The moment a baby’s brain starts to function and other scientific answers on abortion

BoyNextDoor

I hate liars
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When they were wrestling with the issue of a person being able to have the liberty to determine their own health and wellness in Ireland, and amending their constitution to legalize abortion, the Irish Times had a lot of great articles. This is one of them.


The moment a baby’s brain starts to function, and other scientific answers on abortion

Nobody can say when an individual life begins, but the facts can help show when a life does not begin

There are not two views on abortion in Ireland. There are 4,803,748 different perspectives. In the weeks leading up to polling day, the Irish people have started from the ground up and the debate is now firmly in the parameters of “under what circumstances should abortion be available?”

Since last week, 1,500 Irish scientists – ranging from PhD students to Ireland’s only Nobel Laureate for the sciences – have signed a letter written by Scientists for Yes, summarizing our views on abortion.
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Polarised referendum campaigns can stop people from listening and looking at the evidence. As we approach polling day, there are a number of pieces of evidence – social and scientific – that Scientists for Yes believe may be valuable, as the public come to their own conclusions:

When does consciousness begin? For most people it is a functioning brain that defines a human being, as this is where our thoughts, feelings, and conscious minds come from. Some people are concerned with abortions after six weeks of pregnancy because that is when a basic spinal cord and nervous system first develop, but it is not until week eight (six weeks post-fertilisation) that the first rudimentary brain activity – the kind that is observed in organisms as simple as insects – can be observed. The very beginnings of our higher brain structures only start to appear between weeks 12 and 16. Crucially, the co-ordinated brain activity required for consciousness does not occur until 24-25 weeks of pregnancy. We cannot say when consciousness first emerges, but it cannot rationally be called before the end of the second trimester at 24 weeks of pregnancy.
 
When they were wrestling with the issue of a person being able to have the liberty to determine their own health and wellness in Ireland, and amending their constitution to legalize abortion, the Irish Times had a lot of great articles. This is one of them.


The moment a baby’s brain starts to function, and other scientific answers on abortion

Nobody can say when an individual life begins, but the facts can help show when a life does not begin

There are not two views on abortion in Ireland. There are 4,803,748 different perspectives. In the weeks leading up to polling day, the Irish people have started from the ground up and the debate is now firmly in the parameters of “under what circumstances should abortion be available?”

Since last week, 1,500 Irish scientists – ranging from PhD students to Ireland’s only Nobel Laureate for the sciences – have signed a letter written by Scientists for Yes, summarizing our views on abortion.
\
Polarised referendum campaigns can stop people from listening and looking at the evidence. As we approach polling day, there are a number of pieces of evidence – social and scientific – that Scientists for Yes believe may be valuable, as the public come to their own conclusions:

When does consciousness begin? For most people it is a functioning brain that defines a human being, as this is where our thoughts, feelings, and conscious minds come from. Some people are concerned with abortions after six weeks of pregnancy because that is when a basic spinal cord and nervous system first develop, but it is not until week eight (six weeks post-fertilisation) that the first rudimentary brain activity – the kind that is observed in organisms as simple as insects – can be observed. The very beginnings of our higher brain structures only start to appear between weeks 12 and 16. Crucially, the co-ordinated brain activity required for consciousness does not occur until 24-25 weeks of pregnancy. We cannot say when consciousness first emerges, but it cannot rationally be called before the end of the second trimester at 24 weeks of pregnancy.

None of which applies to the US or our political climate.
 
Tis true... fetal development is guided by political climate. No common biology or anything, just politics.

*nods*
 
BB, Corny and ReichGuide's brains haven't started to function yet.
 
A baby's brain starts to function no sooner than a year after birth.

Oh, fuck no! You are wayyyy the hell off! For most it's more like 20 years after. For a few (we've got several examples skulking around here) it never happens.

Comshaw
 
^^^ it's an ethically grey area,
in which both sides are right.
90% of the women who underwent abortion think more like the Right, it was a last-resort, painful decision.


As for the "we need to make exemptions for victims of rape and incest"
that doesn't work either. It often takes a year to prove rape, IF ot's proven at all. Why put women through such an ordeal?
Moreover, you'll see the no. of false rape accusations mushroom, because desperate women who can't live hand to mouth.


As a society, we're not mindful enough to consider measures other than force by law, or 'the foetus is like a toothpaste sludge'.
 
When they were wrestling with the issue of a person being able to have the liberty to determine their own health and wellness in Ireland, and amending their constitution to legalize abortion, the Irish Times had a lot of great articles. This is one of them.


The moment a baby’s brain starts to function, and other scientific answers on abortion

Nobody can say when an individual life begins, but the facts can help show when a life does not begin

There are not two views on abortion in Ireland. There are 4,803,748 different perspectives. In the weeks leading up to polling day, the Irish people have started from the ground up and the debate is now firmly in the parameters of “under what circumstances should abortion be available?”

Since last week, 1,500 Irish scientists – ranging from PhD students to Ireland’s only Nobel Laureate for the sciences – have signed a letter written by Scientists for Yes, summarizing our views on abortion.
\
Polarised referendum campaigns can stop people from listening and looking at the evidence. As we approach polling day, there are a number of pieces of evidence – social and scientific – that Scientists for Yes believe may be valuable, as the public come to their own conclusions:

When does consciousness begin? For most people it is a functioning brain that defines a human being, as this is where our thoughts, feelings, and conscious minds come from. Some people are concerned with abortions after six weeks of pregnancy because that is when a basic spinal cord and nervous system first develop, but it is not until week eight (six weeks post-fertilisation) that the first rudimentary brain activity – the kind that is observed in organisms as simple as insects – can be observed. The very beginnings of our higher brain structures only start to appear between weeks 12 and 16. Crucially, the co-ordinated brain activity required for consciousness does not occur until 24-25 weeks of pregnancy. We cannot say when consciousness first emerges, but it cannot rationally be called before the end of the second trimester at 24 weeks of pregnancy.


Anyone who doesn’t believe that life begins at conception has a brain that isn’t working! Mic drop!
 
A baby's brain starts to function no sooner than a year after birth.

No, it isn't. Abortion is an ugly thing and that's why it's controversial. Stop trying to rationalize it by making it something that it is, and accept it for the ugly thing that it is. The world isn't perfect unfortunately.
 
No, it isn't. Abortion is an ugly thing and that's why it's controversial. Stop trying to rationalize it by making it something that it is, and accept it for the ugly thing that it is. The world isn't perfect unfortunately.

Abortion is a necessary thing and those whose primary response to it is hysteria should take themselves away from the grown up table and go back to their toys.
 
No, it isn't. Abortion is an ugly thing and that's why it's controversial. Stop trying to rationalize it by making it something that it is, and accept it for the ugly thing that it is. The world isn't perfect unfortunately.

It's a medical procedure to end a pregnancy.

Quit pretending that it's small children being decapitated in some horror show
 
They make such a fuss abut the procedure itself, requiring doctors to have admitting rights at hospitals, and so on. Then there are the stalkers outside of clinics.

Why not just do the procedures in normal hospitals? No one would be able to stalk since no one would know why anyone is there. All the care would be available if there are complications.
 
They make such a fuss abut the procedure itself, requiring doctors to have admitting rights at hospitals, and so on. Then there are the stalkers outside of clinics.

Why not just do the procedures in normal hospitals? No one would be able to stalk since no one would know why anyone is there. All the care would be available if there are complications.

Many hospitals are ran and owned by religious groups. They have been given - and often exercise - the right to refuse treatment based on their beliefs. Which is also why admitting privileges for doctors who perform abortions are difficult to get.
 
Change that.

And that isn't all of them to begin with.
 
It's a medical procedure to end a pregnancy.

Quit pretending that it's small children being decapitated in some horror show

If it was that simple, women wouldn't have a hard time with it. Some women who chose not to go under have actually been traumatized by it.
 
If it was that simple, women wouldn't have a hard time with it. Some women who chose not to go under have actually been traumatized by it.

As they would by any procedure that involves insertion of surgical instruments in the vagina.
 
Anyone who doesn’t believe that life begins at conception has a brain that isn’t working! Mic drop!

It does not "begin", it continues, by the merger of two living cells, neither of which has any more personhood than your fingernail clippings. Nothing magical happens all of a sudden when sperm and egg meet. A new soul does not suddenly pop into the picture.
 
Abortion is a necessary thing and those whose primary response to it is hysteria should take themselves away from the grown up table and go back to their toys.

No one said anything about hysteria. Just that its a difficult decision, because it's an ugly option. A necessary one, but an ugly one for an imperfect world.
 
None of which applies to the US or our political climate.

You are 100% correct.... nothing rational, reasonable or based in science applies to the side that "believes" in life with no exceptions.
It is mostly a male control issue.
 
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The CUbaNTripod thinks it's a difficult decision.

What's so difficult about leaving the decision on whether or not to have an abortion up to a woman and her doctor???

It's actually the easiest thing to accept if you aren't a control FREAK.

*nods*
 
Abortion is a necessary thing and those whose primary response to it is hysteria should take themselves away from the grown up table and go back to their toys.

Funny you should use that word . . . "hysteria" originally mean "wandering uterus," a condition to which any remarkable emotionality in a woman was attributed. Now, we know a uterus does not wander, it always remains in the same position between the hips.
 
Funny you should use that word . . . "hysteria" originally mean "wandering uterus," a condition to which any remarkable emotionality in a woman was attributed. Now, we know a uterus does not wander, it always remains in the same position between the hips.

:cool:

Purposefully applied and used as it appeals to my sense of ironic cynicism.
 
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