Welfare as we knew it...

sweetnpetite

Intellectual snob
Joined
Jan 10, 2003
Posts
9,135
I'm about to go to bed, but I found this article on the topic of welfare:

(It's old, but on a topic that's still important)

http://www.zompist.com/welfare.html

highlights:

Bob Dole thinks things used to be better in this country. When you hear that, bear the above chart in mind. What time exactly would he like to move back to? Perhaps 1950, when the poverty rate was three times higher, the middle class had half the income it does today, and schools and public facilities were racially segregated?

Everybody has an opinion about welfare; few of those opinions are based on any actual acquaintance with the poor. Even academic writers have often had no idea of such basic facts as what percentage of a welfare family's income comes from the government.

One source of trustworthy data is Kathryn Edins' interviews with fifty Cook County welfare mothers in 1988-90. Here's a basic summary of where their money comes from and where it goes.

The most important thing to note is that government aid (here, AFDC plus welfare) covers only about 58% of income. Welfare isn't enough to live on. The rest comes from relatives and friends, resident boyfriends, jobs, and (for some respondents) drug dealing or prostitution. (Only 10% of the respondents availed themselves of the latter opportunity, despite the fact that it was by far the most lucrative work available, paying $40 an hour, compared to $5 for regular jobs and $3 for cash-basis jobs like babysitting.)

Technically, the extra income should have been reported to AFDC, which would have reduced benefits accordingly. It should be obvious why the income is not reported: honesty would leave a family with too little to live on. Caseworkers are generally aware of the unreported income, but are human enough not to press the issue. Their superiors, not to mention prominent economists, are left with the impression that welfare recipients live on nothing but welfare.

Where does the money go? Rent and utilities make up 28% of expenses; food another 26%; the remainder goes for clothing, laundry, household supplies, transportation, furniture, appliances, and the occasional treat.

All the families have a TV. This fact sometimes offends their betters, who are concerned to inflict Puritan morality on other people. Televisions are pretty cheap as entertainment, however; and these families are by no means well off. They aren't driving Cadillacs; only 22% have a car at all. Most live in bad apartments (leaky roofs, cockroaches, plaster falling off the walls, heat and hot water frequently out of order) in bad neighborhoods. A quarter of them have no telephone.

Bottom line: Getting rid of the safety net won't help the poor-- it'll just produce more poor people. We used to have no safety net: things weren't better, but worse, with a third of the population living in povery, and families ruined by the loss of a job, serious illness, old age, or a bank failure.

Why would anyone want to go back to those days? We may get some answer by looking at the evident goal of Dole, Newt, & Co.: the economy of a typical Third World country. (Chile is one of their favorites.) The vast majority of such a country is poor and continually gets poorer; but a tiny minority prospers fantastically. The jet set of Santiago or Lima or São Paulo lives far better than the American middle class, doesn't have to worry about obnoxious labor unions, food safety, or environmental regulations, has the government to themselves, and can set it up so that any significant new wealth created accrues to themselves. (An example: here, any gold you discover under your land is yours. In much of Latin America, it belongs to the state.)

The appeal for the rich is obvious. What baffles me is why they get support from so much of the middle class.
 
Well, I'm pretty glad I live in Germany because over here Social Systems like Welfare are, though declining, pretty brilliant. :)

Snoopy
 
SnoopDog said:
Well, I'm pretty glad I live in Germany because over here Social Systems like Welfare are, though declining, pretty brilliant. :)

Snoopy

how so?


---and you mean to tell me that you would rather live in some other country than the US of A? I thought everybody in the world who wasn't lucky enough to be born in America was literally dying to come here. (sarcasm alert)
 
Last edited:
sweetnpetite said:
how so?


---and you mean to tell me that you would rather live in some other country than the US of A? I thought everybody in the world who wasn't lucky enough to be born in America was literally dying to come here. (sarcasm alert)

Well actually I've never been to the US of A but I guess I'd like to live there. But I know that the states have a lot of problems so I'd rather stay here for a while.

Snoopy
 
sweetnpetite said:

---and you mean to tell me that you would rather live in some other country than the US of A? I thought everybody in the world who wasn't lucky enough to be born in America was literally dying to come here. (sarcasm alert)

That may be true for many countries but isn't true for most European countries. It USED to be true.

Why should we want to live in a country that has Dubya as President and Head of State? We may have Tony Blair but Her Majesty the Queen is Head of State. She doesn't have to rely on pregnant chads.

Our welfare systems though expensive and creaky do just about keep people at a reasonable living standard. Substandard housing is a generally a matter of lifestyle, not Government inaction.

Many of us would like to visit the US but not want to become US citizens. Why should we? We live in democratic countries with a reasonable standard of living and don't have to worry about the 'moral majority' or more weapons in private hands than our armies have.

We may love the US, and some of its citizens, some of its institutions, but we can do that as outsiders.

Og (Brit with a loong history even if one of his ancestors was all for emigration to Newfoundland - we have to have a few nuts on the tree)
 
Last edited:
Well I guess you're right Og.
I personally love most of the US lifestyle. So I guess if I were rich or famous I'd love to move to the US and have a nice place and a house on a sunny beach or a decent home in an american suburb.
But if you're a average or below-average person living in a major city or a complete rural area, I guess it pretty much sucks.
So I'll cut it short and say,
If you make it in the US, it's heaven,
If you don't make it, it's hell.

Snoopy, if that made any sense.
 
SnoopDog said:
I'd love to move to the US and have a nice place and a house on a sunny beach ...

If you make it in the US, it's heaven,
If you don't make it, it's hell.

Snoopy, if that made any sense.

I've got a house overlooking a beach. Sun? Sometimes.

What I'd really like is my relative's house North of Sydney, Australia. A few minutes walk from a surf beach, overlooking an inlet with a National park across the water, a tide filled swimming pool, a jetty for the cruiser and yet small enough to be a weekend cottage. They bought the land in the 1930s and built the house and everything else when building work for the firm was slack.

Current worth? I don't know but it is my idea of heaven. Shame about the sharks in the inlet - sometimes Great Whites.

Jeanne (or Og)
 
yep. And its another democracy. Has good beer too.

Australian parliamentary invective would have Southern Baptists calling down the Wrath of the Lord.

And their Parliament Building has a grass lawn on the roof that the voters can walk over and sheep can graze. Puts politicians into perspective.

Jeanne (or Og)
 
Oh yeah, living on welfare is such a blast.

Especially here in Ontario, when they lowered it 20% for the usual reasons. "They'll spend it on beer. They're all just lazy and have never worked a day in their lives." etc. ad nauseum.

Due to mental illness, I was living on welfare at the time. After I paid rent, I had $90 for everything else. When the rates were lowered, I couldn't even pay rent. I lost the place I had been living in for 15 years.

That did wonders for my mental state.

I didn't end up on the street, but I came damn close.

When the premier (our equvilant of governor) did this, he went out with his cabinet and they treated themselves to $400 meals at an expensive restaurant. The lowered welfare rate was $523 a month for a single guy, $700 and change plus $60 a kid for single mothers.

If you have ever seen pictures of the man I used to call Our Esteemed and Beloved Premier for Life, you can tell he's a man who never missed a meal in his life.
 
Back
Top