Soldiers!

REDWAVE

Urban Jungle Dweller
Joined
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Posts
6,013
SOLDIERS!

Why are you in Iraq? Is it to stop the threat from Saddam Hussein's "huge arsenal of weapons of mass destruction"? No, because not the tiniest trace of any such weapons has been found. Is it to topple the dictatorship of Hussein and his Baathist Party? Again, no-- the U.S. government supports many brutal dictatorial regimes in the same region, including Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Azerbaijan, etc. Is it to "bring democracy to the Middle East"? A thousand times NO! The U.S. government has even engineered the overthrow of democratically elected governments, such as that of Mossadegh in Iran, replacing it with the brutal dictatorship of the Shah. How can Bush bring democracy to the Middle East, when we don't even have democracy here at home? We all know the real reasons you have been sent to Iraq: to control the oil of the Middle East, and further the cause of U.S. world domination.

Soldiers! We know that most of you don't want to be there. You are there only because you have been ordered there. We know also that you live in constant fear of attack, and that the attacks on you by guerillas are much more numerous than what people are told back here at home. We know that many of you have been crippled and maimed for life, losing an arm, a leg, an eye, your manhood, etc. We want you brought home NOW!

Soldiers! We know that many of you live in horrendous conditions, ten to a tent, suffering in the heat, in the dust-- while the Army brass and the Air Force flyboys live in luxury and opulence! We also know that many of you are reservists, and have seen your lives totally disrupted, and in some cases destroyed, by being called up. In many cases, your income has drastically declined, you have lost your civilian jobs, your family has been hounded by creditors, your marriages or love relationships have fallen apart under the pressure of separation and poverty. As one reservist said: "One weekend a month, my ass!"

Soldiers! Bush and his rich cronies are just using you, and laughing at you. He has not attended a single funeral of your fallen comrades. They regard you as chumps and suckers. While sending you off to fight and die, they have cut veterans' benefits! They are fighting a lawsuit to get compensation for American troops who were captured and tortured in Iraq in 1991! They don't give a damn about you! To them, you are just cannon fodder to be used to fight and die for oil and empire. YOU will get to make the sacrifices and endure the hardships; THEY will reap the benefits. Bechtel, Halliburton, and other big companies are reaping a bonanza in Iraq from their shameless war profiteering. They get the gold mine. You get the shaft.

Soldiers! When you come home-- if you come home-- there will likely not even be a job for you. Back here, the rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer. They are celebrating a so-called economic "recovery" even while job losses mount! Many of the homeless here are vets. You will be used and then discarded, squeezed dry like an orange and then thrown away!

Soldiers! You have been lied to repeatedly. They told you the Iraqis would welcome you with open arms as "liberators"-- did that happen? They told you that you would be home quickly-- did that happen?

Soldiers! Tens of millions of Americans are filled with anger and outrage against Bush and his gangster regime, but their voices are largely stifled and suppressed by the lying corporate media. Mass demonstrations have already broken out against the occupation of Iraq, and will only grow larger over time. Your family, your friends, your loved ones all want you back home!

Soldiers! We know many, if not most, of you are blacks, Latinos, or poor whites. This war will not benefit you or yours, only the filthy rich pigs who exploit and oppress all the rest of us. You are committing the same ignominious crimes against the Iraqi people which the cops commit against your friends and neighbors here at home! Not only that, but the war you have been sent to fight is an immoral one, a colonial war of repression, and a violation of international law. The Nuremburg Tribunal, set up by the U.S. itself after World War Two, established the precedent that obeying orders is NOT a defense to charges of war crimes. The illegitimate Bush regime is committing war crimes and crimes against humanity right and left in Iraq! You have a moral duty to resist and disobey unlawful orders.

Soldiers! The Iraqi people are NOT your enemy. They are victims and pawns, just as you are. Your true enemy, and theirs, is the same: the lying warmongers who sent you there, and the filthy rich parasites they front for.

Soldiers! In Vietnam, another unjust war of imperialist aggression and mass murder of poor, dark-skinned people, many U.S. soldiers refused to fight. When a gung ho officer tried to force them to fight, he received a little present, in the form of a live granade rolled under his tent flap in the middle of the night. Even the most gung ho officer has to sleep sometime . . .

SOLDIERS-- TURN THE GUNS AROUND! Shoot your officers down! Rise up in rightful rebellion against the lying warmongering scum who sent you off to die for oil and Halliburton! The world will applaud you for your heroic resistance to imperialist aggression.


-- Statement of the Fourth Internationalist Committee. Reproduce and distribute as widely as possible, especially to U.S. military personnel.
 
Errrrrr..... well, tho I don't exactly agree with the method, I do agree that OIL is the reason our soldiers are in Iraq. Its ALL about $$$$, isn't it???

-kym- Remembering our bothers and sisters who are paying for oil with their lives :rose:
 
Amen

MY-Sir's-k- said:
Errrrrr..... well, tho I don't exactly agree with the method, I do agree that OIL is the reason our soldiers are in Iraq. Its ALL about $$$$, isn't it???

-kym- Remembering our bothers and sisters who are paying for oil with their lives :rose:

How true. Bring them home now.
 
How many soldiers in Iraq are able to log onto the 'net?

Once again Red proves to us how fuggin dumb he is.
 
MY-Sir's-k- said:
Errrrrr..... well, tho I don't exactly agree with the method, I do agree that OIL is the reason our soldiers are in Iraq. Its ALL about $$$$, isn't it???

-kym- Remembering our bothers and sisters who are paying for oil with their lives :rose:

Yeah, and the earth is flat.
 
miles said:
Yeah, and the earth is flat.

So you don't believe the US is in Iraq for the oil and the soldiers are there to protect American businessmen with contracts in their back pockets issued by Washington to be negotiated with an American apponted Iraqi Government...

So exactly what do you believe?

That the US is in it because Saadam was a bad guy?

ppman
 
Hussein was murdering his own people. Had Bush simply used that as his reason for war, perhaps there wouldn't be as much opposition as there was. Using WMD as a reason was faulty. If he had any he would have used them during the 'shlock and flaw' period of the war.

MISSION NOTACCOMPLISHED.

Didn't America put him into power in the 80's the same way they helped Afghanistan in the 80's during their war with Russia?
 
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KindaKinky said:
Hussein was murdering his own people. Had Bush simply used that as his reason for war, perhaps there wouldn't be as much opposition as there was. Using WMD as a reason was faulty. If he had any he would have used them during the 'shlock and flaw' period of the war.

MISSION NOTACCOMPLISHED.

Didn't America put him into power in the 80's the same way they helped Afghanistan in the 80's during their war with Russia?

Plenty of leaders throughout the world murder their own people.

One of the most infamous was the Pol Pot regime...

Didn't see much of the US then.

'shlock and flaw'....:D haven't seen it expressed that way before...

ppman
 
we are there because the u.n falled to do there job and all billy done was kick the can down the road.

why cant we bering back the boys and girls that are in germany and france and let them pay for there own military put are people on are borders and stop the illegals from coming over?
 
Excuse me, sorry to be a fly in someone's coffee again, but the story of Tokyo Rose was a total falsehood.

Iva Toguri was not only falsely accused of treason, but she was also eventually pardoned.

She was absolutely nothing like Jane Fonda.
 
HeavyStick said:
How many soldiers in Iraq are able to log onto the 'net?

Once again Red proves to us how fuggin dumb he is.

A few. Mostly in Transport, by the ones that I've come across. They always complain about the heat, dust, and lots of bugs. One even has his own Blog.
 
bra_man69 said:
we are there because the u.n falled to do there job and all billy done was kick the can down the road.

why cant we bering back the boys and girls that are in germany and france and let them pay for there own military put are people on are borders and stop the illegals from coming over?

I would have to disagree with the statement, "...the u.n falled to do there job..". They obviously did their job very well, since the invading Coalition troops didn't get hit by any Iraqi WMDs, and not a trace of any real WMDs have been found even months later by the US/UK forces.
 
REDWAVE said:
We know that most of you don't want to be there. You are there only because you have been ordered there.
Nobody wants a war, and soldiers follow orders.

These people figure that out and think they're goddamn revolutionaries.

REDWAVE said:
-- Statement of the Fourth Internationalist Committee. Reproduce and distribute as widely as possible, especially to U.S. military personnel.
What happened to the first three?

TB4p
 
KindaKinky said:
Hussein was murdering his own people. Had Bush simply used that as his reason for war, perhaps there wouldn't be as much opposition as there was. Using WMD as a reason was faulty. If he had any he would have used them during the 'shlock and flaw' period of the war.

MISSION NOTACCOMPLISHED.

Didn't America put him into power in the 80's the same way they helped Afghanistan in the 80's during their war with Russia?

Saddam has been in power since the '70's and no America didn't put him in power.
 
Officers are soldiers too

You tell the soldiers to turn the guns on the commanding officers and kill them... okay do you really think the new Lt fresh out of OTS has any say in the fact that we are over there, perhaps the Capt who has served a whole 2 years in the military can somehow convince the federal government to bring us home. We are soldiers because we choose to be, we raise our hand and swear to defend the United States against all enemies, not all enemies that we agree are our enemies, not only the ones that will fight fair, not only the ones that we feel like fighting. I have been in the military for 16 years and I will go where they send me and fight if the tell me to. I don't have to agree, I have to do what I swore to do when I raised my hand and joined the military. I was not drafted and no one forced me to join, I choose to do it, I have served this country proudly for 16 years and will contiue to serve proudly until it is time for me to retire. Though I may not agree with why we are there, I will not refuse to go and I don't believe among the Non-commissioned officers you will find many who would refuse.
 
My post is not going to go very well here. I was in Desert Shield, Desert Storm and Proven Comfort. I was stationed in Turkey at the time so I was one of the first ones there and last ones to leave. The weekend warriors got all of the perks but we who were there for the whole thing got little. I now know how the VietNam vets felt when they returned home. I was critized by people I worked with when I got out and told that I was a fool. Those of us who served and serve in the military do what we are told. It is not our place to question the right or wrong, can you imagine a military whose soldiers all made their own decision of whether they want to fight or not. It is no different from police officers and fireman, maybe they to should decide whether they want to uphold the law or not. Whether or not it is right we don't question. We follow the flag, the flag that has meant so much, a flag that means freedom, and a lot of people who died to give us that freedom. Right or wrong we do the job that was and is asked of us. Many who have not served don't understand this. Some of us join the military because we want to give something back to the country that we live in.
 
I'm with dragon tamer in this.
If you don't like what we, the military, are doing then get the man giving us our marching orders out of Washington.
Redwave Wrote:
SOLDIERS-- TURN THE GUNS AROUND! Shoot your officers down! Rise up in rightful rebellion against the lying warmongering scum who sent you off to die for oil and Halliburton! The world will applaud you for your heroic resistance to imperialist aggression.

Um... HELL NO! The revolution was rightful rebellion, doing as you say would be an atrocity that'd only get more people killed. Then those "insane" soldiers would be caught, taken back to the US, court marshalled and killed or imprisoned for life.
You tell me how that helps anyone? I can understand not wanting our troops in Iraq- but they said similar things about Korea and Japan too. Now if we weren't here the Koreans would probably walk all over Japan (more then a little animosity between the two).
What you suggest is inane, ill-thought out and obviously trying to start a fight. What pleasure do you get from this? From making people argue with you? Is there that little joy in your life you must take it from others?
 
Fraternization

As Lenin very shrewdly remarked, the revolution is not so much a fight against the army as a fight for the army.
 
Daddy Warbucks speaks

"On behalf of myself and my fellow plutocrats, I would like to thank all you chumps and suckers-- er, I mean heroes-- who mindlessly obey orders and go slogging off wherever we tell you to go. Thanks to you, the profits of giant, U.S. based multinational corporations are safe and secure. As Thomas Friedman cannily remarked, the "hidden hand" which supports U.S. capitalism throughout the world is the not-so-hidden hand of the U.S. military. Without you saps willing to shed your blood to serve the interests of big business, my portfolio of investments would not be nearly as profitable as it is."
 
Re: Fraternization

REDWAVE said:
As Lenin very shrewdly remarked, the revolution is not so much a fight against the army as a fight for the army.

Wasn't this the same Lenin who set up the Cheka and systematically starved his peasants to death?
 
LovingTongue said:
Excuse me, sorry to be a fly in someone's coffee again, but the story of Tokyo Rose was a total falsehood.

The true story was addressed by me in another thread. Here it's being used as a joke. REDWAVE, you're a joke. Explain it.
 
Right or wrong...

A Soldier's Story
By Matt Condon
t r u t h o u t | Perspective

Tuesday 11 November 2003

I am a veteran of the United States Army. For three years, I served as an armored crewman in the third armored division, stationed in Germany. It is arguable that I served my country to protect her. That is what I was taught to believe and I shall believe it to this day. I am proud of my service and would like to think it was a benefit to the citizens of this country.

You see, I trained to protect the Fulda Gap. This was before the Berlin Wall came down. There were “Western” ideals and “Eastern” pressures. There was, or at least there was perceived, a true “Communist Threat” to Western civilization. Arguably, that same threat was a threat to the “American Way of Life.”

I was trained to believe, rightly or wrongly at the time, that there was a real threat poised right over the border. Mere kilometers from my post stood “The Enemy.” The Fulda Gap was regarded as the likely entry point for “The Enemy” at that time. I walked the perimeter of one of the largest missile silos on that border pulling “twelve hours on, twelve hours off.” Through snow and sleet, facing wild boars and the ever-impending “threat” of the enemy, we guarded those missiles in defense of the United States of America and its way of life. Yes, we were on foreign soil, but I truly believe that, at that time, we were working for the good of our nation. We trained by living in our tanks, by supporting the Infantry and by being supported by Artillery units. We froze, crawled through mud and snow, and somehow survived it all.

What does it mean to protect your nation? It means that you are “defending” not only your soil, but also your way of life, your ideals, your identity and yes, you family and every family that resides within your borders. It means that soldiers are “defending” their soil from an inherent “threat.” A “threat” is defined as an external force, identified by intelligence and ideals, which directly threaten a free and peaceful society. At the time, we were “defending” the Fulda Gap, and Western Europe, from that very threat.

We now find ourselves in the year 2003. I am no longer in the service, but have pondered what life would be like if I were. Oh, what a different time we find ourselves in. What do our soldiers believe in today? What would I believe if I were still manning the 120mm cannon of an M1A1 tank?

The Fulda Gap incursion is no longer a threat. Mainland Europe is relatively safe, as are the shores of these United States. Oh don’t worry, this former soldier remembers 9/11 like it was yesterday. I spent that Tuesday glued to my television like every other world citizen. I was angry. I wept. Then I started to read. And what I learned shocked me as a veteran, shocked me as a citizen and shocked me as a human being. Pushing aside any conspiracy theory that these attacks were not committed without complacency, a theory that I happen to subscribe to, our soldiers and our public are faced with a dilemma. How should we respond - with diplomacy or might? If we respond with might, then who or what should be our target?

Waging war in Iraq? Exactly how are our soldiers “defending America” by preemptively striking Iraq?

They aren’t. Iraq was never a threat to these United States. There was never a threat to these or any shores. No Uranium from Niger. No Weapons Of Mass Distraction.” No Nukes. No Bombs. There were experts who told us this, but did we listen? I challenge you, the reader, to make one case for war based on a direct threat. Show me the evidence.

A soldier’s responsibility is to “defend America,” at all costs and with his or her life if necessary. It is an oath. It is a creed. However, on this Veteran’s Day, this Veteran has to wonder exactly how our troops in Iraq are “defending” this nation, “defending” our way of life, or are “defending” our shores. This is not a “defensive” war. There were no Iraqi citizens on those planes that fateful day in September. There were no Iraqi citizens “infiltrating” our shores. This war didn’t have to happen and we are no safer as American citizens because of it. Our soldiers are being forced to kill rather than protect. Yes, there is a huge difference. As a veteran, that does not make me proud at all. In fact, I feel used.

This war, and the death that is the result, is the direct fault of the President of these United States. He decided that he had a score to settle (for numerous reasons) and it is evident that his decision serves the self-interests of his business partners. This is in no way a “defensive war,” nor are our troops “protecting” this country or its citizens. American forces are not “protecting” our way of life. They have been misused and they are now dying as are their “enemy,” which includes many civilians. This is a war created by Americans so powerful and wealthy that one could call them demigods, who preemptively invaded a region of the world they neither understand nor respect. They have turned the men and women serving in our Armed Forces into cowboys wearing black hats, the same black hats you saw on TV worn by the ‘villains’ in old Western movies.

Ultimately, someone has to take the blame for this travesty. I do blame someone. I blame George W. Bush.

Live with it Mr. Bush. You are a disgrace to this veteran.

http://truthout.org/docs_03/111103G.shtml
 
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