The glories of capitalist dialect!

[shadowsource]

I'm just listening to an opinion jock named Larry Elder explaining on CNN that it's cool to raise the price of gas from $1.50 to $5.00 as soon as the WTC collapsed because hey, that's the American way. I can accept that much, with my dark views. But then he blathered on about how no one had to buy the gas (they'll just refine their own), and, even better, that it was just a matter of supply and demand. Of course, demand didn't rise last Tuesday, nor did supply fall. It was just profiteering. He must be really fun to listen to. Gotta love those purist right wingers. I miss so much living at Ground Zero.

 

[Samuari]

Yup that happened in Tulsa, and the Republican Govenor, Frank Keating, anounced that he was directing the OSBI to investigate and find an applicable law to prosicute hime with.

The prices started coming down within the hour.

 

[lavender]

 

[Never]

Now is that ironic or paradoxical? Hmm.. Okay, she used it correctly. I'm so happy.

 

[Samuari]

Nah, to quote Poul Anderson: "Goverenments are born and die, but Greed goes on forever."

 

[shadowsource]

Well -

This Larry Elder, who seemed to be an African-American Rush clone, was very upset that people might be prosecuted for exercising their American rights. It is a certain contradiction, but I gotta admire these dementoes for upsetting everyone with so much... pristine theory (?) while the Democrats are swallowing their very principled opposition to Bush's plan to shotgun the ABM Treaty, and while the liberals are being so patriotic.
The righties are so fucking cantankerous! And now I'm looking to the likes of Bob Barr to help save the constitution (!) from Ashcroft's sweaty paws as he throws out personal freedoms that have lasted this long. A prize to anyone who can trace the above thought process, point by point (just kidding).

 

[lavender]

 

[Unclebill]

lavender, I'm just curious as to where you've observed capitalism practiced.

 

[miles]

Fascinating how libs are so eager to identify people by race instead of as individuals.

"African-American Rush Clone."
Why is the guy's race so important? Because he's conservative?

Color blind my ass.

 

[lavender]

 

[lavender]

 

[miles]

lavender

Classic illogical Liberal philosophy.

Continue to identify people by race/class so we can help them not be identified by race/class.

Lavender!!!! You're a very bright person, but that's wacky!

Sounds like the famous quote during the Vietnam War:

"We had to burn the village so we could save it."

 

[shadowsource]

I've never claimed to be blind -

Was merely hoping for some dope on the guy, so I described him further. My friends could attest that I've long felt that more African-Americans should play with the GOP and see if they get any respect, so I'm not even posing some kind of moral critique against conservative black people.

Lavy - yes, war criminal John Negroponte was confirmed as UN Ambassador. The Dems are spreading their cheeks as fast as they can. Let's hope Pat Leahy stands guard on Ashcroft's tapping authorization. Having let two guys from the FBI Watch List board a plane for nefarious purposes, the feds should be doing their homework, not demanding unthinkable new powers.
Do any of the avowed Litbertarians agree that we're all gonna get whipped into a national security state over these hideous events?

 

[miles]

Do any of the avowed Litbertarians agree that we're all gonna get whipped into a national security state over these hideous events?

I have no idea what that means.

 

[lavender]

 

[Laurel]

I think he's referring to this:

http://abcnews.go.com/wire/Politics/ap20010919_1936.html


Increased police powers broader than announced; civil liberty groups concerned

The Associated Press



WASHINGTON (AP) The Bush administration asked Congress on Wednesday to let prosecutors use information collected by foreign governments in ways that are unconstitutional in the United States.
The administration also wants to let the FBI and other police agencies seize billing information like credit card numbers from Internet companies without a court order, according to a Justice Department analysis of the anti-terrorism legislative package it plans to submit Friday.

"In many cases, users register with Internet service providers using false names, making the form of payment critical to determining the user's true identity," said the analysis, which was provided in advance Wednesday to senators.

The department said in the documents it envisions that information obtained by foreign police agencies "will come to play a larger role in federal prosecutions" of terrorists. Still prohibited, it noted, would be the use in court of information gathered unconsitutionally overseas if U.S. prosecutors participated in ordering the collection of it.

Ashcroft's legislation would allow the use of electronic surveillance gathered by foreign governments with methods that violate the Fourth Amendment protection against unreasonable search and seizure in American courts against American citizens.

Meanwhile, an unusual liberal-conservative alliance is decrying as an assault on civil liberties the changes in law being sought in response to the airliner hijackings.

"This proposal addresses issues that are well beyond the scope of fighting terrorism," said David Sobel of the Washington-based Electronic Privacy Information Center.

Sobel's group is one of several that has signed a letter to lawmakers stating they should "resist the temptation to enact proposals in the mistaken belief that anything that may be called anti-terrorist will necessarily provide greater security." A draft of the letter was obtained Wednesday by The Associated Press.

Attorney General John Ashcroft, standing outside the site where one of the hijacked planes slammed into the Pentagon, said Wednesday he is deeply concerned about civil liberties.

But "we will not fail to use any tools that can promote apprehension and disruption of the networks that caused these damages and prevent similar recurrences in the future," he said.

Senior lawmakers already are indicating that Ashcroft's anti-terrorist legislation won't move through Congress as quickly as he sought earlier this week.

House Judiciary Chairman James Sensenbrenner, R-Wis., said he would hold hearings before moving the legislation. And Senate Judiciary Chairman Patrick Leahy, D-Vt., revealed that he was working on his own version of an anti-terrorist bill.

"We're trying to find a middle ground and I think we can," Leahy said after meeting with Ashcroft.

In addition to the provisions he announced publicly, Ashcroft's legislation, according to his department's analysis, would:

Expand the definition of a terrorist in the Alien Terrorist Removal Court to anyone who knows or should know that an organization they support in any way is a terrorist organization. "This legislation seeks to stop the provision of support to terrorist organizations through sham non-terrorist organizations," the analysis said.

Make illegal the possession of chemicals that could be used as biological weapons in quantities that cannot be justified by a "prophylactic, protective or peaceful purpose."

Make illegal giving expert advice to terrorists, "for example, advice provided by a person with expertise in aviation matters to facilitate an aircraft hijacking."

Allow seizing the property of any person, organization or country that attacks the United States, even without a declaration of war.

Demand educational records of suspected terrorists. Currently, officials cannot look at anyone's educational records without the consent of the student or his parents.

Allow the attorney general to offer any amount as a reward to fight terrorists, lifting the $2 million current limit.

Allow police to take DNA samples from convicted terrorists.

 

[Problem Child]

Why don't we end the war on drugs and use the money to finance the war on terrorism?

 

[Laurel]

Because that would make sense?

 

[miles]

lavender

That's what I thought. Never one to understate things, is he?

 

[shadowsource]

.

 

[miles]

shadowsource

Only the government can rationalize that if they decrim drugs, society will be irrepairably harmed.

To them it makes more sense to make criminals out of millions of productive citizens, overcrowd our prisons, unnecessarily burden
law enforcement, kill innocent people, waste a shitload of money, and violate our rights.

Stupid motherfuckers.

 

[A_Jacks]

I think it is wrong to go after the owners of the gas stations, it is a free market.

Should we also go after anyone who sold stocks?

And yes, we are rushing to give up freedoms.

Under 8 years of Clinton, we grew lax, appeased our enemies, blindsided our security organizations, made ourselves vulnerable, and ignored the intell saying that this is exactly what was going to be planned and executed.

Now the same institution that was supposed to be keeping us safe is saying, hey, give up more of your freedom and we'll keep you safe.

SAFE FROM WHO?

 

[Samuari]

this trail ballon found the AA

I don't think that I've ever seen a propsal collect harsher crtitics as fast as Ashcroft's legesalation. It's simply going nowhere in its present form. Republicans, Democrats, Liberals, right wing, left wing, even tail feathers are all against it. Hell, its hard to find anyone outside the Justice dept. that likes it. It's going nowhere but we need to keep an eye on it just in case.

 

[Guest]

Funny

I think it is wrong to go after the owners of the gas stations, it is a free market.

Should we also go after anyone who sold stocks?

And yes, we are rushing to give up freedoms.

Under 8 years of Clinton, we grew lax, appeased our enemies, blindsided our security organizations, made ourselves vulnerable, and ignored the intell saying that this is exactly what was going to be planned and executed.

Now the same institution that was supposed to be keeping us safe is saying, hey, give up more of your freedom and we'll keep you safe.

SAFE FROM WHO?

Safe from "whom" would be correct. Pseudo-intellectuals can spout a few lines from last night's beer drinking, cheesepuff eating late night Larry King hour but heaven forbid there would be any semblance of syntax balance within a post. Sheesh!

 

[shadowsource]

Well, let's express ourselves to the elected ones!

I don't think that I've ever seen a propsal collect harsher crtitics as fast as Ashcroft's legesalation. It's simply going nowhere in its present form. Republicans, Democrats, Liberals, right wing, left wing, even tail feathers are all against it. Hell, its hard to find anyone outside the Justice dept. that likes it. It's going nowhere but we need to keep an eye on it just in case.

Her'es the URL for the WORKING GROUP ON PRIVACY, which is trying to contest the proposed laws, which everyone assumes the courts will allow if Congress passes them: http://vees.net/freedom/