What can underage characters see/know?

[Senor_Smut]

I have a question about what a 16-year-old character can see or know. This would be a minor character but she would still be an important part of the story. She would never be placed in a sexual situation herself, nor would she be depicted nude, etc. Rather, she would inadvertently see a picture of another (adult) character having sex and immediately flee the scene. She would not be aroused (she'd be mortified and perhaps amused). Her presence isn't vital to the scene but it would require an awkward work-around to not have her be present at the indicated point.

Later, she and and several adult characters would have absolutely vital conversations with her about sexual activity solely between the adult characters -- none of these would be graphic in any way, more along the lines of "Yes X and I are having sex" or "I caught X and Y having sex." The minor character would definitely not want details, but there's kind of no way around those conversations at that level of acknowledgement. There would be deeper discussions of the emotions involved and the consequences, but no sexual details would be discussed.

Are any of those scenes problematic?

 

[TarnishedPenny]

OK, border-line case. I would suggest you PM Laurel and ask. She is the final authority. Good luck.

 

[oggbashan]

On the face of it? No.

If she is 18 or over? Probably OK. At 16? No.

 

[Euphony]

Nope.

Sex as a concept or understanding doesn't exist to any under 18yo in any capacity essentially.

Anything remotely titillating (to the reader) even if not titillating or is wholly grotesque to the character is getting rejected.

If it looks like you are even breaking the spirit of the law, not the letter, they are erring on the side of caution and rejecting it.

Some love to argue for the fringiest of fringe cases but 99.999% of those hypotheticals get rejected (and I wouldn't want to spend time/effort writing a story around it hoping I'm lucky)

Declarative statements with ZERO emotion/interest can bump up right against the line.

"She lost her vicinity couple years ago." "She gave birth to a daughter when she should have been at prom."

These are EDGE cases and HIGHLY subject to context and author's reputation.

But soooooooooooooooooo many authors want the feeling of being special/naughty and craft insane scenarios just to meet that silly ego need and just limbo in under the rules we all agree to by publishing on this site.

The pinnacle being "what if she was actually born 11:59pm. Can I still have her fucking before her actual time of birth tolls?"

Seriously.

That one hurt me it's so try hard and disconnected from any logical narrative need/imperative.

 

[BobbyBrandt]

As others have mentioned, Laurel will, if prodded, consider the context of what the underage person is exposed to and it's actual relevance to the story versus what the author wants it to be.

An underage character can "know" that their parents have sex, and can even have walked in on them doing so. The details of what they saw, heard, smelled, felt, or thought will be your boundary. (There are several stories in LW, as an example, where the cheating parent is outed by a child who walked on on them. I remember one where the quite young daughter told her father something like, "Mommy told Uncle Joe that his pee-pee was bigger than yours.)

 

[Senor_Smut]

I can not include her in the first scene at all. It's awkward, but there's a way. That's the only one with her confronting actual details.

Honestly the other scenes --the discussions -- would have no detail at all, not be "naughty" at all, and would just be discussions of emotions involved and the consequences of two characters being caught.

But honestly I'm not sure the story is right for this site anyway. Literotica has its rules and we all have to respect them.

 

[oggbashan]

I can not include her in the first scene at all. It's awkward, but there's a way. That's the only one with her confronting actual details.

Honestly the other scenes --the discussions -- would have no detail at all, not be "naughty" at all, and would just be discussions of emotions involved and the consequences of two characters being caught.

But honestly I'm not sure the story is right for this site anyway. Literotica has its rules and we all have to respect them.

You are still pushing at the boundaries and are likely to have your story rejected. You postulate too much detail. This thread does not help your case.

 

[Euphony]

Honestly the other scenes --the discussions -- would have no detail at all, not be "naughty" at all, and would just be discussions of emotions involved and the consequences of two characters being caught.

Not implying you would fail this test but keep in mind physical descriptions of sex aren't the only measure of sexual "activity" here for minors.

Some authors wiff on this.

An underage character lusting for a post-sex cuddle could even run afoul if not written very deliberately.

I also offer that length of passage can stumble into territory/spirit of the law.

The edge cases that do work almost always read a nearly unnecessarily passages. Quick in/quick out/quick to move on.

They are that level of demure.

 

[Senor_Smut]

You are still pushing at the boundaries and are likely to have your story rejected. You postulate too much detail. This thread does not help your case.

As I said, the story isn't right for this site so it's irrelevant.

 

[Djmac1031]

Your easiest solution is age her up to 18, or cut the scene.

We don't make the rules here, we just abide by them.

 

[Senor_Smut]

Your easiest solution is age her up to 18, or cut the scene.

We don't make the rules here, we just abide by them.

I can't age her up (she's the little sister of an 18-year-old), and she's so intimately woven into the story that cutting the discussion scenes would necessitate cutting the character. And I could theoretically do that, but the more I think about it, the more roadblocks I see to posting this particular one on Literotica. It fits better on other sites.

 

[Djmac1031]

I can't age her up (she's the little sister of an 18-year-old), and she's so intimately woven into the story that cutting the discussion scenes would necessitate cutting the character. And I could theoretically do that, but the more I think about it, the more roadblocks I see to posting this particular one on Literotica. It fits better on other sites.

I'm sure it's an integral part of your story. Maybe, as others have suggested, reaching out to Laurel will help.

I don't really have much more to offer by way of advice than that myself.

Good luck.

 

[djrip]

I don't know if it will fly or not but it seems like parents should be able to have a birds and bees talk with their child that would be appropriate in a real life non-incestuous normal family, in a story here. Which is what it sounds like you're describing to me. I disagree with others here that that is pushing the boundaries. But I'll defer to them on whether it's likely to be rejected, maybe they have received rejections for similarly innocuous stuff. Or maybe they haven't and are full of it. Who knows? Well, Laurel I guess.

 

[Rob_Royale]

I had my main character (18+) reminisce about lusting for someone since he was 16. It was denied for that alone. No one under 18 can even think in a sexual way.

 

[Senor_Smut]

I'm sure it's an integral part of your story. Maybe, as others have suggested, reaching out to Laurel will help.

I don't really have much more to offer by way of advice than that myself.

Good luck.

Honestly, the more I think about this story...those scenes are not my biggest problem. LOL

Which is fine. Literotica has it's rules. I'm not complaining about them. I wasn't trying to push them by my question, I was just asking how things stood. What I want to write is out-of-bounds, so I won't write it here. No big.

 

[SimonDoom]

I think you've already reached the right conclusion -- it's not the right fit for this site. I don't think it will fly. It sounds like you are making her a point-of-view character, and you want to narrate her discussing sexual matters. Even if it's in a non-sexual way, it probably transgresses the rules.

 

[Voboy]

I just wrote a story with a four-year-old as an integral character/hugely important plot point. You're welcome to read it, OP, but here are the high points:

• The boy never speaks directly, and is never spoken to. He is always on the fringes of every scene in which he appears.
• There is some mild sexual contact and associated ribaldry while I describe the boy playing outside, but he never does anything other than laugh. From outside. Meaning, he is never anywhere near the room where this happens.
• The actual sex begins after the grown-ups leave the house where the boy lives.

The key? The kid is NEVER anywhere near actual penises, nor vaginas, nor flirting adults. Nor is he near any reproductions, images, descriptions, or representations of same. His part of the story is completely divorced from any hint of the story's sexual elements.

That's what you've got to do if you want to post stories here that include kids.

 

[oneagainst]

I've had no issue throughout What We Say In the Dark and its sequel - plenty of kids in there, and integral to character progression since they're talking at school drop-off etc. But they're included in the same way as the furniture: in the background, running around, making noise. You have to expect a milf story to have offspring around, but when it gets adult they're nowhere near. It's a hard limit.

 

[Bramblethorn]

I just wrote a story with a four-year-old as an integral character/hugely important plot point. You're welcome to read it, OP, but here are the high points:

• The boy never speaks directly, and is never spoken to. He is always on the fringes of every scene in which he appears.
• There is some mild sexual contact and associated ribaldry while I describe the boy playing outside, but he never does anything other than laugh. From outside. Meaning, he is never anywhere near the room where this happens.
• The actual sex begins after the grown-ups leave the house where the boy lives.

The key? The kid is NEVER anywhere near actual penises, nor vaginas, nor flirting adults. Nor is he near any reproductions, images, descriptions, or representations of same. His part of the story is completely divorced from any hint of the story's sexual elements.

That's what you've got to do if you want to post stories here that include kids.

FWIW, I think that first point is much less important than the others. There are plenty of "single parent finds romance" stories here where children are significant characters with plenty of dialogue, e.g. GinnyPPC's Catering Girl. Just as long as they're kept away from the sex.

 

[Kumquatqueen]

FWIW, I think that first point is much less important than the others. There are plenty of "single parent finds romance" stories here where children are significant characters with plenty of dialogue, e.g. GinnyPPC's Catering Girl. Just as long as they're kept away from the sex.

There's also plenty of 'counsellors at summer camp' stories where adults get together, often with the help of a kid telling one that the other likes them, but any sexual activity has to be somewhere away from the kids. I wrote one explicitly mentioning that the staff tents were out of earshot from the kids.

It would be helpful if the site rules explicitly said that any thoughts about sex counted as sexual activity for Lit purposes, because that seems to be the main issue people come up against.

 

[BobbyBrandt]

If the intention is to integrate underage characters into erotic scenes, give it up and go someplace else.

If the intention is to create a well written and skillfully crafted erotic story that happens to include underage characters, then it can be done, and has been done here hundreds of times. If you have the time, the ability to consider situations from every angle, and the skills to properly position characters within scenes, don't let the nay-Sayers dissuade you.

 

[oggbashan]

But the story postulated in the OP won't fly on Lit.

 

[BobbyBrandt]

But the story postulated in the OP won't fly on Lit.

I respectfully disagree.

she would inadvertently see a picture of another (adult) character having sex and immediately flee the scene.

As I mentioned previously, almost this exact scenario exists in stories here where a child witnesses one parent cheating on the other and rats them out.

So, just as an example, if the OP had instead said, "she would inadvertently see (name character) being intimate {ABSOLUTELY NO DETAILS OR DESCRIPTIONS} with (another character). When she saw what they were doing, she immediately fled the scene," that context would be similar to what others have already had approved and posted here.

I am not advocating that anyone should attempt to "skirt the rules" regarding restrictions on underage sex on Literotica. I am simply stating that the context in which underage characters are depicted and the scenes involving them can be crafted to fit within the parameters of the rules. I've done it several times, as have others.

 

[BobbyBrandt]

Was the OP's decision to post elsewhere really because his story was "out of bounds", or was he led to believe that through the negative responses to his post?

While I haven't delved into bestiality or necrophilia, as with underage characters in stories, I have successfully written stories here that included elements of "snuff" action in them. Others have done likewise. It isn't always simple, easy, or within the original concept imagined for the scenes, but it can be done.

IMO, I think that we do a disservice to new or existing writers by categorically stating that they can't, under any circumstances write about certain topics. It simply isn't factual to do so and hundreds of stories here offer contrary proof.

Should we encourage them to break the rules or try to find a work around? Definitely not. But, we can encourage them to expand their creativity and broaden their views into possibly developing scenarios that work to tell their tale within the confines of this site's rules.

 

[oggbashan]

We don't have to say no, not in any circumstances, but the story postulated in the OP was a definite no.

Trying to get around the rules appears in too many threads. Yes, it can be done, carefully and sensistively, if the intention is not to tittilate by providing underage sex, but that story wasn't.