The difference between a submissive and a slave.

[Guest]

As someone who has been exploring BDSM in both real life and online for just short of four years, i have a few thoughts on the differences between a submissive and a slave. i don't know that this has been posted on here before, and if it has im sorry to trouble you with the same question, but i would really like some input from other people. i've always seen the submissive role as one with a little less permanance. i never put much stock into a "collared submissive" because i see a collar as a sign that this person is OWNED by someone. A slave is owned. A submissive is merely involved with a Dominant. Speaking of which this also brings up the question of a Dominant vs. a Master. They both deserve respect no doubt, but does one really have the right to call themselves a Master? Isn't it a title earned due to skill in a particular area (much like schooling or martial arts, where one must go through years of learning in order to attain such a title) i mean no insult to anyone but i always thought an M/s relationship was slightly deeper than a D/s relationship. A slave is willing to explore further in order to satisfy his or her Master. Does anyone else share this opinion? Any other thoughts on this subject would be much aopreciated.

 

[Lancecastor]

I don't think any of the nomenclature stuff matters very much at all.

I'm presently seeing two young grrls who are friends of each other...I'm either training them to be subs, playing with them as my dedicated slaves, in a threesome with them, doing a daddy thing with them, introducing them to their bisexual fantasies, teaching them about kink...or just fucking their brains out, depending on the labels people might apply to the dynamic.

 

[s'lara]

Hello subwnc and welcome to the board.

Here is a recent link which discusses this topic. Maybe you'll find the answer you're looking for in this thread and if you do not, feel free to pursue the discussion in this thread. Fresh commentary on a prior subject is always welcome. i will try to find the other threads where this was discussed in great detail.

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?threadid=241657&highlight=Master*

Good luck and i hope you enjoy your time here on the BDSM Board.

lara

P.S. i found another link which discusses the structural makeup of "natural" Dominant's and submissives and certainly covers your question.

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?threadid=174794&highlight=*differences*+and+*slave*

 

[Guest]

s'lara i thank you for your reply but im not so much looking for commentary on the innate nature of these people, more the depth of the relationship between people with these various titles. some submissive types refer to themselves as slaves, some a submissives, and some Dominant types refer to themselves as Dom/mes and some as Master/Mistresses. my only intention is to find out how various people might differentiate this.

 

[s'lara]

s'lara i thank you for your reply but im not so much looking for commentary on the innate nature of these people, more the depth of the relationship between people with these various titles. some submissive types refer to themselves as slaves, some a submissives, and some Dominant types refer to themselves as Dom/mes and some as Master/Mistresses. my only intention is to find out how various people might differentiate this.

You're welcome. i am continuing my search for the various threads which addressed this very question. The innate nature of those who identify as Master/Mistress and sub/slave is relevant. People will identify with what feels natural to them, so the natural exemplar thread does apply.

If i understand you correctly, you are looking for explanations of why people call themselves a particular title and how they compare to each other. Please see some of the links below:

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?threadid=39661&highlight=*slave*+and+*submissive*

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?threadid=85388&highlight=*slave*+and+*submissive*

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?threadid=96715&highlight=*slave*+and+*submissive*

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?threadid=106235&highlight=*slave*+and+*submissive*

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?threadid=107230&highlight=*slave*+and+*submissive*

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?threadid=118698&highlight=*slave*+and+*submissive*

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?threadid=82695&highlight=*slave*+and+*submissive*

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?threadid=159119&highlight=*slave*+and+*submissive*

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?threadid=174501&highlight=*slave*+and+*submissive*

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?threadid=106500&highlight=*slave*+and+*submissive*

 

[s'lara]

And more still:

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?threadid=170817&highlight=*slave*+and+*submissive*

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?threadid=177071&highlight=*slave*+and+*submissive*

https://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?threadid=118198&highlight=*slave*+and+*submissive*

i hope some of these help. Fresh commentary is always good too.

Best of luck subwnc.

lara

 

[Guest]

frowns some
s'lara would it have been too much for you to simply answer her question instead of throwing links at her and saying we already covered that catch up. If we do not post new threads and talk about the issues that people bring up then whats the point of having a board all for BDSM talk at all. Instead why don't we just have one thread with thousands of posts on it instead and tell everyone to fend for themselves learning anything new. I am disappointed in your response.

To subwithnocollar....
submissives: I feel that alot more people fit into this category then into slavery. This one encompasses those that can only life the life part time. I mean those that are married to someone vanilla, those that have jobs that this is an escape for them, or those that simply do not have the time to invest in something 24/7. I do not look at these people any differently then I do those that have the means to be a complete slave.

slaves: This is a smaller group in my mind. These are the ones that are with their dominant half 24/7 or as close to that as possible. Many times they are married to their dominant. These people live as a slave. This is not to say they sleep on the floor all the time and kneel everywhere but they know innately that they are owned by someone and that does not change if they are out at a resturaunt, picking their kids up from school, or scening.

Just my thoughts. I hope that you find some of the actual dicussion that you were looking for subwithnocollar.

 

[s'lara]

As the board librarian, i thought subwnco would benefit from seeing past thoughts of others on the subject. i also said fresh commentary is always good and encouraged her to pursue the discussion in this thread if she was dissatisfied with the definitions presented in prior threads. Maybe you missed my saying it.

If you took my posts to mean "catch up", you read it entirely wrong. i typically try to supply those who come to the board with information from our Library in an effort to help people find answers. i in no way intimated to her to discontinue her thread. If you found my offering of links for her to peruse as a hint to close the discussion, then you've certainly misread me. As for answering her question, whether i choose to do so or not is my affair. After reading through many of the previous posts on the matter, i chose not to simply because they had already been stated.

i hope my explanation has made things clear to you.

lara

 

[Guest]

ladies, settle down. im not so much looking for answers as curious to the thoughts of others. s'lara, im not really interested in weeding through the past as a current discussion on peoples beliefs in this area. hostility is not neccesary.... thank you for the links and perhaps i will get to some of them later. i know what my opinions on this subject are, i just want to gauge where i am with the others on this board.

 

[s'lara]

ladies, settle down. im not so much looking for answers as curious to the thoughts of others. s'lara, im not really interested in weeding through the past as a current discussion on peoples beliefs in this area. hostility is not neccesary.... thank you for the links and perhaps i will get to some of them later. i know what my opinions on this subject are, i just want to gauge where i am with the others on this board.

i'm far from riled or hostile subwnc. i responded to a post calling my actions into question. i don't want to continue to detract from the subject of your thread so i'll let that be the last i say in regard to that matter.

You're welcome for the links and as i've said a few times, new and fresh commentary is always welcome on the board. i look forward to the responses.

Cheers,

lara

 

[Justina123]

HEre's my perspective.

Sir and I are 100 percent committed to each other, live 24/7, and have been Dom/sub for about 2 years now. We both have demanding jobs outside the home, and 3 of our collective 8 kids live with us fulltime (as opposed to part time due to being in college, married, or living most of the time with the ex). For all of these reasons, we prefer the Dom/sub designation.

However, this does not detract from the fact that I BELONG to Sir. For me, "Slave" conjures up a picture of someone who can devote themselves totally to their Master or his needs pretty much all the time with very few distractions. Work and children prevent this; although Sir always has the final decision and veto power on anything I may be called on to decide. I also am just plain not comfortable with the honorific "Master", and I can and so say "Sir" in front of the kids and our friends, while I do not think I could say "Master."

So for us, Dom/sub just feels like the more appropriate label, but it does not denote any less devotion or ownership, perhaps more a style difference dictated by life circumstances.

Don't know if that is understandable, but my thoughts anyhow!

-justina

 

[catalina_francisco]

i've always seen the submissive role as one with a little less permanance.

As s'lara has pointed out as librarian, this topic is one which is raised regularly, each time with a variety of responses, some old, some new. I think you will find the terms and roles attached to those terms are subjective to the people within the relationship and living by what fits for them most comfortably at that time. Some see being a slave as a part-time and/or reversible role, while others understand that to fall more under the term submissive. I don't think one or the other can be seen in general to be more permanent than the other, though for us personally in our relationship, slavery is a permanent and irreversible role from which the only way out is through the death of one of the participants.

i never put much stock into a "collared submissive" because i see a collar as a sign that this person is OWNED by someone. A slave is owned. A submissive is merely involved with a Dominant.

There are various meanings attached to collars, and a variety of collars available. Wearing one does not necessarily signify ownership, though it may. The relevance lies with the people involved and what they attach to that symbol, and is usually respected in that manner by others outside the relationship.

Speaking of which this also brings up the question of a Dominant vs. a Master. They both deserve respect no doubt, but does one really have the right to call themselves a Master? Isn't it a title earned due to skill in a particular area (much like schooling or martial arts, where one must go through years of learning in order to attain such a title) i mean no insult to anyone but i always thought an M/s relationship was slightly deeper than a D/s relationship.

Master can mean a variety of things, just as the word dominant can....all depends on context. In the D/s sense, I identify personally with the meaning it is one who holds complete power over another, most often in a TPE arrangement. Others do not always identify with that, and some in the same type relationship prefer other terms, including Sir. I would say, even if it did rely on it meaning it is someone who has gained particular learning/wisdom...a greater power than the slave/submissive...my Master fulfils that. I may not always like what he tells me, or how he perceives my actions or inaction, but I have come to appreciate no matter how painful or difficult it may be for me, he is demonstrating a glimpse into my heart and soul I and others have not been open to before. In that way he does have a skill in a particular area, that being in knowing what is best for me, and acting as guide and confidante....definately not an easy job as I am sure he and the many who tried unsuccessfully will tell you.

A slave is willing to explore further in order to satisfy his or her Master.

I daresay there are submissives who are willing to explore just as deeply with the right person, and there are slaves I have known who do not see exploring as an option or necessary. It once again is relevant to the relationship and individuals involved. It also can look from the outside as if someone is not trying because what to you or someone else is a piece of cake to attempt, may for that person be a huge psychological, emotional, or physical challenge, at times frighteningly overwhelming. Stereotypes exist, but my experience has been each person is individual in their experience and may or may not buy into what is seen as the bonafide ridgy didge of D/s. Is an interesting journey to explore and observe.

Catalina

 

[AngelicAssassin]

Although s'lara hardly needs defending, i feel compelled to reply to some of the comments thus far.

Instead why don't we just have one thread with thousands of posts on it instead and tell everyone to fend for themselves learning anything new.

That single thread existed long before you joined Lit, and if you'd bothered to read a few lines in the library, you'd know that. The big stickies at the top of the forum exist for a reason. One of those reasons? Anelize Darkeyes spent days, perhaps weeks, putting the library together in an attempt to provide answers to the casual passerby, the new and nervous, even the jaded.

frowns some
s'lara would it have been too much for you to simply answer her question instead of throwing links at her and saying we already covered that catch up.

What part of this ...

i hope some of these help. Fresh commentary is always good too.

zipped past your eyeballs without registering?

Going a little further ... and in full PYL mode ... every damn one of the links s'lara gave out

• exist in the threads for the forum for anyone that felt masochistic enough to read through all of them
• respond to a Lit forum search for someone that bothered to do the search
• appear in an alphabetical listing divided by subject in the library
• get handed to you on a silver platter by the librarian when all of the above don't suffice

Do you want someone to wipe your ass after spoon feeding you as well? This ain't the GB, yet you've drug the same BS approach in here. My apologies to the rest of the forum readers in advance if you're offended, but i'm a little disappointed in the lack of every day manners when someone gets slammed for going out of their way to help.

 

[AnelizeDarkEyes]

As someone who has been exploring BDSM in both real life and online for just short of four years, i have a few thoughts on the differences between a submissive and a slave. i don't know that this has been posted on here before, and if it has im sorry to trouble you with the same question, but i would really like some input from other people. i've always seen the submissive role as one with a little less permanance. i never put much stock into a "collared submissive" because i see a collar as a sign that this person is OWNED by someone. A slave is owned. A submissive is merely involved with a Dominant. Speaking of which this also brings up the question of a Dominant vs. a Master. They both deserve respect no doubt, but does one really have the right to call themselves a Master? Isn't it a title earned due to skill in a particular area (much like schooling or martial arts, where one must go through years of learning in order to attain such a title) i mean no insult to anyone but i always thought an M/s relationship was slightly deeper than a D/s relationship. A slave is willing to explore further in order to satisfy his or her Master. Does anyone else share this opinion? Any other thoughts on this subject would be much aopreciated.

Posts like this just CRACK my ass UP. *snickering madly*

I'm just SOOOOOOO glad that my status as an owned submissive is ... how did she put it..... "merely involved."

*more snickering*

Oh wait....there's more!

A slave is willing to explore further in order to satisfy his or her Master.

*uncontrollable laughter*

My role has "less permanence" too.

What a bunch of ridiculous broad brush drivel.

When, oh, when, will people discuss things without painting the rest of us with their particular brand of D/s as though it where written in stone? Hmmm?

Well, sweets. I don't wear a collar. Don't believe in 'em. Neither does my Dom. OMG!! The sky is going to fall right in, and the mountains will fall to dust. *eyeroll*

The thing is, we practice our own particular brand of 24/7 D/s, and have for quite some time now. Most people find what works for them and their relationship, and go with that. There is no great, all-encompassing manual of D/s. Slaves aren't better. Masters don't somehow trump Doms.

Your incredibly insulting and frankly, childish, and ridiculous posts belie the so-called experience you claim. You might want to go back to subbie school and open your mind, dear.

As an aside, you ROCK, s'lara!! Keep up the good work. And thanks, AA for the kudos.

~anelize, in obscurity

 

[Bandit58]

Thanks Anelize, for a second there I thought oh dear we don't fit into the "accepted" school of D/s. I mean:

1. We live together but I'm not a slave.

2. I call Him Master and He calls me His slut but only during play, the rest of the time we're like any other couple.

3. We are in a committed, permanent relationship. I am His carer in that His health isn't the best, so I serve in ways other than the bedroom, but ours is primarily a sexual D/s relationship. We will be having a commitment ceremony in a few months. We will decide closer to the time if there will be a collar involved.

I feel our relationship is as entitled to be Master/sub as any other. No one's choices are better or worse than any one elses. We take the bits of BDSM that suit us and leave the rest. I'm learning how to please Him, and He is teaching me so much about my responses and the depth of my love for Him just keeps growing.....

Labels are for jars and bottles, not people and relationships

 

[AngelicAssassin]

Read between the lines.

And thanks, AA for the kudos.

Hush wench, and get back to your "non-conformist, no collar having, imitation D/s" relationship while some of us run around with green eyes ... http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-8/363868/2cool2.gif

My thanks for all your hard work.

 

[Guest]

im not saying you're wrong, toots. In no way did i say that. that is merely my take on it, from what i've observed and what i feel. my personal degrees of commitment and dedication have nothing to do with yours. if i was really so closed minded would i be asking the opinions of others? There is a reason i posted this thread. Thank you for your input, despite the daggers thrown at me, i appreciate hearing what someone else has to say.

 

[sunfox]

As someone who has been exploring BDSM in both real life and online for just short of four years, i have a few thoughts on the differences between a submissive and a slave. i don't know that this has been posted on here before, and if it has im sorry to trouble you with the same question, but i would really like some input from other people. i've always seen the submissive role as one with a little less permanance. i never put much stock into a "collared submissive" because i see a collar as a sign that this person is OWNED by someone. A slave is owned. A submissive is merely involved with a Dominant. Speaking of which this also brings up the question of a Dominant vs. a Master. They both deserve respect no doubt, but does one really have the right to call themselves a Master? Isn't it a title earned due to skill in a particular area (much like schooling or martial arts, where one must go through years of learning in order to attain such a title) i mean no insult to anyone but i always thought an M/s relationship was slightly deeper than a D/s relationship. A slave is willing to explore further in order to satisfy his or her Master. Does anyone else share this opinion? Any other thoughts on this subject would be much aopreciated.

Put simply: No. I don't share the opinion that a relationship that doesn't involve the label of Master/slave is lesser. Color me quirky, but I feel that every relationship is equal in difficulty and joy, regardless of whether my partner and I call each other Fred and Ginger or Master and slave.

And honestly, I fail to see how you can be surprised that some people have reacted negatively to "i mean no insult to anyone but i always thought an M/s relationship was slightly deeper than a D/s relationship."

Let's make this sentence a bit more obvious.

"I'm trying to appear curious instead of superior, but let's overlook that while I inform you that your relationship isn't up to my standards of depth. What a lot of slacking amateurs you all are, and I bite my thumb at thee."

I can't imagine how anyone could find that offensive.

And for the record... I live with my Dominant. 24/7. And if he ever calls me his slave, it won't be me sitting gingerly on the sore ass.

I am submissive. Hear me roar.

 

[Phoenix Stone]

Oh, G-d Sunfox, you crack me up! LOL

Ah, sheesh, still chuckling. will have to come back later... (shaking head in wonder.)

 

[Netzach]

Chez Netzach, slaves are less permanent. If I tire of one I simply dismiss him. If you can't deal with that, you're not a slave I'm interested in having.

Oh, that's not very pc, is it?

Such are the perils of owership and becoming property, as I see it.

Slaves are there to make my life better, more efficient, and more enjoyable. That's the bottom line. And if I don't want one there, he's not.

My fiance is my submissive, actually more a bottom.

D/s = D/s.

commitment=commitment.

It's really not that complicated, people.

 

[Kajira Callista]

As someone who has been exploring BDSM in both real life and online for just short of four years, i have a few thoughts on the differences between a submissive and a slave. i don't know that this has been posted on here before, and if it has im sorry to trouble you with the same question, but i would really like some input from other people. i've always seen the submissive role as one with a little less permanance. i never put much stock into a "collared submissive" because i see a collar as a sign that this person is OWNED by someone. A slave is owned. A submissive is merely involved with a Dominant. Speaking of which this also brings up the question of a Dominant vs. a Master. They both deserve respect no doubt, but does one really have the right to call themselves a Master? Isn't it a title earned due to skill in a particular area (much like schooling or martial arts, where one must go through years of learning in order to attain such a title) i mean no insult to anyone but i always thought an M/s relationship was slightly deeper than a D/s relationship. A slave is willing to explore further in order to satisfy his or her Master. Does anyone else share this opinion? Any other thoughts on this subject would be much aopreciated.

My opinion...and only just that...an opinion.
First off i dont understand some of what you wrote. "a submissive is MERELY involved with at Dominant"..is that like a slave is merely owned by a Master?
does anyone have the RIGHT to call themselves Master?"....do you have the right to judge who shall and shall not be called that.
Anyway... here is my take. A D/s relationship is a relationship period. same as any other...it is about the two people involved and outside influence, labels, etc have no bearing on what two ppl do to make themselves happy. It is no ones business how its made to work in each individual relationship and no one has a right to set rules or make judgements on any of it. It's all about what floats your boat...has nothing to do with how deep ones submission is or how masterful you see a person. IMHO i think you need to drop the labels categories and judgements and take another look to see if this lifestyle is really for you.

 

[tn_greeneyez]

Ok, I'm still relatively new to exploring D/s...........only having been for a year now........but I have opinions.

I think that if a submissive agrees to give a Dominant his or her gift of submission, and the Dominant accepts that gift, that they should have already discussed such things as titles and names. I believe it to be a very personal and situational matter, and if the parties involved enjoy the "Master" title, then so be it.

Also, as for collaring. I've never worn one, but I must say that it would be interesting at least..........maybe even very stimulating......to wear one, if only for play time.

Some people, for various reasons, must keep their D/s relationships completely private, and for those reasons, public collar wearing couldn't work.

Anyway, just thoughts.

 

[sunfox]

Oh, G-d Sunfox, you crack me up! LOL

Ah, sheesh, still chuckling. will have to come back later... (shaking head in wonder.)

That's why I'm the Captain and get paid the big bucks. Or something like that.

Always glad to amuse.

 

[Wizard]

Thanks Anelize, for a second there I thought oh dear we don't fit into the "accepted" school of D/s. I mean:

1. We live together but I'm not a slave.

2. I call Him Master and He calls me His slut but only during play, the rest of the time we're like any other couple.

3. We are in a committed, permanent relationship. I am His carer in that His health isn't the best, so I serve in ways other than the bedroom, but ours is primarily a sexual D/s relationship. We will be having a commitment ceremony in a few months. We will decide closer to the time if there will be a collar involved.

I feel our relationship is as entitled to be Master/sub as any other. No one's choices are better or worse than any one elses. We take the bits of BDSM that suit us and leave the rest. I'm learning how to please Him, and He is teaching me so much about my responses and the depth of my love for Him just keeps growing.....

Labels are for jars and bottles, not people and relationships

Minus the health issue you pretty much described my skitten and I. I hate labels and we certainly are not hard core. We can’t live a 24 / 7 lifestyle for many reasons KIDS being one. We look forward to a time when maybe we can. I know there are many others here that I respect and enjoy learning for and talking with. To me they live and are the real deal. I never quite understood or got the hang of the online Dom/sub thing. Just to me now, I’m not knocking it if that’s what your into but It just don’t seem real to me.

My wife of soon to be 17 years is clearly a sub and most all of out bdsm play is limited to the bedroom. She is my sub but I don’t own her, she will how ever serve my every wish.

We do our own thing.

 

[bbkradwell]

My take on the subject:

I guess it's all, pretty much, as someone already stated, subjective. Slave/ submissive. A rose by any other name, it's all semantics. Can someone be one and not the other?
It IS possible to be a sub and not a slave. But not the other way around.