Safe, Sane Consentual... and Genetic?!

[BlueSugar]

I'm in my last semesters in college and I'm sitting through another Genetics and Human behavior class to fulfill my psychology major requirements and we're going through impulsive "disorders," that have to do with lack or excess of dopomine and serotonin. (chemicals that increase happiness, fulfillment, the need to novility seek, the cortical arousal centers in the brain...) Novility seeking by definition in my book from class today, is when we need to go out and experience things (Impulsivity) when there is rising tension in our bodies/minds and after we do this act there is a sense of relef and well being (regulated by neurotransmitters).

Impulsivity includes but is not limited to:
Eating disorders, depressions, kleptomania, pulling ones own hair out when stressed, AND (ready for this) Exobitionism, Voyerism, and sadomacism.

1. I sat through this class with a smile on my face.
2. Teacher had to explain the last three terms to over 20 students who honestly didn't know what the terms ment.
3. I sat through the class writing little notes down so I can report back here. (sad, hm? lol)

We are the products of our parents, who we are today...40% of it, has been genetically predetermined (things like our temperment, levels of seratonin etc...) are mainly genetically based. 60% of who we are, is environmental... may the environment been in the womb, school, home, work, the region we grew up in, if we were a twin, the weather... you know all of this I don't have to go into it.

There were experimentes done to look for the "novility seeking gene," and other things related to dopomine/serotonin creation in our bodies (there was an abnormal amount of receptors in humans for serotonin- this also seperates us from the animal kingdom) and they sort of found it ! ... sort of.
They found people with a longer gene for "novility seeking" but it was much weaker bc it was so long and had trouble making binds with dopomine WHICH made the person be more of a novility seeker. (ie... had 'problems' with wanting to be more active, maybe had an eating disorder, was a klepto... enjoyed pain and sex.)
P.S. the studies we looked at were done in 2000.

Is this what seperates us Bdsm-ers and the Vanilla?
Safe sane consentual... and genetic?
How do you feel about enjoing Bdsm with this little light shining on posibilities?
40% genetic eh, are we a look into our parent's bedroom/mind?
Got me to wonder how many Vanillas have an eating disorder and their recovery could be through bdsm... reminded me of the movie Secretary...
Is this why it is such a fulfilling experience?
How do you think twins affected/effected by all this since they share the MOST genetic material with any other human on the planet? ((Is anyone a twin, identical or not?))

Thoughts?
(i went poking through the library and didn't see anything that is quite like this...similar, but not quite...sorry if ya'll are bored with it.)

 

[Astro]

I studied the environmental v genetics aspect from a different angle - behavioul ecology linked to bioinformatics.

Though the figure quoted in our lectures was 50/50 nature/nututre.

The problem with the figure quoted is that it defines S&M as a disorder, such as homosexuality used to be quoted. IT was a disease that was cured overnight - as soon as it was left out of the Disease List (Doctors etc will remember the books name).

However - if genetics determines 40-50% of our sexual behaviour, it does shed some interesting light on the sex lives of our ancestors near and distant.

 

[KestralWolfe]

Genetics and behvioral studies have always fascinated me, though I have not gotten a chance to study either in depth. This thread did make me think, quite alot, about myself, my past.... made me wonder how much of my own wants/needs/desires are learned behavior, or genetics. Spiffy! *grins* I love things like this. Anything to make methink in new directions is absolutely great. Keep em commin!!

 

[catalina_francisco]

Didn't bore me..usually long introductions to a new thread lose my interest when I am having a night like tonight, but this one held my attention well. Always a fascinating area of study, especially when cross referenced. The best thing is the study is recent, so we know those of us who like delving may be able to hope for more. As to classing it as an illness or problem, it is a negative thing we don't need but the upside is if it is being examined even with that thought in mind, chances are they will soon find just as they did with homosexuality that we are just as stable and relevant as the vanilla set!! What is good about that? No more grounds to police clubs and media etc., more freedom to enjoy!!

Catalina

 

[AvaAdore]

psychology is not real science.

 

[BlueSugar]

psychology is not real science.

no, its not a real science per se, because it isn't perfect ... just like humans.

Was just to shine a new light on things because most studies found are from forever ago. I knew it effected eating sleeping depression and all that, I just never thought about it in a pleasure/sex sense.
I wouldn't say I'm reciently into BDSM, but I'm discovering new levels of pain that I enjoy and it is suprising me. When a simple spanking wasn't enough and we moved onto a paddle I didn't notice other then I could deal with it, I "graduated." But to look at it in this light ... I wonder how much I am actually pleasured by, and how much of it I actually need to chase that dopomine high.

 

[AvaAdore]

no, its not a real science per se, because it isn't perfect ... just like humans.

Was just to shine a new light on things because most studies found are from forever ago. I knew it effected eating sleeping depression and all that, I just never thought about it in a pleasure/sex sense.
I wouldn't say I'm reciently into BDSM, but I'm discovering new levels of pain that I enjoy and it is suprising me. When a simple spanking wasn't enough and we moved onto a paddle I didn't notice other then I could deal with it, I "graduated." But to look at it in this light ... I wonder how much I am actually pleasured by, and how much of it I actually need to chase that dopomine high.

actually, i've noticed that exactly the same thing happens with eating spicy food. if you eat mildly spicy food for a while, you stop noticing it so much and move on to medium, etc.

now they should do a study to see if people who like spicy food are masochists.

 

[BlueSugar]

actually, i've noticed that exactly the same thing happens with eating spicy food. if you eat mildly spicy food for a while, you stop noticing it so much and move on to medium, etc.

now they should do a study to see if people who like spicy food are masochists.

spicy food... I never understood it. I'm "a taster" (my brother is a chef and his school was doing taster tests and he took me with him) and I can't handle too much crushed pepper in my food (heh) I hate it bc it locks me out of something that I want to try often. (i hate when I feel like i'm missing out on something)

my step father/mother/brother on the other hand can eat spiiiicy foods often and they'll turn red and sweat and almost cry, gag etc... and keep eating it.
I can understand masochists and sex ... but I like to enjoy the food I'm eating and not gag and sweat all over the place.

:: shrug::
to each their own.

 

[Ms_Kat]

Nature v Nurture

First, the content of science is the process of science.

Second, the more we understand about brain biology and physiology the more apparent it becomes that how the brain is organized internally makes a big difference in the behaviors that a person exhibits. For example, I recently read a study that had used chemical markers to locate an area of about 3 cm square that becomes abnormally active when a schizophrenic descends into hallucinations. Given that schizophrenia also has a high correlation with familial relations, it seems somewhat simple to me that genetics are somewhat responsible for determining the content and conections in this extremely small area of gray matter. It isn't necessarily a single gene, but more like a proclivity for physical formation similar to what is accepted in bone density and body musculature in families.

That's a long-winded way to say that there probably is a lot going on in our brain that has something to do with who and what are parents are. Is it possible to inherit an interest in BDSM like it is possible to inherit brown eyes? I don't think it's that simple. A better comparison would be the likelihood of a large breasted woman having children (daughters, hopefully) that are also large breasted. Obviously, it isn't a 100% thing, but it is more likely than not.

How do I feel about the idea that my Mom possibly dominates my Dad? Honestly, it doesn't bother me. Nor does it bother me that my sweet little angel boys may one day grow up and enjoy having a woman run their lives. (I have no problems if the power flows the other way, either.) Like most parents, I want my kids to be happy, healthy, and to experience all the love that is possible to squeeze into one lifetime. Whether it is kinky or not is really nothing to me.

I personally resist clumping BDSM with eating disorders and "impulsive/compulsive" disorders. For me, it just doesn't fit. A compulsive disorder is something that is an overwhelming urge. An impulse is something that is done without much or any forethought. Neither one describes my lifestyle in the least. My understanding of eating disorders is that they are classified as disorders because they lead to deteriation of the body - generally, it interferes with at least two of the big three social situations (home life, work/school, play/recreation). Again, this just doesn't describe my lifestyle.

Of course, anything can be done in a destructive way, impulsively or compulsively. Since my father-in-law is a preacher, I've seen this happen with religion among some of his flock. Shopping is something that a lot of women have trouble with in this fashion. Exercise is also a similar situation for some.

The DSM (Diagnostic and Statistical Manual) is the book accepted most widely for setting diagnostic criteria for mental conditions. Its use, however, is highly controversial among social workers as well as psychologists and psychiatrists. It is well known to shift through its incarnations along with prevailing social currents - such as the initial diagnosis of homosexuality as a disease (or disorder) and later recanting that position. PMS is a mental disorder according to that book, but the person who chaired the committee that developed the diagnostic criteria didn't even believe that PMS actually exists. Interestingly enough, that person is also a woman.

Hugs,


Kat

 

[Ms_Kat]

Nature v Nurture

First, the content of science is the process of science.

Second, the more we understand about brain biology and physiology the more apparent it becomes that how the brain is organized internally makes a big difference in the behaviors that a person exhibits. For example, I recently read a study that had used chemical markers to locate an area of about 3 cm square that becomes abnormally active when a schizophrenic descends into hallucinations. Given that schizophrenia also has a high correlation with familial relations, it seems somewhat simple to me that genetics are somewhat responsible for determining the content and conections in this extremely small area of gray matter. It isn't necessarily a single gene, but more like a proclivity for physical formation similar to what is accepted in bone density and body musculature in families.

That's a long-winded way to say that there probably is a lot going on in our brain that has something to do with who and what are parents are. Is it possible to inherit an interest in BDSM like it is possible to inherit brown eyes? I don't think it's that simple. A better comparison would be the likelihood of a large breasted woman having children (daughters, hopefully) that are also large breasted. Obviously, it isn't a 100% thing, but it is more likely than not.

How do I feel about the idea that my Mom possibly dominates my Dad? Honestly, it doesn't bother me. Nor does it bother me that my sweet little angel boys may one day grow up and enjoy having a woman run their lives. (I have no problems if the power flows the other way, either.) Like most parents, I want my kids to be happy, healthy, and to experience all the love that is possible to squeeze into one lifetime. Whether it is kinky or not is really nothing to me.

I personally resist clumping BDSM with eating disorders and "impulsive/compulsive" disorders. For me, it just doesn't fit. A compulsive disorder is something that is an overwhelming urge. An impulse is something that is done without much or any forethought. Neither one describes my lifestyle in the least. My understanding of eating disorders is that they are classified as disorders because they lead to deteriation of the body - generally, it interferes with at least two of the big three social situations (home life, work/school, play/recreation). Again, this just doesn't describe my lifestyle.

Of course, anything can be done in a destructive way, impulsively or compulsively. Since my father-in-law is a preacher, I've seen this happen with religion among some of his flock. Shopping is something that a lot of women have trouble with in this fashion. Exercise is also a similar situation for some.

The DSM (Diagnostic and Statistical Manual) is the book accepted most widely for setting diagnostic criteria for mental conditions. Its use, however, is highly controversial among social workers as well as psychologists and psychiatrists. It is well known to shift through its incarnations along with prevailing social currents - such as the initial diagnosis of homosexuality as a disease (or disorder) and later recanting that position. PMS is a mental disorder according to that book, but the person who chaired the committee that developed the diagnostic criteria didn't even believe that PMS actually exists. Interestingly enough, that person is also a woman.

Hugs,


Kat

 

[catalina_francisco]

Re: Nature v Nurture

The DSM (Diagnostic and Statistical Manual) is the book accepted most widely for setting diagnostic criteria for mental conditions. Its use, however, is highly controversial among social workers as well as psychologists and psychiatrists. It is well known to shift through its incarnations along with prevailing social currents - such as the initial diagnosis of homosexuality as a disease (or disorder) and later recanting that position. PMS is a mental disorder according to that book, but the person who chaired the committee that developed the diagnostic criteria didn't even believe that PMS actually exists. Interestingly enough, that person is also a woman.

Kat

So true, and I think you could add feminists to that list of people who do not like to put a lot of store in the all knowing wisdom of the DSM. As a feminist SW I found it limited my colleagues who rushed to delve into the pages each time they saw a new client. They could not understand how my clients who were seen by me as equals going through a difficult stage in life, seemed to move forward at a much faster, successful, and more assertive rate than their own who they had mentally assigned a mental condition to and dealt with on that basis.

Interestingly, last week it was announced they have found a gene they have associated with obsessive/compulsive disorder so looks like that is just one moer of a long list of condidions which were incorrectly designated as mental illness with no physiological basis.

Catalina

 

[BlueSugar]

I just threw this thread up bc it made odd far fetched connections that could or could not and all that jazz... work out in reality... just to make us think about ourselves and a new little light on the community at lit to discuss
I also don't believe it is a single gene to most "disfunctions," but there are things on the protein, nerve level that when wrong or disfunctional ... things happen. OCD to BDSM.

As for mother to daughter big breasts and when they get their period being inherated there are also studies on the chemicals in foods and what are foods consits of now a day - to stimulating growth hormones, they're not negative... but have you seen some children these days in the city where parent's are usually less about eating organic... My grandmother got her period and breasts late in teenhood, my mother recived hers a little later then that (grew up in 60/70 when it was all about being organic and hemp) ... and I was one of the firsts (before highschool) in my class...grew up in the 80/90s where synthetic foods were at a high.
Impulsive/compulsive- you gave great definitions, but there are also neurosis (normal) and psycosis (abnormal/extreme) and there are extremes and norms that are changing more and more in society. ADD and athsma was abnormal one day, children died and now every child as ADHD and asthma ritilin and an inhailer.


ugh, so much more to say but I have work now. oi, till then.