What happened to all of the doom and gloom economic threads?

[mercury14]

Did you truly ask that?

Here, I'm not a republican but I'll answer it truthfully, just this one time.

The reason you are told to do your own research is because NO MATTER WHAT A MEMBER OF THE OPPOSITE SIDE SAYS - unless you find your own links and evidence you will indict the source they quoted or used for their information.

This is the main reason I don't bother with most of the "Link Please" and "My Source" people on this site; there is nothing you can say, do, or post if it is from any source other than the blog they favour that they will accept as truth.

Kbate, you're thoroughly confused. Nobody is attacking sources that are legit. In case you haven't noticed, the righties here C&P partisan blogs all day, every day. Sometimes they make a quick point and then a huge C&P, other times they don't even say a thing and all we get is the paste. Often times they're busted plagiarizing as well. From what I know of Sean he's not one that's going to attack a legit source.

It is the weakest form of debate - to argue with links from other people's thinking or writings. "Moody's said in 2009 that this . . ., Well fuck a duck, it's now 2011 and they've since revised their estimates - but hey, back then they said that so it must be the gospel, the only gospel and the final gospel.

Ugh... You're making the critical error of lumping "other people's thinkings (ie American Thinker blogs) with linking professional research from an independent economic firm (such as Moody's or IHS). Not only that but you're setting up a catch-22 where the poster has to back their argument but somehow can't do it with links to evidence. (wtf?)

I agree with you in part - arguing with other people's thinkings and writings from opinion/blog sites (right or left wing) is extremely weak. Look around at who's doing that here though. How many lefties do you see on Lit linking MoveOn.org publications or Michael Moore articles? Virtually none. Now consider how much blog/opinion spam we get from the right.

 

[Frisco_Slug_Esq]

Seeing how somewhere between 48 and 51 percent of Americans (It seems to vary from source to source) are so poor they don't pay taxes I gotta call BS that the poor don't remain poor for two years or more. I mean the idea that sucess is so fleeting in America that bottom half is constantly moving through the upper ranks only to return to the poor or send new poor down sounds like bullshit on its face to me. Doesn't it sound like bullshit to you?

Unless cars, car maintaince (including gas), clothing, rent, food and people maintenence is irresponsible spending you need to rephrase that as: Democrats try to create opportunities for the poor by freeing what little money they have to spend either on starting businesses or at least supporting them.

Even if windmills were dead end (and I'm of mixed feelings) investing in them wouldn't and couldn't make jobs scarce. Investing in people dressing up like Spiderman in the hopes that we could capture the villian Electro and us him to power a city would create jobs. Stupid jobs but jobs for as long as that money held out.

You mean they don't pay income taxes. They do get refunds now on a tax they did not pay. I'm sorry if it sounds like Bullshit, but it is true, but it's not all rags to riches, but more generally from poor to middle class and aside of a few graduates each year, the ranks of the poor are mainly repopulated from the ranks of our youth, who then begin to move up...

Democrats mean well in trying to help other people, but good intentions do not create economic winners, only political winners and they do this from transferring money from where it will be used productively, stripping it of $.40 on the dollar, and then giving it to the unproductive with the realization that it is also bribing the unproductive for future votes and future plunder.

The problem is that the private sector makes bets based on research when it comes to producing jobs and uses its own capital to do so. The government does not bet, it merely picks winners and then steals capital from the private sector to do so, making it more difficult for the private sector to create jobs, infrastructure and wealth.

At the time of my birth, we began placing men into orbit and I witnessed us place a man on the moon. 30 years ago, we launched the shuttle program in order to build a space station and we knew at that time, we would have to have a replacement for the shuttle in 30 years. We have no replacement and our placing personnel on the Space Station is now up to Russia...

That's the story of government enterprise in a nut shell.

 

[Frisco_Slug_Esq]

That's because all of your sources are mainstream sources beholden, and openly so, to the Democrat Party.


Your own government economists refuted the Moody's bit of analysis that you cling so bitterly to in order to escape the reality of what actually occurred as to the "stimulus" which was presaged by all these right-wing blogs which you so wish to dismiss as if none of them had any more understanding of the economy than the reporters who spread the administrations story line as gospel truth. You can continue to claim that you stopped a Depression all you want because its an IF that you think you have proved, but if you study the pattern of the Great Depression and Japan's Lost Decade then you will note a similarity between then and now...

Furthermore, when presented with actual research and reports in contradiction all you did was peruse them for any sentence that you felt impeached them and bolstered your report.

Unemployment went to 9.2% away from the 8% that was promised to the taxpayer in return for a higher limit on our national credit card and now, the authors of that failure are demanding a new higher limit and more taxes and promising a cure to all our problems if we let them continue this irresponsible pattern of behavior.
__________________
Barry Says: I'm puttin' some lipstick on that pig!

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

I'm reading Paul Allen's (Microsoft) autobiography. The process Allen details is almost identical to what the other moguls experienced creating their own empires. Allen and Gates didnt start out rich. Ditto for Hewlett and Packard. Allen estimates that he and Bill Gates averaged about $2 an hour for a few years.

Pretty nearly everybody pays dues for a while, and Democrats dont wanna pay dues.

 

[Frisco_Slug_Esq]

It's not anything that I haven't said repeatedly in my own words, but well-written...

July 9, 2011
Living Bastiat
By Ryan Craig

Like many of you, I have been living through Bastiat's economic arguments, and I would like to relate them here from a personal, rather than philosophical, perspective. This helps make things more tangible, since the best teachable moments are the ones we go through ourselves.

For those of you not up to speed on your dead economists, Frederic Bastiat argued in his "Broken Window" analogy and "That Which is Seen, and That Which is Not Seen" that economic theory must take into account the whole picture, including second- and third-order effects of policy.

For example, the government institutes a tax to pay for a stimulus project. Money is collected, funneled through a bureaucracy, and then doled out to a construction company that will do the work. That is what is seen. What is not seen is where that money was to be spent had it not been taken from the taxpayer in the first place, and the results are often more positive had the money been left alone.

Background

I was raised with a strong work ethic, so I didn't really have a "20s" -- that time in our lives spent partying and experimenting out in the world away from our parents. I graduated high school at seventeen and immediately went to college for a year and a half while working up to three jobs before joining the Army. I eventually made it back to college, earning a B.A. and M.S. I am almost finished with my PhD. I did all of this through marriage and divorce, with kids in tow.

With my work ethic, experience, and education, I have increased my earning potential and moved up some tax brackets. This doesn't mean I am immune from the job market. Far from it. I went through the first eleven months of 2009 without a full-time job. I refused to go on welfare, and I ended up burning through my savings and 401k while working part-time in a menial labor position before finding my current job. This brings us to the present.

Due to a myriad of circumstances, no taxes were withheld from my income for the first six months of 2010. I didn't think much of it because they were withheld in the latter half of the year, and the government always takes out too much. I was also working in a part of the world where people were shooting at me, which means tax exemptions.

It turns out that I did not qualify for those exemptions. Because of this, though due more in part to the fact that I have worked endlessly to better myself and increase my earning potential, I "made too much money" to qualify for tax breaks for interest paid on my house, for child tax credits, for house remodeling, or for any of the other special breaks instituted to lower the burden. My total bill to the IRS was a couple grand under what I had in my recovering savings account. Two-thirds of that amount went to the federal government.

That Which is Seen

The government took that money and threw it into various pots. To be clear, I have no problem funding the legitimate functions of government, such as defense or the court system. It is with the social welfare and redistribution programs that I find fault, because these constitute an irrational form of taxation that punishes the very people who do the right things in life and try to live without being a burden on others.

Some of my money went to pay for a health care program I am not eligible for.

Some went to a retirement program that will not exist by the time I am eligible to retire. Some went to pay for food stamps for people I do not know. Some went to pay for some congressman to upgrade to first class. Some went to the president to fly Air Force One to an official speech and unofficial campaign stop. You get the point.

That Which is Unseen

Before my money was to have been spent, it would have sat in my savings account, where the bank counted it in its total assets. The addition of my money into the bank's system meant that the bank had more capital to loan out to individuals to buy cars and to businesses to expand and hire.

My portfolio was decimated, and my money was supposed to go to invest in a company drilling for oil, a move which would have helped them buy new equipment that would have allowed them to bring more oil to the market, thus helping lower fuel prices for everyone. Some was to go to various tech companies that are producing tomorrow's vehicles, medical devices, and energy sources, extending the human lifespan and making everyday activities cleaner, cheaper, and more efficient -- all while helping ensure that I do not need to depend on others for my retirement.

My roof leaks in places, and my money was supposed to go to a local company to come and replace my shingles. The operation would have employed at least five people directly, to say nothing of the people responsible for producing the shingles and the products used to attach those shingles to my house.

My gutters are rusted in some places and detaching from my house in others, and my money was supposed to go to another local company to replace my gutters. Four people would have been directly hired for this job, with second-order effects reaching the workers who produce the gutters and leaf guards.

Pets and general wear and tear have made my carpets stained and worn, and my money was supposed to go to a local hardware store that sells a specific brand of hardwood flooring. While this is a project I am doing myself, the store is local, and the manufacturing company is American.

If I had bought those goods and put those local professionals to work, all of these people and enterprises would have earned money, which would have resulted in an increase in economic activity and taxable income and events. But they did not get my business. Instead, my money went to pay for the interest on an ever-expanding national debt, for housing vouchers at HUD, and for government lawyers to argue a case in support of a horrible health care law that 26 states have formally rejected.

Whether the argument is at the state or federal level, we are in this economic mess of ours because of a philosophical breakdown. The economic theories espoused and put in practice today by the people we elect are regressive, born of jealousy and envy, and were disproven over a century ago. We will not get out of this mess until an overwhelming majority of the country stands in unison and yells "laissez-nous faire!" With the Tea Party movement and the last election, we are off to a good start.

The American Thinker
__________________
You loot the private sector, strip every dollar of 40¢ for overhead, and then give the other 60¢ to your political base in order to revitalize the looted.

What's not to like about that plan?
A_J, the Stupid

 

[Frisco_Slug_Esq]

merc, do you know how to make a pencil?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zjZObU2703s

 

[Frisco_Slug_Esq]

I'm reading Paul Allen's (Microsoft) autobiography. The process Allen details is almost identical to what the other moguls experienced creating their own empires. Allen and Gates didnt start out rich. Ditto for Hewlett and Packard. Allen estimates that he and Bill Gates averaged about $2 an hour for a few years.

Pretty nearly everybody pays dues for a while, and Democrats dont wanna pay dues.

Another important lesson from so many of our success stories is how few of them finished college.

 

[Frisco_Slug_Esq]

July 9, 2011
California's Newest Job-Killer
By Gary Jason

The job-killing internet sales tax law just signed by Governor Jerry Brown will only accelerate the decline of our most populous state.

Consider the facts. Already, on the recent ranking of states on the basis of their tax climates done by the Tax Foundation, California is almost at the bottom at #49. On the ranking of states for economic freedom done by the Mercatus Center, it stands at a risible #48.

Moreover, as business relocation consultant Joe Vranich reports, California has seen a rapidly increasing business flight. California was averaging one "disinvestment event" (read: a business either relocating an existing facility to or deciding to open a new facility in another state) per week in 2009. Last year it jumped to an average of 3.9 disinvestment events a week. So far this year, this benighted state has seen that average soar to 5.4 a week.

The business exodus is so pronounced that some California state legislators -- accompanied, ironically enough, by the state's Lieutenant Governor Gavin Newsom, the ex-mayor of San Francisco -- recently visited Texas to get some clue as to why so many of California's businesses are fleeing there, as if they didn't know already.
And California's unemployment rate still hovers around 12%, one of the highest in the nation.

In the face of all this, Democrat Governor Jerry Brown and the Democrat-controlled legislature decided to enact a law that would require internet retailers such as Amazon to start collecting and forking over state sales taxes on all internet purchases by Californians.

Now, in 1992, the U.S. Supreme Court ruled (in Quill Corp v. North Dakota) that while states could compel mail-order companies (and, by probable inference, internet companies) to collect sales taxes for a state if, but only if, those companies had a physical presence -- bricks-and-mortar facilities -- within that state.

This ruling, parenthetically, makes fairly good sense. If we view the legitimate purpose of sales taxes on businesses as being to help pay for the police and fire protection those businesses receive for their facilities, then it seems unconscionable to collect taxes from any business that has no facilities in that state.

But the unintended negative consequence then becomes obvious. When a national internet company like Amazon has affiliates in a state, and that state imposes an internet sales tax, the logical thing for the big internet company to do is just to cease doing business with its small affiliates in that state. The small affiliates then either have to move to another state or cut back their operations. Either response costs jobs in the state imposing the internet sales tax.

That is precisely what Amazon did when Illinois passed such a law recently: Amazon ceased doing business with its Illinois affiliates.* And before California passed its similar law, Amazon warned it that it would do the same in the Golden State.

Even knowing all this, the wise solons in Sacramento passed the law anyway, and Governor Brown signed it. The promise is that it will raise $317 million a year in sales tax revenue. But does anyone believe that? When Rhode Island passed such a law, it collected only negligible receipts.

In any case, sure enough, the day after Brown signed the law into effect, Amazon notified its 25,000 affiliates in California -- small businesses, typically sole proprietorships that sell specialty items in part through Amazon -- that it is ceasing all business with them.

Many people stand to lose jobs because of this idiotic move, but (to use Bastiat's phrase) they will be unseen. The guy who has been selling, say, obscure DVDs for a few extra grand a year will either have to move or cut back his own purchases from local retailers. Either way, the state loses jobs. Oh, and that guy will now no longer be paying as much income tax to the state. If he moves, he'll be paying none at all.

The American Thinker


* Keep in mind that a couple of years ago, Illinois slapped a windfall tax on casinos to raise revenue; it did not. Boats undocked and left while others cancelled second shifts to stay under the tax cap. Taxation and regulation change behavior and in this economy, we see capital being sat on due to uncertainty and the fear of the plunder that will occur if success is produced...

 

[Frisco_Slug_Esq]

9.2% — unemployment rate for June.

0.1% — increase since May.

16.2% — underemployment rate for June.

0.4% — increase since May.

8% — conventional wisdom for the maximum allowable unemployment rate to win reelection.

15 — remaining BLS reporting months before Election Day.

255,000 — net jobs that must be created each and every month to reach 8%.

18,000 — net jobs created last month.

44,000 — downward revision to April and May job creation.

3,825,000 — total net jobs needed before Election Day.

2,100,000 — jobs created in the last fifteen months.

11.2% — unemployment rate if the labor participation rate was as high as it was in January, 2009.

290,000 — best monthly net jobs gain during Obama administration.

231,000 — real best gain, minus temporary Census hiring.

14 — months since best monthly gain.

1% — decrease in DJIA in the opening minute of trading, day that jobs figures released.

$1,200,000,000,000 — cost of ARRA “stimulus,” with interest.

1,900,000 — net jobs lost since ARRA was signed.

2 — quantitative easing programs since 2008.

~$2,000,000,000,000 — total of first QE program during Great Recession.

$600,000,000,000 — total of second QE program, just ended.

40% — increase in federal debt since January, 2009.

30% — increase in annual federal spending since January, 2009.

20% — decrease in federal revenues since January, 2009.

12% — decline in value of US dollar since January, 2009.

37% — increase in number of Americans on food stamps since January, 2009.

62% — increase in Misery index since January, 2009.

800 — days since the Senate passed a budget.

1.9% — last quarterly GDP increase.

2.5% — consensus projection for last quarterly GPD increase.

2.7% — official White House projection.

3.0% or better — GDP growth needed to dent unemployment.

3.6% — official White House GDP growth projection for 2012.

2.7% — IMF GDP growth projection for 2012.

30% — federal debt held by public as percentage of GDP, 2005.

60% — federal debt held by public as percentage of GDP, 2010.

180% — federal debt held by public as percentage of GDP, CBO estimate, 2035.

0% — odds of current path being sustainable.



http://pajamasmedia.com/vodkapundit/2011/07/08/the-bistromath-economy/

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Another important lesson from so many of our success stories is how few of them finished college.

Based on my own 8 years of college experience college is a colossal waste of time, money, and effort. I say, invest in something you love to do.

 

[Frisco_Slug_Esq]

Based on my own 8 years of college experience college is a colossal waste of time, money, and effort. I say, invest in something you love to do.

My experience is similar...

I had more doors opened based on being a Marine than I did based on a degree, in fact, I was working programming long before I earned my degree.

 

[Frisco_Slug_Esq]

Could Ratings Firms Become Irrelevant?
By Dunstan Prial
Published July 08, 2011 | FOXBusiness

Europe wants to do what the Dodd-Frank financial reform bill so far has not – curb the influence of the big three credit rating firms.

After issuing a sharp chorus of criticism of Moody’s Investors Service for downgrading Portuguese debt earlier this week, European bankers on Thursday said they would accept Portuguese-backed debt regardless of its rating.

The European Central Bank’s decision to waive a minimum rating required to accept collateral for credit from Portugal is a clear slap at Moody’s, but also at the two other big U.S.-based rating firms, Fitch and Standard & Poor’s.

In effect, Europe is telling the firms that their services may no longer be required.
Germany, seeking to take things a step further, has called for the creation of a European rating agency.

It’s been a long time coming. Criticism of the broad influence wielded by the three firms has grown louder since the financial crisis of 2008. That criticism has now escalated to a full-throated roar in Europe.

“They don’t want to be held hostage by credit rating agencies’ decisions,” said Brian Dolan, chief currency strategist at Forex.com.

The pushback by European bankers is understandable for a couple of reasons. First, there was a widespread perception in Europe that the timing of Moody’s decision to downgrade Portuguese debt only served to exacerbate an already-bad situation.

Furthermore, the decision seemed to confirm suspicions held by many European fiscal decision-makers that the credit firms are harder on European-issued debt than they are on debt issued in the U.S.

“It seems strange that there is not a single rating agency coming from Europe. It shows there may be some bias in the markets when it comes to the evaluation of the specific issues of Europe,” European Commission President Jose Manuel Barroso told reporters shortly after the Moody’s downgrade.

...

To most bond investors, a AAA rating by Moody’s, Fitch’s or Standard & Poor’s is virtually a guarantee that the security is safe.

But they badly misjudged the subprime mortgage market and their critics believe it was no mistake. A lot of evidence suggests the firms knowingly rubber stamped risky securities with their highest ratings because it was profitable to do so.

Dolan said there is legitimate cause to wonder “why anybody should listen to them any more” given their failure to “detect the earlier crisis.”

He said skeptics of the firms point to their business model in which the firms are paid by the very companies whose debt they are rating.

“They get paid by the issuers of debt,” he said. “The ECB views that as a conflict of interest.”

Read more: http://www.foxbusiness.com/industries/2011/07/08/could-ratings-firms-lose-their-clout/#ixzz1Rc4D8Gg3

If you don't like the outcome, then change the rules.

If you don't like the unemployment number, change the measure...

Fiat Economy 101

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

My experience is similar...

I had more doors opened based on being a Marine than I did based on a degree, in fact, I was working programming long before I earned my degree.

I used to work with an old Marine we called SGT ROCK. Jim was 80 years old and so fit he could kick any kids ass. All muscle and hustle. Born in 1900 he went thru WW1, Haiti and Nicaragua, WW2, & Korea. Then did 30 years in construction.

 

[Sean Renaud]

You mean they don't pay income taxes. They do get refunds now on a tax they did not pay. I'm sorry if it sounds like Bullshit, but it is true, but it's not all rags to riches, but more generally from poor to middle class and aside of a few graduates each year, the ranks of the poor are mainly repopulated from the ranks of our youth, who then begin to move up...

Democrats mean well in trying to help other people, but good intentions do not create economic winners, only political winners and they do this from transferring money from where it will be used productively, stripping it of $.40 on the dollar, and then giving it to the unproductive with the realization that it is also bribing the unproductive for future votes and future plunder.

The problem is that the private sector makes bets based on research when it comes to producing jobs and uses its own capital to do so. The government does not bet, it merely picks winners and then steals capital from the private sector to do so, making it more difficult for the private sector to create jobs, infrastructure and wealth.

At the time of my birth, we began placing men into orbit and I witnessed us place a man on the moon. 30 years ago, we launched the shuttle program in order to build a space station and we knew at that time, we would have to have a replacement for the shuttle in 30 years. We have no replacement and our placing personnel on the Space Station is now up to Russia...

That's the story of government enterprise in a nut shell.

Wait. That doesn't sound like bullshit to you? Just right off the bat this doesn't smell right.

 

[Frisco_Slug_Esq]

"The state is that great fiction by which everyone tries to live at the expense of everyone else. ... there is only one remedy: time. People have to learn, through hard experience, the enormous disadvantage there is in plundering one another."

"We know that the number of government jobs has been increasing steadily, and that the number of applicants is increasing still more rapidly than the number of jobs. … Is this scourge about to come to an end? How can we believe it, when we see that public opinion itself wants to have everything done by that fictitious being, the state, which signifies a collection of salaried bureaucrats? … Very soon there will be two or three of these bureaucrats around every Frenchman, one to prevent him from working too much, another to give him an education, a third to furnish him credit, a fourth to interfere with his business transactions, etc., etc. Where will we be led by the illusion that impels us to believe that the state is a person who has an inexhaustible fortune independent of ours?

... under the name of the state the citizens taken collectively are considered as a real being, having its own life, its own wealth, independently of the lives and the wealth of the citizens themselves; and then each addresses this fictitious being, some to obtain from it education, others employment, others credit, others food, etc., etc. Now the state can give nothing to the citizens that it has not first taken from them.
Frédéric Bastiat

 

[Frisco_Slug_Esq]

This touches on how good ideas become harder and harder to implement, especially with protectionism involved (as well as the unintended consequences of grand ideas like the Interstate):

Pyne is also the founder of American Feeder Lines, which he envisions as a fleet of specialized container ships that will move freight on a marine highway from Halifax, Nova Scotia, to Houston, Texas, and several ports in between.

The intermodal, hub-and-spoke systems that would evolve around interconnected ports would ease the strain on highways across the continent, reduce fuel consumption and carbon emissions from long-haul trucking, and create jobs where none before existed.

"This is one business we don't have to invent," Pyne said.

Short-run container transportation has long thrived in Europe and Asia. But in the U.S., the interstate highway system gave rise to a trucking industry so efficient that routes along America's coastline were abandoned.

To restart this industry in the U.S., Pyne must comply with the Jones Act*, which regulates commerce in U.S. waters between U.S. ports. The law requires domestic shipping by American owned, operated and staffed ships. The ships must also be built in the U.S., presenting huge challenges.

Not only are the shipbuilding costs higher in the U.S., but the nation's commercial shipbuilding capabilities have declined since the 1950s. And Pyne has to find ways to ramp them up to build the sophisticated ships his fleet requires.

He'll also face challenges raising hundreds of millions in financing, as well as getting America's companies to change the way they move materials and goods around the country.

But Pyne says he's well on his way. He has taken on partners who understand the shipping business in Europe, including Tobias Koenig, founder of Koenig & Cie., an investment firm that finances ships, and Johannes Bitter-Suermann, former senior vice president at HSH Nordbank in Germany.

Pyne also recently launched a ship that runs between Halifax; Portland, Maine; and Boston, hauling scrap metal. He hopes to show companies how they can lower their transportation costs on American Feeder Lines without sacrificing much on delivery times.

"We think it's the greatest transportation opportunity in the last century," Pyne said.

"I'm drinking my own whiskey, but I've been drinking it long enough to feel comfortable saying that.

"Just think of it as the Long Island Expressway. It just doesn't have any trucks on it."

Perhaps Pyne will go down in history, like Malcom McLean.

Who's Malcom McLean? He developed the metal shipping container in 1956, revolutionized the way cargo is handled around the globe, and died in 2001 with great wealth but in relative obscurity.

"Twenty years from now .. the country will have adopted this," Pyne said. "There will be lots of companies doing it. There will be hundreds of thousands of people .. employed in the business. And, we'll have a much greener footprint because of it.

"Nobody will remember where it started," Pyne said. "It doesn't matter. We just have to get it started."

Read more: http://www.foxbusiness.com/industri...eneur-envisions-marine-highway/#ixzz1Re1Bzt41

Here is the private sector doing the best it can to create jobs.



* Remember the issues this act caused during the BP oil spill. By the way U_D, has that oil surfaced yet?

 

[mercury14]

That's because all of your sources are mainstream sources beholden, and openly so, to the Democrat Party.

Yes all mainstream sources are liberal whipping boys. See how horribly persecuted you are? And if you're persecuted, you can't be blamed.

But no, seriously, you see me linking facts from places like the census bureau, bureau of labor & statistics, etc far more than I link Reuters (OMG LIBERAL REUTERS!). But let's just think about what you're saying here. Left-wing media is liberal. "Mainstream media" is liberal. And right wing media (blogosphere, NRO, Thinker, Heritage, Cato, etc) is what? Judging by your C&P spam from these kinds of sites you're saying that it's quality information, despite these sources' mission statements saying their goal is to promote right-wing ideology.

One of the many things you appear confused about is that your sources aren't news. They're partisan persuasion pieces with the exact value of Glenn Beck's show. Their value is paltry at best. Likewise I will denounce Alam Combs as a news source just as vehemently.

Here's what wise people do: they go out and get their news from multiple sources. Read Fox News articles and then go read about the same story from the Boston Globe. After that, make up your own mind. This is what my undergrad Political Science professor taught me and I've been doing it ever since. It's becoming a bit of a lost art nowadays but that just makes it more important than ever don't you think?

Your own government economists refuted the Moody's bit of analysis that you cling so bitterly to...

Who knows what "my own government economists" means. I didn't know I had any. If you mean Obama's economic team, I couldn't care less about them. They're spinsters just like any administration's crew. That doesn't mean what they have to say should be ignored, just that it should be handled with a very high degree of caution.

... in order to escape the reality of what actually occurred as to the "stimulus" which was presaged by all these right-wing blogs which you so wish to dismiss as if none of them had any more understanding of the economy than the reporters who spread the administrations story line as gospel truth. You can continue to claim that you stopped a Depression all you want because its an IF that you think you have proved, but if you study the pattern of the Great Depression and Japan's Lost Decade then you will note a similarity between then and now...

Your right-wing blogs predict hundreds of things, a large number of which never come true. How much longer will I have to wait before Obama fills his cabinet with black liberation extremists so that these blogs can be right? But it's not like bloggers go back four years later and take responsibility for their failures. Look how often Breitbart is wrong, then when he gets the Wiener story right he sounds like he's being exonerated for his trail of failed predictions.

Furthermore, when presented with actual research and reports in contradiction all you did was peruse them for any sentence that you felt impeached them and bolstered your report.

You presented us with independent research on the stimulus ONE time. Just once. And in its conclusion section in table 13 it showed how the stimulus saved 3-4 million jobs, exceeding the estimates of any research I've even seen. Just what were we supposed to take from that study? I mean... You were complaining that Moody's used an inaccurate process in their analysis that showed 2.7 million jobs were saved - and that your study had a better model (less Keynsian or something). And the model you endorsed said 3-4 million jobs were saved instead of the paltry Moody's figure.

Unemployment went to 9.2% away from the 8% that was promised to the taxpayer in return for a higher limit on our national credit card and now, the authors of that failure are demanding a new higher limit and more taxes and promising a cure to all our problems if we let them continue this irresponsible pattern of behavior.

Yes the Obama administration underestimated the depths of the economic crisis - so did the Bush administration. So did Republicans during the time this 8% figure was given. Shame on them. Chalk it up there with Bush telling the American people that the entire cost of the Iraq war would be $80 billion dollars instead of $2 trillion. Wait, which do you think impacts our debt limit and financial stability more, $2 trillion in military spending pissed away in Iraq or $800 billion in economic investment? (remember $265 billion of which wasn't even spending but tax breaks).

Your own research says that without the stimulus we'd be ~3.5 million jobs smaller and pushing 11% unemployment, not to mention the ripple effect on the economy. Using your own numbers GDP and consumer spending would have been in the shitter right now MUCH more than they already are. Welfare spending would be far higher. The deficit would be far higher with less revenue and more people in dire need.

 

[busybody..]

Link please.

teehee

 

[koalabear]

FREE guns to Mexico. To stimulate the economy. That's called foreign aid.

No, it's called murder. MORON

 

[mercury14]

No, it's called murder. MORON

Free murder. To stimulate the economy.

 

[cebalrai]

Read more: http://www.foxbusiness.com/industri...eneur-envisions-marine-highway/#ixzz1Re1Bzt41

Here is the private sector doing the best it can to create jobs.

The aim of the private sector is not to create jobs.

 

[Frisco_Slug_Esq]

I'm sorry, but my sources cite the same sources you do, I just include the original wrapping while you try to make you analysis look like it's all of your own research.

I have reality and you have models.

I have Praxeology and you have the idea that an economy is a series of inputs and chaotic outputs that will always produce a certain result, which obviously, for all the reasons I have posited, not true, for no one has yet to quantify Human Action.

You could care less about Obama's Economic Team?

lol

 

[Frisco_Slug_Esq]

The aim of the private sector is not to create jobs.

Thank you Professor Mill...

 

[RobDownSouth]

I'm sorry, but my sources cite the same sources you do, I just include the original wrapping while you try to make you analysis look like it's all of your own research.

I have reality and you have models.

I have Praxeology and you have the idea that an economy is a series of inputs and chaotic outputs that will always produce a certain result, which obviously, for all the reasons I have posited, not true, for no one has yet to quantify Human Action.

You could care less about Obama's Economic Team?

lol

Dang AJ, seems like you got everything on your side!

Except facts, of course.

Oh, and math. Let's not forget how much you like denigratin' those pointy-head intellectuals who use "math".

 

[Frisco_Slug_Esq]

Throb thread:
http://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?t=745068

Whose children will you be attacking today?