Safety Question - How do I turn off the 'sub' vibe?

[paisleyavenger]

Hi all,
Long time lurker, occasional poster here. Hoping to benefit from the wealth of knowhow on this site. If this has already been addressed, I’m sorry - but I didn’t find it.

This is a safety question primarily. I identify as a sub. Yesterday I had my first real-life encounter with a Dom. (me-likey). We stayed up too late and had lots of fun. Great first date. Now that I’m done bragging, here’s the question – how do you get out of the sub mentality? Last night, he was pulling my hair, kissing me hard, etc. and I wanted it. And he knew that.

But today, at the bus station, I got well, it started out as being hit on. But this guy, well, he was putting out a vibe, and I went back into squishy mode... (and I’m not sure I wasn’t putting on a neon light with a SUB sign over my head) He got touchy feely quick. Tickling, rubbing my leg, grabbing my hand. At the frickin bus station!! And then he grabbed my throat and kissed me. And then, thank God, my bus came. But while he was accosting me, I was just laughing my ass off(which is something I do when I’m uncomfortable) I did tell him to stop when he started pushing my skirt up, but he didn’t. He tried to restrain me from getting on the bus. As I was riding away from the stop, my mind came back to me – where the fuck were the danger signals? Why on earth didn’t I listen to them? And was I putting out a ‘victim vibe’?

So my question, stated simply – is how do you get out of sub mode and back into take-care-of yourself because no one else will mode? (yes I realize there Must be some of that whilst in sub mode, or one runs the risk of getting seriously harmed)

Sorry if this is an idiotic question, but I just was thinking that it could’ve gotten really bad if I was riding at night, and if the bus station were empty…
I want to be a responsible sub, and today was a lapse, to say the least.
Thanks in advance for any tips/advice. I know I fucked up, but if you feel the need to remind me, I understand.

Thanks,
Paisley

 

[rosco rathbone]

Need OSG in here.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Jeezes, am I glad you came away safe!

Now it's possible that you just happened to run into someone who would have done the same thing to a 90 year old granny if she had been the only woman available... It really truly could have been a coincidence. The only thing a woman has to have around her to be raped, really, is a rapist.

However, if you think that your street smarts might be deserting you because of getting your happy on-- and I can imagine that quite well-- then you need to work out a little routine that you run after playtime, signalling your brain that it's time to defog from all those endorphins. With some practice you might learn to put them on hold till you're somewhere safe.

Anyone got suggestions? I'm thinking a hypnotist-- a real one, not some random buddy who thinks they can

 

[eastern sun]

This sort of thing used to happen to me when I was young, and I just chose to stay attached at all times to a man. I also learned how to be physically unattractive when I went out - to the point where I was getting hit on by mentally ill homeless men - and fucked them too, but that did nothing for my self-esteem or my health.

A milder version of this happened to me more recently with the dads at my kids' school in the first few months I turned slave, including one man who grabbed me and started kissing me at his daughter's 6th birthday in front of all the other moms.

It isn't quite like a light switch that you can turn on and off, though I have heard people talk about rituals and signals to create boundaries. My husband talks a lot about boundaries, but they don't really exist if you're 24/7.

Instead, I had to learn how to differentiate between sexual energy and submissive behavior.

 

[RedButterflySlut]

I have this problem too! I thought it was only me, for a bigger girl I get a lot of attention no matter where I go, especially if I'm alone. Perhaps I emit the 'sub vibe' you're talking about.

I've noticed if I control the way I walk, it helps. I sway my hips a little when I walk because it's more comfortable, but if I walk a bit more military-like I get harassed a bit less.

 

[His_pet_slut]

oy....not good, not good at all.

As Stella said, it could be coincidence...but...some of us do put off that vibe, especially after a really strong encounter.

M~ no longer lets me leave straight away, especially if it has been a prolonged or really intense encounter. Even if he has to return to the office (if it is an afternoon rendezvous) I must rest for a set period of time before I clean up and get ready to leave.

It sounds simplistic, but did you eat this morning? I sometimes forget basics like that and it seems to make me more susceptible to things getting out of control. I think the combination of the aftereffects of the adrenaline and endorphins along with a low blood sugar is quite dangerous for really submissive types.

 

[AlwaysPale]

Mmm...I hated that damn neon sign. The BB gun worked wonders, though.

Seriously...I took up swordplay as a hobby. (I ain't Zorro, or even sweet Ms. Jones, but...) Now, one cannot easily carry a sword around all the time, but there's usually a decent selection of longish, thick sticks one can grab. Or iron rods, depending on location. Umbrellas...

And yes, I have defended myself using such items. Well, not the metal rods. And don't expect to use the umbrella again, if you bash them with it. Thankfully, it's only been that bad twice.

The knowledge that you can fend them off if you never gave your consent helps immensely. Forced play is play only when you have previously given your *coherent and sober* consent to that person.

Also, a chant in the back of your head; "This is not playtime. This is not playtime..."

 

[paisleyavenger]

Jeezes, am I glad you came away safe!

Now it's possible that you just happened to run into someone who would have done the same thing to a 90 year old granny if she had been the only woman available... It really truly could have been a coincidence. The only thing a woman has to have around her to be raped, really, is a rapist.

However, if you think that your street smarts might be deserting you because of getting your happy on-- and I can imagine that quite well-- then you need to work out a little routine that you run after playtime, signalling your brain that it's time to defog from all those endorphins. With some practice you might learn to put them on hold till you're somewhere safe.

Anyone got suggestions? I'm thinking a hypnotist-- a real one, not some random buddy who thinks they can

Stella, thank you for your response. I was wondering if i just rant into a skeezy-wanktard at an inopportune time, too. But the thing is - i just don't get hit on, normally - I don't feel like I'm on anyone's sexual radar, lol. so today was a head-scratcher. I like the idea of creating a routine to come down from playtime. There's definitely something there. Thanks!

It isn't quite like a light switch that you can turn on and off, though I have heard people talk about rituals and signals to create boundaries. My husband talks a lot about boundaries, but they don't really exist if you're 24/7.

Instead, I had to learn how to differentiate between sexual energy and submissive behavior.

Ooh!! I like this. I think you hit the nail on the head. There is a difference. and i've been conflating the two. and when you're submissive in unplanned/unasked for sexually charged situations, the bad kind of shenanigans can ensue. I need to think more on that. Thank you for relating your experiences. Its enlightening to a complete noob.

I have this problem too! I thought it was only me, for a bigger girl I get a lot of attention no matter where I go, especially if I'm alone. Perhaps I emit the 'sub vibe' you're talking about.

I've noticed if I control the way I walk, it helps. I sway my hips a little when I walk because it's more comfortable, but if I walk a bit more military-like I get harassed a bit less.

Hi Red Butterfly, That's the thing- Idon't usually have this problem! although chesty as all get-out, and I'm sure people notice, I don't notice them noticing. and I never get hit on! So that's why i was wondering if i was putting up the sub-signal or something today. But maybe stella's right too. I'm gonna pay attention to your walking advice though - thank you!

oy....not good, not good at all.

As Stella said, it could be coincidence...but...some of us do put off that vibe, especially after a really strong encounter.

M~ no longer lets me leave straight away, especially if it has been a prolonged or really intense encounter. Even if he has to return to the office (if it is an afternoon rendezvous) I must rest for a set period of time before I clean up and get ready to leave.

It sounds simplistic, but did you eat this morning? I sometimes forget basics like that and it seems to make me more susceptible to things getting out of control. I think the combination of the aftereffects of the adrenaline and endorphins along with a low blood sugar is quite dangerous for really submissive types.

Not simplistic at all - i did eat, but I only got a maybe 2 hours of sleep, and I'm used to at least 7, with pharmaceutical aid - at that. So couple a strong encounter with a bit of sleep dep, I think it could be a similar scenario to what you laid out with blood sugar. lol...apparently i'm a natural at this, or so i was told, so I'm definitely going to be very careful with what happens afterwards.

My hope is that now that I know I'm susceptible, I'll be alert for it.

thanks for the well thought-out replies. Makes a girl feel welcome.
Peace,
Paisley.

 

[waaitg]

If it's not too late to chime in, I would suggest adopting a few conscious behaviors because what you want to do is go against your preferences.

* Frown a lot/have a sour look on your face
- Not only does that put out a "you are not welcome face" to others, it provides a feedback loop for you.

* Clench your fists
- This takes energy to maintain and causes you to tense up. People respond to that as well even if not consciously

* Bite your tongue, keep quiet, and if you can, try to focus your vision on something distant and not the other person
- By not acknowledging the other person, you are communicating they are not there / dismissing them. You can also try texting yourself messages (the other person doesn't need to know), or even just put on some earplugs with the cord going into your jacket (again, they don't need to know you are just ignoring them).

Who we are is communicated to others in a variety of ways, and unless you are an actor, when you run across people who are good at reading body language and listen attentively, they will pick up on who you are.

We can't change who we are, but what I suggest you do try to do is confuse the signals that you do put out. I hope this helps

W~

 

[Curious_in_Cali]

Headphones/ear buds is fantastic advice that I actually got from a single friend of mine a few years back. It was and is a big help for me.
Best of luck to you!

 

[ataxia.girl]

i wear a permanent involuntary confused frown on my forehead.

 

[knot_sweet]

I would suggest having your PYL bring you back up to normal before he leaves if that's possible.

Otherwise it's about putting yourself back into 'you' mode effectively and quickly.

I find walking it off, doing simple but strenous household chores or calling a friend / parent (after allowing suitable afterglow nap time) works wonders at restoring some semblance of normality to my 'swimming in sub brain'...

What brings you up from a bad mood or PMS funk? That may work too...

 

[kellyz_craic]

I work part time in a bar and there are times when I'm generally really happy with life and it seems to give me this aura. Everyone is that bit more cheerful because I am. So it stands to reason when when I'm floating on a cloud of just-got-fucked some men are going to pick up on that. I get hit on when I'm in a good place sexually with my husband. When I'm livid with the man everyone gets a stay-the-fuck-outta-my-space vibe, which is a good thing because responding to a man's advances because I'm fucked off with my husband is bad for poor Mr Random's health when word inevitably got back home.

So, I have to be chatty and polite, smiling's part of my job and there are always guys who will hit on me specifically because they know I can't just tell them to take a long walk off a short drop. I'm careful to observe the '6 inch rule' which was an old Catholic school rule years ago where male and female pupils had to remain 6 inches apart at all times! I find that avoiding and discouraging any kind of physical contact sets a boundary that most people respect... for most of the night. I'm a sly bitch though and if someone's taking the piss I'll tear a strip off them while smiling radiantly, so that my boss still thinks I'm being polite. One of the old boys who props up the bar once commented that 'Kelly's a woman who can turn her back on a man while looking them straight in the eye.'

But before you start swearing and brandishing brollies, just use the same voice you'd use for a naughty kid or dog - deep and loud - and say 'what the hell do you think you're doing?' Hopefully they'll drop you like a hot coal. It also helps to attract the attention of bystanders, so that if the guy persists someone else will hopefully step in and defend you. Even if you're sending mixed signals, it not an open invitation so don't go thinking it's your own fault when someone assaults you! Make it clear that they've read you 'wrong' and anything they do after that point is assault.

When I was single in between my two marriages I used to wear my old engagement ring on nights out just to deceive the enemy. It won't put everyone off but it'll cut down on the hassle you put up with dramatically. Just get a cheap costume ring, like I did when I sold the one he gave me!

Also, if you know you're in that headspace, be careful about what you wear. There's days when I'm floating and I just know that a low cut top or short shirt is asking for trouble. Maybe leave your skimpy bits in the back of the wardrobe until you know you're to be trusted in them. Rock a burka and veil and see who hits on you then.

Headphones are a great idea, because you can get away with totally ignoring people. Plus, actually listening to music distances yourself from what people are doing around you, so you're less likely to spot some cocky arsehole and put out silent 'slut' vibes.

 

[paisleyavenger]

Wow more kick-ass advice.
thanks all!
This rocks me socks!
I more feel equipped to handle myself, i apreciate the help and the guidance a lot!

 

[Velvet Bubbles]

I do believe posture was mentioned a few times. This is something I got trained on a bit in a self-defense class I took years ago. If you're slouching and acting meek people aren't going to treat you the same as when you're standing tall and looking them square in the eye. Try for the "You're going to get hurt if you touch me" vibe instead.

 

[Pelagie]

That sounds absolutely horrifying, paisleyavenger!

I avoid eye contact with most people and keep my body language very closed. It's been pretty effective. I don't think wearing headphones is a good idea actually. You wouldn't be able to hear if someone were to sneak up on you.

 

[Curious_in_Cali]

That sounds absolutely horrifying, paisleyavenger!

I avoid eye contact with most people and keep my body language very closed. It's been pretty effective. I don't think wearing headphones is a good idea actually. You wouldn't be able to hear if someone were to sneak up on you.

When I wear mine for this specific reason they are always turned off. (actually not even plugged into anything as the cord is just visibly tucked into the neck or collar of my shirt/jacket/sweatshirt)...but the people around me don't know that.

I will also add that I am also a big fan of caps and sunglasses... allows you to be very aware of your surroundings but also to give you more time to react and plan your way out of a situation you know you shouldn't be in.

Posturing makes sense, but I know for me is a a lot tougher to wear than the bud/cap/glasses combo when I am in a certain frame of mind. I find seeming hurried works in a pinch as it can come across as a sort of feigned confidence too.

As a side, listening to music on my earbuds is something I usually do when I am safe at home AND alone.

 

[MasterandSir]

Hi all,
Long time lurker, occasional poster here. Hoping to benefit from the wealth of knowhow on this site. If this has already been addressed, I’m sorry - but I didn’t find it.

This is a safety question primarily. I identify as a sub. Yesterday I had my first real-life encounter with a Dom. (me-likey). We stayed up too late and had lots of fun. Great first date. Now that I’m done bragging, here’s the question – how do you get out of the sub mentality? Last night, he was pulling my hair, kissing me hard, etc. and I wanted it. And he knew that.

But today, at the bus station, I got well, it started out as being hit on. But this guy, well, he was putting out a vibe, and I went back into squishy mode... (and I’m not sure I wasn’t putting on a neon light with a SUB sign over my head) He got touchy feely quick. Tickling, rubbing my leg, grabbing my hand. At the frickin bus station!! And then he grabbed my throat and kissed me. And then, thank God, my bus came. But while he was accosting me, I was just laughing my ass off(which is something I do when I’m uncomfortable) I did tell him to stop when he started pushing my skirt up, but he didn’t. He tried to restrain me from getting on the bus. As I was riding away from the stop, my mind came back to me – where the fuck were the danger signals? Why on earth didn’t I listen to them? And was I putting out a ‘victim vibe’?

So my question, stated simply – is how do you get out of sub mode and back into take-care-of yourself because no one else will mode? (yes I realize there Must be some of that whilst in sub mode, or one runs the risk of getting seriously harmed)

Sorry if this is an idiotic question, but I just was thinking that it could’ve gotten really bad if I was riding at night, and if the bus station were empty…
I want to be a responsible sub, and today was a lapse, to say the least.
Thanks in advance for any tips/advice. I know I fucked up, but if you feel the need to remind me, I understand.

Thanks,
Paisley

While "turning off" your feelings isn't something you can really do of your own volition. Changing your head space from floaty and open to submission to alert and "normal" is not as difficult as it sounds.

I agree with Stella that hypnotism would be very useful as a way to change it back quickly, but there would be a lot of details to deal with such as signals that acceptable play is starting and signals that it is finished, plus if you are "down" in subspace and come up all at once due to a trigger it can be physically dangerous.

I would recommend discussing this problem with your Dom and asking that He debrief you after play and as part of your aftercare talk to you about nonsexual things that force you to think. This will help put your head space back to normal. During this time it is important that there is not any play, and as for things that will make you think, you could do puzzle games together like sudoku or crosswords. Then your Dom being aware of your mental state and needs will assess with you when it is safe to go back to the real world. It could take 20 minutes it could take hours depending on the play and the people.

 

[Etoile]

I second the suggestion for OSG to come over, can somebody send her a PM? It's hard from my phone.

Even being of a submissive nature doesn't mean you deserve to be accosted in public, IMO. Our society has rules, and that guy broke them. Yes, you CAN take advantage of a woman that way, but you're not SUPPOSED to. I consider that a lack of common decency to your fellow humans.

 

[4bidnfruit]

I grasp the fact that men can pick up on a submissive woman but I had no idea that women could get into a mental state that would cause them to behave in a way that they normally wouldn’t, especially when alone in public. I can see a woman giving in out of fear, being interested in what is happening, but giving in because they are in sub-mentality blows my mind.

That is fucked up and I’ve never been submissive so I can’t even imagine some man being crazy enough to put his hands on me like that but If I were submissive, I’d take my crazy ass back there when I got out of sub-mentality and see how big his balls were. That isn’t a suggestion; I’m just stating the fact that something like this would break my ass. It’s no wonder I don’t play in the bdsm community, I’m not stable enough for it.

 

[catalina_francisco]

It's all about being aware and in control of your own emotions enough to not confuse being submissive in personality and relationship choice, to putting out for everyone who looks in your direction. Believe me, I know it is easy to get carried away with the submissive label, but it is not a 'please molest/rape me' condition unless you choose to make it so and then blame others for your own behaviour. As an adult we all take responsibility for our behaviour and own it. Did you let people do this before this incident? I am guessing not, so why now, and why blame it on being submissive and claim no resonsibility on your part? And yes, I continually get told by people I am one of the most submissive (not even necessarily in a BDSM sense) personalities they have ever met, but those same people do not molest me, nor would they expect me to go along with it if they or anyone else did> But hey, if it works for you to equate being submissive to being easy and helpless, more power to you.

Catalina

 

[Stella_Omega]

While "turning off" your feelings isn't something you can really do of your own volition. Changing your head space from floaty and open to submission to alert and "normal" is not as difficult as it sounds.

I agree with Stella that hypnotism would be very useful as a way to change it back quickly, but there would be a lot of details to deal with such as signals that acceptable play is starting and signals that it is finished, plus if you are "down" in subspace and come up all at once due to a trigger it can be physically dangerous. .

I'm curious--how do you mean, "Physically dangerous?"

Break a leg? Have a heart attack? Piss her panties? Suffer an attack of the bends?

I like everything else that you said, but your advice becomes suspect when you add something so preposterous as that.

I second the suggestion for OSG to come over, can somebody send her a PM? It's hard from my phone.

Even being of a submissive nature doesn't mean you deserve to be accosted in public, IMO. Our society has rules, and that guy broke them. Yes, you CAN take advantage of a woman that way, but you're not SUPPOSED to. I consider that a lack of common decency to your fellow humans.

As I remember it, osg's solution was to never ever go anywhere public without her Master or someone else, for protection. So... I don't know how much use she would be in this case.

 

[Etoile]

As I remember it, osg's solution was to never ever go anywhere public without her Master or someone else, for protection. So... I don't know how much use she would be in this case.

That was her solution, but I think that having been in that situation before, she might be able to provide support and encouragement from a "been there, done that" perspective.

 

[bhndblueyes88]

Piss her panties? Suffer an attack of the bends?

Lol ^_^

 

[Netzach]

From the street smart perspective: look like you are going somewhere. This has worked for me relatively well. Also ignore anyone's small talk or act too stupid to answer their questions, there's nothing that demands a response from you. I brandish my phone at all times too, someone's MUCH less likely to start shit when you look like a person who WILL call the cops.

Try to come up with some kind of a closure gesture thing if you need to. I know that sometimes if I'm messing around on the bottom I get blue when it's time to go home again, and being "put back in the world" with a kiss on the forehead or whatever helps close the compartment on that part of my day.