RTF Formatting

[Jaunty_Menace]

Hi Folks. I swear I've looked through the existing threads for the answer to this.

I write in Markdown, convert to RTF, and upload. I look over the RTF before uploading, but the last couple of uploads have ended up with some irritating formatting issues that screw up more than just the looks: some section breaks are missing, which causes a trainwreck when POV changes with no warning, and a series of one-line paragraphs representing a text message thread rendered without any line breaks as a big text block.

Is it possible to edit posted chapters, to fix these issues? If so, I can't find it. And, any recommendations to make sure the site can read my RTF properly?

Thanks.

 

[BeechLeaf]

(1) Are the section breaks centred? This is a known, major, very annoying bug: any method of centring goes wrong on pages 2 and onward.

(2) Edits to fix things take a very long time to be applied: a month or more. And if it's to fix the centred break problem, it won't fix it.

 

[FrancesScott]

There is a known bug where centered dividers appear on Page 1, disappear on Page 2 and later pages, and yet reappear if you refresh the delinquent pages. I suspect that explains the first part of your problem.

The second part is probably to do with how Lit interprets RTF new lines when converting to HTML. But as to the details, I have no idea, as I always use HTML directly.

 

[FrancesScott]

(1) Are the section breaks centred? This is a known, major, very annoying bug: any method of centring goes wrong on pages 2 and onward.

Jinx!

 

[TheWritingGroup]

Is it possible to edit posted chapters, to fix these issues? If so, I can't find it. And, any recommendations to make sure the site can read my RTF properly?

Did you check the FAQ?

https://www.literotica.com/faq/publishing/editing-published-work

The divider thing sounds like it might be the already-reported bug that removes centered text ... sometimes.

https://forum.literotica.com/threads/another-new-bug.1645759/

 

[MetaBob]

Hi Folks. I swear I've looked through the existing threads for the answer to this.

I write in Markdown, convert to RTF, and upload. I look over the RTF before uploading, but the last couple of uploads have ended up with some irritating formatting issues that screw up more than just the looks: some section breaks are missing, which causes a trainwreck when POV changes with no warning, and a series of one-line paragraphs representing a text message thread rendered without any line breaks as a big text block.

Is it possible to edit posted chapters, to fix these issues? If so, I can't find it. And, any recommendations to make sure the site can read my RTF properly?

Thanks.

Before I switched to Apple Pages, I wrote in plain text with markdown, using a simpler WP program that would have allowed me to use RTF, but I write in plain text because it's less complicated. I don't upload, I just cut and paste into Lit's editing window, then read through the preview.

It is possible to edit posted pieces, but it takes a lot longer to post an edit than it does a new piece. Here's the recommended procedure:
https://www.literotica.com/faq/publishing/editing-published-work

The only centered text I mark down is section breaks:
<center>* * *</center>

The divider thing sounds like it might be the already-reported bug that removes centered text ... sometimes.

https://forum.literotica.com/threads/another-new-bug.1645759/

I noticed after my most recent piece was posted that some of these section breaks were missing. I assumed that Laurel had chosen to remove them, but this makes me wonder if it's actually a bug. Fortunately, nothing but some of these section breaks was removed.

 

[dirk2024]

There is a known bug where centered dividers appear on Page 1, disappear on Page 2 and later pages, and yet reappear if you refresh the delinquent pages. I suspect that explains the first part of your problem.

The second part is probably to do with how Lit interprets RTF new lines when converting to HTML. But as to the details, I have no idea, as I always use HTML directly.

Does it matter which centering command is used?

On my last story, I used <p align="center">xxx</p>

When it published, it only showed the center breaks on page 1, the rest were missing as mentioned by others.
Then I refreshed it a couple of times, and I can see all the breaks now. But I heard from a reader last week who still couldn't see them. Frustrating. Why I can see them and she couldn't, I don't know.

So I am wondering if this is the same result with <center></center>?

 

[FrancesScott]

Does it matter which centering command is used?

On my last story, I used <p align="center">xxx</p>

When it published, it only showed the center breaks on page 1, the rest were missing as mentioned by others.
Then I refreshed it a couple of times, and I can see all the breaks now. But I heard from a reader last week who still couldn't see them. Frustrating. Why I can see them and she couldn't, I don't know.

So I am wondering if this is the same result with <center></center>?

Each of <p>…</p>, <div>…</div>, and <center>…</center> yield the same bug.

 

[MrPixel]

Does it matter which centering command is used?

No it does not. People here have been trying direct HTML workarounds. It fixes nothing.

 

[dirk2024]

Each of <p>…</p>, <div>…</div>, and <center>…</center> yield the same bug.

No it does not. People here have been trying direct HTML workarounds. It fixes nothing.

What a silly issue. Stupid, antique website.

 

[TheWritingGroup]

Fortunately for me, I've always used left-justified section breaks.

 

[MetaBob]

Does it matter which centering command is used?

On my last story, I used <p align="center">xxx</p>

When it published, it only showed the center breaks on page 1, the rest were missing as mentioned by others.
Then I refreshed it a couple of times, and I can see all the breaks now. But I heard from a reader last week who still couldn't see them. Frustrating. Why I can see them and she couldn't, I don't know.

So I am wondering if this is the same result with <center></center>?

I checked my most recently published piece. My first section break (<center>* * *</center>) on that piece's second Lit page was missing. When I refreshed the page, it appeared. Weird.

 

[Britva415]

There is a way to do this in plain text.

My opinion is that formatting is a "nice-to-have," not something which should be a point of failure. When intended formatting doesn't render correctly, or at all, then the text itself should not fail to make clear what's happening.

 

[TheLobster]

There is a way to do this in plain text.

My opinion is that formatting is a "nice-to-have," not something which should be a point of failure. When intended formatting doesn't render correctly, or at all, then the text itself should not fail to make clear what's happening.

When the failure is tantamount to removing the formatted section completely and at random, then I’m afraid this is not something you can account for in the mercifully spared remainder of the text.

 

[TheWritingGroup]

When the failure is tantamount to removing the formatted section completely and at random, then I’m afraid this is not something you can account for in the mercifully spared remainder of the text.

It does not remove a section, just the separation marker.

 

[TheLobster]

It does not remove a section, just the separation marker.

The formatted section is the separation marker. The formatting is the centering, the section is the asterisks or whatever the author used.

So yes, it does remove the whole section, and in this case it’s even more catastrophic than if it were, say, a missing word that was supposed to be italicized, because it’s not even clear at a glance that something is wrong.

 

[Britva415]

The formatted section is the separation marker.

In other words, "not content."

In other words, the content (the text) failed to be clear.

 

[old_prof]

In other words, "not content."

In other words, the content (the text) failed to be clear.

Seperators are a crucial part of the text of a story. Being able to communicate a more substantial break than a normal paragraph is a significant part of the semantics of a story. The section breaks do that effectively and succinctly, pretty much ideally for a reader. Leaving those out is omitting a key part of the story.

Would you be happy if they left key punctuation out of your story randomly. By the same logic, it's not part of the text. Or ran paragraphs together, leaving out the whitespace. Not part of the text either.

 

[Britva415]

Seperators are a crucial part of the text of a story. Being able to communicate a more substantial break than a normal paragraph is a significant part of the semantics of a story. The section breaks do that effectively and succinctly, pretty much ideally for a reader. Leaving those out is omitting a key part of the story.

Would you be happy if they left key punctuation out of your story randomly. By the same logic, it's not part of the text. Or ran paragraphs together, leaving out the whitespace. Not part of the text either.

Audiobooks don't render any of what you're describing. This is the way I think about what I write and how I "format" it. If it couldn't be clear when you can't even see the whitespace or the "formatting," then that's relying on something unreliable instead of just writing clearly.

 

[MrPixel]

In other words, the content (the text) failed to be clear.

Written scene transitions (segues) are clunkier than hell. "Meanwhile, back at the ranch..." and that kind of crap. There have to be clear scene changes. Curtains closed between acts. Fade-to-black, then fade back in.

So where do you put the commercials?

 

[Britva415]

Written scene transitions (segues) are clunkier than hell. "Meanwhile, back at the ranch..." and that kind of crap. There have to be

And all sorts of writers manage to do it without a "section break."

Everything you named:

clear scene changes. Curtains closed between acts. Fade-to-black, then fade back in.

can be, and very frequently are, done without visual or typographical section breaks.

Or, they are done with visual/typographical section breaks, but they aren't needed. The words still tell the story.

Written scene transitions (segues) aren't all "clunkier than hell," though you did a nice job of finding a clunky crap transition to strawman for them all.

Anyway, I haven't been saying "don't use section breaks." I've been saying don't rely on them, and now I'm pushing back against the weird and demonstrably false notion that "you can't ever do anything without them or it comes out crap."

 

[EmilyMiller]

We can argue about anything here, absolutely anything

 

[old_prof]

And all sorts of writers manage to do it without a "section break."

And many, many talented, professional writers do use them. My argument is there is nothing wrong with doing the way you think works best for your story. Not dictating one particular style that all authors have to follow, which seems to be what you are saying.

Of course, you do have to follow the rules of the site; different sites allow different kinds of styling. From my limited exposure, Lit is kind of in the middle, probably leaning to less formatting. That's their right. The problem with the centering is that they said it was fine and thousands of stories here were written to take advantage of that option. But the site has not maintained their word to actually support it. Faithfully rendering stories that fit the formatting requirements is overwhelmingly the single most important thing that this site has to do. Top top this it off, they haven't said it's no longer supported (or that it is still supported -- they can't even bother to do the minimal essential communication). Manu just can't get off his ass enough to fix the problem. Or is fundamentally too incompetent to do so.

This argument about whether using section breaks is necessary or evil incarnate is stupid. It is undeniably a viable way to tackle a real issue in writing; one that is widely used. (I guess it is deniable, as has been done here. It's just not rationally deniable.)

 

[FrancesScott]

And many, many talented, professional writers do use them. My argument is there is nothing wrong with doing the way you think works best for your story. Not dictating one particular style that all authors have to follow, which seems to be what you are saying.

Of course, you do have to follow the rules of the site; different sites allow different kinds of styling. From my limited exposure, Lit is kind of in the middle, probably leaning to less formatting. That's their right. The problem with the centering is that they said it was fine and thousands of stories here were written to take advantage of that option. But the site has not maintained their word to actually support it. Faithfully rendering stories that fit the formatting requirements is overwhelmingly the single most important thing that this site has to do. Top top this it off, they haven't said it's no longer supported (or that it is still supported -- they can't even bother to do the minimal essential communication). Manu just can't get off his ass enough to fix the problem. Or is fundamentally too incompetent to do so.

This argument about whether using section breaks is necessary or evil incarnate is stupid. It is undeniably a viable way to tackle a real issue in writing; one that is widely used. (I guess it is deniable, as has been done here. It's just not rationally deniable.)

The site confirmed that the various approaches to centered dividers worked as recently as my How To… to which the site added content themselves.

 

[TheWritingGroup]

We can argue about anything here, absolutely anything

NO WE CAN'T!