Using basic terms incorrectly...

[richard_daily]

Anarchism was historically associated very strongly with the labor union movement, as many anarchists saw organized labor as being an ideal tool for the overthrow of the twin evils of the state and capitalism.

Whoops!

 

[BotanyBoy]

anarchism IS egalitarianism.

That's not what the definition says.

Quite the opposite in fact.

That's egalitarianism, dude...

You've seriously just been posting that definition over and over and over, and it proves you wrong. You're just too dense to get it.

Then explain to me how you read this.

Definition of anarchism

1 :a political theory holding all forms of governmental authority to be unnecessary and undesirable and advocating a society based on voluntary cooperation and free association of individuals and groups
2 :the advocacy or practice of anarchistic principles

And read that as egalitarianism??

Because what I read is that it's a political theory holding all forms of governmental authority to be unnecessary and undesirable and advocating a society based on voluntary cooperation and free association of individuals and groups.

you don't understand that social darwinism IS NOT voluntary cooperation. They are diametrically opposed, in fact.

BAAAAAHAHAHAHA!~!!! How is it diametrically opposed?

Voluntary cooperation = people working together.....

That's not diametrically opposed to working together to their own demise or defeat in the face of a superior group.

And pretty fucking far from egalitarianism.

 

[richard_daily]

BAAAAAHAHAHAHA!~!!! How is it diametrically opposed?

Voluntary cooperation = people working together.....

That's not diametrically opposed to working together to their own demise or defeat in the face of a superior group.

And pretty fucking far from egalitarianism.

Here dude...

Anarchy is the condition of a society, entity, group of people, or a single person that rejects hierarchy.

Does capitalism or the right wing reject hierarchy? IF so, show me ANYTHING to prove that. A single source... please. ANYTHING.

 

[BotanyBoy]

So if I decide that I don't want to voluntarily cooperate, the free market ceases to affect me?

Come on dude... you can't be that ignorant.

Yea, it's free bro.....you can participate or fuck right off and do whatever you want under both capitalism and anarchism.

Whoops!

So? LMFAO....

That doesn't make anarchism egalitarianism or even definitively left.

 

[richard_daily]

There are many types and traditions of anarchism, not all of which are mutually exclusive.[24] Anarchist schools of thought can differ fundamentally, supporting anything from extreme individualism to complete collectivism.[15] Strains of anarchism have been divided into the categories of social and individualist anarchism or similar dual classifications.[25][26] Anarchism is often considered to be a radical left-wing ideology,[27][28] and much of anarchist economics and anarchist legal philosophy reflect anti-statist interpretations of communism, collectivism, syndicalism or participatory economics. Some individualist anarchists are also socialists or communists while some anarcho-communists are also individualists[29][30] or egoists.[31][32]

This is BASIC stuff. You can't even get past the first line in wikepedia without your entire argument falling apart.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Here dude...



Does capitalism or the right wing reject hierarchy? IF so, show me ANYTHING to prove that. A single source... please. ANYTHING.

Link to your hugely biased source that's not even remotely close to any of the standard definitions?

 

[richard_daily]

Yea, it's free bro.....you can participate or fuck right off and do whatever you want under both capitalism and anarchism.

If you really believe that, you don't understand capitalism.

 

[richard_daily]

Link to your hugely biased source that's not even remotely close to any of the standard definitions?

I've linked you to dozens of sources, articles, and examples. You haven't refuted a single one, with ANY evidence.

 

[richard_daily]

Capitalism sure looks like a hierarchy to me!

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e8/Pyramid_of_Capitalist_System.jpg/462px-Pyramid_of_Capitalist_System.jpg

 

[BotanyBoy]

This is BASIC stuff. You can't even get past the first line in wikepedia without your entire argument falling apart.

Britannica, Oxford, Cambridge, Dictionary.com, Vocabulary.com, philosophybasics.com, Websters.....all shit on the first sentence on the wiki which was clearly written by someone like you who thinks anarchism is somehow egalitarianism and not the rejection of all government authority.

Can't explain how....

But somehow anarchism really loves government authority as long as it's left wing....because they REALLY mean socialism and communism (egalitarianism). Not that all forms of government authority are unnecessary and undesirable.

LMFAO!!!

You lefties are a riot.

 

[BotanyBoy]

I've linked you to dozens of sources, articles, and examples. You haven't refuted a single one, with ANY evidence.

LOL you only get to say that if you ignore all common dictionaries and Encyclopedia Britannica online.

Capitalism sure looks like a hierarchy to me!

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e8/Pyramid_of_Capitalist_System.jpg/462px-Pyramid_of_Capitalist_System.jpg

That's because you're ignoring the definition of capitalism and chugging the socialist Kool-Aid .

Capitalism =/= rich people being big meanie heads.

 

[richard_daily]

Britannica, Oxford, Cambridge, Dictionary.com, Vocabulary.com, philosphybasics.com, Websters.....all shit on the first sentence on the wiki which was clearly written by someone like you who thinks anarchism is somehow egalitarianism.

Can't explain how, all those definitions somehow don't say rejection/condemnation/anti government authority....because they REALLY mean socialism and communism (egalitarianism).

LMFAO!!!

You lefties are a riot.

No, all of those definitions back me up. You just don't get it.

I've also linked you to dozens of articles, wikis, supported and researched papers, and historical documents, along with providing you with nearly a dozen examples of left wing anarchist uprisings and rebellions. You haven't given me a single source that backs up your claim that anarchy is right wing or comparable with your hierarchical viewpoints.

Anarchy is NON-HIERARCHICAL. Capitalism is HIERARCHICAL. They are diametrically opposed, and all real world examples show that.

Egalitarianism is not socialism or communism. It's leftism. Anarchy falls in there, to a great extent, and to an extent so does socialism, and some strains of communism, depending on if they are hierarchical or egalitarian.

 

[BotanyBoy]

No, all of those definitions back me up. You just don't get it.

No they don't, that's why you can't explain how.

I've also linked you to dozens of articles, wikis, supported and researched papers, and historical documents, along with providing you with nearly a dozen examples of left wing anarchist uprisings and rebellions.

And never made a SINGLE argument of your own.

All you've got is proof some socialist, who want egalitarianism LARP'ed a few times as anarchist because they don't know what the word means.

Anarchy is NON-HIERARCHICAL.

Only in the most unicorn fart induced mind job imaginable. In the real world without government shit gets hierarchical really fucking fast. Like instantly.

Capitalism is HIERARCHICAL.

And in the real world so is anarchism.

They are diametrically opposed, and all real world examples show that.

LMFAO!!! Not a single real world example of egalitarianism or anything close ever happening in the absence of government authority.

Egalitarianism is not socialism or communism.

Never said it was.

Socialism is the primary and really the only tool of the egalitarian.

It's leftism.

Which REQUIRES government authority to do anything other than get put down like a fucking dog in the street. Without government authority to go rob the haves for the have nots and keep the predators in check all that equality goes out the fuckin' window in a heartbeat in favor of dog eat dog.

That's why leftist LOVE socialism and social justice. Equality is not the natural state of things.

Anarchy falls in there, to a great extent.

How? How does lack of government facilitate anything other than free market capitalism and unfettered social darwinism?

 

[richard_daily]

Britannica, Oxford, Cambridge, Dictionary.com, Vocabulary.com, philosophybasics.com, Websters.....all shit on the first sentence on the wiki which was clearly written by someone like you who thinks anarchism is somehow egalitarianism and not the rejection of all government authority.

From Britannica:

he anarchists, for their part, would admit many of Brissot’s points. They deny man-made laws, regard property as a means of tyranny, and believe that crime is merely the product of property and authority.

https://www.britannica.com/topic/anarchism

Websters:

c :a utopian society of individuals who enjoy complete freedom without government

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/anarchy

Utopian:

2 often capitalized :a place of ideal perfection especially in laws, government, and social conditions

(ie, egalitarian)
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/utopia


Collins:

1. the theory that all forms of government interfere unjustly with individual liberty and should be replaced by the voluntary association of cooperative groups

https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/anarchism

Cambridge:

olitics a person who believes in anarchism:
He was a poet, an anarchist, and a vegan.
an anarchist group/slogan/bookshop

http://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/dictionary/english/anarchist


Wordnik:

n. In popular use, one who seeks to overturn by violence all constituted forms and institutions of society and government, all law and order, and all rights of property, with no purpose of establishing any other system of order in the place of that destroyed; especially, such a person when actuated by mere lust of plunder.

https://www.wordnik.com/words/anarchist


Seriously dude, every single source I looked up that you listed proved my point, and disproved yours.

 

[richard_daily]

And in the real world so is anarchism.

Show me one example of this alleged "real world hierarchical anarchism".

A single example.

 

[richard_daily]

How? How does lack of government facilitate anything other than free market capitalism and unfettered social darwinism?

Social Darwinism is a hierarchy. Anarchy is anti-hierarchical by definition.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Seriously dude, every single source I looked up that you listed proved my point, and disproved yours.

No they didn't and you were cherry picking LOL

How does being anti government facilitate egalitarianism in any way?

Very first words in Britannica.

Anarchism, cluster of doctrines and attitudes centred on the belief that government is both harmful and unnecessary.

https://www.britannica.com/topic/anarchism#toc66523

The full definition from-

anarchism
NOUN

mass noun
1Belief in the abolition of all government and the organization of society on a voluntary, cooperative basis without recourse to force or compulsion.
Example sentences
1.1 A political force or movement based on belief in anarchism.

https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/anarchism

Definition of anarchism

1 :a political theory holding all forms of governmental authority to be unnecessary and undesirable and advocating a society based on voluntary cooperation and free association of individuals and groups
2 :the advocacy or practice of anarchistic principles

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/anarchism

 

[richard_daily]

LOL you only get to say that if you ignore all common dictionaries and Encyclopedia Britannica online.

Uh huh... Here's your source:

These words could serve as a model for the denunciations delivered by all opponents of anarchism. The anarchists, for their part, would admit many of Brissot’s points. They deny man-made laws, regard property as a means of tyranny, and believe that crime is merely the product of property and authority.

Does that sound like capitalism?

Godwin also condemns “accumulated property” as a source of power over others and envisions a loose economic system in which people would give and take according to their needs.

Does that sound like capitalism?

The main themes of his work were mutualism, federalism, and the power of the working classes to liberate themselves through organized economic action, an idea later known as “direct action.” By mutualism he meant the organization of society on an egalitarian basis.

Does that sound like capitalism?

He therefore envisioned a society formed of independent peasants and artisans, with factories and utilities run by associations of workers, all united by a system of mutual credit founded on people’s banks.

Does that sound like capitalism?

Although the individualism and nonviolence implicit in Proudhon’s vision have survived in peripheral currents of the anarchist tradition, Bakunin’s stress on collectivism and violent revolutionary action dominated mainstream anarchism from the days of the First International down to the destruction of anarchism as a mass movement at the end of the Spanish Civil War in 1939.

Does that sound like capitalism? (note, the reference to the FAI / CNT which I've shown you a half dozen times now)

Kropotkin developed a variant of anarchist theory known as anarchist communism. Kropotkin and his followers went beyond Bakunin’s collectivism, arguing not only that the means of production should be owned cooperatively but that there should be complete communism in terms of distribution. This theory revived the scheme described in Sir Thomas More’s Utopia (1516),

Does that sound like capitalism?

wait a second... wait a second... this definitely doesn't sound like capitalism:

The anarcho-syndicalists argued that the traditional function of trade unions—to struggle for better wages and working conditions—was not enough. The unions should become militant organizations dedicated to the destruction of capitalism and the state. They should aim to take over factories and utilities, which would then be operated by the workers. In this way the union or syndicate would have a double function—as an organ of struggle within the existing political system and as an organ of administration after the revolution.

https://www.britannica.com/topic/anarchism

Your source dude...

 

[BotanyBoy]

Show me one example of this alleged "real world hierarchical anarchism".

A single example.

Pick a lawless shit hole, there are dozens of them.

Social Darwinism is a hierarchy. Anarchy is anti-hierarchical by definition.

No, anarchy is anti-government by definition.

Definition of anarchism

1 :a political theory holding all forms of governmental authority to be unnecessary and undesirable and advocating a society based on voluntary cooperation and free association of individuals and groups
2 :the advocacy or practice of anarchistic principles

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/anarchism

noun
1.
a doctrine urging the abolition of government or governmental restraint as the indispensable condition for full social and political liberty.
2.
the methods or practices of anarchists, as the use of violence to undermine government.

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/anarchism

Anarchism, cluster of doctrines and attitudes centred on the belief that government is both harmful and unnecessary.

https://www.britannica.com/topic/anarchism

anarchism
NOUN

mass noun
1Belief in the abolition of all government and the organization of society on a voluntary, cooperative basis without recourse to force or compulsion.

https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/anarchism

 

[richard_daily]

No, anarchy is anti-government by definition.

Again, your source:

1 :a person who rebels against any authority, established order, or ruling power

Is that hierarchy?


https://www.britannica.com/topic/anarchism




https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/anarchism[/QUOTE]

 

[BotanyBoy]

Uh huh... Here's your source:


Does that sound like capitalism?


Does that sound like capitalism?


Does that sound like capitalism?


Does that sound like capitalism?


Does that sound like capitalism?

Does that sound like capitalism?

wait a second... wait a second... this definitely doesn't sound like capitalism.

https://www.britannica.com/topic/anarchism

Your source dude...

You're right sounds like a bunch of socialism, none of which would happen without a government authority.

In anarchism, fuck you and your equality I do what I want.

I own all this property, drugs, women, slaves.....what the fuck are you going to do about it?

Kumbyah me?

Go call on your government??

Not very anarchistic of you....

 

[richard_daily]

‘To me, his main point is that the great clash of civilisations is over - socialism (in all its forms, whether sydicalism, anarchism, communism or national socialism or other) has been consigned to irrelevance.’

https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/anarchism

Do you even read your own sources?

 

[richard_daily]

You're right sounds like a bunch of socialism, none of which would happen without a government authority.

In anarchism, fuck you I do what I want, I own all this property, drugs, women, slaves.....what the fuck are you going to do about it? Kumbyah me?

Go call on your government?? Suddenly not an anarchist are we?

Dude, that's your source, describing anarchism.

Here's the link again, in case you're having trouble:


https://www.britannica.com/topic/anarchism

Show me where your source talks about "owning all this property, drugs, women, slaves"...

Let me know when you give up looking.

 

[richard_daily]

Pick a lawless shit hole, there are dozens of them.

I'm not going to do your arguing for you (especially since your position is a fairy tale), stop being lazy. Give me a single example of your "right wing hierarchical anarchy".

One.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Show me where your source talks about "owning all this property, drugs, women, slaves"...

Let me know when you give up looking.

Right in the definition.

Anarchism, cluster of doctrines and attitudes centred on the belief that government is both harmful and unnecessary.

https://www.britannica.com/topic/anarchism

Guess what happens without government authority (anarchism)???

Hint: not egalitarianism or socialism....LMFAO.

That's right...I get to do whatever the fuck I want.

So again, explain to me how anarchism facilitates egalitarianism in any way shape form or fashion outside of a really good acid trip or willfully ignoring the reality of human greed and lust for power.