Understanding scoring?

[lovecraft68]

I want to see you write noir. Well, not SEE you write it, but see the noir you'd write. I want to see what happens when thriller/horror gets hard-boiled. I want to see psychopaths in Chandleresque curtains of rain, stubbing out their cigarettes and making nihilistic remarks.

If it sounds like it couldn't work, consider these Raymond Chandler quotes:

“I was as hollow and empty as the spaces between stars.” – The Long Goodbye

“The plants filled the place, a forest of them, with nasty meaty leaves and stalks like the newly washed fingers of dead men.” – The Big Sleep

“A few locks of dry, white hair clung to his scalp, like wild flowers fighting for life on a bare rock.” – The Big Sleep

“He looked about as inconspicuous as a tarantula on a slice of angel food.” – Farewell, My Lovely

See? It could work. Plunk down one of your psychologically fractured characters in the midst of that and what would you get? A story I'd like to read.

Lit needs a mystery category.

I've thought about it, I flirted with Noir a bit in one of my novels, but it didn't quite have the true grit and awesome euphemisms, I lean towards snarky one liners. Its on my list, right after a bodice ripper romance....okay, that's a joke...seriously.

 

[SimonDoom]

I've thought about it, I flirted with Noir a bit in one of my novels, but it didn't quite have the true grit and awesome euphemisms, I lean towards snarky one liners. Its on my list, right after a bodice ripper romance....okay, that's a joke...seriously.

Try a noir spoof. That's what I did with my sole LW story, BTB Incorporated. Noir is super fun to write, especially if you don't take it seriously.

It's my worst-rated story, by far, but I loved writing it. My favorite paragraph:

He quivered. He'd known what was coming, and he'd had three days to prepare for it, and still he shook like a baby in the hands of a psychotic day care provider.

I know you're good for this, LC.

 

[Enchantment_of_Nyx]

I came across an old file of story beginnings on my computer. They seem to have been mysteries or thrillers. I had forgotten I'd written them. They were GOOD! I wanted to know what happened. I have no idea what I meant to happen in any of them, and it drives me nuts. I must have had something in mind.

 

[lovecraft68]

Try a noir spoof. That's what I did with my sole LW story, BTB Incorporated. Noir is super fun to write, especially if you don't take it seriously.

It's my worst-rated story, by far, but I loved writing it. My favorite paragraph:

He quivered. He'd known what was coming, and he'd had three days to prepare for it, and still he shook like a baby in the hands of a psychotic day care provider.

I know you're good for this, LC.

If I can use "He folded faster than Superman on laundry day" I'll give it a shot

 

[lovecraft68]

I came across an old file of story beginnings on my computer. They seem to have been mysteries or thrillers. I had forgotten I'd written them. They were GOOD! I wanted to know what happened. I have no idea what I meant to happen in any of them, and it drives me nuts. I must have had something in mind.

That sounds frustrating. I have a 'remnant' folder that has random sex scenes fight scenes conversations etc from things I cut out of books or started and lost interest...but I call them 'plug and play' because on occasions I've used them with name changes to go into a WIP.

But nothing should ever go to waste....

 

[Enchantment_of_Nyx]

That sounds frustrating. I have a 'remnant' folder that has random sex scenes fight scenes conversations etc from things I cut out of books or started and lost interest...but I call them 'plug and play' because on occasions I've used them with name changes to go into a WIP.

But nothing should ever go to waste....

Even if I never finished writing them, I just want to know what happened. Like this one:

Henry Morgan winced at the voice on the other end of the line. It had a dry, sandpapered quality that made him crave water. The voice went on, never rising, never falling, eroding his sanity like wind scouring sandstone. Henry wanted to hang up. He wanted to scream. He wouldn’t, though, and the voice’s owner knew he wouldn’t. He couldn’t afford to miss a single desiccated syllable, so he clutched the phone in a white-knuckled grip and forced back the nausea washing through his gut. “Do you understand?” the voice rasped, the question trailing off like the last grains of sand trickling through an hour glass. Henry nodded. Silence rolled out uncomfortably as he waited. Then he realized the voice was waiting. “I understand,” Henry managed. The line went dead.

Whose voice?! I want to know whose voice! I want to know what Mr. Sandpaper said. I'm less interested in who the hell Henry Morgan is. I'm the only one who ever knew, and I don't know it anymore. It drives me up the wall. Most of the fragments are a lot longer, but I still don't know what I intended.

 

[TarnishedPenny]

If anyone can do it with grace and good prose and a thin veneer of artistic plausibility, you can. Go for it!

A thin veneer, Simon? I'm wounded!

 

[SimonDoom]

A thin veneer, Simon? I'm wounded!

I wrote a story called "Penis Fish." Even I'd have trouble making a serious artistic case for "Raft of Penguins."

But don't let me stop you.

 

[ElectricBlue]

Ahem. I'm proud of my penguin collection but it does not deserve to be mentioned in the same breath as Lovecraft's.

I am proud of the fact that I've actually INCLUDED penguins in a story. It took some ingenuity. I don't think even Mr. LC has done that.

"I know, right," said Suzie. "I was so proud of my bro, doing that one. Along with my Daddy Bear tee-shirt entry!"

 

[ElectricBlue]

Even if I never finished writing them, I just want to know what happened. Like this one:

Henry Morgan winced at the voice on the other end of the line. It had a dry, sandpapered quality that made him crave water. The voice went on, never rising, never falling, eroding his sanity like wind scouring sandstone. Henry wanted to hang up. He wanted to scream. He wouldn’t, though, and the voice’s owner knew he wouldn’t. He couldn’t afford to miss a single desiccated syllable, so he clutched the phone in a white-knuckled grip and forced back the nausea washing through his gut. “Do you understand?” the voice rasped, the question trailing off like the last grains of sand trickling through an hour glass. Henry nodded. Silence rolled out uncomfortably as he waited. Then he realized the voice was waiting. “I understand,” Henry managed. The line went dead.

Whose voice?! I want to know whose voice! I want to know what Mr. Sandpaper said. I'm less interested in who the hell Henry Morgan is. I'm the only one who ever knew, and I don't know it anymore. It drives me up the wall. Most of the fragments are a lot longer, but I still don't know what I intended.

There's a story anthology, Nyx, right there - continue this opening. Set it up with Laurel and I'm in.

Cue Nick Cave's Murder Ballads and there's your soundtrack.

 

[lovecraft68]

Even if I never finished writing them, I just want to know what happened. Like this one:

Henry Morgan winced at the voice on the other end of the line. It had a dry, sandpapered quality that made him crave water. The voice went on, never rising, never falling, eroding his sanity like wind scouring sandstone. Henry wanted to hang up. He wanted to scream. He wouldn’t, though, and the voice’s owner knew he wouldn’t. He couldn’t afford to miss a single desiccated syllable, so he clutched the phone in a white-knuckled grip and forced back the nausea washing through his gut. “Do you understand?” the voice rasped, the question trailing off like the last grains of sand trickling through an hour glass. Henry nodded. Silence rolled out uncomfortably as he waited. Then he realized the voice was waiting. “I understand,” Henry managed. The line went dead.

Whose voice?! I want to know whose voice! I want to know what Mr. Sandpaper said. I'm less interested in who the hell Henry Morgan is. I'm the only one who ever knew, and I don't know it anymore. It drives me up the wall. Most of the fragments are a lot longer, but I still don't know what I intended.

Sounds like a call from an ex wife

 

[SimonDoom]

Even if I never finished writing them, I just want to know what happened. Like this one:

Henry Morgan winced at the voice on the other end of the line. It had a dry, sandpapered quality that made him crave water. The voice went on, never rising, never falling, eroding his sanity like wind scouring sandstone. Henry wanted to hang up. He wanted to scream. He wouldn’t, though, and the voice’s owner knew he wouldn’t. He couldn’t afford to miss a single desiccated syllable, so he clutched the phone in a white-knuckled grip and forced back the nausea washing through his gut. “Do you understand?” the voice rasped, the question trailing off like the last grains of sand trickling through an hour glass. Henry nodded. Silence rolled out uncomfortably as he waited. Then he realized the voice was waiting. “I understand,” Henry managed. The line went dead.

Whose voice?! I want to know whose voice! I want to know what Mr. Sandpaper said. I'm less interested in who the hell Henry Morgan is. I'm the only one who ever knew, and I don't know it anymore. It drives me up the wall. Most of the fragments are a lot longer, but I still don't know what I intended.

Henry shuddered at what Mr. Sandpaper had demanded he do: kill Sandpaper's wife. Henry couldn't imagine following through. He wasn't a killer -- not really, unless you counted that time with the baby and the steel brush.

And if he didn't follow through? Sandpaper would kill Henry's wife, Mabel.

He couldn't let that happen. Not to his Mabel. Wife of 20 years. Mother to his three kids.

But the wheels turned in Henry's brain, like rotten eggs flipped over a skillet by a short-order cook that hadn't showered in a week.

Henry thought. Sure, Mabel was his wife, but, after all, her life insurance policy had just been renewed, she'd put on 20 pounds in the last year, and if she served that damned-awful meatloaf for dinner one more time Henry would have to strangle yet another cat.

 

[Enchantment_of_Nyx]

Henry shuddered at what Mr. Sandpaper had demanded he do: kill Sandpaper's wife. Henry couldn't imagine following through. He wasn't a killer -- not really, unless you counted that time with the baby and the steel brush.

And if he didn't follow through? Sandpaper would kill Henry's wife, Mabel.

He couldn't let that happen. Not to his Mabel. Wife of 20 years. Mother to his three kids.

But the wheels turned in Henry's brain, like rotten eggs flipped over a skillet by a short-order cook that hadn't showered in a week.

Henry thought. Sure, Mabel was his wife, but, after all, her life insurance policy had just been renewed, she'd put on 20 pounds in the last year, and if she served that damned-awful meatloaf for dinner one more time Henry would have to strangle yet another cat.

Damn. I didn't know Henry was like that. I hope Mr. Sandpaper does him in.

 

[lovecraft68]

Henry shuddered at what Mr. Sandpaper had demanded he do: kill Sandpaper's wife. Henry couldn't imagine following through. He wasn't a killer -- not really, unless you counted that time with the baby and the steel brush.

And if he didn't follow through? Sandpaper would kill Henry's wife, Mabel.

He couldn't let that happen. Not to his Mabel. Wife of 20 years. Mother to his three kids.

But the wheels turned in Henry's brain, like rotten eggs flipped over a skillet by a short-order cook that hadn't showered in a week.

Henry thought. Sure, Mabel was his wife, but, after all, her life insurance policy had just been renewed, she'd put on 20 pounds in the last year, and if she served that damned-awful meatloaf for dinner one more time Henry would have to strangle yet another cat.

Mabel ended the call and smiled at the voice changer she'd bought at the Halloween store last year. That ten spot was the best money she'd spent since she'd upgraded to the gold membership on adult friend finder.

Good old "Mister Sandpaper" had Henry jumping through her hoops like a fatter uglier, and much slower version of a purebred being put through their paces at an America kennel club show.

Henry may have been a purebred when they'd first met. Sleek, strong, well mannered onn the surface, but never more than a step away from going rabid.

That rabid streak and those pedigree looks was what had attracted Mabel to him in the first place. I mean, what else did he had going for him? The dumb box of rocks was getting extorted into increasing acts of violence by his own wife and didn't know it.

Now that his looks had faded, and he'd gone from a rabid dog to a toothless Lion that's idea of hunting was creeping up on whatever food the zoo keeper put in his bowl, the shine was gone.

Henry complained she'd put on some weight, but his mid section was now as soft as a pile of dog shit after a day of rain.

But yet the fucker had managed to survive every trap she'd laid for him, so he still had more in the tank than she'd thought. Let's see if he could survive this one. Odds are he wouldn't seeing Mr. Sandpapers 'wife' was a former CIA operative turned gun for hire.

If that dried up old turd could get through her, then she'd be hard pressed to come up with another plan.

Hell, even the meatloaf she made using the strangled cats she kept finding in the back yard hadn't killed him yet.

An excerpt from the upcoming anthology "Things LC attempts to write while hung over"

 

[Enchantment_of_Nyx]

Mabel ended the call and smiled at the voice changer she'd bought at the Halloween store last year. That ten spot was the best money she'd spent since she'd upgraded to the gold membership on adult friend finder.

Good old "Mister Sandpaper" had Henry jumping through her hoops like a fatter uglier, and much slower version of a purebred being put through their paces at an America kennel club show.

Henry may have been a purebred when they'd first met. Sleek, strong, well mannered onn the surface, but never more than a step away from going rabid.

That rabid streak and those pedigree looks was what had attracted Mabel to him in the first place. I mean, what else did he had going for him? The dumb box of rocks was getting extorted into increasing acts of violence by his own wife and didn't know it.

Now that his looks had faded, and he'd gone from a rabid dog to a toothless Lion that's idea of hunting was creeping up on whatever food the zoo keeper put in his bowl, the shine was gone.

Henry complained she'd put on some weight, but his mid section was now as soft as a pile of dog shit after a day of rain.

But yet the fucker had managed to survive every trap she'd laid for him, so he still had more in the tank than she'd thought. Let's see if he could survive this one. Odds are he wouldn't seeing Mr. Sandpapers 'wife' was a former CIA operative turned gun for hire.

If that dried up old turd could get through her, then she'd be hard pressed to come up with another plan.

Hell, even the meatloaf she made using the strangled cats she kept finding in the back yard hadn't killed him yet.

An excerpt from the upcoming anthology "Things LC attempts to write while hung over"

I knew you could do justice to a spin on noir. Maybe you just need to drink more. Maybe I just need to drink more. Why doesn't this place have Bloody Marys?

 

[lovecraft68]

I knew you could do justice to a spin on noir. Maybe you just need to drink more. Maybe I just need to drink more. Why doesn't this place have Bloody Marys?

Yes....with extra tobasco and black pepper.

 

[Wannabeauthor]

Troll Control

You guys are excellent noir writers! But, back to scoring for a moment?

I’m pretty new (6 months) to this site and creative writing in general, so I’m not jaded yet and I do watch my scores. I had hoped they would serve as a broad-based reflection of reader opinion. Unfortunately, my stories still have low vote counts and (inexplicably!) a few have scored well, so they are vulnerable to trolling.



In mid-May I had a couple of stories climb onto page 1 in their categories (under “Hall of Fame.”) I don’t recommend this! Within a day or so, a third of my stories, all over 4.75, were trolled with multiple votes of 1 or 2. Others have been trolled since. My latest story was trolled the moment it was posted (presumably by someone “following” me), which seems to have depressed both viewers and (IMHO) the ultimate score. I’m almost certainly not alone; nearly every story on the first page of the E&V Hall of Fame was down-voted to some degree during the same period.



Now the trolled scores will prevail until the next sweep, because as every good troll knows, it takes many 5’s to offset a 1 if the story score starts high enough. A single 1 will knock a 4.85/100 down to 4.81, and another, to a 4.77. Then it takes over fifty consecutive 5’s to recover, so sweeps are the only answer. Unfortunately it’s been almost a month since the last sweep, at least for me. What’s more, the trolls are apparently so highly motivated that they troll again within a day or two, so the trolled scores effectively prevail all the time and views languish.



I’ll survive, and I still like writing, but trolling defeats things the site should want to promote: encouraging the authors who create its free content, giving them accurate feedback, and directing readers to good stories.



The obvious question is, why does the site tolerate such pervasive trolling? Troll defense doesn’t seem that hard. The site could:

· sweep constantly to wear the trolls down (intervals are at least 9 days, in my limited experience, and usually much longer),
· dilute troll scores by more strongly encouraging regular readers to vote (only about 1 in 1,000 seem to vote now, if view counts are accurate),
· allow authors to disable followers, since following probably facilitates those early 1 votes,
· react (perhaps automatically) to reports of trolling submitted via the “Report Story” link, and
· best of all, simply not register scores of less than 50% or 45%, or whatever, of a story score after a threshold number of votes has been cast.

None of these measures seems conceptually difficult. Why isn’t there more action on trolls? Is anyone else mildly annoyed?

Under the circumstances, this post is not from my author account.

 

[KeithD]

I haven't looked at the Hall of Fame lists for years. I don't feel deprived.

 

[Enchantment_of_Nyx]

You guys are excellent noir writers! But, back to scoring for a moment?

I’m pretty new (6 months) to this site and creative writing in general, so I’m not jaded yet and I do watch my scores. I had hoped they would serve as a broad-based reflection of reader opinion. Unfortunately, my stories still have low vote counts and (inexplicably!) a few have scored well, so they are vulnerable to trolling.



In mid-May I had a couple of stories climb onto page 1 in their categories (under “Hall of Fame.”) I don’t recommend this! Within a day or so, a third of my stories, all over 4.75, were trolled with multiple votes of 1 or 2. Others have been trolled since. My latest story was trolled the moment it was posted (presumably by someone “following” me), which seems to have depressed both viewers and (IMHO) the ultimate score. I’m almost certainly not alone; nearly every story on the first page of the E&V Hall of Fame was down-voted to some degree during the same period.



Now the trolled scores will prevail until the next sweep, because as every good troll knows, it takes many 5’s to offset a 1 if the story score starts high enough. A single 1 will knock a 4.85/100 down to 4.81, and another, to a 4.77. Then it takes over fifty consecutive 5’s to recover, so sweeps are the only answer. Unfortunately it’s been almost a month since the last sweep, at least for me. What’s more, the trolls are apparently so highly motivated that they troll again within a day or two, so the trolled scores effectively prevail all the time and views languish.



I’ll survive, and I still like writing, but trolling defeats things the site should want to promote: encouraging the authors who create its free content, giving them accurate feedback, and directing readers to good stories.



The obvious question is, why does the site tolerate such pervasive trolling? Troll defense doesn’t seem that hard. The site could:

· sweep constantly to wear the trolls down (intervals are at least 9 days, in my limited experience, and usually much longer),
· dilute troll scores by more strongly encouraging regular readers to vote (only about 1 in 1,000 seem to vote now, if view counts are accurate),
· allow authors to disable followers, since following probably facilitates those early 1 votes,
· react (perhaps automatically) to reports of trolling submitted via the “Report Story” link, and
· best of all, simply not register scores of less than 50% or 45%, or whatever, of a story score after a threshold number of votes has been cast.

None of these measures seems conceptually difficult. Why isn’t there more action on trolls? Is anyone else mildly annoyed?

Under the circumstances, this post is not from my author account.

I had the same experience in April. It was frustrating. Being the top of your favorite category is pretty flattering. But it was only frustrating for a little while. Easy come, easy go, right? If you think about it, even landing in the top spot isn't just a matter of good writing. It involves all sorts of other factors, like when your story lands relative to site traffic and whether happy readers or trolls leave the initial scores. I'm not downplaying your success. You didn't get there without doing good work. All I mean to suggest is that there is plenty of chance that goes into the process whether you are moving up or moving down in the ratings. There's also the effect the trolls are having on similarly positioned writers to consider.

I was puzzled about how it happened for much longer than I felt disappointed. I'm still somewhat puzzled by things that don't seem to make sense in scoring. Personally, I'm going to continue to figure things out where I can, but I'm not going to hurt my head over it and I'm not going to let myself get a persecution complex.

I think plenty of people are upset or frustrated about real and perceived faults with the scoring system. We don't actually know what is being done to maintain integrity or what might be possible to be done in addition. I wish more readers would vote, but I don't know how the site could make that happen. I'm not sure I understood the part about not recording votes below 50 percent once a story reaches a threshold number of votes. Wouldn't that completely skew the scoring? I think it would definitely discourage voting. The thing is, it's all academic. It's not something we can change.

Since we can't change the circumstances, we are left to decide our reaction to them. That's my take on it, anyway.

 

[RejectReality]

Just keep writing and posting. Eventually, you'll build up enough readers to offset the trolls — even on the toplists. You may not be able to hold a high position on them, but you'll have enough votes that by the time the troll onslaught stops, your score won't have bottomed out. Instead, you'll be just outside what the trolls consider the "threat zone" to whomever they're boosting.

Then the sweeps will run, you'll pop back up, and get bombed right back down again. It's a frustrating, seemingly impossible situation, but every time you're on there — however briefly — you'll attract new eyes and votes.

The more votes you get, the harder the trolls have to work, and the more likely it is that they'll make a mistake that exposes them to the sweeps, keeping you on there longer, and providing even more padding against their attacks.

As to putting controls in place... The best you can do is block the casuals. The truly dedicated and knowledgeable trolls will find a way around every measure you put in place to attempt to prevent troll voting before it happens. You reach a point sooner rather than later that legitimate users are far more inconvenienced than the jackasses.

Blocking followers would be a very bad idea, if it was possible. Yes, people may be using it as a trolling radar, but regular readers are also getting alerts every time you post a new story, and there will always be more of them. That is your best chance to get early votes from your fans to get an early H and attract new readers.

You guys are excellent noir writers! But, back to scoring for a moment?

I’m pretty new (6 months) to this site and creative writing in general, so I’m not jaded yet and I do watch my scores. I had hoped they would serve as a broad-based reflection of reader opinion. Unfortunately, my stories still have low vote counts and (inexplicably!) a few have scored well, so they are vulnerable to trolling.



In mid-May I had a couple of stories climb onto page 1 in their categories (under “Hall of Fame.”) I don’t recommend this! Within a day or so, a third of my stories, all over 4.75, were trolled with multiple votes of 1 or 2. Others have been trolled since. My latest story was trolled the moment it was posted (presumably by someone “following” me), which seems to have depressed both viewers and (IMHO) the ultimate score. I’m almost certainly not alone; nearly every story on the first page of the E&V Hall of Fame was down-voted to some degree during the same period.



Now the trolled scores will prevail until the next sweep, because as every good troll knows, it takes many 5’s to offset a 1 if the story score starts high enough. A single 1 will knock a 4.85/100 down to 4.81, and another, to a 4.77. Then it takes over fifty consecutive 5’s to recover, so sweeps are the only answer. Unfortunately it’s been almost a month since the last sweep, at least for me. What’s more, the trolls are apparently so highly motivated that they troll again within a day or two, so the trolled scores effectively prevail all the time and views languish.



I’ll survive, and I still like writing, but trolling defeats things the site should want to promote: encouraging the authors who create its free content, giving them accurate feedback, and directing readers to good stories.



The obvious question is, why does the site tolerate such pervasive trolling? Troll defense doesn’t seem that hard. The site could:

· sweep constantly to wear the trolls down (intervals are at least 9 days, in my limited experience, and usually much longer),
· dilute troll scores by more strongly encouraging regular readers to vote (only about 1 in 1,000 seem to vote now, if view counts are accurate),
· allow authors to disable followers, since following probably facilitates those early 1 votes,
· react (perhaps automatically) to reports of trolling submitted via the “Report Story” link, and
· best of all, simply not register scores of less than 50% or 45%, or whatever, of a story score after a threshold number of votes has been cast.

None of these measures seems conceptually difficult. Why isn’t there more action on trolls? Is anyone else mildly annoyed?

Under the circumstances, this post is not from my author account.

 

[Wannabeauthor]

Troll control

After couple of days, I think it’s fair to summarize the advice here as “relax and enjoy it.” That may well be the only practical course for us authors. But:

This site presents an unparalleled opportunity to get broad-based, near-instantaneous feedback from thousands of readers within a few days, which is amazing. True, the meaning of a rating is uncertain – the readers are, I’m sure, all over the place in terms of background and interests, and they may be rating style or plot or just whether they get off. But still, amazing feedback – ruined by trolls.

The site is otherwise pretty well run, don’t you think? Why let this one major flaw persist? Especially when better defense seems so easy, unless there are big technical issues I can’t appreciate at my level of expertise. Maybe the whole site runs on Atari and sweeps are done by hand! Nyx (if I may call you that), my final idea was simply not to register votes that are too far below a wide consensus; for example, don’t count 1’s or 2’s if 100 or more other votes average 4.8 or better (supply your own parameters). Throwing out the highs and lows is common in statistics. Yes, all higher scores may rise, but this isn’t a competition, and at least the scores will mean something.

I’m at the point of considering the possibility that turmoil in the Hall of Fame is tolerated intentionally, to keep it fresh and increase site visits.

I’ve whined to Laurel about this a couple of times. It is the only topic on which I have received no response. I’m going to continue whining, politely. I hope anyone else who thinks un-redressed trolling is annoying and preventable will follow suit.

 

[Enchantment_of_Nyx]

After couple of days, I think it’s fair to summarize the advice here as “relax and enjoy it.” That may well be the only practical course for us authors. But:

This site presents an unparalleled opportunity to get broad-based, near-instantaneous feedback from thousands of readers within a few days, which is amazing. True, the meaning of a rating is uncertain – the readers are, I’m sure, all over the place in terms of background and interests, and they may be rating style or plot or just whether they get off. But still, amazing feedback – ruined by trolls.

The site is otherwise pretty well run, don’t you think? Why let this one major flaw persist? Especially when better defense seems so easy, unless there are big technical issues I can’t appreciate at my level of expertise. Maybe the whole site runs on Atari and sweeps are done by hand! Nyx (if I may call you that), my final idea was simply not to register votes that are too far below a wide consensus; for example, don’t count 1’s or 2’s if 100 or more other votes average 4.8 or better (supply your own parameters). Throwing out the highs and lows is common in statistics. Yes, all higher scores may rise, but this isn’t a competition, and at least the scores will mean something.

I’m at the point of considering the possibility that turmoil in the Hall of Fame is tolerated intentionally, to keep it fresh and increase site visits.

I’ve whined to Laurel about this a couple of times. It is the only topic on which I have received no response. I’m going to continue whining, politely. I hope anyone else who thinks un-redressed trolling is annoying and preventable will follow suit.

I assume an algorithm that throws out high and low scores is part of the sweeps process. It would have to be done periodically. If it were done as votes came in, scores would be artificially near-frozen.

When a story goes to the top of the lists, it is subjected to a different readership who may have different standards than the readers who check out the "New Stories" list. One group is specifically looking for something at what they deem a high level, while the other group is looking for new material and hoping for good stuff. A Top List reader is comparing the stories to similarly ranked stories. A New Stories List reader is comparing them stories to everything that comes in. It's to be expected that the scores are going to go down when they hit the Top Lists, with or without the assistance of the troll brigade.

So, when stories hit 100 votes, it really needs to be subjected to that second tier of reader votes without having those votes discounted. Once a few weeks have passed, there should be enough voting to allow the algorithm to discount the outliers that have accumulated without holding a story in a range that isn't supported by the votes of the new tier of readers. That, I assume, is part of what sweeps do. I don't know that for a fact. It's the most logical way it could be done, though. .