Unauthorised editing

[jsmiam]

Whether new arrivals outnumber the departed’s or not, I can’t say. But there are departed’s whose pleas for help go unanswered every day. There are people in pending hell to this day. There People not getting emails from Literotica to this day.

I said something that in a rare moment feels as if had to have been heard. So I feel it was hugely helpful. Some disagree, and that’s fine.

The chosen ones who Laurel has historically spoken through (while mostly saying nothing herself) may feel a sense of loss. If Laurel really started communicating more, some chosen ones might feel less important. Is that a factor in the more staunch defenses? I can’t say.

But things needed to be said. Laurel got tons of support along with some direct feedback, I’m hoping she’ll find the positive feedback intoxicating. Something as simple as direct communication is (to a degree) all we (and that includes me) are asking for.

There’s been a Henry Ford “they can have any color they want as long as it’s black” vibe here. Why let customers leave when you’re the top site in its category, when basic communication is such a big part of appraising the masses?

 

[sirhugs]

Obviously I touched a nerve. But 13 or more likes (I haven’t rechecked the count), beats three and a half (and perhaps counting too) negatives. It’s a win! Hopefully it felt good.

I certainly didn’t shy away from the negatives, but I also acknowledged how many people welcomed the communique, and encouraged more, more, more.

These are not unreasonable things to want.

i didn't realize that it was a contest.
You must be a sad sad sad person.

 

[sirhugs]

I am thankful for this view. I think I should be clearer about mine, too.

I actually do have experience managing and having to deal with higher-ups. But as you said it yourself, it's not a good analogy. This here resembles what I actually do as my day job; it resembles a classroom. We don't work for Laurel, and she doesn't work for us, but she is in a position of authority and has all, or almost all, the power in this relationship.

Having been a teacher for 15+ years, I can tell you that communication is the key to a successful classroom. If you don't provide any information about decisions and issues, the students will protest and form their conspiracy theories. It will sow dissent. If you offer too much, it will be seen as justification, and it will make them think they can change the rules to fit their own desires.
No, the trick is to provide enough information and understanding so that they know their concerns are taken into account and their needs considered, if not always heeded. I don't think I even need to point out which faulty approach Laurel is guilty of.

And now, let's consider what you said - that showering Laurel with flowers and thanks anytime she deigns to post in the AH is going to entice her to post more often.
This is the key problem with the AH. Laurel has been absent from the forum since way, way before I joined. And in all my time here, now almost four years, I have never seen anyone except for myself, sometimes lovecraft, and a few times jsmiam, directly criticize Laurel. No, even in her absence, she is showered with the goodwill of the AH. But even after all the years of her absence, you still hold on to the idea that she will make a comeback if you are just polite, thankful, appreciative, and even loving enough towards her.

Do you not see how absurd that is? To paraphrase Einstein, you are all doing the same thing, over and over again, for many years, and you are still hoping for a different result? This is exactly why I compared the relationship that a majority of the AH has towards Laurel to a religion. You all pray and hold faith, even when your goddess stays silent.

And to be perfectly clear, I don't expect that my criticizing approach will change anything either. Unlike most of you, I think that everything Laurel does is deliberate. Both Manu and Laurel limit their scarce communication to cases when it's useful to them. Praying and pleading don't achieve anything, even if you are of such a mindset to resort to those.

No, your kisses and flowers won't make her come back, just as our criticism and occasional harsh words won't push her away. Laurel does what Laurel wants, and I respect that at least, as much as I resent her approach towards authors. The PM reply she made to @PennyThompson 's post should have been the clue you all needed to finally see that she is never going to change her ways. The disdain she showed towards the AH in that post makes it all too clear.

Your post presumes that Laurel somehow has an obligation to post to the forum. nothing that i have seen supports that premise. This forum exists for discussion between authors. There is an entire separate forum for site news and tech support.

I suggest that the "disdain" you complain about is simply your perception, without a factual basis.

I'd stack my almost 50 years of managing complex businesses, including 11 years as a Managing Director, up against teaching any day. But I've also been a teacher for over a dozen years as a side job. If you want to experience disdain, deal with academic administration for a while.

 

[AwkwardlySet]

There is an entire separate forum for site news and tech support.

Which they also mostly ignore.

I was first going to reply in more detail, but I believe it would be a wasted effort. You know, even Laurel's staunchest supporters here admit that her communication is lacking. I think it's your perception that's skewed here, not mine.

 

[sirhugs]

Which they also mostly ignore.

I was first going to reply in more detail, but I believe it would be a wasted effort. You know, even Laurel's staunchest supporters here admit that her communication is lacking. I think it's your perception that's skewed here, not mine.

My perception is just that I am grateful each and every day that the site is as wonderful as it is, rather than complaining about what it isn't.

 

[jsmiam]

i didn't realize that it was a contest.
You must be a sad sad sad person.

In my case I’m thrilled and happy that I can look in a mirror and say that I stood up for others, and for basic accountability.

I am held accountable for how I do my job, where I am indeed required to keep things humming along. And it’s not a job with a magic button. There is a queue of work that means people don’t get what they ask for immediately, and every day is a challenge. I get praise if I do it well, and I face consequences if I do it poorly. And communication is the biggest factor in keeping clientele satisfied.

To those saying Laurel doesn’t have to respond to anybody or do anything: you’re partly right. But when she does, she’s doing a better job. And when she doesn’t, she’s doing a worse job. I’m encouraging her to reevaluate the patterns of silence. Count me among the ones who would welcome more communication.

 

[AwkwardlySet]

My perception is just that I am grateful each and every day that the site is as wonderful as it is, rather than complaining about what it isn't.

And that's fine. It's the kind of person that you are. I'm the kind that can't help thinking about all the (simple) ways Literotica could be better for authors and readers both, and the inaction in that sense makes my Literotica experience much more of a mixed bag.

 

[sirhugs]

In my case I’m thrilled and happy that I can look in a mirror and say that I stood up for others, and for basic accountability.

I am held accountable for how I do my job, where I am indeed required to keep things humming along. And it’s not a job with a magic button. There is a queue of work that means people don’t get what they ask for immediately, and every day is a challenge. I get praise if I do it well, and I face consequences if I do it poorly. And communication is the biggest factor in keeping clientele satisfied.

To those saying Laurel doesn’t have to respond to anybody or do anything: you’re partly right. But when she does, she’s doing a better job. And when she doesn’t, she’s doing a worse job. I’m encouraging her to reevaluate the patterns of silence. Count me among the ones who would welcome more communication.

If Laurel measures success in revenue from sales of adult toys and commissions from webcam links, more power to her.

Your mistake is thinking that we are her clientele.

We are lucky we get whatever she gives us for free.

 

[THBGato]

Let's try to avoid ad hominem attacks people (or ad feminam). That was the whole crux of my post; nothing gets achieved through personal attacks. It will never win those you are arguing with over.

This site is at its best when users collaborate, be it co-writing, editing, beta-reading or supporting each other in the forum.

 

[LissyW]

Update: I have now resubmitted the story with the original, checked, unmolested, text. In some indeterminate space of time, it will be republished, and I will then be interested to proof read it again.

 

[jsmiam]

Some of us are sincerely trying to help the site do better.

It won’t happen overnight, but if enough authors are given the motivation to go elsewhere, and if some competitor bubbles to the top and numerous authors go there, Lit will have no one to blame but themselves for opening up that window of opportunity for the competitor, who simply treated their donors of free content a little better.

In my own hold accountable way, I’m trying to help too, by pointing out how easily the site could do some crisis management. Because some number people are leaving due to no responses, little to no action, and little to no communication. And that is indeed a crisis, a self inflicted one, with an unbelievably simple answer.

Communicate! I gave her the answer in my own way, just as all the likes also did. The site should be thanking us!

 

[SimonDoom]

Update: I have now resubmitted the story with the original, checked, unmolested, text. In some indeterminate space of time, it will be republished, and I will then be interested to proof read it again.

I'm glad you did that, and I hope you don't get the same problem again.

 

[TheExperimentalist]

I've had unapproved edits made to my work on 'the site with the red interface' (IYKYK), but never heard of it happening here. Good to know it's not Lit's policy to do so, and some other issue must have occurred. (It's irked me when it's happened on the other site, but not enough to make a nuisance of myself. Good on you for having more of a backbone than I would.)

 

[TheWritingGroup]

Some of us are sincerely trying to help the site do better.

It won’t happen overnight, but if enough authors are given the motivation to go elsewhere, and if some competitor bubbles to the top and numerous authors go there, Lit will have no one to blame but themselves for opening up that window of opportunity for the competitor, who simply treated their donors of free content a little better.

In my own hold accountable way, I’m trying to help too, by pointing out how easily the site could do some crisis management. Because some number people are leaving due to no responses, little to no action, and little to no communication. And that is indeed a crisis, a self inflicted one, with an unbelievably simple answer.

Communicate! I gave her the answer in my own way, just as all the likes also did. The site should be thanking us!

I'm 100% sure you mean this, but your writing was so confrontational, it came across as an angry outburst.

 

[Voboy]

Why let customers leave when you’re the top site in its category, when basic communication is such a big part of appraising the masses?

You're reflecting a fundamental fact that a number of louder, more activist posters here also fail to grasp: we, the writers, are not the site's customers.

When writers leave, it is simply not a major problem for the site. The sooner you understand that, the more sense this place is likely to make.

 

[jsmiam]

I'm 100% sure you mean this, but your writing was so confrontational, it came across as an angry outburst.

It was confrontational, truthful too, no doubt. That doesn’t mean I’m not trying to help. People are leaving the site and going elsewhere. Not everybody. And perhaps the stayers outnumber the goers, I don’t know.

But one day, one of the “goers” will be the next Texas tall tales, dream cloud, etc., who will help make some other site gain viewers instead of Literotica. And why? Because of the patterns of silence. I’m saying, trying to say, “fix it!”

You're reflecting a fundamental fact that a number of louder, more activist posters here also fail to grasp: we, the writers, are not the site's customers.

When writers leave, it is not a major problem for the site. The sooner you understand that, the more sense this place is likely to make.

I spoke in broad terms. I did also say “donors of free content”, that was better word choice.

But let’s get hypothetical. A successful author with a successful series leaves, without the happy ending of this thread. Each and every follower who starts visiting some other site because of that departure, is a customer in the truest sense. So letting donors of free content depart due to non responsiveness and acts of silence, is ultimately leading to lost customers.

Helping can be by way of tough love. Somebody needed to say it. I’m glad I did. I probably, but no guarantees, will say no more. The collective body of what I’ve said so far says all I have to say. Thanks to all, including those who disagree. We all get to have our say.

 

[Voboy]

Helping can be by way of tough love. Somebody needed to say it. I’m glad I did. I probably, but no guarantees, will say no more. The collective body of what I’ve said so far says all I have to say. Thanks to all, including those who disagree. We all get to have our say.

You didn't need to say it. And by doing it publicly, you've made sure the story is about you and not Laurel. That's why I called it virtue signaling. I disagree that your post was helpful in any meaningful way, but you've convinced yourself that it was. That's your own bias, not reality.

The site has problems. Laurel could be better at communication. BUT those problems are known and the lack of communication is not new. At this point, it is very unlikely to change. We choose to be here, and we choose to remain.

We are people who have purchased a home near an airport. You're complaining about the noise of the planes. Most of the rest of us knew what we were getting into. More to the point, we could move away anytime we want to. The planes will still fly as though we were never here.

 

[TheWritingGroup]

I realize not everyone does, but I completely believe Laurel that she and her team are very busy, and don't want to spend hours monitoring forums or chatting with authors, because "real work" would pile up during that time.

Do I think she's handling everything perfectly? Of course not, she's a human being, we aren't perfect. Do I have ideas for ways Lit could be run better? Of course I do.

For one, a site blog to keep both readers and writers updated would be huge and would take an hour a week or less. Proper beta testing of new features is inconsistent at best, and that bothers me a lot. Sweeps should happen on a regular schedule, not on the apparent basis of "When an admin happens to feel like doing one."

None of that means that I want to scream about how Laurel is stupid for not listening to me, though. Nobody, literally, knows more about owning Literotica than the only person who has ever done that. (I'm right, mind you, but I can recognize that Laurel might not think so and that disagreeing with me does not make her somehow evil or foolish.)