SM, BDSM, and All Those Things We've Come To Love

[catalina_francisco]

Thought I would share a couple of articles which are interesting and related to things close to our hearts, and on areas we often question here. Was going to place them in particular threads, but apart from deciding which one making it difficult, thought this would be a good way for people to not only discuss the theories and/or thoughts raised if they wished (here or in other threads), but also a place where we could all post links to articles we come across which relate to BDSM and D/s. Hope you enjoy ther reading....I am still wading through in between doing other things.

http://www.revisef65.org/reiersol1.html

http://www.jahsonic.com/SM.html

Catalina http://www.smilies4you.de/content/liebe/b18.gif

 

[Pure]

I kinda liked Reiersol, though he's long winded. In essence, he calls for the normalization of almost all fetishes [paraphilias/ deviancies]. He wants to focus psychiatric attention on abuse and disrespect, and reserve the term 'perversion' for those sexual behaviors, e.g. rape.

He's opposing a psychoanalytic definition of 'normal sex' and resists making intercourse the 'preferred', 'normal' and 'ideal' or 'required' form.

He notes that DSM IV, the psychiatrist's manual (used by many other health professionals) increasing adds a "B" criterion for diagnosing any fetish/paraphilia, namely that the practice interfere with the normal tasks of life (e.g., one's job), and normal social functioning.

Hence even sadism and transvestic fetishism are increasingly defined not just by the practice, but also by impairment: i.e., I'm not just turned on by wearing female clothes, but that I obsess over it so much that I don't make it to work regularly and get fired; and/or I yak about it so much that no one wants to talk to me, let alone indulge my deviation.

NOTE: It may be that Reiersol--who normalizes everthing that doesn't qualify as abuse, coercion, assault, rape, murder-- goes further than some persons of this forum, who want to label their practices as OK, and other nonharmful adult sexual practices as sick or utterly offensive.

--
PS. It might be interesting to post the Money master list of dozens of paraphilias (perversions), but I'm not sure it's appropriate here (or where?), or if there's any interest. Reiersol refers to it.

 

[Miss Diva]

I love your smilies next to your signature. They make reading your posts more fun. Ok now back to the topic.

 

[esclave_PP]

Catalina these are great! Actually one of my favorite books is Venus in Furs by Leopold von Sacher-Masoch -- I happen to like reading both de Sade's works and his. I came across a site that has full copies of Justine online too. That was quite a find. I will try to find it again and post the link here.

 

[esclave_PP]

Found it!

http://www.supervert.com/elibrary/sade.html

Enjoy!

 

[PhoenixPrime01]

I ran across this online many years ago and rewrote and edited to fit my personal Philosophy of Dominance.
Wish I could recall the writer of the original version so I could give him his due credit for the original version.
Here's my reworked version of "Why BDSM".

Edited By Moderator

 

[catalina_francisco]

Happy this thread is working, and thanks for all the contributions so far. Unfortunately the next few days will be spent tiling and laying floors here so not much time to read the links as yet, but have been skimming the Bob Flanagan Pain Journal http://vv.arts.ucla.edu/terminals/flanagan/flanagan.html who is documented by Wikipedia as follows:

"Bob Flanagan (December 27, 1952- January 4, 1996) was an American writer, poet, performance artist, and comic. He was also a sufferer of cystic fibrosis who used BDSM to convert his pain into pleasure, and into his art. He was the subject of the documentary SICK: The Life and Death of Bob Flanagan, Supermasochist.

Flanagan is featured in the widely banned music video for the song Happiness In Slavery by Nine Inch Nails. In the video, he plays a character who straps himself to a torture machine that ultimately rapes and kills him.

While some of his performances were notable for acts of extreme masochism (on at least one occasion he hammered a nails through his own scrotum, while cracking jokes), he also wrote rather clever, humorous songs, many of them intended as much for children as adults."

Catalina http://www.smilies4you.de/content/boese/a43.gif

 

[Netzach]

I love Bob's oeuvre. I think everyone who has spent too much time online needs to hie their butt over to that sometime and read about the man, read everything they can about his performance pieces as well.

It's a document of what SM was in a non chatroom non fantasy dungeon la la land, non castlerealm fucked up edge world of reality and intense fantasy. It challenges all our ideas about sexuality, illness, the body, masculinity.

Bob's work was one of my first exposures to SM. I came to SM through exposure in the contemporary high art world, from looking at works like Bob Flanagan's Robert Mapplethorpes, Catherine Opie's early work, and the extreme bodily sport of performance artists like Stelarc and Linda Montano and Chris Burden in his early work, and finding that I just could not seem to rip myself away from these pieces, the history and documentation of them.

it's a very physical, personal relationship to SM and D/s, it's intensely cerebral at times, it's people sacrificing their bodies to an idea if not to a Dom/me.

 

[rosco rathbone]

Weird, you took me back in time there Netzach. The girl that I first discovered conscious perversity with (as opposed to acting-out) was a huge BF fan. He had a one-man show at the old Guggenhem extension space that used to be at Prince and Broadway in Soho, basically him in his hospital bed surrounded by a a gallery full of torture tools bought from hardware stores. She used to take me in there every other day (she lived a couple blocks away) and sit there talking to the guy while I roamed around wide-eyed. A lot of it had to do with the weird masochist/alternative health/overcoming-disease scene.

 

[Pure]

Phoenix, with all due respect, it seems to me that your 4000 word tome on mainstream BDSM belongs in its own thread, since it touches on many issues. My impression of the thread was that it was about new ideas and approaches. I also find it odd to post a document that's mainly{?} another's ideas and words, but improved wherever you see fit, with the other's name 'unavailable', and without giving the reader any way of identifying said 'improvements.'

NOTE:
I believe this is the original, with url, and the author Veaux explicitly asked NOT to be revised, if borrowed.

http://www.xeromag.com/fvbdsm.html

[verbatim quote]

Last updated 12-October-2004
Note: These pages are copyright by Franklin Veaux. You may reproduce the contents of these pages, provided you do so intact and unedited, and you provide credit and a return link.

BDSM? What? Why? How?

All right, so what is "BDSM"?

"BDSM" is an acronym of "B&D" (Bondage & Discipline), "D&S" (Dominance & Submission), and "S&M" (sadomasochism). "BDSM" refers to any or all of these things, and a lot of stuff besides.Tying up your lover is BDSM; so is flogging that person, or bossing that person around, or any of a thousand other things. BDSM is highly erotic, usually (though not always) involves sex or sexual tension; and is highly psychologically charged. One person (the "submissive") agrees to submit to another person (the "dominant").

 

[Netzach]

Weird, you took me back in time there Netzach. The girl that I first discovered conscious perversity with (as opposed to acting-out) was a huge BF fan. He had a one-man show at the old Guggenhem extension space that used to be at Prince and Broadway in Soho, basically him in his hospital bed surrounded by a a gallery full of torture tools bought from hardware stores. She used to take me in there every other day (she lived a couple blocks away) and sit there talking to the guy while I roamed around wide-eyed. A lot of it had to do with the weird masochist/alternative health/overcoming-disease scene.

I think the piece was "visiting room" and it was at the New Museum if I'm remembering the same one. I was a freshman home for Christmas traipsing what was then an art scene in Soho. I was too freaked to actually go in, but oddly compelled. Now I regret it.

 

[rosco rathbone]

That was the one.


Odd to think that I might have seen you there.

 

[PhoenixPrime01]

Pure,

As this was what was posted in the initial post to this thread, "Thought I would share a couple of articles which are interesting and related to things close to our hearts... and ...thought this would be a good way for people to not only discuss the theories and/or thoughts raised if they wished (here or in other threads), but also a place where we could all post links to articles we come across which relate to BDSM and D/s." I thought that my post was appropriate as it touched on all three aspects of the BDSM acyronym.
As it was years ago and harddrives have come and gone the original was lost as it wasn't backed up as my rewrite was so I couldn't post the original nor recall the author of the original's name.
I can't highlight, although I can't see a real need to do so, what I added and/or changed from the original as there was quite a lot of it in what I've posted.

However, I don't honestly see the need to do so as it's the content and not the writer that's what I see as important and I think it gives an insight and reason for us doing what we do, especially to those who may be new to BDSM, so thought it was worth posting and sharing.

I'm sorry you don't feel that way, but support your right to you having your opinion whether I agree or not Pure.

If catalina wishes I'd willingly delete it if she agrees with you and if she feels it's inappropriate to her thread and lets me know.

PP

edited to add this P.S.

By the way posting my version here grants me a copyright according to copyright law so this version is now attribuitable to me and is my intellectual property as I changed well over half of what's been posted.
Just an FYI.

 

[Pure]

Phoenix said,

this version is now attribuitable to me and is my intellectual property as I changed well over half of what's been posted.
Just an FYI.

With respect, I highly doubt it. You're saying you've quoted about two THOUSAND words of another, copyrighted words, and added your piece of the same size, forgotten the other's name, and now it's all yours. In fact the original is widely available on the net.

I think I'll try that with a [currently published history textbook]!

In any case, you've been told his name and about the current circulation of the original; regardless of the law, I'd assume you might pay his wishes and directions--as a BDSM community member-- some heed and respect.

Though I don't doubt your good intentions, I'm asking the moderator to clarify this matter.

 

[PhoenixPrime01]

Pure, thank you for locating it, although I've never seen or visited that site previously so that can't be where I'd read it.

When I read your last post I scrolled back to recheck your first one and found the "edited" addition otherwise I'd have never come across the URL link.

According to what I recall reading in the copyright law if over 20-25%, and I'll use your 4.000 word figure as correct, that would mean changing or adding 800-1,000 words to what had been written, for it to be considered for a new copywrite.

Ah well, since I'm leaving mine and you've provided the link both versions are now available for any and all to read. Thank you kindly for finding it for me and that site's now in my Favorites.

PP

 

[Pure]

Phoenix, perhaps you could draw our attention to, or reproduce, a section of the above longish piece, of say a couple hundred words that you wrote--that is, added to the original-- and containing some thoughts of which you are particularly proud.

 

[PhoenixPrime01]

A nice suggestion but never mind Pure. The intent of what I was trying to do is ruined as far as I'm concerned.

As I said it was originally posted for those who may be newcomers to what we live and may wonder why we do what we do.

In as much as you took the effort to locate that URL and were so upset that you had to PM to ask if my memory on copyright was correct or not, I'm deleting my post entirely and will just copy and paste in the url link in place of my post.

It's far shorter so should please you more and since it's a link there's no chance of copyright infringment either.

PP

Never mind, I see that it's already been deleted before I was able to do so, hopefull that will satisify you and I've decided to unsubscribe to avoid any further contention on what was a innocent intent and honesty on my part.

 

[Pure]

Phoenix said in part

[apparently to pure:]
and [you] were so upset that you had to PM to ask if my memory on copyright was correct or not,

I have never PM'd you. I posted a disagreement about copyright, and brought the matter to the attention of the moderators. Your post seems to confuse me with them. They do as they see fit, and act according to the rules, and will surely--if they haven't already-- explain any actions you wish to inquire about.

PS. I think you should paste the url for the original, in the same manner as did Francisco.

======


Phoenix said,
//A nice suggestion but never mind Pure. The intent of what I was trying to do is ruined as far as I'm concerned.

As I said it was originally posted for those who may be newcomers to what we live and may wonder why we do what we do.

In as much as you took the effort to locate that URL and were so upset that you had to PM to ask if my memory on copyright was correct or not, I'm deleting my post entirely and will just copy and paste in the url link in place of my post.

It's far shorter so should please you more and since it's a link there's no chance of copyright infringment either.

PP

Never mind, I see that it's already been deleted before I was able to do so, hopefull that will satisify you and I've decided to unsubscribe to avoid any further contention on what was a innocent intent and honesty on my part.//

 

[s'lara]

Happy this thread is working, and thanks for all the contributions so far. Unfortunately the next few days will be spent tiling and laying floors here so not much time to read the links as yet, but have been skimming the Bob Flanagan Pain Journal http://vv.arts.ucla.edu/terminals/flanagan/flanagan.html who is documented by Wikipedia as follows:

"Bob Flanagan (December 27, 1952- January 4, 1996) was an American writer, poet, performance artist, and comic. He was also a sufferer of cystic fibrosis who used BDSM to convert his pain into pleasure, and into his art. He was the subject of the documentary SICK: The Life and Death of Bob Flanagan, Supermasochist.

Flanagan is featured in the widely banned music video for the song Happiness In Slavery by Nine Inch Nails. In the video, he plays a character who straps himself to a torture machine that ultimately rapes and kills him.

While some of his performances were notable for acts of extreme masochism (on at least one occasion he hammered a nails through his own scrotum, while cracking jokes), he also wrote rather clever, humorous songs, many of them intended as much for children as adults."

Catalina http://www.smilies4you.de/content/boese/a43.gif

Back on topic.

This was spot on in terms of traveling through the glass to get to the sweet. Doesn't always happen, but it's worth it everytime for even a chance at the sweet.

"... mostly fantasizing about this alligator clip thing, and trying it out a little bit with a couple of clips here and there, those jagged little teeth biting into my tender spots as I grab hold of something like the bed rail and squeeze until the pain floats off a little, turns sweet almost, until it's time for another clip. It's almost like eating hot chili peppers, except that the taste buds for this delicacy are in my balls, not my mouth."

http://vv.arts.ucla.edu/terminals/flanagan/04apr.html

As for my first exposure (no pun) to Bob, i have to say i wasn't averse to his masochism or the emotional highs/lows surrounding his activities. Actually, his thoughts read like an exposed bulb in a bare room. Pain ain't always good or loved ... but, you still find yourself picking at it like a scab that's nearly healed. i think he captured that in the journals i've read so far. Interesting. Thanks Cat.

lara

 

[Pure]

I hadn't thought about Bob for a while, though I remember pictures from years back. A rather unique pervert.

He's at one of the vertices of the masochism polygon. Pure physical pain. Not a type I see much in this forum. I don't have much sense of the erotism of it. I don't see him as a psychological masochist-- into shame, humiliation, arrows against self esteem. It's also hard to see a link with Sacher Masoch, who's at another vertex, who has to be in relationship, be special, and bend it to his own ends: Beat me, and love me. Lots of folks in this general area.

 

[catalina_francisco]

Thought this could be interesting.....Effects of religion on pain

Catalina

 

[esclave_PP]

Fascinating. I hope it doesn't burn their skin. Apparently there is a hot sauce so deadly it can peel your skin away. I wonder if they'll see God? But I bet if you're doused with enough pepper you're bound to see anything (ooo sorry bad pun).

 

[catalina_francisco]

Thought some might find this site, and the upcoming book and dissertation interesting....Ph.D. Dissertation about BDSM

This is an abstract about the study by Robert V. Bienvenu II, Ph.D.:

"Dissertation Abstract

Today, distinctively stylized representations of fetishistic and sadomasochistic sexuality are commonplace in popular culture and fashion. This dissertation analyzes the historical development of modern fetishistic sadomasochism (SM) as a cultural style, and examines how this style was introduced into popular culture.

Drawing from a rich array of archival and primary source material, this analysis locates the origin of modern SM and fetishistic styles in early twentieth-century practitioner networks in Europe, Australia, and the United States. Modern SM styles are distinguished from their nineteenth-century antecedents, and three distinct, modern SM styles are specified: European Fetish (c. 1928), American Fetish (c. 1934), and Gay Leather (c. 1950). These styles originated in distinct social groups and exhibit differences in aesthetics and composition. Together, these three early-modern styles established a body of stylistic precedents from which subsequent SM and fetish styles evolved, both in sexual subcultures and in late twentieth-century popular culture. The focus of the dissertation is on the development of the American Fetish and Gay Leather styles in the United States from 1933-1971.

The general explanatory approach used in the dissertation is the production-of-culture framework in the sociology of culture. This approach has previously been used in historical explanations of the development of styles in art. It is used here to explain the development of style associated with a category of sexuality. Variations in the aesthetics and conventions of SM styles are explained in terms of processes such as the historical development of practitioner networks and social circles, the economics of the production and distribution of SM and fetishistic erotica, and the political, legal, technological, and institutional contexts in which fetishistic materials have been produced, consumed, and constrained by agencies of social control."

Catalina