We don't have to, we're the phone company.

jfinn

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Joined
Jun 12, 2002
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593
Sorry, I apologize for the length of this rant and it undoubtably belongs on the General Board, but those people scare me ;) and you all are way more sympathetic. Besides I just read Dr. M's thread, Please wait for an important message, and it made me think of this--like I need much of a reminder since I've been living this nightmare for three months--so here goes.

I moved in October. Moving is and always will be a pain in the ass, but this time there was a little extra agony layered on the mix. It started innocently enough. The phone company I'd been using had lousy service (except when it came to getting paid, they were always on top of that) and I thought this would be a good excuse to get a new service. I called around and got some quotes and finally decided to go with AT&T because the price was about average and they promised a hookup in five business days once I placed the order. I also asked about DSL, but was told that regretably, I didn't qualify since my computer apparently didn't meet their high standards even though I have several friends who have equipment that makes mine look like a brand new Lexus and they have DSL.

The only thing was the moving date was pretty fluid because new carpet had to be laid and painting had to be done etc. So I set everything up and then told them I'd call them when I actually knew when I'd need them. The next bit will be easier to understand if I do it like a diary.

October 3rd: finally set the moving date for Oct 10th. I called AT&T, spoke to a nice guy named Mike and gave him the happy news. He said the phone would be on that day.

October 10th: no phone, but too busy to do anything about it. Decided to call after the weekend.

October 13th: called on my cell (Which hasvery limited minutes since I usually don't use it that much.)and spoke to Carrie. Very friendly, said they had the info about where to hook up, but didn't show the order. I told here I'd spoken with Mike and she said she'd put the order in, but since she still couldn't find the original order confirmation, it wouldn't be until Friday the 17th until service would actually start.

October 17th: since I work nights and sleep days it wasn't until 6PM that I tried the phone. No service. No one at the service center either. Their message said call back during regular business hours.

October 20th: called and went through the normal voice mail hell. I wanted to talk to a human, but I was put on hold for so long I gave up and called back through the automated area to see when they had my service scheduled. The computer's voice (Forrest Gump has found his vocation) informed me that my phone was scheduled to be turned on the next day, October 21st. I wondered why the hell it was taking so long, but I still couldn't get through to the service center to talk to a breathing entity. After three tries I gave up.

October 21st: got up at 4:30 just to see if Ma Bell and I were now all set with each other. Dead air. Called again on my cell and was told that sometimes it takes a while for the service to kick in and to wait until after six to see if I was connected. Six came and no phone. Of course the service center was closed by then.

October 22nd: as soon as I got home from work I called AT&T. First I checked the automated service- yes, they had installed my phone service. Except I didn't have a dial tone. I hung up and called back and after twenty minutes of "Your call is important to us..." I talked to Kyle. I think Kyle is the guy on the computer tape. At least he talked as slowly and gave out as much information as that did, which is pretty much zip.

He told me the phone was connected. I told him it wasn't. He said it must be a problem with my inhouse line and that he'd send out a phone repairman. It would only cost me a $135.00. I told him I didn't want to pay $135.00, even if it was spread out over three payments on my bill, and especially since I doubted there was a problem with the inhouse line or any other line since the people who'd just moved had had AT&T and managed to have a dial tone for twelve years. He said it had to be my house because --are you ready for this-- the phone company doesn't make mistakes. He also suggested that since the repairman was going to be coming out anyway, that I might want to consider having some additional wall jacks installed since it would only cost $90.00 a half hour, which he apparently thought was a real steal (so did I, literally) and should be taken advantage of even though this place has jacks in every room including the furnace room in the basement. I decided Kyle was an idiot who needed to be humored and told him I'd get back to him about the repairman and hung up.

I then called another company that had been recommended to me. I was told me they'd love to give me service and at a cheaper rate, but first I needed to be connected by someone else since they didn't do that. I called MCI, whom they'd informed me was the only other company in my area who did hookups and coincidentally my old carrier. They made me go through this huge confession about why I'd left them in the first place, then reluctantly agreed to give me service in "three to four weeks". I put myself on the list, but decided I'd give AT&T another shot in the meantime.

I called them back and this time I got Debbi, I don't know if that's how she spelled it, but I'm betting it is and with a heart instead of dot over the 'i'. Perky is the word that describes this girl. She cooed and gushed and said how frustrating this all must be for me, then she checked and said that yes the computer showed I was all set at 2364 ... This made me pretty perky now too since I live at 2463... Oops, Debbi said. That must be the problem. Yeah, no shit. Especially when I later discovered that there is no 2364.

But Debbi apologized profusely and was so damn sweet I couldn't help but say if they could just come back and fix it I'd forgive and forget. She was thrilled and told me my new install date would be no later than 11AM. On October 27th.

I was puzzled. Why so long since this was obviously a mistake on their part. Debbi sweetly explained that service was rendered on a first come, first serve basis and that meant I'd have to wait five business days. I came back with the logical (I thought) argument that if that were really true, then they should be out in front of my place in the next ten minutes. She laughed. SHE LAUGHED!!!

I suddenly didn't give a shit how sweet she was and let her have it with both barrels. Debbi got real quiet and with what sounded like tears in her voice, told me that was just the way they did things and if I didn't like it I might want to find another company to deal with. She had me and she knew it. I scheduled the service.

October 27th: I was excited. I was sure I was finally getting a phone. At 10AM I picked up the receiver--no dial tone, but it was early. At Noon it was the same. At 1PM, at 2PM, at 3PM... Are you seeing a pattern here? I gave up and went to bed. There was still no phone by the time I left for work.

October 28th: this time I got Chuck. Apparently he'd heard about me, because when I said my name, I could hear the cautious tone creep into his voice (I didn't think I'd been that bad with Debbi.) I told him I still didnt have a working landline. He told me the computer showed I did and that maybe I had problems with my inhouse wiring. It was a good thing Chuck is in a different state. But I took a deep breath and asked him what address had been hooked up. There was some tapping and then he came back on the line and said, 2363. At least they were getting closer.

We went through the same song and dance I'd done the week before with Debbi except this time when he rescheduled me for November 7th I asked to speak to a supervisor--I'd asked before, but apparently not with any conviction because the others had never even responded. Chuck did however. He told me no.

I told him to get off his behind and get me his boss right now. He hung up.

I called back, I never found out the name of this one. I didn't care; I had no intention of talking to her, I wanted to talk to the boss. She transferred me to a Mr. Brown (un huh, sure), he sounded a lot like Kyle. I asked if he was the supervisor of the customer service area and his response was a nebulous, "I'm the person who can help you." which would have been nice--and a first-- if it were really true. We finally agreed, well I insisted and he didn't actually say no, that I'd have my phone by the next day, Thursday at the latest, and that someone from 'that division' would call me back in 24 hours.

October 27th: no one called back.

October 28th: no one called back.

October 29th: I called them and after 45 minutes finally got to 'that division' that was in charge of connecting service. Some guy named Hank looked it up and let me know my phone would be connected no later than November 11. His timing was unfortunate since I'd just gotten home from a really bad night at work and had gotten my butt chewed because my boss had tried to call me on the landline number I'd given him and gotten a this number is not in service notice so being told I was going to have to wait another week was really not a good thing for Hank to be doing right then.

He listened to my rant and then told me I needed to 'lighten up'. I asked to speak to his boss and he told me I didn't need to be rude. I told him I'd tried nice, humor, frustration and none of that had worked so rude seemed to be the next logical step. Apparently he didn't agree because he hung up on me.

I got in my car and went to the library and signed into the internet. Do you know that AT&T must be the only company in the world that doesn't list their officers? They also don't provide a corporate address. I went back home wondering how many minutes I was going to have to pay extra on my cell phone that had now become my only link to the outside world.

November 3rd: I called MCI to find out the exact date I'd be hooked up with them. They said that since I hadn't called back--not that they'd asked me too-- they'd actually not scheduled me for hookup and now it would be 'the end of November' before I could get service. I asked 'Bob' how this could be and his reply was 'Remember that old Lily Tomlin sketch? It's really true." At least he was honest about it.

November 11th: on the off chance that Assholes, Tyrants and Thieves might have actually done what they said they would, I picked up my phone. Nope and since I'm a masochist from way back, I decided to call them one more time. This was when I got my first lucky break in this whole sad tale.

See, I had to look them up in the phone book since I'd deleted them from my cell and torn up they're little welcome letter into teeny, tiny pieces. In the Yellow Pages, AT&T is right after Ameritech and thank the gods, I called the wrong number. Now I'd never bothered with them because I'd been told they weren't a carrier in my area, but just for fun (and because I was desperate) I decided to hang on the line and ask them myself. I talked to Monica. Yes, they serviced my area, yes they could turn on my service, yes, they really did charge ten bucks a month less than MCI and AT&T and they could have the whole thing up and running in two days. And guess what, they did!

I called AT&T and MCI and told them to take their service and shove it. Both of them were so sorry I wasn't going to be their customer, but if I ever changed my mind, I knew where to find them. Uh huh, that's going to happen.

Oh, and another thing about Ameritech. They had DSL, my computer was just fine for it and they were running a special, half price for a year if I kept them as my phone company.

This should have been the end of my tale, but two weeks ago I got a little love note from AT&T and it wasn't a Christmas card. It was a late notice for a bill for $97.00 for 'Services rendered'. Seems like they finally got the right address.

I stuck it in a drawer. Screw 'em, they want to talk about this, let 'em call me.;)

Jayne
 
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It sounds to me like AT&T is closely related to South Western Bell, only my story is 6 months long, still going on, and on my credit... you better call them about that bill... and tell them you got a lawyer. Or better yet, actually get a lawyer, if you care about your credit. I ended up just upping my cell phone plan... I get free long distance, and the bill is only a bit more than the regular phone service, w/o the long distance, so I figure it ends up working out.

Oh, and btw... I didn't laugh at you, but I sure did laugh with you. Cause if you don't laugh, next thing you know, you are flying to Dallas to buy a 12-gauge and take a cab to the corporate headquarters. :D


Happy New Year!!! LOL.
 
Re: Re: We don't have to, we're the phone company.

niteshade said:
It sounds to me like AT&T is closely related to South Western Bell, only my story is 6 months long, still going on, and on my credit... you better call them about that bill... and tell them you got a lawyer. Or better yet, actually get a lawyer, if you care about your credit. I ended up just upping my cell phone plan... I get free long distance, and the bill is only a bit more than the regular phone service, w/o the long distance, so I figure it ends up working out.

Oh, and btw... I didn't laugh at you, but I sure did laugh with you. Cause if you don't laugh, next thing you know, you are flying to Dallas to buy a 12-gauge and take a cab to the corporate headquarters. :D


Happy New Year!!! LOL.

Yikes, six months! Thanks for the advice, I do have 'a lawyer acquaintance' that I can send a copy of a letter to so I can write them and at least pretend I have counsel. Another thing I've found that can help in these kinds of situations is to contact your congressman and tell them the problem. It's amazing what a difference a letter from them can make, at least it used to pump up the blood in the bosses at the insurance company I used to work for and I've been thinking about doing that too. As for the 12-gauge, stuff like this is why I don't have a gun in the house. It would be just too tempting.

Jayne
 
So how has the break-up of the phone company monopoly worked out for you? Is your service better, faster, anbd cheaper now that the government broke them up and stopped regulating?

---dr.M.
 
Re: Re: We don't have to, we're the phone company.

niteshade said:
It sounds to me like AT&T is closely related to South Western Bell, only my story is 6 months long, still going on, and on my credit... you better call them about that bill... and tell them you got a lawyer. Or better yet, actually get a lawyer, if you care about your credit. I ended up just upping my cell phone plan... I get free long distance, and the bill is only a bit more than the regular phone service, w/o the long distance, so I figure it ends up working out.

Oh, and btw... I didn't laugh at you, but I sure did laugh with you. Cause if you don't laugh, next thing you know, you are flying to Dallas to buy a 12-gauge and take a cab to the corporate headquarters. :D


Happy New Year!!! LOL.

You don't need to get a lawyer really. You can call the major credit ratings places and tell them you want to attach a consumer comment to thte complaints the phone co. is sending and that the bill is disputed. In most cases they will not list a disputed bill on your credit report, but even if they do you may attache a consumer complaint and state it's disputed.

In Jfinn's case, since there was never any service connected a simple call to the state Ag's office and a complint with the Public Sevice Commission should clear it all up in a jiffy. The next time any of you have trouble with the phone co just go online, look up your state Public Service Commission and fill out an online complaint. Having worked for verizon I can promise you they hate PSC complaints and will generally do whatever it takes to shut the customer up, no matter how silly.

True Story: I got a PSC complaint work order one time. The woman was complaining because her drop wire looked tackey. I went and checked it out, it was done correctly and while obviously visible over her pristine yard it was a freaking telephone wire. What did she want us to do? How bout Bury it? Sounds rediculous, but I called my supervisor and at first he laughed, but when he saw it was a PSC complaint two hours later CX&M was out with machinery and they burried the wire.

-Colly
 
Oh yeah. You gotta love the phone company. Though I was (prior to reading this thread) convinced that Centel/Sprint was absolutely the worst. (Side-note for drM: Centel wasn't the result of the breakup; this area always had its own little phone company, though I don't know why. It's always had the most appalling customer service. Sprint bought it a while back, and service is even worse now. Something I wouldn't have believed possible.)

I once uttered these words to a "customer service representative" when trying to sort out a billing issue: "So you're telling me that reality has altered in the last month?" At which point my then-husband began making frantic "give me the phone!" motions, since he knew I had just stepped past being reasonable and was on my way to homicidal. ;) I did turn the phone over and stomped around the house wanting to throw things while he attempted to understand Sprint's altered version of reality. They did fix the issue. Eventually. About three months later. Morons.
 
*whipes tears*

jfinn, that's lovely! :rose: :rose: :rose: :rose: :rose: :rose:

Seriously, they were awfully rude hanging up on you. I have a story that is a very distant cousin to yours.

I lived out in the country back then. We only had buses running every second hour, and only until 6pm. (It's still like this out there, only now I live in town and don't have to care about it very often.) On weekends, however, they did have ONE service for us "peasants". We could take a different bus, that took us half way home, and then the driver of the bus would call for a cab to drive us the remaining way home, without it costing any more than what we would pay for going all the way home by bus only. You with me this far?

This one saturday evening, I had been out watching a male striptease show in town, my dad had been to some kind of company party, and together with 3 other people, whom we didn't know, we were going back to the village. The first part went OK, we got half way home, the driver let us off, and said that he had called for a cab, and he hoped it would be there soon. We waited. After 45 minutes, dad borrowed the cellular of one of the guys, and called the bus traffic central. A snobby woman explained that this cab service only existed on nights going on weekend days, ie friday and saturday. It was now 0.20am, Sunday, so they had cancelled the cab.

Dad tried to explain to the woman that she had misunderstood the whole thing. A night going on a weekend day would be a friday night going on a saturday, and a saturday night going on a sunday. If it had been sunday night, going on Monday, she would have been correct, but this was still the night going on Sunday. The woman disagreed, and claimed that since it was already Sunday, there would be no cab. Dad tried to point out to her that it was still night, it was half past midnight, but she cried out that he was being rude, and she hung up in his ear.

Dad just smiled. "Don't worry," he told the rest of us. "That was actually the best thing she could do. Her rudeness has just paid for our trip." He called for a cab, and paid for everyone, and came monday, he called the bus traffic center, asked to speak to the boss, and explained what had happened.

Not only did he get his money back, he also got a written excuse and two free bus tickets.

I'd have liked to sit and listen to the boss telling the woman off for being ignorant of the company rules, for being rude to a costumer, AND for causing them even higher expenses than what sending out the damned cab in the first place would have cost!!!
 
This may not fit on this thread, since you people actually WANT to speak to these people, but short of starting another thread, this must be the place.

I was visiting my Aunt Chloe – a rather cantankerous old broad who has, during the last year moved into a retirement home, where she is making life a challenge for the authorities there.

Halfway through the visit she got a phone call. She picked up and listened for a few seconds, then she spoke a single sentence, smiled – it was actually more like a sneer of superiority – then hung up.

She was so happy that she simply had to tell me about it.

All her life she had been bugged by people calling her on the telephone to make sales pitches, solicit charity, offer new telephonic services, et fecking cetera. Finally, she has hit upon the perfect way to get rid of them,

As soon as she recognizes she is speaking to a tele-marketer, she asks this one question: “Do you realize you are calling a retirement home?”

So far, they have all got off the line as quickly as they can. A few have even apologised for disturbing her. She recommended that I try it myself.

During the past month I have been from home several days, and even when not upon visits, I was not at my dwelling. I had almost forgotten my Aunt Chloe’s advice.

On January 2, I got a call which I was able to identify as a sales pitch, eventually aimed at allowing a salesman through my door to sell me a vacuum cleaner. I have encountered them before. They are harder to shake (politely) than Jehovah’s Witnesses.

I suddenly remembered Aunt Chloe’s magic phrase, and used it. It works like a charm!

My New Year’s Gift to all who need it, courtesy of my Aunt Chloe.
 
Regarding them Jehova's Witnesses people, I heard another advice. Whenever they knock on your door, instead of shutting the door in their face, invite them in, grab a bible, and start discussing all the errors and exaggerations and ambiguieties in it with them. Don't let them answer back more than once or twice/hour.

After about 5 hours of such torture, you won't be buggered again for the rest of your life.

Maybe that would work with the salespeople, too? Instead of listening to their salesrap, put on an old person's voice, and start talking about your made-up grandchildren, your rheumatism, your hemorrhoids (how DO you spell that???), etc, and pretend not to hear them.

They will hang up, and make a note in their papers never to call you again.
 
Flicka, I used to simply say, No habla ingles. Then I started getting Spanish speaking sales reps, so I responded in Russian. Haven't received any Russki calls (yet).

As for Jehovah's people, I just say I'm Roman Catholic and they run like hell.

Perdita
 
What a nightmare. I had a similar situation trying to get the phone company to deal with the fact that my phone stopped working every time it rained. Most of the people I spoke to wanted me to just buy a new phone, but one told me that that cordless phones always stop working in the rain. It took a couple of rainy months to solve the problem.

But the very worst part was at the end of each phone call I made (from a pay phone, in the rain) to COMPLAIN ABOUT THE LOUSY SERVICE, the person would tell me, "Thanks for calling Verizon." Argh.
 
I love this Danish comic strip called Nemi, about a goth-girl with attitude. In this one strip, she got back at the JW's who ran around spreading his evil doctrines, by walking up to him, grinning wickedly, and saying: "Do you believe in the Devil? I'm from the Satanist Worshippers' Church..."

The little Christian maggot ran off like a paycheck...
 
The phone company is definatly bad but get this my mortgage was tranferred to perhaps the worst mortgage company ever
I was origianlly with Wamu ( washington mutual) when my loan was tranferred (w/o 30 days notice) to Emc ( Eqiuty mortgage Corp.) the transfer took effect as of the first of september since the mortgage is due as of the first (not including the 15 day grace period my september payment was already en route to Wamu. I called the aforementioned mortgage company and was told to contact my new servicer. I did so but of course the loan would take until the sixteenth of sept to be loaded into their system. I was advised that for the first sixty days with the new company no credit reporting would take place, an that my september payment would be forwarded to the by Wamu eith no problems. This was the beginning of a horrifying nightmare. I recived "reminder calls everyday to advise that my septembr payment was late but when I returned the calls customer service informed me that my loan was not in the system yet so they couldn't check the payment status nor could they stop the incessant and automated calls. By the 16 my loan was indeed in the system and my payment was made, but the statement that arrived from EMC showed that my full payment had gone on interest including the two thousand I sent as an additional principle payment. SO I was back on the phone in an instant the representative promptly informed me that I had a DSI (Daily simple inerest loan) Which I disputed. She told me to fax my original loan documents to the company and all would be settled and the payment reversed and applied correctly. I did so and also sent another payment with an additional two thousand for additional principle for october. Once again all of the payment went on intrest. I called again and went through the representative advising that I had a DSI loan. I explained to the woman that I would never sign up for a loan where interest accured on the daily basis as it would be almost impossible to pay 30 days from each payment and thereby get my loan paid off in the estimated 20 years. She hung up on me. for four months my pmnt was applied to intrest while my principle remained the same plus the company added some sort of flood insurance on the loan despite my having an escrowed loan. Things are still unresolved and my 8000 dollars additional principle still hasn't been reversed. :mad:
 
destinie21 said:
The phone company is definatly bad but get this my mortgage was tranferred to perhaps the worst mortgage company ever
I was origianlly with Wamu ( washington mutual) when my loan was tranferred (w/o 30 days notice) to Emc ( Eqiuty mortgage Corp.) the transfer took effect as of the first of september since the mortgage is due as of the first (not including the 15 day grace period my september payment was already en route to Wamu. I called the aforementioned mortgage company and was told to contact my new servicer. I did so but of course the loan would take until the sixteenth of sept to be loaded into their system. I was advised that for the first sixty days with the new company no credit reporting would take place, an that my september payment would be forwarded to the by Wamu eith no problems. This was the beginning of a horrifying nightmare. I recived "reminder calls everyday to advise that my septembr payment was late but when I returned the calls customer service informed me that my loan was not in the system yet so they couldn't check the payment status nor could they stop the incessant and automated calls. By the 16 my loan was indeed in the system and my payment was made, but the statement that arrived from EMC showed that my full payment had gone on interest including the two thousand I sent as an additional principle payment. SO I was back on the phone in an instant the representative promptly informed me that I had a DSI (Daily simple inerest loan) Which I disputed. She told me to fax my original loan documents to the company and all would be settled and the payment reversed and applied correctly. I did so and also sent another payment with an additional two thousand for additional principle for october. Once again all of the payment went on intrest. I called again and went through the representative advising that I had a DSI loan. I explained to the woman that I would never sign up for a loan where interest accured on the daily basis as it would be almost impossible to pay 30 days from each payment and thereby get my loan paid off in the estimated 20 years. She hung up on me. for four months my pmnt was applied to intrest while my principle remained the same plus the company added some sort of flood insurance on the loan despite my having an escrowed loan. Things are still unresolved and my 8000 dollars additional principle still hasn't been reversed. :mad:

Get a lawyer Des. Ask about and find a real shark. Applying your overage to interest and not principle is highly illegal. A good lawyer and your payment stubs and original loan documant and you might very well end up owning the company when all is siad and done :)

Goodluck!

-Colly
 
A couple of years ago, me and my then-husband lived together in Uppsala. We applied for and was granted a state-financed conrtibution to our rent. About two years later, when we were divorced, the institution that had given us the money wrote to us and said that they had re-calculated our finances, and come to the conclusion that they had given us too much money. We know owed them 6.000:- SKR.

By law, we now had to pay 50% each - something I found unfair, seeing as we hadn't shared our incomes 50% while we were married (my exhusband was a real scrooge!), but he had the law on his side, so I owed the institution 3.000:- SKR. My ex-husband apparently signed up for a payment plan, but I wrote a letter to them, and explained that I couldn't pay, because I was unemployed and lived on social security. They postponed the whole thing, and sat there like vultures, waiting for me to get a job, so they could jump at me with their sharp bills. (Pun intended.)

2 years ago, I got a job. A part time job at McDonalds... I took all the extra hours I could get, but I still didn't make enough money to pay for the rent, so I had to ask the social office to help me out with what was missing. The institution once again wrote to me, and asked me to pay up, now that I had a job.

I tried to reason with them. I tried to explain to them that yes, I did make 24.000:- SKR a year now, but that still wasn't enough for me to live on, so I had to get help from the social office, who in turn subtracted the 24.000:- from the amount of money that I would have got if I had been unemployed, so in the end, I still had a little less than 7.000:-/month to live on. I couldn't pay my debt. The intelligent and nice people at the institution couldn't understand my logic, and pointed out that I suddenly made 24.000:- more than last year, and they only wanted a measly 3.000:-..? Again, I tried to explain to them that I only had 7.000:-/month, and the only difference in Real Life was that unlike last year, when I got 7.000:- from the social service, and 0:- in salary, I now got 3.000:- from the social service, and 4.000:- in salary. I still couldn't pay my debt, because I had problem making the money last to pay for food, even. Still, they couldn't seem to grasp this, and pointed out that I had a job, I had income..? Not until I sent them an angry letter saying I CAN'T PAY, I HAVE NO MONEY, did they leave me alone.

That is, until last year. By then, my ex-husband had grown tired of paying his debt, and fled the country. The institution then wrote me a letter, basically saying that since he had run away, and they couldn't find him, I would have to pay his part of the debt as well as my own!
My mother stepped in, paid the whole lot, and then managed to get hold of him on the phone to ask for her money back. I donb't know if he has paid her yet, or not.

Funny.

My ex-husband fled to Sweden from Russia to avoid getting put in prison for desertion during war-time.

Now, he better stay in the country where he is now, becuase if he ever comes back to Sweden, his ex-wife is going to hunt him down, drug him, tie him up, and rent him out to gay men, to get that payment out of his ass!!!:mad:
 
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