Smoker's whinge

[Guest]

I know I am in a minority, especially in California. I know smoking is unhealthy, deadly for some, etc. But this is political, public neurosis. For decades now I have wondered why those who fight against second-hand smoke do not fight as adamantly against the majority of deadlier air pollutants (traffic, smog, industrial waste, etc.) in their neighborhoods. It seems ridiculous to me that in a traffic burdened city like SF (hardly 7 miles from any point to another) people will feel healthier by banning smoking in the parks. Thankfuck they left the ocean beach alone.

I don't want non-smokers lecturing me about fuck all (please start a non-smokers thread if you like); this is my rant for the day.

Perdita

S.F. board votes to ban smoking in city's parks - Only golf courses would be exempt - Suzanne Herel, SF Chronicle, January 26, 2005

Smokers, take heed: A new law is kicking your butts out of San Francisco parks and open spaces. The Board of Supervisors voted 8-3 Tuesday to outlaw smoking outdoors in all recreational areas managed by the city except for golf courses. That includes parks, squares, gardens and playing fields but not federal lands such as the Presidio or Ocean Beach.

"Secondhand smoke outdoors is just as dangerous (as indoors)," said Supervisor Michela Alioto-Pier, who said she drafted the law out of concern for the environment and children. "Like other young parents, I have had the wonderful experience of a child picking up a cigarette butt off the lawn and popping it in their mouth," she said, also noting that discarded butts make up 1 out of every 4 pieces of litter in the city, and take up to a dozen years to degrade.

The law now goes to Mayor Gavin Newsom, who is expected to sign it. The ordinance, to be enforced by police and employees, would not go into effect until July 1 to give the city time to erect "no smoking" signs. Supervisor Ross Mirkarimi unsuccessfully tried to get golf courses covered by the ordinance, saying it should apply to all city property. They had been exempted for several reasons, including the possibility that the ordinance could bite into the city's revenue stream, and that discarded cigarette butts aren't a big problem on golf courses. But, said Mirkarimi, "It has this undertone of elitism."

He voted against the law, along with board President Aaron Peskin and Supervisor Jake McGoldrick. McGoldrick, who represents the Richmond District, was particularly worried about how the law might disproportionately affect some immigrant communities, including Chinese Mah Jong players at Portsmouth Square who enjoy a cigarette with their game.

At Portsmouth Square park in the heart of Chinatown, cigarette butts littered the ground. The Chinese speakers on Tuesday's drizzly afternoon declined to be interviewed, but a security guard puffing on a cigarette said he was bothered by the idea of the fines -- $100 for the first offense, $200 for the second and $500 for subsequent infractions. "That's ridiculous, that is, man,'' he said, declining to give his name because he didn't want to get in trouble with his boss. "They need to find something else to stop people from doing.''

The sentiment was echoed elsewhere. "This is outside, man,'' said Damani Blankenship, puffing on a Newport in Hallidie Plaza at the foot of Powell Street. "I think this new law is terrible. This isn't a bar or a small room. This is outdoors. Lots of fresh air out here. How can this be a problem?''

The article was edited for brevity, look it up yourself if you want to read more.

 

[ABSTRUSE]

I'm with you P, I choose to smoke.
I detest football games but I don't say there shouldn't be football playing in a park.

I don't want to sit near a crying brat in a restraunt, but I tolerate it.


I tolerate alot of other people's rights and priveleges...but let's be real, banning smoking in the outdoors in insane!!!

If I can't walk around topless in the summer, then let me have a damn cigarette!!!

 

[Guest]

If I can't walk around topless in the summer, then let me have a damn cigarette!!!

Let's start a new campaign. Public topless smoking. (Except on stupid golf courses.)

Perdita

 

[sweetnpetite]

Let's start a new campaign. Public topless smoking. (Except on stupid golf courses.)

Perdita

Steal PETA's "I'd rather go naked than wear fur" and change it to,

"I'd rather go naked than give up my smokes"

or you could make a joke about butts. How about "See, you're not even looking at my butt"

They shouldn't ban smoking in the park- but maybe put a huge fine for leaving ciggies lying around on the ground. (cigarette butts go into toddlers mouths quicker than you can say boo.)

 

[ABSTRUSE]

Let's start a new campaign. Public topless smoking. (Except on stupid golf courses.)

Perdita

I'm there, let's use Sweet's line as out logo.

Golf is the gayest sport except for the carts.

 

[ABSTRUSE]

They shouldn't ban smoking in the park- but maybe put a huge fine for leaving ciggies lying around on the ground. (cigarette butts go into toddlers mouths quicker than you can say boo.)

I'm not a rude smoker, I try to be mindful of those around me who don't care for it and dispose of my butts properly. I can't speak for all the ignorant ones.

My cig tax also pays for a lot of parks, so if I wanna smoke in them I will.

 

[NoJo]

Golf is the gayest sport except for the carts.

Yes, I feel very heterosexual sitting in one of them carts...

But are you saying Bob Hope was gay??

 

[Guest]

... but maybe put a huge fine for leaving ciggies lying around on the ground. (cigarette butts go into toddlers mouths quicker than you can say boo.)

This is not aimed at you, Sweet, but allow me one more blast.

Toddlers put anything in their mouths, don't get on me about cig butts (which I do not use as litter). I pulled a giant water beetle out of my son's mouth once (I'd rather it have been a cig butt).

I smoked outside in Haworth, Yorkshire and always put the cig out and in my pocket til I found a trash bin (same in Venice). I am a considerate smoker, don't even smoke in my own home if a guest doesn't (which is also probably why I invite few people over, hahaha).

Honestly, bringing babies into the anti-smoking campaign is low.

Perdita

 

[woodnymph_O]

getting in line

for the topless smoker parade

Nymphy

 

[rgraham666]

It's just another manifestation of the great North American neurosis, our inability to face death.

The people behind this believe that it they get rid of smoking (and anything else) that can shorten our lives, they will live forever.

Sometimes I don't think religion is such a bad idea. At least it give the fraidycats some hope.

 

[ABSTRUSE]

Yes, I feel very heterosexual sitting in one of them carts...

But are you saying Bob Hope was gay??

Yes, did you see his pants?

 

[Guest]

It's just another manifestation of the great North American neurosis, our inability to face death.

Rg, your remarks are very interesting. I never looked at it from that angle. When someone 'reminds' me that smoking can take years off my life, I reply, "Well, I don't want to live all that long." Quite astute of you.

Perdita

 

[rgraham666]

Rg, your remarks are very interesting. I never looked at it from that angle. When someone 'reminds' me that smoking can take years off my life, I reply, "Well, I don't want to live all that long." Quite astute of you.

Perdita

I first realised years ago how neurotic we North Americans are about death from an article about, of all things, fictional monsters.

It said monsters were the manifestations of things we don't want to face.

The first according to the article was Frankenstein's monster. An unnatural life, created by man. Nature as I understand was a taboo subject at the time.

The next were Dracula and Mr. Hyde. Quite overtly sexual monsters, and sex was something good Victorians didn't want to know about.

Now our monsters are Freddy, Jason and their ilk. Monsters that bring us face to face with death. A subject we currently don't want to know about.

I regard anti-smoking as another facet of our fear and ignorance of death. In fact I regard all the 'wellness' bile traipsing about as a facet of this.

 

[LadyJeanne]

I think Boulder, CO has some kind of ordinance against smoking in your yard or on your deck if the smoke wafts into your neighbor's yard.

Incessantly barking dogs and crying children are still allowed, for now.



I'm curious, though, as to what will happen to all the pot smokers on Hippie Hill in Sharon Meadow at GG Park. And at the Haight St. entrance to the Park.

 

[BlackSnake]

I've only been smoking for 22 years until the new year, but I understand what you are saying. The other thing is they can just get out of your face if they don't want to smell the smoke.

I've been smoke-free for nearly a month now, and I can still eat a pack. Smoking suck....

 

[ABSTRUSE]

I was curious as to where taxes paid on cigarettes go, it's different for each state, but the numbers are amazing none the less.

I found this great article on 'sin taxes'.



"What is to stop the government from taxing other behaviors it happens to deem unhealthy? Once the state has moved in to tax “morally ambiguous” activities, it has crossed an invisible line putting it into the business of protecting its citizens from themselves. How long before there is a sin tax proposed for soda or fast food, both of which can contribute to obesity or heart disease? Gluttony, after all, is a deadly sin."

For more on this go here.


sin tax

 

[Guest]

Bloody selfish polluters.

(I gave up almost exactly a year ago. )

 

[ABSTRUSE]

Bloody selfish polluters.

(I gave up almost exactly a year ago. )

do you sit in the Blow job or non-blow job section now???

 

[Guest]

do you sit in the Blow job or non-blow job section now???

What do you think???

 

[ABSTRUSE]

What do you think???

I hope they tax you on that.


ps...congrats on the one year mark I'll smoke one in your honor.

 

[Guest]

I hope they tax you on that.


ps...congrats on the one year mark I'll smoke one in your honor.

I have a "special" arrangement with the tax man.

Cheers, love! Don't cough up a lung now, will you.

 

[oggbashan]

If every UK smoker gave up the Health Service would collapse from lack of funds.

Smokers cost the NHS millions of pounds. Taxes on smoking pays four times as much as that cost. Spend on prevention of smoking and help for smokers who want to give up is miniscule. The government is addicted to the tax they get from smokers.

Same for drinkers.

As for motorists? One tenth of their taxation is spent on transport related matters including road building.

If we gave up smoking, drinking and driving the economy would collapse. Just don't do all three at once.

My local council makes more money from car park charges and fines for illegal parking than it takes in Council Tax. No wonder the tourists stay away.

Og, going outside for a quiet contemplative smoke.

PS. Question: If a local drug addict decides to give up, how long do they have to wait before being referred someone who can help?















Ans: Nine months is the fastest.

 

[Lisa Denton]

Supervisor Michela Alioto-Pier, who said she drafted the law out of concern for the environment and children. "Like other young parents, I have had the wonderful experience of a child picking up a cigarette butt off the lawn and popping it in their mouth," she said,

Yea, lets get rid of the ciggie butts so that toddlers will only have cat shit to pick up and pop in their mouths.

This is not just a stupid law, it s fuckin crazy. Most ciities in Texas like mine have banned smoking in indoor places like bars and stuff. Anyone can see the logic in that, and even a smoker like myself can agree with it and go outside.

I will go outside, and I will light up, and nobody better tell me I can't do it there.

Things happen in other states I don't understand, in Texas we still remember some old piece of paper that says we have the right to keep and bear arms. All these other states where they say an honest citizen cannot have a gun to protect themselves, but they will only give a criminal 10 days in jail for carrying one, are asking for the apathy they are getting. Why should anyone stop a crime? The criminal always has a gun, and the honest citizen doesn't. Stupid. Call a cop, one will show up in a few days, and probably give you a ticket for smoking. Stupid, stupid.

In Texas this law would never pass and if it did it would be overturned on the first case. What the fuck happened to freedom? I don't drink but I will fight to allow anyone who does the freedom to do so.

These "people" who allowed this law to be passed will next be told where they can eat, drink, talk, and of course, the worst kind of crime, think.

Let the lawmakers decide what is best for you, because you are too stupid to decide it for yourself, and give your kid some cat shit to chew on so he won't try to pick up some nasty cigarette butt.

 

[ABSTRUSE]

Lisa you are too funny........cat shit......Bahahahahahahahaa!

I'm using that arguement.

 

[Colleen Thomas]

I kinda feel like this. Let em ban smoking. Then lets see how happy they are when they can't keep the parks openbecause the tax base dropped so badly.

There is no evidence second hand smoke is even significantly detrimental to anyone. All the "studies" that said so were so badly done, with such obvious biase, and without even paying lip service to the sceintific method, that even the government, no group of intellectuals by any means, quit pushing it when A circut court judge said basing legislation on it was unconstitutuional.

While I am bitching bout partisan stuies, did anyone ever see the reports that saccrine causes cancer in lab rats? It does too. However, for you to get the dose of saccrin they were giving the rats, you would have to eat a railroad tanker care a day. At those levels water will cause cancer.

It's so nice back home. Still have smoking sections in the resturants. Bars are wide open, even the airport bar.