Thanks Kim Davis! A Majority Of Americans Now Oppose “Religious Freedom” Loopholes

[Ulaven_Demorte]

Now who's getting the last laugh?

A majority of Americans oppose “religious freedom” exemptions for government officials who wish to discriminate against same-sex couples while on the job, a new Associated Press-Gfk poll shows.

According to the poll’s results, 56 percent of Americans think government officials who oppose same-sex marriage should be required to issue them in accordance with the law, compared to 41 percent who believe there should be “religious exemptions” for people of faith in such situations.

The findings reflect major changes for both Democrats and Republicans after a similar poll gauged their reaction to the Supreme Court’s decision on same-sex marriage in July.

At that time, 49 percent of Americans said there should be religious exemptions for people of faith while 47 percent said there should not.

The change in opinion in such little time could be contributed in part to the fact that Americans experienced first-hand how harmful it can be when government officials decide to obey their own laws when Kim Davis, the defiant Kentucky county clerk who found fame after disobeying several court orders to issue same-sex marriage licenses, found herself in jail this summer.

The AP notes that the biggest change in opinion happened among Republicans. In July, 72 percent of Republicans favored religious exemptions, but now, only 58 percent still support them.

Notable changes were also recorded among Democrats. In July, 67 percent opposed religious exemptions, and recently, that number rose to 73 percent.

 

[DSpeeGal]

what about signing statements?

 

[Ulaven_Demorte]

what about signing statements?

Still don't like them. I think a President should either sign a bill into law or veto it. Tossing a caveat that into a law that "I personally believe that this infringes on my powers" is bullshit.

Do you have anything pertinent to THIS topic to offer?

 

[toubab]

The only polls that count are the ones that involve actual voting instead of questionable phone conversations and the like. Look at what happened yesterday in Kentucky.

 

[Ulaven_Demorte]

The only polls that count are the ones that involve actual voting instead of questionable phone conversations and the like. Look at what happened yesterday in Kentucky.

You mean the same Kentucky that is home to "Democrats" like Kim Davis?

It's not surprising that Kentucky went for the Republican Gubernatorial candidate. Their older "Democrats" are almost imperceptibly milder versions of the Dixiecrats.

 

[toubab]

You mean the same Kentucky that is home to "Democrats" like Kim Davis?

It's not surprising that Kentucky went for the Republican Gubernatorial candidate. Their older "Democrats" are almost imperceptibly milder versions of the Dixiecrats.

Yes, that Kentucky. And it's not just older Democrats who voted for the Republican, who was consistently behind by five in all the polls except for one, which was a Republican poll which had the race tied. The Republican won by nine, a difference of fourteen from the "trusted" polling. Polling today cannot be trusted.

 

[RobDownSouth]

Yes, that Kentucky. And it's not just older Democrats who voted for the Republican, who was consistently behind by five in all the polls except for one, which was a Republican poll which had the race tied. The Republican won by nine, a difference of fourteen from the "trusted" polling. Polling today cannot be trusted.

Fallacy of the small sample. You are using one data point and declarin' a trend.

That's queerbait-class ignorance.

 

[toubab]

Fallacy of the small sample. You are using one data point and declarin' a trend.

That's queerbait-class ignorance.

If you haven't noticed the trend, you're the one who is ignorant.

 

[DSpeeGal]

You don't understand

2 people complain about some Lib shit, and all hell breaks out, and Hussein Obama Bin Soetoro gets involved

Election after Election, goes one way, and its meaningless

 

[NOIRTRASH]

On the other hand America hanged plenty of Nazis for doing their duties. At the time America championed religious defiance of immoral laws and orders. We were right.

I defied a few court orders. On one occasion a judge ordered a child placed with her sexual abuser. I put her in a highway patrol car and drove up the interstate till our lawyers got the order squashed.

On another occasion a silly judge ordered unsupervised visits with a mom who tried to murder her kids. I told the judge, NO WAY JOSE.

 

[RobDownSouth]

If you haven't noticed the trend, you're the one who is ignorant.

How'd that "unskewed polls" meme work out for you in 2012?

 

[Lord Pmann]

On the other hand America hanged plenty of Nazis for doing their duties. At the time America championed religious defiance of immoral laws and orders. We were right.

I defied a few court orders. On one occasion a judge ordered a child placed with her sexual abuser. I put her in a highway patrol car and drove up the interstate till our lawyers got the order squashed.

On another occasion a silly judge ordered unsupervised visits with a mom who tried to murder her kids. I told the judge, NO WAY JOSE.

Oh you rebel, you.

 

[toubab]

How'd that "unskewed polls" meme work out for you in 2012?

You must have forgotten that both Gallup, the "gold standard of polling", and Rasmussen had Romney winning. I haven't. I also haven't forgotten how atrociously bad the polling was in 2010 and 2014 across the board and across the country for all kinds of races.

 

[richard_daily]

If you haven't noticed the trend, you're the one who is ignorant.

Where's the trend?

 

[toubab]

Where's the trend?

Duuuuuuuuuuhhhhhhhhhhhh.

 

[Ulaven_Demorte]

In recent news, Kim Davis has lost yet ANOTHER appeal of the judges ruling that she must issue marriage licenses to same sex couples. This time she tried to claim that the judges ruling applied ONLY to the four couples involved in the suit and not all couples seeking licenses.

This brings her appeal record to ZERO wins.

But all is not lost for the intolerant, the new Teahadist Governor of Kentucky has said that he will be working "to accommodate the religious beliefs of Kim Davis and other Kentucky Clerks."

Next up, should the new Governor succeed, the SCOTUS finds Kentucky's new religious accommodations law unconstitutional in yet another stunning blow to homophobic religious zealots.

 

[DSpeeGal]

Demented Mentally Ill "person" flogs a dead horse

Where is the ASPCA?

 

[Ulaven_Demorte]

I know DizzyBooby.. You're still stinging from the massive smackdown you received.

Don't worry, nobody thinks any less of you. That wouldn't be possible.

 

[lovecraft68]

The world would be a much more peaceful safer place with Christians not trying to spread "God's love" and peaceful Muslims killing everyone.

In general with no religion we'd be a much better society world wide.

 

[Liar]

Fallacy of the small sample.

Voter turnout was about 31%. So it can be argued reality was a pretty small sample.

 

[magicalmoments]

I know very little about constitutional rights in the USA but it seems to me that if the Supreme Court has ruled that the people have a certain constitutional right, for example gay marriage, then there is never any justifiable reason for anyone to deny a person seeking to exercise that right. To do so would be a breach of the constitution.

 

[Colonel Hogan]

I know very little about constitutional rights in the USA but it seems to me that if the Supreme Court has ruled that the people have a certain constitutional right, for example gay marriage, then there is never any justifiable reason for anyone to deny a person seeking to exercise that right. To do so would be a breach of the constitution.

The Constitutional right for gays to marry would be no less nor any greater than the right to the "free exercise" of religion guaranteed by the First Amendment. If the free exercise of YOUR religion implores you to stand in opposition to homosexual behavior and the normalization thereof throughout society, then we have a conflict. And the law ESTABLISHES AND PROTECTS your right to stand in opposition to someone else's right(s) if that's what your "free exercise" entails. That is NOT the same as saying the law authorizes you to break the law in so doing, but your religion and your practice of it does not have to recognize someone else's rights. And many religions don't when they teach that God's law is superior to man's law.

What is very easy to miss in this day and age is that secular law in this country has a long tradition of "borrowing" from the moral principles and teachings of Judeo Christian theology. "Thou shalt not kill" is an easy one that directly transfers to homicide criminal statutes. But it also used to apply much more broadly to abortions. Additionally, there were all sorts of prohibited sexual behavior statutes with regard to interracial marriage, sodomy, adultery (particularly in establishing legal "grounds" for divorce and division of property), and so forth. Things that today most people view as being absolutely none of the state's business.

With this as a background, it is very difficult for many people who remember those days to adjust to secular law that no longer parallels religious precepts as faithfully as it once did.

 

[phrodeau]

The Constitutional right for gays to marry would be no less nor any greater than the right to the "free exercise" of religion guaranteed by the First Amendment. If the free exercise of YOUR religion implores you to stand in opposition to homosexual behavior and the normalization thereof throughout society, then we have a conflict. And the law ESTABLISHES AND PROTECTS your right to stand in opposition to someone else's right(s) if that's what your "free exercise" entails. That is NOT the same as saying the law authorizes you to break the law in so doing, but your religion and your practice of it does not have to recognize someone else's rights. And many religions don't when they teach that God's law is superior to man's law.

What is very easy to miss in this day and age is that secular law in this country has a long tradition of "borrowing" from the moral principles and teachings of Judeo Christian theology. "Thou shalt not kill" is an easy one that directly transfers to homicide criminal statutes. But it also used to apply much more broadly to abortions. Additionally, there were all sorts of prohibited sexual behavior statutes with regard to interracial marriage, sodomy, adultery (particularly in establishing legal "grounds" for divorce and division of property), and so forth. Things that today most people view as being absolutely none of the state's business.

With this as a background, it is very difficult for many people who remember those days to adjust to secular law that no longer parallels religious precepts as faithfully as it once did.

Those who say that Middle-Eastern Muslims are living in a Medieval era might consider how much Western culture changed over the last few dozen decades.

 

[Colonel Hogan]

Those who say that Middle-Eastern Muslims are living in a Medieval era might consider how much Western culture changed over the last few dozen decades.

And for much of my childhood slavery itself was less than a century in the past.

 

[toubab]

In recent news, Kim Davis has lost yet ANOTHER appeal of the judges ruling that she must issue marriage licenses to same sex couples. This time she tried to claim that the judges ruling applied ONLY to the four couples involved in the suit and not all couples seeking licenses.

This brings her appeal record to ZERO wins.

But all is not lost for the intolerant, the new Teahadist Governor of Kentucky has said that he will be working "to accommodate the religious beliefs of Kim Davis and other Kentucky Clerks."

Next up, should the new Governor succeed, the SCOTUS finds Kentucky's new religious accommodations law unconstitutional in yet another stunning blow to homophobic religious zealots.

It won't be a law. It will be an executive order. And it will be interesting to see if the courts want to challenge the right of the executive branch to issue executive orders.