The most dangerous woman in America

[BlackShanglan]

I believe in equal treatment under law. I would not like to see a celebrity receive more lenient treatment than the average person. On the other hand, I would also not like to see someone crucified in part because of that celebrity. On those grounds ... have we really got absolutely nothing better to do with our time?


http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/303132p-259487c.html


Martha's big night
out spurs probe

Nice work if you can get it.
Officials are looking into whether Martha Stewart's appearance at a glitzy Manhattan ball last week was proper under her workrelease program. The probe began after the domestic diva attended Time magazine's gala Tuesday celebrating its 100 Most Influential People - including Stewart, authorities said.

"We have some information that this event may not have been directly work-related, so we will be doing some investigating," said Chris Stanton, chief federal probation officer for the Southern District of New York.

Stewart, who was released from a five-month prison term in March and wears an electronic monitoring device, had received permission to attend the event from the Probation Department, he said.

Stewart was convicted of lying to authorities probing a stock trade. She is confined to her Westchester house except for 48 hours a week for religious services, food shopping, medical appointments and work.

Jonathan Lemire

 

[elsol]

Didn't she just sign a 5 gajillion dollar contract with XM...

Publicity IS work to someone like Martha Stewart... I would daresay it's even her religion.

Sincerely,
ElSol

 

[minsue]

Oh for fuck's sake. It's bad enough that her conviction was simply for lying to investigators (which really gets under my skin if there is no other crime involved...jailing someone for lying and lying alone is a bit frightening to me), but this is pathetic.

I'm no Martha fan, but I have a healthy respect for anyone able to build an empire like that. The embodiment of the "American Dream" complete with doilies.

 

[rgraham666]

Well, the government has to make it look like they were doing something about corporate malfeasance.

She was a woman and had no friends in the current administration. So she made a fine scapegoat.

 

[yui]

There are baby rapers walking the streets but Martha is safely locked away. I sleep better at night knowing that.

 

[Joe Wordsworth]

Not to be argumentative, but there are baby rapers behind bars as well and people that commit fraud that victimizes others walking the streets.

I got a stern lecture from my lawyer, one afternoon, about how wrong Martha Stewart was. How serious lying to the investigators is, especially concerning insider trading. Why insider trading is so serious, etc.

I've got no real sympathy for her. She screwed up. Committed fraud.

 

[yui]

Not to be argumentative, but there are baby rapers behind bars as well and people that commit fraud that victimizes others walking the streets.

I got a stern lecture from my lawyer, one afternoon, about how wrong Martha Stewart was. How serious lying to the investigators is, especially concerning insider trading. Why insider trading is so serious, etc.

I've got no real sympathy for her. She screwed up. Committed fraud.

Hi Joe,

I understand that she committed a crime and I do think that she should have been punished; however, I'm not entirely certain that her punishment was appropriate. Her celebrity definitely worked against her, in my opinion. If you had done the exact same thing, I doubt you would have done prison time. I may be completely wrong. I readily admit that I am not an expert on insider trading, but there are other people and other crimes that I personally would rather see pursued to the full extent of the law. Just my opinion.

Luck,

Yui

 

[Joe Wordsworth]

Hi Joe,

I understand that she committed a crime and I do think that she should have been punished; however, I'm not entirely certain that her punishment was appropriate. Her celebrity definitely worked against her, in my opinion. If you had done the exact same thing, I doubt you would have done prison time. I may be completely wrong. I readily admit that I am not an expert on insider trading, but there are other people and other crimes that I personally would rather see pursued to the full extent of the law. Just my opinion.

Luck,

Yui

Well, here's the short-version of what my guy tells me:

Insider trading is just a form of fraud. That's all. It's a simple form of fraud, too, one that anyone can do at any time. Just know something before anyone else does and you can sell short some stock or trade out a little stock here and there and make a few bucks. However, its important to realize that the money you make in the stock market isn't like the money you make in a Casino--for example. The Casino has money, it gets it from other gamblers. But you're only taking the Casino's money, regardless the people.

Insider trading, you're pulling money from the market. You're taking money away from unsusecting other people that don't know what you know. The penalties are harsh for it, too, not because your making a few dollars is a big crime, but because of how easy of a crime it is to pull off and how many people out there can do it.

If insider trading didn't carry such a heavy penalty... there would be a glut of people and companies basically just robbing people in the market by trading these secrets and it would create an entirely seperate class of market privilage. The stock market just could not function honestly.

Its there as a deterrant, because the system needs a certain level of honesty and disclosure to be fair to everyone who wants to participate.

And, to be fair, people have lost their life savings, their retirement investments, their college funds... they've lost thousands to one guy in a tie making calls on a telephone and selling short some stock because he knows its going to go for a ride. He's no different than someone who robs your bank account or cons you out of your savings... it's a form of theft.

You say there are crimes you'd like to see punished to the full extent of the law... personally, I'm glad they bagged her and am disappointed she didn't do more time. And I applaud the government for not taking such a thing lightly.

 

[minsue]

You say there are crimes you'd like to see punished to the full extent of the law... personally, I'm glad they bagged her and am disappointed she didn't do more time. And I applaud the government for not taking such a thing lightly.

If Martha Stewart had been jailed for insider trading, Joe, I'd agree with you wholeheartedly.

 

[R. Richard]

Insider trading is just a form of fraud. That's all. It's a simple form of fraud, too, one that anyone can do at any time. Just know something before anyone else does and you can sell short some stock or trade out a little stock here and there and make a few bucks. However, its important to realize that the money you make in the stock market isn't like the money you make in a Casino--for example. The Casino has money, it gets it from other gamblers. But you're only taking the Casino's money, regardless the people.

Insider trading, you're pulling money from the market. You're taking money away from unsusecting other people that don't know what you know. The penalties are harsh for it, too, not because your making a few dollars is a big crime, but because of how easy of a crime it is to pull off and how many people out there can do it.

If insider trading didn't carry such a heavy penalty... there would be a glut of people and companies basically just robbing people in the market by trading these secrets and it would create an entirely seperate class of market privilage. The stock market just could not function honestly.

Its there as a deterrant, because the system needs a certain level of honesty and disclosure to be fair to everyone who wants to participate.

And, to be fair, people have lost their life savings, their retirement investments, their college funds... they've lost thousands to one guy in a tie making calls on a telephone and selling short some stock because he knows its going to go for a ride. He's no different than someone who robs your bank account or cons you out of your savings... it's a form of theft.

You say there are crimes you'd like to see punished to the full extent of the law... personally, I'm glad they bagged her and am disappointed she didn't do more time. And I applaud the government for not taking such a thing lightly.

Facts:
"A panel of eight women and four men found Stewart, 62, guilty of conspiracy, obstruction and two counts of lying to investigators for covering up the circumstances surrounding her Dec. 27, 2001, stock trade of biotech company ImClone."

On 27 Feb 2004, a Federal judge dismissed secruites fraud charges against Martha Stewart.

 

[Joe Wordsworth]

If Martha Stewart had been jailed for insider trading, Joe, I'd agree with you wholeheartedly.

As those were the circumstances surrounding her fraud... I found them relavent. Much the same way that lying to police about a friend's parking ticket is different than lying to the police about a friend's mass-murdering.

 

[minsue]

As those were the circumstances surrounding her fraud... I found them relavent. Much the same way that lying to police about a friend's parking ticket is different than lying to the police about a friend's mass-murdering.

For someone ordinarily so focused on details and technicalities, you surprise me, Joe.

Do I believe she was guilty of insider trading? Yup, I do.

Would I have had a problem with her being imprisoned for it? Not in the least, if she had been tried and convicted.

Do I have a problem with her being imprisioned for lying, and only for lying, because the government had no other case against her? You betchya. It was a vindictive abuse of the system, plain and simple, and chills me to the core.

 

[BlackShanglan]

Personally, I don't have an issue with the punishment itself. Insider trading is rightly a crime; one gains money at the expense of others. I only wished to question whether further close scrutiny of her attendance at a single event - an action that she cleared with the authorities before she went - is really necessary or beneficial to anyone.

 

[Joe Wordsworth]

Do I have a problem with her being imprisioned for lying, and only for lying, because the government had no other case against her? You betchya. It was a vindictive abuse of the system, plain and simple, and chills me to the core.

I don't know that it was vindictiveness that put her away. Only that she committed fraud, to the government nontheless. I take fraud pretty seriously.

 

[R. Richard]

I don't know that it was vindictiveness that put her away. Only that she committed fraud, to the government nontheless. I take fraud pretty seriously.

It was not fraud. The fraud charges against Martha Stewart were dismissed. Google it for yourself.

 

[Virtual_Burlesque]

Whatever Martha did, or did not deserve as punishment, I believe that the people responsible for Martha’s presence at the Time Awards should reexamine the definition of the word influential.


“I now present the next award of Time Magazine's "100 Most Influential People," to Martha Stewart — the liar — for improving her corporation’s bottom line while doing hard time at Camp Cupcake.”

 

[Quiet_Cool]

Do I have a problem with her being imprisioned for lying, and only for lying, because the government had no other case against her? You betchya. It was a vindictive abuse of the system, plain and simple, and chills me to the core.

They got Capone for tax evasion. I don't feel the slightest bit of sympathy for him. Whatever gets the job done.

As for Martha? Dunno how I feel about it exactly, but people in the public eye make good examples. And it isn't like she got life or anything overly absurd. Consider how much more seriously we'd take the drug laws if Robert Downey Jr. had actually been held responsible in some notable way for his actions.

Q_C

 

[minsue]

They got Capone for tax evasion. I don't feel the slightest bit of sympathy for him. Whatever gets the job done.

You can't seriously be comparing getting Al Capone off the streets to getting Martha Stewart off the streets, can you?

 

[dr_mabeuse]

As I recall, what she was convicted of was this: she erased some stock transactions from her records after investigators contacted her, and then she thought better of it and undeleted them.

As far as insider trading goes, it's an open joke. Where I worked, the CEO, Pres, and several VP's dumped millions of dollars in stock just days before it was publicly announced that their new drug had failed its clinical trials. They said it was only coincidence and weren't even investigated.

If your brother in law tells you that his new dot.com is going to be a winner and you buy some stock, you're guilty of insider trading. Any analyst who talks to an employee of a business he makes recommendations on is guilty. I'd bet that 90% of all stock trades involve insider information, directly or indirectly.

I don't like Martha either, but they were just headline-hunting when they went after her.

And meanwhile, what's hapening with the folks from Enron?

 

[Joe Wordsworth]

It was not fraud. The fraud charges against Martha Stewart were dismissed. Google it for yourself.

I'm only talking about why she was pursued, not about her conviction.

 

[minsue]

I'm only talking about why she was pursued, not about her conviction.

*biting my tongue against jokes that the pursuit was certainly a fraud*

 

[BlackShanglan]

I'll back Joe on this: I do think it's important that lying to prosecutors, covering up crimes, evading arrest and destroying evidence have a heavy penalty. Here's a case in point:

There's a trial underway now of a nanny in California. She's on trial because she plowed her car into a group of small children and killed two of them, then fled the scene without so much as stopping to see if they had survived. She has three prior convictions for drunk driving, and was spotted by witnesses driving erratically shortly before the accident.

Her defense? There's no toxicology test, of course. There's no final evidence proving that she was undoubtedly drunk. If, as she claims, she simply lost control of the car, then we're not talking about the homocide charges that she's up on - just leaving the scene and a possible careless driving.

Of course, the sole reason for the lack of a toxicology report was her flight from the scene of the accident. In fact, many might argue that that flight itself is another suggestion that she was indeed drunk, and did not wish to be proved so. In a case like this, I think that it's vitally important that there be a severe penalty for attempting to destroy or conceal evidence (her blood alcohol at the time) and, if it's proven, for lying to investigators. Why? Because otherwise, there's not reason ever to forbear from lying or destroying evidence. If the penalty is very minor compared to the possible consequences of being truthful or letting the evidence stand, then it would be logical SOP to destroy everything and lie through one's teeth right to the bitter end.

Just my tuppence -

Shanglan

 

[Quiet_Cool]

You can't seriously be comparing getting Al Capone off the streets to getting Martha Stewart off the streets, can you?

Absolutely. Back when, organized crime was ruining America; now, it's corporate conglomerates trying to keep thier icons safe from harm. Bright roses; home-made bunt cakes; re-finished tespots....

My ass, it's a good thing!!!



But the point remains, glitches in the system can be for the better when the need calls. Capone needed to be dealt with. A glitch got him off the streets.

Has Martha ever been near the streets (without her limo driver)?



Q_C

 

[Virtual_Burlesque]

You can say what you like about Martha Stewart but I do believe she is the first ex con to have a new television program whose contract was negotiated, signed, and announced while the star was still inside the pokey.



Jeff Zucker, president of NBC Universal Television Group, was Martha’s collaborator.

Is he any relation to the Zucker Brothers who did Airplane!, and all those Leslie Nielsen movies?

 

[LadyJeanne]

Has Martha ever been near the streets (without her limo driver)?



Q_C

Yes. See below:

Martha Bio

"Martha Stewart was born Martha Helen Kostyra on August 3, 1941 in New Jersey. She was the first daughter of Eddie and Martha Kostyra. She was born to a large middle class family of Polish heritage. She has a older brother, Eddie. She also has 4 other siblings.

When she was born, her family lived in an apartment in a two-family home. They bought a house in Nutley, New Jersey when Martha was three years old. It was a busy household with six kids. Martha's mother cooked and sewed clothes for the family. She saved money by making the childrens' clothing. Martha's parents believed in a strong work ethic.

Martha's mother taught her how to cook. They had large Christmas celebrations and Martha and her mother baked and decorated cookies. Martha also learned the art of canning and preserving at her grandparents' home in Buffalo, New York. She spent some summers there as a child. They taught Martha how to preserve and can vegetables and fruits. These are skills that would prove to be important in her life.

Martha's father, Eddie, was an avid gardener. He shared his gardening skills with Martha. They would work together in the yard and garden. They would plant flowers, fruit trees, and bushes of berries. Their garden grew and evolved over time. Martha learned many of her skills used today from her parents and grandparents.

Martha attended schools in Nutley, New Jersey all the way to college. She was an excellent student. Martha also loved to read. She was active in extracurricular activities as well. She was involved in the school newspaper, the Art Club and several other clubs.

As she came from a large family, her house was always bustling with visiting family and friends. They often entertained and the family would do all the preparations, such as cooking and baking. Unbeknownst to Martha, this was the beginning of her "entertaining" career.

During her high school years, Martha decided to go to New York and try to get modeling jobs. She was hired and eventually was in a TV commerical and several magazines. In addition to modeling, she was still going to high school and she continued to excel in her studies. She was an overachiever. She graduated in the top ten of her high school class and decided to attend Barnard College in New York City.

While attending college, she continued to model. Her majors were history and architectural history. She met her husband, Andy Stewart, while she was attending Barnard College.

Martha wed Andy Stewart in 1961. Martha and her mother made her wedding dress. They lived in an apartment in New York City. It needed work, so Andy and Martha renovated and decorated it together. This was Martha's first real introduction into home decor. In 1965, their only child, Alexis, was born.

After Alexis was born, they decided they should live in a house and make a home for their little family. They bought a one room schoolhouse and renovated it from top to bottom by themselves. They enjoyed the work and the challenges it presented.

For a short time after her modelling career slowed, Martha went to work as a stockbroker. It was during this period in her life that she learned how businesses operate. Again, she was successful and this experience would prove invaluable.

Their next home was in Westport, Connecticut. This is the now famous home on Turkey Hill Road. Well experienced with home renovation, they took this project on with pleasure. Restoring and decorating soon became apparent to Martha that these were her true passions. Andy and Martha landscaped with fruit trees, berry bushes of all varieties, and many vegetable and flower gardens, just like Martha did when she was growing up. They painted the interior and the exterior of the house, too.

During this renovation, Martha decided to try her hand at catering. She always liked entertaining and thought this might be the perfect business for her. She started simply by placing a catering ad in a small local paper and the jobs started coming. Her first official catering job was a wedding. Her business grew as did the publicity for the functions she catered. Martha catered a party for Andy's publishing firm and met many editors and important people. It was during this party that she was offered the opportunity to publish a book on catering.

That book became "Entertaining" and was published in 1982. It was a bestseller and continues to sell today. She also published two cookbooks as a followup. She started to appear on television and she even hosted her own Thnaksgiving special on public televison. People either loved her or hated her. She fast became known as a lifestyle expert. "