Patrick

I agree with that, that our health system is too top heavy and way too many bureaucrats. this will only get worse under obamacare

 

[NeverEndingMe]

Rightfield is only educated in things on the Con side. The other idiot you are responding to was educated in a mental hospital.

wow, such a little coward you are some day maybe you can grow up to be a real man

 

[patrick1]

I agree with that, that our health system is too top heavy and way too many bureaucrats. this will only get worse under obamacare

Cuba has a better primary health care system than the USA. This was pretty much that they made a virtue of necessity - with a high level of education and zero money!

I have travelled to both Cuba and the USA, been ill in both places, and I would rather be ill in Cuba: they look after you however poor you are, and the medicines are cheap. They do have a slightly higher life expectancy too, but I would need a statistician to tell tell me if this was within a margin of error

I am not a Communist or even a socialist, this is just what I observe.

Patrick

 

[NeverEndingMe]

Cuba has a better primary health care system than the USA. This was pretty much that they made a virtue of necessity - with a high level of education and zero money!

I have travelled to both Cuba and the USA, been ill in both places, and I would rather be ill in Cuba: they look after you however poor you are, and the medicines are cheap. They do have a slightly higher life expectancy too, but I would need a statistician to tell tell me if this was within a margin of error

I am not a Communist or even a socialist, this is just what I observe.

Patrick

and in Cuba they have 1 or 2 hours of power a day. hot water is a luxury

America is one of the few places where one can go from being bankrupt to being a multi millionaire if one is willing to work for it. too many people are not willing to work. they want it handed to them for free.

we need to teach people how to fish, and stop handing out fish that are stolen from others.

 

[patrick1]

and in Cuba they have 1 or 2 hours of power a day. hot water is a luxury

America is one of the few places where one can go from being bankrupt to being a multi millionaire if one is willing to work for it. too many people are not willing to work. they want it handed to them for free.

we need to teach people how to fish, and stop handing out fish that are stolen from others.

1. Do you have evidence for what you're saying about Cuba? I do for what I said about it.

2. I know what you're describing, it's the american dream. I believe the evidence is sadly (because I'm a great admirer of the usa) against it, that the usa has become a place where movement between the social classes is among the lowest in the developed world. Do you have evidence to the contrary?

Patrick

 

[Sean Renaud]

and in Cuba they have 1 or 2 hours of power a day. hot water is a luxury

America is one of the few places where one can go from being bankrupt to being a multi millionaire if one is willing to work for it. too many people are not willing to work. they want it handed to them for free.

we need to teach people how to fish, and stop handing out fish that are stolen from others.

1. Bullshit. They have power just fine and hot water is not a luxury.

2. You can go from being bankrupt to being a millionaire anywhere on the planet. You chances of doing it via work are much higher in Europe than in the United States.

 

[NeverEndingMe]

1. Bullshit. They have power just fine and hot water is not a luxury.

2. You can go from being bankrupt to being a millionaire anywhere on the planet. You chances of doing it via work are much higher in Europe than in the United States.

well Sean, then maybe you need to move to Europe

stop being a quitter

1. Do you have evidence for what you're saying about Cuba? I do for what I said about it.

2. I know what you're describing, it's the american dream. I believe the evidence is sadly (because I'm a great admirer of the usa) against it, that the usa has become a place where movement between the social classes is among the lowest in the developed world. Do you have evidence to the contrary?


Patrick

hello South Florida is Cuba ver 2.0

 

[Sean Renaud]

well Sean, then maybe you need to move to Europe

stop being a quitter





hello South Florida is Cuba ver 2.0

Nah. I'd rather fix this place. I take pride in my home and wouldn't leave just cus it's not perfect, and I'd be damned if I'd leave it in the hands fools who think like you.

 

[Frizzle_Fry]

hot water is not a luxury.

LMFAO in what fantasy world do you live in? Fuck hot water...potable water is a luxury.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

That's like saying you're a right-leaning communist. Makes no sense.

I keep saying that to no avail...

I think he's closer to Anarcho-Syndicalism myself.


Mutualism...

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

We KANT WAIT!!!

NOVEMBER 18, 2011 12:00 A.M.
The Pipeline Sellout
Obama puts politics over nation, again.
Charles Krauthammer, NRO

In 2008, the slogan was “Yes We Can.” For 2011–12, it’s “We Can’t Wait.” What happened in between? Candidate Obama, the vessel into which myriad dreams were poured, met the reality of governance.

His near–$1 trillion stimulus begat a stagnant economy with 9 percent unemployment. His attempt at Wall Street reform left in place a still too-big-to-fail financial system as vulnerable today as when he came into office. His green-energy fantasies yielded Solyndra cronyism and a cap-and-trade regime not even a Democratic Congress would pass.

And now his signature achievement, Obamacare, is headed to the Supreme Court, where it could very well be struck down, just a week after its central element was overwhelmingly repudiated (2–1) by the good burghers of Ohio.

So what do you do when you say you can, but, it turns out, you can’t? Blame the other guy. Charge the Republicans with making governing impossible. Never mind that you had control of the Congress for two-thirds of your current tenure. It’s all the fault of Republican rejectionism.

Hence: “We Can’t Wait.” We can’t wait while they obstruct. We can’t wait while they dither with my jobs bill. Write Congress today! Vote Democrat tomorrow!

We can’t wait. Except for certain exceptions, such as the 1,700-mile trans-U.S. Keystone XL pipeline, carrying Alberta oil to Texas refineries, which would have created thousands of American jobs and increased our energy independence.

For that, we can wait, it seems. President Obama decreed that any decision must wait 12 to 18 months — postponed, by amazing coincidence, until after next year’s election.

Why? Because the pipeline angered Obama’s environmental constituency. But their complaints are risible. Global warming from the extraction of the Alberta tar sands? Canada will extract the oil anyway. If it doesn’t go to us, it will go to China. Net effect on the climate if we don’t take that oil? Zero.

Danger to a major aquifer, which the pipeline traverses? It is already crisscrossed by 25,000 miles of pipeline, enough to circle the Earth. Moreover, the State Department had subjected Keystone to three years of review — the most exhaustive study of any oil pipeline in U.S. history — and twice concluded in voluminous studies that there would be no significant environmental harm.

So what happened? “The administration,” reported the New York Times, “had in recent days been exploring ways to put off the decision until after the presidential election.” Exploring ways to improve the project? Hardly. Exploring ways to get past the election.

Obama’s decision was meant to appease his environmentalists. It’s already working. The president of the National Wildlife Federation told the Washington Post (online edition, November 10) that thousands of environmentalists who were galvanized to protest the pipeline would now support Obama in 2012. Moreover, a source told the Post, Obama campaign officials had concluded that “they do not pick up one vote from approving this project.”

Sure, the pipeline would have produced thousands of truly shovel-ready jobs. Sure, delay could forfeit to China a supremely important strategic asset — a nearby, highly reliable source of energy. But approval was calculated to be a political loss for the president. Easy choice.

It’s hard to think of a more clear-cut case of putting politics over nation. This from a president whose central campaign theme is that Republicans put party over nation, sacrificing country to crass political ends.

Nor is this the first time Obama’s election calendar trumped the national interest:

Obama’s decision to wind down the Afghan surge in September 2012 is militarily inexplicable. It comes during the fighting season. It was recommended by none of his own military commanders. It is explicable only as a talking point for the final days of his reelection campaign.

At the height of the debt-ceiling debate last July, Obama pledged to veto any agreement that was not long term. Definition of long term? By another amazing coincidence, any deal large enough to get him past Election Day (and thus avoid another such crisis next year).

Tuesday it was revealed that last year the administration pressured Solyndra, as it was failing, to delay its planned October 28 announcement of layoffs until November 3 — the day after the midterm election.

A contemporaneous e-mail from a Solyndra investor noted: “Oddly they didn’t give a reason for that date.” The writer was clearly born yesterday. The American voter was not — and (s)he soon gets to decide who really puts party over nation and reelection above all.

We can’t wait.

 

[Wat_Tyler]

I'm feeling doomed, so I have created my stimulus from the failed stimulus of Irene, which bore so much promise, but showed so little delivery.



Some of those jobs weren't fallen-tree ready.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

There is a long tradition of left libertarians.

Here's the wiki version of it, not great, but a start: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Left-libertarianism

It's an error by the right to fail to realize the history of libertarianism. But there you go.

Patrick

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarcho-syndicalism

Note the similarities when you read about "mutualism..."

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

I'm feeling doomed, so I have created my stimulus from the failed stimulus of Irene, which bore so much promise, but showed so little delivery.



Some of those jobs weren't fallen-tree ready.

Shortage of Mexican labor?

Government clerks?

Checks for free?

 

[Wat_Tyler]

Shortage of Mexican labor?

Government clerks?

Checks for free?

Money for nothin' and chicks for free . . . that ain't workin'.



Off for some frolics on an autumnal day. Yellow sun . . . sunshine, sunflowers, sons-of-bitches.



We're not in Kansas any more, Toto.



And I don't miss the rains down in Africa.