Religion & Politics

[gordo12]

I know the conventional wisdom is to avoid those subjects. Still, I have little patience with religious zealots and overbearing church organizations—especially the C church, where they've denigrated women/gays for hundreds of years. I was ready to drop a story, and when I started editing, I was shocked to see how many swipes I'd taken at religion initially. (church wedding scene) It doesn't last (contained within the first 300 words out of 22,000+), and I'm already doing ch2.

But I'm also aware of one sentence in another story where I referred to a certain orange-haired moron, how the comment section blew up, and the score suffered. However, similar religious swipes in other stories don't seem to evoke much blowback! In fact, some guy came back and asked if something I'd written was true because it would be cool if it were.

I think the beginning would suffer if I removed it all, but it does concern me.

How have you handled similar issues?

 

[NotWise]

I tend to be not very critical of the choices other people make.

 

[EmilyMiller]

I know the conventional wisdom is to avoid those subjects. Still, I have little patience with religious zealots and overbearing church organizations—especially the C church, where they've denigrated women/gays for hundreds of years. I was ready to drop a story, and when I started editing, I was shocked to see how many swipes I'd taken at religion initially. (church wedding scene) It doesn't last (contained within the first 300 words out of 22,000+), and I'm already doing ch2.

But I'm also aware of one sentence in another story where I referred to a certain orange-haired moron, how the comment section blew up, and the score suffered. However, similar religious swipes in other stories don't seem to evoke much blowback! In fact, some guy came back and asked if something I'd written was true because it would be cool if it were.

I think the beginning would suffer if I removed it all, but it does concern me.

How have you handled similar issues?

So long as you don’t suggest that bitches who cheat on their abusive husbands shouldn’t be burnt, then you should be fine.

Em

 

[gordo12]

I tend to be not very critical of the choices other people make.

I've had some horrid experiences in life. Including raising a young girl from Gr9 to first-year uni because her parents refused to accept her being gay. Her "church" accepted gay people as long as they admitted they were wrong and trying to change. You should have heard her mother rant on about God and the Church and gay as a sin. So yeah, I feel I can be critical of idiots.

I have little doubt the poor kid is traumatized for life!

 

[gordo12]

To be honest, I've tossed back two kindle unlimited books in the last month or so because of too much religious content.

 

[MrPixel]

So long as you don’t suggest that bitches who cheat on their abusive husbands shouldn’t be burnt, then you should be fine.

Or have the temerity to suggest that in most societies monogamous marriage is a codified religious construct.

I "go there", more or less, in an upcoming installment highlighting a local pastor who is hyper-vigilant about the MMC and FMCs' sexual mores, only to be exposed that his hands were very much in the cookie jar. It'll be a while before this installment hits the LitE streets, tho'.

 

[gordo12]

Or have the temerity to suggest that in most societies monogamous marriage is a codified religious construct.

I "go there", more or less, in an upcoming installment highlighting a local pastor who is hyper-vigilant about the MMC and FMCs' sexual mores, only to be exposed that his hands were very much in the cookie jar. It'll be a while before this installment hits the LitE streets, tho'.

I researched the vows of a lot of religions, and the "forsaking all others" doesn't appear much. Orgy anyone?

 

[ronde]

Religion or the lack thereof and politics are major drivers in many people's lives so depending on how you want to paint your characters, both have a place in erotica. It also depends upon the time.

In today's world, religion and politics are hair triggers for some people, and especially so if you use the name or description of known figures in either. People will stop reading if they have strong feelings either way. Though you may have strong feelings one way or the other, writing your opinions and beliefs about current politics into a story is likely to come off as a rant rather than a story.

In another time though, both can have a place that adds to the characters and their situations.

I write a lot about the late 1800's, before, during, and after the American Civil War. The religion of the time was mostly shared by all involved. The politics obviously were not. Using religion and politics can set up some tension between the characters that they can either resolve or not resolve. That basically stayed the same until the 1960's. Most people were still practicing some type of religion and in general were at least accepting of differing politics with the exception of race. In the 1960's the US was generally still a nation of people with religious beliefs but very differing beliefs about the Vietnam war, both the need for US involvement and the conduct of the war. That was also the time period that generated the Civil Rights Act, and the politics were split even further. Once again, there are opportunities to create tension between some characters and create sympathy in readers.

I also like writing stories involving Native Americans, and sometimes have my characters compare their religions to each other. Just do some research so it sounds like you know what you're writing about.

One other thing is very important and that is to absolutely not apply the morals of today to situations in the past or to different cultures. The fact that it was very difficult for a wife to divorce her husband in the early 1900's doesn't make it right, but it's what most people of the time believed to be morally "right". Writing that situation as something abhorrent would not fit with the time.

 

[gordo12]

I write a lot about the late 1800's, before, during, and after the American Civil War.

One other thing is very important and that is to absolutely not apply the morals of today to situations in the past or to different cultures.

I write Westerns based on that time period. I struggle with the issue of morals and trying to keep them more in tune with the age rather than my current beliefs.

 

[SimonDoom]

None of my stories, so far, have featured political or religious topics in a significant way, although I'm working on a story that involves a woman's unusual interpretation of biblical scripture to justify certain of her activities.

Keep in mind the Content Guidelines prohibit stories with too much political/religious content:

• Works that promote or focus heavily on politics or religion, or political or religious figures. Lit readers are bombarded with political disputes on other platforms and they prefer to avoid these types of divisive issues in their erotica.

 

[KeithD]

I try mainly to focus on elements/issues other than religion or politics. They are sometimes there in the background but neither gets a heavy pounding in the story.

 

[John_Vandermeer]

My stories are about sex, of course, or sexual power even, but not politics or religion. But I feel I am more willing to establish setting with political or religious aspects than most others in the US (in other countries, it might be less of an issue). Funny thing is, tribalism is so strong in those matters in the US, it is almost the US has more in common with places we consider backwards lawless hellholes for that very reason, than with the rest of the western world.

As an example, in one of my stories my two MCs go shooting on a range. My MMC recognizes himself as being way out of place, as he is not participant of that subculture which is nevertheless associated with his home state and its neighboring states (never mentioned, but thinly veiled only). And that is emphasized by all the "this is my tribe" bumper stickers and colonial banners and civil war flags he sees in the pickup trucks around the parking lot as soon as they get there. Social discomfort was a part of the point of that part of the story. But as I was writing I was nervous, I admit, of offending both those that belong to that "tribe" and those that belong to that "antitribe". In case the former thought I was mocking them, and in case the latter thought I was supporting the former.

My view is everybody has to take a deep breath and calm down. And we should not be so affraid of offending everybody all the time. Art becomes that much poorer because of it.

 

[Zenith77]

I skirted close to this in my latest series, where I suggested that the chief protagonists had a rather dim view of organised religion, preferring a more hedonistic approach. However, in keeping with that attitude, they didn't mind if other people wanted to waste their time on a Sunday morning attending a 'boring and hypocritical' activity. That's as far as I went... not exactly risqué.

Religion (probably more so than politics) is extremely divisive. Go there if you want to, but realise that everyone against the camp you choose will score you appropriately.

 

[Djmac1031]

I tend to avoid both topics. Although there is a story I'm currently working on that will probably piss off more than a few religious people, especially Christians.

It's not my INTENT to piss them off, but the subject matter alone is probably enough.

I have mentioned my atheism in one story through my Main Male Character.

He makes a passing reference to being atheist, then states he has no particular issues with people of faith until they take their religious ideals to extremes.

Which is basically my stance.

Politics I avoid like the plague in my stories.

If I wanna argue with people about that, I have Twitter.

I think anyone with an ounce of deductive reasoning could figure our my leanings through both my writings and my occasional comments here.

But I have zero desire to engage in debates or arguments over politics, nor push an agenda in a story in a way meant to directly antagonize readers.

But hey, that's just me.

 

[Zenith77]

If it helps any, it's worth remembering that the religions are mutually exclusive, so if they're all right then we're *all* fucked, because whichever religion you subscribe to, another one exists that will call you a heretic. So if all the religions are correct we're all going to hell. Love it.

As there's no way of determining which are right and which aren't, I tend to prefer to believe that none of them are. Simpler.

 

[tenyari]

I find that people who are ready to champion diversity in sexuality are often the same people who get extremely hostile over diversity in ethnicity / race. More so than even the people who are anti-sexual-diversity. My stories often feature or are about non-White protagonists. I cannot do them justice if they write them with a worldview that isn't honest. And some people do not like that because it challenges their worldview.

But I almost always write from a first person POV, so my stories see the world through the protagonist's eyes.


On religion, I will self-insert my view on that as a perspective from time to time. I've yet to take flak on that - because my view is very pro-spiritual but anti-religion. Religion is a tool for political actors to get in between a person and their faith and gain power from so doing. My new series is set in Mexico which is a deeply Catholic country (albeit a form of Catholicism that blends in many Mesoamerican elements so I personally - respect it). And you can imagine that if 'Space Aliens' landed on Earth Religion would have a LOT of questions. So I do go into that. But I moved it away from hot issues by having my Aliens and Humans note commonalities in their spirituality:

After seeing a Priest my Alien protagonist has questions, I write a scene with some expeditionary dialog explaining how her ancestors had 'gotten rid of' people with faith and religion, her scientist handler has a smug reaction to noting the religions of the two world don't match... but then she starts a conversation with the Priest which I handled more in exposition than in dialogue, and put in this key piece:

What bothered Carmine the most was that when we got to the details of the teachings of our faiths, we found that anything that seemed mean spirited or dogmatic was not consistent between our worlds, but anything that spoke to living in peace was uncannily matched. I had Teacher pull up passages from my ancestors varied holy books and we would find that, correcting for translation, some lessons could be matched word for word. Particularly those in several faiths promoting treating others with kindness and understanding.

While we couldn't draw out an exact map to say a certain set of connections showed some faith as being true, it all seemed to imply that my people had been wrong to dismiss faith

- Now... this wasn't written on accident. It's actually something you can find if you look at our real world's many faiths. Except for the 'word for word' angle.

(This actually hints at my least favorite aspect of that particular story - it's the first in the series, the First Contact one - and it has more exposition that I would like. I worked really hard to blend that into story and dialog, but it was also unavoidable because I'm building a massive world / setting that is not our world... so I had to sneak in a lot of info-dumps like this. Readers however seem to like this particular story so I guess it worked.)

 

[djrip]

although I'm working on a story that involves a woman's unusual interpretation of biblical scripture to justify certain of her activities.

This verse?

 

[Kumquatqueen]

I wrote one story which is basically one guy's complex relationship with the Catholic church, being mused on while having gay sex to help him get over his mother's funeral. As you do. Got a decent rating and a few Faves.

Given someone round the same time was complaining about their story being taken down for religious content, I wasn't sure it would be accepted, but it was. I suspect the other author's story included a religion and race certain people don't like reading about so were more likely to complain.

 

[Rob_Royale]

The furthest my stories get into religion is the God they cry to when in the throes of orgasm.
The furthest my stories get into politics is when someone in the story mentions an asshole.
Nuff said.

 

[ElectricBlue]

Politics as a topic for erotica is not erotic, so I'd never bother dropping overt political content into a story. Why bother? I might drop in a line to suggest a flavour within a character, but no more. Her left wing beliefs, so what, move on (none of my characters are ever right wing).

I have several stories with allusions back to a church influence over a character's upbringing, but again, low key, and a part of his or her background, no more.

I'm not religious, don't live amongst zealots, so religion's not much of a story dynamic for me. Although I'm probably wrong about that, as my mother taught in a convent school for a decade and got on well with the sisters, so some of that must rub off. But then my dad was an atheist, so that's there too.

 

[jaykaythree]

Would it be out of line to do as I am looking to do in a story I'm working on right now? It's as follows ...

Male lead describes his father as mostly conservative, but himself, his younger sister, and the female lead as "left here, right there," but not homogeneously one or the other. "Our exact stances on any one issue are as they have been long since -- nobody's business but ours and God's."

In another set of already-published stories, my leads have a Christian faith that is part of their lives. I'm not looking to proselytize with it, only to point out that it guides them, and can even help explain a situation.

 

[gordo12]

Would it be out of line to do as I am looking to do in a story I'm working on right now? It's as follows ...

MMC describes his father as mostly conservative, but himself, his younger sister, and the FMC as "left here, right there," but not homogeneously one or the other. "Our exact stances on any one issue are as they have been long since -- nobody's business but ours and God's."

In another set of already-published stories, my leads have a Christian faith that is part of their lives. I'm not looking to proselytize with it, only to point out that it guides them, and can even help explain a situation.

That's mild compared to the stuff I've written in my stories. You're fine.

It's the non-proselytizing that's important.

 

[Bramblethorn]

I mostly write stories about relationships between queer characters. Once one gets beyond "brief encounter" pieces and starts looking at characters' formative experiences, how they relate to their families and so on, it's pretty hard to entirely avoid religious and political issues. I think most of mine have ended up touching on these one way or another.

A Stringed Instrument: F-F relationship, Phoebe comes from a Greek Orthodox family and part of the story is her father and grandmother coming to accept her partner. Some readers wanted the story to end with a marriage, and I had to explain that it was written and set in a time and place where Phoebe and Yvonne could not legally get married. (A few years later they would've had the "fun" of living through a public vote on whether that law should change, while the "no" campaign spent six weeks pushing their "we don't hate queer people we just don't think your relationships are real and we don't think you're fit to parent children" BS.)

Red Callum, Sweet Cate: at one point it's mentioned that Callum had slept with an entire convent's worth of nuns. Maybe not one of my more nuanced pieces.

Magnum Innominandum: exploring links between early horror themes and homophobia, with a 1920s doomed lesbian relationship. The title is referencing both HPL's "He Who Must Not Be Named" and Wilde's "the love that dares not speak its name". Inevitably political.

Copper Coin: same-sex romance between an atheist and a queer Muslim woman. I think this is the only one where I deliberately made RL religion a major theme in the story, exploring what it means for two people with different beliefs to commit to one another, and trying to write a plausible character whose beliefs are very different to mine.

Anjali's Red Scarf: Anjali has grown up in the shadow of her heavily conservative parents and getting out from that is part of her character arc.

Loss Function: set against a fictionalised version of Eastern European politics, partly in a country which is somewhere between Belarus and Ukraine with Russian-style laws against "promotion of homosexuality". Those politics are part of why Nadja is the person she is.

I can't say I've experienced a lot of pushback against that level of religious/political content. In categories like Lesbian I think most readers understand that homophobia is a thing and that a lot of queer people have difficult relationships with religion.

 

[Bramblethorn]

Would it be out of line to do as I am looking to do in a story I'm working on right now? It's as follows ...

MMC describes his father as mostly conservative, but himself, his younger sister, and the FMC as "left here, right there," but not homogeneously one or the other. "Our exact stances on any one issue are as they have been long since -- nobody's business but ours and God's."

In another set of already-published stories, my leads have a Christian faith that is part of their lives. I'm not looking to proselytize with it, only to point out that it guides them, and can even help explain a situation.

I doubt that much would be a problem.

 

[SimonDoom]

That's mild compared to the stuff I've written in my stories. You're fine.

It's the non-proselytizing that's important.

Isn't this problematic? Doesn't it stack the deck in a way that is contrary to freedom of speech and artistic freedom?

On the one hand, it's OK for an author who has anti-religious views to write a story about characters who are burdened and oppressed by their religion, and to narrate a story of how they become sexually liberated from it.

On the other hand, it's NOT OK for an author with pro-religious views to write an erotic story about how following the teachings of the religion may be affirming or liberating to that character and give the character sexual happiness.

It seems to me that what's sauce for the goose must be sauce for the gander.

Many, many stories that are allowed here proselytize in one way or another. Why limit what people can proselytize about?

I sort of understand the site's policy about religious and political topics, but only sort of, and I don't agree with it, because I think it's too limiting. The fact of the matter is that religion and politics are such huge parts of people's everyday lives, AND both are so deeply intertwined with the subject of sexuality, that to ban them from having a role in erotic stories is incredibly and unreasonably limiting, in a way that, IMO, excessively limits artistic and erotic expression.