Socialism is now popular among young folks, UNLIKE 2 years ago

[LJ_Reloaded]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/12/29/young-people-socialism_n_1175218.html?ref=fb&src=sp&comm_re

Young People More Likely To Favor Socialism Than Capitalism: Pew

The Huffington Post Alexander Eichler
First Posted: 12/29/11 05:43 PM ET Updated: 12/29/11 06:45 PM ET

Young people -- the collegiate and post-college crowd, who have served as the most visible face of the Occupy Wall Street movement -- might be getting more comfortable with socialism. That's the surprising result from a Pew Research Center poll that aims to measure American sentiments toward different political labels.

The poll, published Wednesday, found that while Americans overall tend to oppose socialism by a strong margin -- 60 percent say they have a negative view of it, versus just 31 percent who say they have a positive view -- socialism has more fans than opponents among the 18-29 crowd. Forty-nine percent of people in that age bracket say they have a positive view of socialism; only 43 percent say they have a negative view.

And while those numbers aren't very far apart, it's noteworthy that they were reversed just 20 months ago, when Pew conducted a similar poll. In that survey, published May 2010, 43 percent of people age 18-29 said they had a positive view of socialism, and 49 percent said their opinion was negative.

 

[Sean Renaud]

Which is a bad thing. To bad the idiots on the right watching this and thinking. Hmmm. . . .smoke. Ignore it.

 

[GracefullyYours]

It's part of the cycle. The younger generation thinks they're entitled (RE: Occupy shit), and socialism fits right in with that.

 

[Sean Renaud]

It's part of the cycle. The younger generation thinks they're entitled (RE: Occupy shit), and socialism fits right in with that.

The younger generation IS entitled. It's not a feeling when they actually are owed it. Just as we were and just as the generation before us was.

 

[GracefullyYours]

The younger generation IS entitled. It's not a feeling when they actually are owed it. Just as we were and just as the generation before us was.

It is my personal belief that I'm owed nothing and entitled to nothing except the chance to make my own living and create a life for myself.

 

[Sean Renaud]

It is my personal belief that I'm owed nothing and entitled to nothing except the chance to make my own living and create a life for myself.

You're wrong. Or at the very least your oversimplifying things. Every generation up to this point was simply handed a better life than their parents had before them. It was their birthright as Americans. The current generation is struggling, despite many of them having done everything that they were told to do, to get on their own feet.

 

[LJ_Reloaded]

It is my personal belief that I'm owed nothing and entitled to nothing except the chance to make my own living and create a life for myself.

Then why don't you just move to a jungle and live there? There's no difference between your beliefs and the life of forest animals.

 

[GracefullyYours]

You're wrong. Or at the very least your oversimplifying things. Every generation up to this point was simply handed a better life than their parents had before them. It was their birthright as Americans. The current generation is struggling, despite many of them having done everything that they were told to do, to get on their own feet.

Who cares what people before me had? I don't think my life - I - deserve to be graded on a curve, so to speak. We get to play the hand we're dealt, and I don't think that what other people have or don't have, today or yesterday, this generation or the last, has a bearing on what I should expect.

As Nacho Libre said, "I am the gatekeeper of my own destiny, and I will have my glory day in the hot sun." Idk about glory or hot sun, but I agree with the responsible part.

 

[GracefullyYours]

Then why don't you just move to a jungle and live there? There's no difference between your beliefs and the life of forest animals.

Actually, that is pretty much how I feel. While I feel I'm owed no help and that I'm responsible for my life and choices, I do feel an obligation to my family and loved ones, whom I help to support.

 

[FloridaSmoothie]

You're wrong. Or at the very least your oversimplifying things. Every generation up to this point was simply handed a better life than their parents had before them. It was their birthright as Americans. The current generation is struggling, despite many of them having done everything that they were told to do, to get on their own feet.

"It was their birthright as Americans." Oh, yes, stated right there in the Constitution.

 

[LJ_Reloaded]

Actually, that is pretty much how I feel. While I feel I'm owed no help and that I'm responsible for my life and choices, I do feel an obligation to my family and loved ones, whom I help to support.

Like I said, what is the point of you living in a civilized society? Why don't you leave and go to a place where families support themselves and fuck all for everyone else?

You have no place in a nation. A nation that lives by your rules does not survive long.

 

[Sean Renaud]

Nope not in the Constitution. They call it the American Dream though and people have died getting here to live that dream. People STILL die today coming here to live that dream and escape whatever countries they are in.

Who cares what people before me had? I don't think my life - I - deserve to be graded on a curve, so to speak. We get to play the hand we're dealt, and I don't think that what other people have or don't have, today or yesterday, this generation or the last, has a bearing on what I should expect.

As Nacho Libre said, "I am the gatekeeper of my own destiny, and I will have my glory day in the hot sun." Idk about glory or hot sun, but I agree with the responsible part.

You should care. The fact that you don't doesn't matter.

The idea that you are the gatekeeper to your own destiny is laughably naive though. The reality is you are a product of your enviroment. Sure you have some effect on how things play out the but the biggest factor is what tools are around for you to use in the first place. Our parents and grandparents before them laid down the foundation so we didn't have to start over at the beginning.

 

[GracefullyYours]

Like I said, what is the point of you living in a civilized society? Why don't you leave and go to a place where families support themselves and fuck all for everyone else?

You have no place in a nation. A nation that lives by your rules does not survive long.

Because I think that I'm also responsible for contributing posiitively. I volunteer frequently at homeless shelters, I donate my time and the money I've earned, and I do my best to make a positive impact on those around me.

When I said i deserve nothing, that's true. I don't think I'm owed anything for having been born. That being said, I'm still giving to others. I'm not an island. I pay taxes and I do all that's required of me. In exchange, I have the privilege of working, growing, achieving, and supporting myself.

 

[GracefullyYours]

Nope not in the Constitution. They call it the American Dream though and people have died getting here to live that dream. People STILL die today coming here to live that dream and escape whatever countries they are in.

You should care. The fact that you don't doesn't matter.

The idea that you are the gatekeeper to your own destiny is laughably naive though. The reality is you are a product of your enviroment. Sure you have some effect on how things play out the but the biggest factor is what tools are around for you to use in the first place. Our parents and grandparents before them laid down the foundation so we didn't have to start over at the beginning.

I am a product of my environment, and I agree that I've been greatly impacted by my surroundings and the tools at my disposal. I still don't see why I "should" feel entitled, though? I'm still owed nothing. I've been more fortunate than many, to be sure, but I'm still owed nothing. I see it as fortune - a blessing - not something I'm owed or deserve.

 

[Sean Renaud]

I am a product of my environment, and I agree that I've been greatly impacted by my surroundings and the tools at my disposal. I still don't see why I "should" feel entitled, though? I'm still owed nothing. I've been more fortunate than many, to be sure, but I'm still owed nothing. I see it as fortune - a blessing - not something I'm owed or deserve.

So let me get this straight. You admit you're a product of your enviroment and happily take advantage of all the tools given to you. Yet you don't feel you had the right to use them?

 

[GracefullyYours]

So let me get this straight. You admit you're a product of your enviroment and happily take advantage of all the tools given to you. Yet you don't feel you had the right to use them?

I think that you and I are misunderstanding each other....

I don't feel that the government, this country, or society owes me anything. When you say "entitled," that's what I understand you to mean. I was born into a family of intelligent and hard-working people; I've benefited from my family and my upbringing and I was taught to work hard and support myself. I feel that I was entitled to be taken care of by my family until I was 18 years old, at which point I moved out and began supporting myself...effectively, I might add.

 

[koalabear]

T-ball mentality, I knew it would bring the country down.

 

[Sean Renaud]

I think that you and I are misunderstanding each other....

I don't feel that the government, this country, or society owes me anything. When you say "entitled," that's what I understand you to mean. I was born into a family of intelligent and hard-working people; I've benefited from my family and my upbringing and I was taught to work hard and support myself. I feel that I was entitled to be taken care of by my family until I was 18 years old, at which point I moved out and began supporting myself...effectively, I might add.

You were born not only into a family with upbringing, but also a country with tools. Tools your parents helped build not only through there work but through their taxes. Also through whatever voting they've done over the years to shape various parts of our country be it funding for schools or funding the space race. If you don't like the word entitled, then call it collecting what your parents paid for. Regardless it is yours.

 

[CandiCame]

The younger generation IS entitled. It's not a feeling when they actually are owed it. Just as we were and just as the generation before us was.

Everyone write this day down. It's my first, and possibly last political rant.

See... I'm pretty young, and I think that I'm not really owed, money or anything, but that there are social obligations that I should get, or I shouldn't have to be a citizen (pay taxes, pay attention to government and vote, use their utilities, ect). If I don't get what I want, I think I should be allowed to just dissapear, and they should leave me the fuck alone.

But the thing is, we don't really live in a democracy- we live in a capitalist democracy. And that means that to even begin to be able to do that (land, solar generators, water collectors and other crazy, green man in the woods shit are incredibly expensive even if you DIY most of it. I'm going to be awesome when I'm old!) you have to survive within the system- and win at it, long enough to make money.

So for whatever your goal is, as a young adult- this point- this "college/right after college" point is a waiting game. You work shitty jobs and you wait on your degree so that your real life can start. And you start to think, "Why am I saving like this? Why don't I just move?"

You meet people from other countries and you discover that some (Saudi Arabia- where you can't see women, drive ever, and gay sex- again, in a culture where you can't see women- is punishable by death- and yet, where I was told I would probably still get raped at some point- to China, where apparently there are just to goddamn many people- to the point where it has become a problem and will drive you mad. Fuck them, right? Get a house in the country and chill for the first time in your life) suck. They suck way worse then yours. But some (Japan- which is, to hear them tell it just as crowded, as China, but sucks it up better and has my friends ready to stay here. Canada, England, Australia) have governments that just give shit away like free health insurance.

So I was like, "Wait- what?"
So I did some research. And I found out that we're paying for some of the countries that we conquered under our last president and are still rebuilding- I don't know enough about presidenting but I assume that you have to play 'real world' risk and build those lands back up or some shit- but that part's not important to this rant- to have governments that gave away health insurance. We were paying for their health insurance- but we didn't have socialized healthcare? That kind of pissed me off. I think we should come first- because hasn't that, historically been the American way? I mean we were founded by a document that opens, paraphrased:

"Dear King George;

Fuck you and your tea. Fuck your whole 'rule by divine right' bullshit. We are not paying this shit- or anything else that you seem to think we owe you. You are so out-of-touch with the real world- you have no idea what the colonies are like- you seem to be completely full of shit. Fuck you- and the ship you rode in on. Do not fuck with us on this.

-Americans"

Fuck with an American's supply of caffeine- and the shit be on.
Though I do find it ironic that most Americans I see drinking caffeine in this day and age-especially tea, buy it at Starbucks, which says, right under the logo that it's owned by the East India Trade company. They buy it for $7 a glass. I'm sure our ancestors would be real proud.

Anyway, then we did- what... a bunch of other wars- cumulative with staying the fuck up out of Hitler's shit until the Axis strait up fucked up our coolest beach state. Hawaii is awesome. It's all rich people and beaches- and they'll pay you exorbitant amounts to do anything- and you're close to Japan so you can get exclusive toys and sell them in the States. I want to live in Hawaii- anyway- then we came in and Captain America, if I remember my history correctly, killed Hitler-and his disproportionately hot girlfriend- and warned everyone again, that we are not the people to fuck with. Stay away.

So... I guess I really need someone to explain this to me, why are we still cleaning them up at all and why the hell are we making sure that they get national healthcare before us?

Now as to capitalism- I can get behind it. But I like socialism because it's communism that takes into account the greed and naturally capitalistic nature of... everyone I know. I like the idea that no matter how bad I fuck up, I can keep from starving- barely. I wish that there was a way to keep a roof over your head- some kind of government housing for when you were completely fucked that didn't have a waiting list 3 years long and tell you to fuck off they always went to women with families. Which- as an aside- WTF is that, government- I was told that when I applied to a lot of things- there are a fuck-ton of programs in Ky that are gender-exclusive. Anyway- I understand that democratic capitalism is supposed to be a meritocracy- but the problem is, it's possible to sink so far down that you cannot climb up. You could do something like... get a felony, that makes it impossible for you to get a job to pay your debts. And it's your fault, because you did whatever it was you did, so no one's gonna help you. We're an individualistic culture. You fucked up, and now it just piles and piles on top of you. Or, you bought something that you really couldn't afford (me and my apartment) because it was so fucking awesome that you were sure that if you just stretched everything else, you could afford it. But you couldn't. And you couldn't get out of your lease, because you owed so much money... and then you got evicted. And now no one else in town will rent to you...)

Seriously, what do you do in situations like that? There are times when you can almost see the light- almost have your bills paid or whatever- and the fucking tags are due on the car. And a cop notices. My point is, I guess, that in a true meritocracy, everyone would have a safety net- but that safety net would be identical and kind of suck. I don't like the idea, in a meritocracy, of hereditary property of value. I understand sentimental value, but I've talked before about how I don't like people who want things because of their monetary worth.
Like... everyone gets a shitty apartment in the bad side of town where everything's always breaking down, and you're expected to go to school and graduate or start working up a career path. No matter what you do or how bad you fuck up, you always have this really shitty place to go back to- but it's only slightly better then being homeless.
And socially, living there as an adult would be seen as something bad- something that you should have been able to do better than, so the few older people who live there would want to get out as quickly as possible. Or they're so beaten down by life that it doesn't bother them, and if that's the case, let them be.

And try not to let us die. All I'm saying with the healthcare thing is that it'll be way cheaper in the long run for you to take five or ten minutes and give me antipsychotics now then to heal the people I maim and the court, and the housing and all that. Most diseases are easier, and cheaper to treat if you get them early. Just let people be able to do that then have to wait and go to the ER- which is gonna cost you more, because it'll have escalated into something crazy at that point.

And you know that we aren't going to pay you anyway. Do it cheaper for yourselves.

Those are really the only two things I really want. I don't really somuchas feel entitled to them as I think it's pathetic that Canada can do it and we can't. That, as a patriot, hurts me. The government's gonna tell me that Canada can do something we can't? That just seems like something government man wouldn't stand for. Captain-Corporate-America.

It's not really somuch a sense of entitlement as it is just a sense of hope. The wish that one day these programs would exist- that we wouldn't have homeless people or folk in a society who didn't want to be. I don't think that most people are outsiders by choice- they're forced outside because the sanctium holds no value to them, and to become one with such a system would devalue their beliefs. I think that's true on either the extreme right or left. And the thing is- there are needs out there that are no being met on all fronts. As a politician, that is your job, to people the people of your country/state/city/town/district happy, healthy, and intelligent- especially in comparison with other countries or districts or whatever they may be. So if you have the choice between say- fucking around with old wars that need to be closed off and- instituting laws that would benifit your own constituites- then you need to evaluate that decision. That, unlike what most people seem to believe, is more congress then the president's doing, and congressmen never answer letters.

Never. Especially if they happen to be a senator from Kentucky, who has made their personal agenda very well-known in the hopes that it fits in with that of his more redneck constituents-but this particular constituent happens to be a fag. So, what do you do?

/end of rant for now *bumbumbum*

 

[eyer]

You're warrior queen and redheadedtexan's test-tube baby...

...aren't you?

 

[CandiCame]

You're warrior queen and redheadedtexan's test-tube baby...

...aren't you?

THose kids are like, $10,000. You think anyone ever invested that much in me?

 

[eyer]

THose kids are like, $10,000. You think anyone ever invested that much in me?

It's like that perpetual self-pity is the actual air you breathe...

 

[CandiCame]

It's like that perpetual self-pity is the actual air you breathe...

I know. The drugs I used to inhale were kinda better.

Hey- in dystopian socialism, can't we get free government somas and whatnot? How's that work?

 

[Dragonlipz]

It's part of the cycle. The younger generation thinks they're entitled (RE: Occupy shit), and socialism fits right in with that.

On the contrary, the Occupy movement does not feel that they are entitled to anything other than life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. You display a very limited and stunted world view that is not enhanced or bolstered by your posts....Hopefully, you will turn off FAUX NEWS and educate yourself.....you have everything to gain.....Namaste

 

[GracefullyYours]

On the contrary, the Occupy movement does not feel that they are entitled to anything other than life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. You display a very limited and stunted world view that is not enhanced or bolstered by your posts....Hopefully, you will turn off FAUX NEWS and educate yourself.....you have everything to gain.....Namaste

I feel that they are entitled to get off their asses and go back to work, just as you're entitled to your opinion and I'm entitled to ignore you completely.