Vista bad!

linuxgeek

Rogue Scholar
Joined
Feb 1, 2004
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32,718
and here's why: http://badvista.fsf.org/

Microsoft's new Windows Vista operating system is a giant step backward for your freedoms.

Usually, new software enables you to do more with your computer. Vista, though, is designed to restrict what you can do.

Vista enforces new forms of “Digital Rights Management (DRM)”. DRM is more accurately called Digital Restrictions Management, because it is a technology that Big Media and computer companies try to impose on us all, in order to have control over how our computers are used.

Technology security expert Bruce Schneier explains it most concisely:

"Windows Vista includes an array of "features" that you don't want. These features will make your computer less reliable and less secure. They'll make your computer less stable and run slower. They will cause technical support problems. They may even require you to upgrade some of your peripheral hardware and existing software. And these features won't do anything useful. In fact, they're working against you. They're digital rights management (DRM) features built into Vista at the behest of the entertainment industry - And you don't get to refuse them."

DRM gives power to Microsoft and Big Media.
* They decide which programs you can and can't use on your computer
* They decide which features of your computer or software you can use at any given moment
* They force you to install new programs even when you don't want to (and, of course, pay for the privilege)
* They restrict your access to certain programs and even to your own data files

DRM is enforced by technological barriers. You try to do something, and your computer tells you that you can't. To make this effective, your computer has to be constantly monitoring what you are doing. This constant monitoring uses computing power and memory, and is a large part of the reason why Microsoft is telling you that you have to buy new and more powerful hardware in order to run Vista. They want you to buy new hardware not because you need it, but because your computer needs it in order to be more effective at restricting what you do.

Microsoft and other computer companies sometimes refer to these restrictions as “Trusted Computing.” Given that they are designed to make it so that your computer stops trusting you and starts trusting Microsoft, these restrictions are more appropriately called “Treacherous Computing”.

Even when you legally buy Vista, you don't own it.

Windows Vista, like previous versions of Windows, is proprietary software: leased to you under a license that severely restricts how you can use it, and without source code, so nobody but Microsoft can change it or even verify what it really does.

The software is licensed, not sold. This agreement only gives you some rights to use the software. Microsoft reserves all other rights. Unless applicable law gives you more rights despite this limitation, you may use the software only as expressly permitted in this agreement. In doing so, you must comply with any technical limitations in the software that only allow you to use it in certain ways.

To make it even more confusing, different versions of Vista have different licensing restrictions. You can read all of the licenses at http://www.microsoft.com/about/legal/useterms/default.aspx.

It's painful to read the licenses, and this is often why people don't object to them. But if we don't start objecting, we will lose valuable freedoms. Here are some of the ridiculous restrictions you will find in your reading:

* If your copy of Vista came with the purchase of a new computer, that copy of Vista may only be legally used on that machine, forever.
* If you bought Vista in a retail store and installed it on a machine you already owned, you have to completely delete it on that machine before you can install it on another machine.
* You give Microsoft the right, through programs like Windows Defender, to delete programs from your system that it decides are spyware.
* You consent to being spied upon by Microsoft, through the “Windows Genuine Advantage” system. This system tries to identify instances of copying that Microsoft thinks are illegitimate. Unfortunately, a recent study indicated that this system has already screwed up in over 500,000 cases.

Free software like GNU/Linux does not require you to consent to these absurd licensing terms. It is called free software because you are free to make as many copies as you want, and to share it with as many friends as you want. Nobody will be monitoring your actions or falsely calling you a thief.

What you can do to help protect your freedom

What you can do to help protect your freedom

There is a battle underway between those who value freedom, and corporations such as Microsoft who wish to profit by taking that freedom away. DRM and absurd licenses are at the heart of that battle. Please join us on the side of freedom by saying NO not just to Windows Vista and other DRM-enabled products, but to proprietary software in general. Instead, use non-DRM, “free” software such as the GNU/Linux operating system. You can get your work done while ensuring that your rights and freedoms will not be restricted now and into the future.

As more and more of our lives become digital, it is vital that we protect our digital freedoms just like we have always worked to protect our freedom of expression in print and speech.
 
Arg. I can tell that I'm going to have to learn how to actually operate a computer. I can't stand that DRM shit.
 
Makes one almost wish that Apple's O/S could be run on a PC.

Ummm...maybe it does and if so, does it suffer from the same restrictions as Vista?
 
islandman said:
Makes one almost wish that Apple's O/S could be run on a PC.

Ummm...maybe it does and if so, does it suffer from the same restrictions as Vista?
It can be run on a PC. Technically, the hardware is exactly the same now.

I don't know about DRM in OS X.
 
MechaBlade said:
It can be run on a PC. Technically, the hardware is exactly the same now.

I don't know about DRM in OS X.

Does it still need hacks to run on a PC? That was the last thing I heard about the installation scheme.
 
I can see Microsoft wanting to limit single installations, if youhave XP and try to install it on multiple machines, only the first one will be updated etc..., subsequent installations of the same serial code will be rejected.

But them deciding what's to be deleted as spyware etc is just wrong. Microsoft is screwing up bad and people are having to take it in the rear. MacIntosh OS 10.x etc has it's own horrid issues. Try to change the refresh rate of your display. For those who one the all in one style Macs (basically a monitor with everything built into the same case) good luck replacing the display if it should go teats up on ya. At this point I'll stick with my PC with XP, I can still operate it effectively, and if my monitor smokes and goes poof, I can get another one the same day etc... for way less than a Mac display.
 
linuxgeek said:
and here's why: http://badvista.fsf.org/

Microsoft's new Windows Vista operating system is a giant step backward for your freedoms.

Usually, new software enables you to do more with your computer. Vista, though, is designed to restrict what you can do.

Vista enforces new forms of “Digital Rights Management (DRM)”. DRM is more accurately called Digital Restrictions Management, because it is a technology that Big Media and computer companies try to impose on us all, in order to have control over how our computers are used.

Technology security expert Bruce Schneier explains it most concisely:

"Windows Vista includes an array of "features" that you don't want. These features will make your computer less reliable and less secure. They'll make your computer less stable and run slower. They will cause technical support problems. They may even require you to upgrade some of your peripheral hardware and existing software. And these features won't do anything useful. In fact, they're working against you. They're digital rights management (DRM) features built into Vista at the behest of the entertainment industry - And you don't get to refuse them."

DRM gives power to Microsoft and Big Media.
* They decide which programs you can and can't use on your computer
* They decide which features of your computer or software you can use at any given moment
* They force you to install new programs even when you don't want to (and, of course, pay for the privilege)
* They restrict your access to certain programs and even to your own data files

DRM is enforced by technological barriers. You try to do something, and your computer tells you that you can't. To make this effective, your computer has to be constantly monitoring what you are doing. This constant monitoring uses computing power and memory, and is a large part of the reason why Microsoft is telling you that you have to buy new and more powerful hardware in order to run Vista. They want you to buy new hardware not because you need it, but because your computer needs it in order to be more effective at restricting what you do.

Microsoft and other computer companies sometimes refer to these restrictions as “Trusted Computing.” Given that they are designed to make it so that your computer stops trusting you and starts trusting Microsoft, these restrictions are more appropriately called “Treacherous Computing”.

Even when you legally buy Vista, you don't own it.

Windows Vista, like previous versions of Windows, is proprietary software: leased to you under a license that severely restricts how you can use it, and without source code, so nobody but Microsoft can change it or even verify what it really does.

The software is licensed, not sold. This agreement only gives you some rights to use the software. Microsoft reserves all other rights. Unless applicable law gives you more rights despite this limitation, you may use the software only as expressly permitted in this agreement. In doing so, you must comply with any technical limitations in the software that only allow you to use it in certain ways.

To make it even more confusing, different versions of Vista have different licensing restrictions. You can read all of the licenses at http://www.microsoft.com/about/legal/useterms/default.aspx.

It's painful to read the licenses, and this is often why people don't object to them. But if we don't start objecting, we will lose valuable freedoms. Here are some of the ridiculous restrictions you will find in your reading:

* If your copy of Vista came with the purchase of a new computer, that copy of Vista may only be legally used on that machine, forever.
* If you bought Vista in a retail store and installed it on a machine you already owned, you have to completely delete it on that machine before you can install it on another machine.
* You give Microsoft the right, through programs like Windows Defender, to delete programs from your system that it decides are spyware.
* You consent to being spied upon by Microsoft, through the “Windows Genuine Advantage” system. This system tries to identify instances of copying that Microsoft thinks are illegitimate. Unfortunately, a recent study indicated that this system has already screwed up in over 500,000 cases.

Free software like GNU/Linux does not require you to consent to these absurd licensing terms. It is called free software because you are free to make as many copies as you want, and to share it with as many friends as you want. Nobody will be monitoring your actions or falsely calling you a thief.

What you can do to help protect your freedom

What you can do to help protect your freedom

There is a battle underway between those who value freedom, and corporations such as Microsoft who wish to profit by taking that freedom away. DRM and absurd licenses are at the heart of that battle. Please join us on the side of freedom by saying NO not just to Windows Vista and other DRM-enabled products, but to proprietary software in general. Instead, use non-DRM, “free” software such as the GNU/Linux operating system. You can get your work done while ensuring that your rights and freedoms will not be restricted now and into the future.

As more and more of our lives become digital, it is vital that we protect our digital freedoms just like we have always worked to protect our freedom of expression in print and speech.

1. The DRM scheme is under huge fire right now, and wonder what that means for the anti-trust lawsuits that came down the pike before? Does thins simple squelch the ability to compete?

2. As for the EULA, it has always been that way, as you very well know, but I had no idea the license was non-transferrable. It is crazy because what if one box breaks down and you need to install it on another one? Upgrades? That must be a bitch.

I have not gotten the OS yet, and still use XP/Slackware, but am considering OSX now.
 
Wikipedia may have errors and suffer vandalism, but it often is a good starting point for at least references.
 
Joaquin1975 said:
Does it still need hacks to run on a PC? That was the last thing I heard about the installation scheme.
Oh nevermind, it says at the apple website that you need a Macintosh computer. However, since Macs use Pentiums and Mac is built on top of Unix, I'm sure it's not too difficult to get it to run on a PC.

Kain__Thornn said:
For those who one the all in one style Macs (basically a monitor with everything built into the same case) good luck replacing the display if it should go teats up on ya. At this point I'll stick with my PC with XP, I can still operate it effectively, and if my monitor smokes and goes poof, I can get another one the same day etc... for way less than a Mac display.
I love the idea of a computer/monitor together, but this is why I won't get one until Monitors are guaranteed to work for 7 years or so.

linuxgeek said:
I've been there, and I've embarrassingly even seen a presentation on DRM, but that's a lot to read and on my todo list.
 
linuxgeek said:
Wikipedia may have errors and suffer vandalism, but it often is a good starting point for at least references.

Well, yes, it is not the be all end all reference. Google is nice too, haha. Did you hear about the big "scandal" of the dude claiming to have all these degrees and come to find out it was *gasp* not true?

It has to be true. He said it over the Intarwebs. It is always true.
 
MechaBlade said:
It can be run on a PC. Technically, the hardware is exactly the same now.

I don't know about DRM in OS X.

I'll be damned if I pay good money for something that prohibits how I use it. Then again, I have Verizon Wireless and can't walk away from it and still use the same cell I purchased on Cinglular or T-mobile's network.

Sign 'o the times.
 
MechaBlade said:
Oh nevermind, it says at the apple website that you need a Macintosh computer. However, since Macs use Pentiums and Mac is built on top of Unix, I'm sure it's not too difficult to get it to run on a PC.

No, no, do not get me wrong, I was not questioning your earlier statement. I just wondered if the process was easier, is all. If it were, or is, I would run and buy it tomorrow.
 
islandman said:
I'll be damned if I pay good money for something that prohibits how I use it. Then again, I have Verizon Wireless and can't walk away from it and still use the same cell I purchased on Cinglular or T-mobile's network.

Sign 'o the times.

I see more a sign of the times being the cell phones being introduced which run off open source software and having no limitation what software you are allowed to run on them and inovation (hardware & software) is not limited to what the big companies want to give the public.


http://www.tmcnet.com/usubmit/2006/03/10/1447852.htm

http://www.opencellphone.org/index.php?title=Main_Page
 
This is partially why I'm sticking with Windows XP for a long, long time. I wish Microsoft and the government would take the entertainment companies dicks out of their mouths long enough to see just how bad they are screwing over the average consumer. That will never happen though. Big business is just going to buy our government out more and more.
 
MechaBlade said:
Oh nevermind, it says at the apple website that you need a Macintosh computer. However, since Macs use Pentiums and Mac is built on top of Unix, I'm sure it's not too difficult to get it to run on a PC.


I love the idea of a computer/monitor together, but this is why I won't get one until Monitors are guaranteed to work for 7 years or so.


I've been there, and I've embarrassingly even seen a presentation on DRM, but that's a lot to read and on my todo list.


Getting OSx to run on a PC is only slightly less difficult than getting a Microsoft Rep on the phone :)

j/k, it really isnt hard at all, matter of fact there are HOW TO's out there


Getting windows to run on a mac however is a breeze :)

I love my new macbooks :)
 
OscarTheGrouch said:
Getting OSx to run on a PC is only slightly less difficult than getting a Microsoft Rep on the phone :)

j/k, it really isnt hard at all, matter of fact there are HOW TO's out there


Getting windows to run on a mac however is a breeze :)

I love my new macbooks :)

Now I want one.

How hard is getting software for Macs? It is not like you can run to Wal Mart and pick up say Office.

Ow wait, you said win works fine on a mac. Never mind.
 
NoLeafClover7 said:
This is partially why I'm sticking with Windows XP for a long, long time. I wish Microsoft and the government would take the entertainment companies dicks out of their mouths long enough to see just how bad they are screwing over the average consumer. That will never happen though. Big business is just going to buy our government out more and more.

As long as big business is allowed to finance politicians, they will be allowed to stick their dicks where ever they want.
 
linuxgeek said:
As long as big business is allowed to finance politicians, they will be allowed to stick their dicks where ever they want.

Pics please.
 
OscarTheGrouch said:
Getting OSx to run on a PC is only slightly less difficult than getting a Microsoft Rep on the phone :)

j/k, it really isnt hard at all, matter of fact there are HOW TO's out there


Getting windows to run on a mac however is a breeze :)

I love my new macbooks :)


I thought they released an x86 version of OSX or was it that just started putting x86 chips into Mac formfactor?
 
Kain__Thornn said:
I can see Microsoft wanting to limit single installations, if youhave XP and try to install it on multiple machines, only the first one will be updated etc..., subsequent installations of the same serial code will be rejected.

But them deciding what's to be deleted as spyware etc is just wrong. Microsoft is screwing up bad and people are having to take it in the rear.

I would hesitate to say that MS's spyware idea is "wrong". How many PC user's out there have a seperate application that does much the same thing? Those that do require manual intervention seem to mystify many user's so they don't get used or updated.

MS isn't so much wrong as much as it is targeting the lowest common denominator for computer users.

For those of us with a few more skills and knowledge it would be nice if they'd give us an "advanced options" choice that allowed the user to control the application instead of it just taking over.

But, that is the way things are progressing. Beleive it or not, those that know how to deal with spyware and the internal working of an OS are still in a small minority. Some 30% of the woprlds population is able to use a PC. Less than 10% are "advanced users". The people making the PCs and OSs couldn't care less about the power users. Their vision is to remove any excuses from the remaining 70% of the worlds population that aren't already their customers.
 
Joaquin1975 said:
Now I want one.

How hard is getting software for Macs? It is not like you can run to Wal Mart and pick up say Office.

Ow wait, you said win works fine on a mac. Never mind.


Not at walmart- go to comp usa, or your local apple retailer :)

They make Office for the mac. *I* wont pay for it, but thats me. It is a nice product though...

If you have a Mac, join macrumors, and get bootcamp :)
 
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