Relationship Advice Needed

[LetterToElise]

Good Evening All,

I am actually a long-time Lit member, but I'm posting this under a different screen name because I prefer to keep my privacy. Additionally, my question is about my significant other, whom I met on this site, and I don't want to risk him seeing this thread under my normal name. I am really just looking for honest opinions and advice; I'm not looking to rock the boat in my relationship quite yet. I have long read and admired the advice of those who frequent the How To forum.

My SO and I have known each other for a year, and as I mentioned we met here. It's a long-distance relationship; we're about 500 miles apart. We met in person for the first time last June, and we've seen each other about 4 times since then, if memory serves (2 of those times were because my job took me to his home town). He is much older than me – I’ll be 40 shortly and he's turning 60 a week before my birthday. Age has never been an issue for us, really.

We hit it off immediately, and we've really fallen in love with each other. Those first 6 months were obviously all emails and texts, a few phone calls... the "getting to know each other" phase. In the first few months we were both seeing other people casually (just sex really), but as time wore on we both stopped seeing those other people, as we began to really be interested in one another. (We didn't discuss this; it just happened naturally.) After we met in person, we definitely knew that we had no interest in other people. We had a fantastic time – that first visit was really magical! He was so sweet and attentive, and the sex was awesome. Often we'd exchange emails several times a day (long emails as well). I am so attracted to his intelligence, sense of humor, warmth, kindness, sensuality. He is everything I'm looking for, and he seems to be quite taken with me.

So what's the problem? Well, in the last few months the emails tapered off. We text a lot – every day we exchange at least a text or two, usually more. We don't go a day without some kind of communication. But he doesn't like talking on the phone, and since the emails have dwindled, that literally leaves our entire communication consisting of a sentence or two here and there. I continue to send him emails, even if I don't always get a response. I am diligent about telling him often, and in unique ways, how much I love him. He's told me he loves me, many times, and when we're physically together things seem great. He's very affectionate and considerate, and he seems focused on "us."

But it's these times in between visits where it seems like our relationship falls by the wayside. He often claims he's tired or busy, but nothing in his life has changed substantially from when I met him. When we were in that "wooing" stage, he seemed to have no shortage of beautiful, funny emails in him. He found the time to write often and express his thoughts freely. He was witty, fun and sexy – the man I fell in love with completely. Now, we're down to these primarily vapid texts. ("Chicken salad for lunch then on to an afternoon of meetings." Exciting, huh?)

The other really big issue is getting him to plan visits to see each other. I've told him again and again that I'll do all the leg work, he just needs to give me dates that are good for him. I make the hotel reservations (if needed), even pay the bill, etc. I really want nothing more than to see him. I don't care how far I have to drive or how much it costs (within reason, obviously). But getting him to settle on a weekend here or there is like getting him to go through a damn root canal.

Now in the interest of fairness, he does have a lot of baggage. He's currently separated (moved out) from his 3rd wife. He hasn't finalized the divorce because of something to do with his retirement or something, I'm not really clear on it. They have one daughter together who's turning 18 soon and graduating this year. The mother and daughter are both still in the house he owns; he has an apartment. He is very involved with his daughter, which I totally understand. She is his priority, as well she should be. He also has 3 other daughters from previous marriages, but they're all grown (ages roughly 24-34), and none are in the same city, so he doesn't seem them as often. He has a full time job that has him traveling locally around his state most days. So yes, he has a full life that keeps him busy; I get it. As I mentioned, it's the same life he had when I met him.

Here's the thing: when I talk to him about this (we had a long talk recently), when I ask him if it's just too "hard," would he rather not have me in his life, he says no. He can't imagine his life without me in it (his words). He loves me, etc. So, if that's the case, why does he feel like he doesn't need to put forth effort now? I have often heard that if a man really loves or wants a woman, he will do whatever it takes to be with her. (I'm reminded of the book, He's Just Not That Into You – that's how I’m feeling!) If he loves me and wants to see me, wouldn't he be anxious and enthusiastic to make time to see each other? Or at least email me, want to talk, want to bridge that distance, even if we can't physically be together? I am always thinking of him – I love him, for Christ's sake! I email him and tell him my thoughts, what's going on here, etc.; I text him sweet messages (and naughty ones too). I really try in every way I can to make sure he knows how I feel about him. Is it too much to expect the same in return? Especially when he gave it so freely early on? Now it seems we've already fallen into a rut, and my God we haven't been together long enough for that to happen!

I just think it's such a cop out to use the "I’m so busy" or "I’m so tired" excuse. There have been so many nights I came home from work very late, absolutely exhausted, and still sat down to send a sweet email to him. Why? Because he MEANS something to me; I make time to do it. Isn't that what you do for people you love?

I don't know if I'm being too demanding, or if I'm really just letting him walk all over me. I feel like I deserve more – I deserve to have someone who's really crazy about me and shows it! But I'm not ready to just throw all this away so quickly. I do love him, and I know he has such a good heart, he's a good man. When we're together, he's really great. And when I've talked to him about this kind of stuff, he seems to understand, and he's very apologetic. He feels guilty, he says "I'm such an asshole!" (which I argue with, I don't want him to feel like an asshole), and then he does better for maybe a week or two. Then I'm back to feeling like I'm just way, way down on his priority list.

I know he has a lot on his plate, and I am trying to have infinite patience, truly I am. But really... is it just that he really doesn't care as much as he says? To the men out there: if you really loved a woman, would you still behave like this? Wouldn't you be talking to her and trying hard to ensure she felt your love? Especially if she brought this up to you as a concern and given that long-distance relationships are hard enough as it is?

I'm just so confused by it all. On the one hand I think my expectations are too high and I'm being too demanding. But then another part of me thinks... No – I deserve someone who will love me like I love him! I have SO much love to give, and I give it willingly to him. Shouldn't I get that in return?

Am I just way out of line here? Honesty is appreciated, I can take it. Sorry for the length – as you can see, this weighs on me. I'm wondering if I'm creating problems where there really aren't any, or if I'm really disregarding my own needs and putting up with something that's less than what I really want.

Thoughts??

 

[LadyVer]

You will do all the legwork and pay the bills? Find someone else.

 

[NightL]

I've told him again and again that I'll do all the leg work, he just needs to give me dates that are good for him. I make the hotel reservations (if needed), even pay the bill, etc.

I am going to be blunt - you are sex on tap - of course he does not want you to go - you are convenient and to be honest no longer a challenge. Sorry that sounds harsh. Read again the quoted section above.

With all the baggage you write about, the initial stages of your relationship were probably pleasant distractions for him - an escape away into an exciting world away from his problems. The problems are still there however, while the distractions are just not enough to keep him avoiding his life and responsibilities.

60/40 will become a problem very soon - think about 70/50 or indeed 75/55. Not saying it can't work but probabilities are that it will turn into a whole lot of stuff that will get increasingly incompatible.

You are a way too young to be burdened with his baggage. Find a 35 yr old who will make you sing - run - travel - be free - take you dancing - someone you will be proud to have on your arm when you are socialising with your girlfriends.

My suggestion is read what you wrote - even show it to a girlfriend in the world beyond Literotica and actually listen to what I predict she would say - phone the guy up - say "thank you, it has been fun, but it is over now" and RUN.

 

[LetterToElise]

Sorry, let me clear up that statement, since it seems to be a focal point. The first time we were together, I did indeed pay for the room. (He offered to help, I declined.) He paid for all our meals instead. The second visit, he flew here to visit me at home on his dime. We generally split meals out. The other 2 visits were largely paid by my company since it was business, but any personal nights, I paid hotel and again we split meals usually. He's not cheap or trying to take advantage, I don't think. My point to me saying that I would plan and pay for everything was just to illustrate that my desire is to spend time with him, and I wanted to make it simple for him. I was trying to combat the "I'm too busy" thing and offer to plan it all.

I appreciate the comments so far. It's giving me a lot to think about. This sucks.

 

[Domesticity]

I am going to be blunt - you are sex on tap - of course he does not want you to go - you are convenient and to be honest no longer a challenge. Sorry that sounds harsh. Read again the quoted section above.

With all the baggage you write about, the initial stages of your relationship were probably pleasant distractions for him - an escape away into an exciting world away from his problems. The problems are still there however, while the distractions are just not enough to keep him avoiding his life and responsibilities.

60/40 will become a problem very soon - think about 70/50 or indeed 75/55. Not saying it can't work but probabilities are that it will turn into a whole lot of stuff that will get increasingly incompatible.

You are a way too young to be burdened with his baggage. Find a 35 yr old who will make you sing - run - travel - be free - take you dancing - someone you will be proud to have on your arm when you are socialising with your girlfriends.

My suggestion is read what you wrote - even show it to a girlfriend in the world beyond Literotica and actually listen to what I predict she would say - phone the guy up - say "thank you, it has been fun, but it is over now" and RUN.

I couldn't have said it better!

And while I get that, "but I love him!", feeling it is just as easy to fall in love with someone who will love you how you need to be loved.

It will hurt to walk away but you are worth it.

 

[LadyVer]

Sorry, let me clear up that statement, since it seems to be a focal point. The first time we were together, I did indeed pay for the room. (He offered to help, I declined.) He paid for all our meals instead. The second visit, he flew here to visit me at home on his dime. We generally split meals out. The other 2 visits were largely paid by my company since it was business, but any personal nights, I paid hotel and again we split meals usually. He's not cheap or trying to take advantage, I don't think. My point to me saying that I would plan and pay for everything was just to illustrate that my desire is to spend time with him, and I wanted to make it simple for him. I was trying to combat the "I'm too busy" thing and offer to plan it all.

I appreciate the comments so far. It's giving me a lot to think about. This sucks.

One party should not do all the legwork and cover most of the expenses. If both people are interested, they're both going to be involved. If not, it will become a source of unmet expectations and resentment.

 

[TeaforMe]

He is spending his energies elsewhere. You're chasing him now. He has failed at 3 marriages, and was sleeping with someone else when he met you and slept with you. How can he possibly be all a woman could possibly dream of?

There are many other men out there who will love you like you need to be loved. This man isn't it.

 

[NightL]

I feel like I deserve more – I deserve to have someone who's really crazy about me and shows it!

he says "I'm such an asshole!"

I deserve someone who will love me like I love him!

yes

he is

and yes


If a friend of yours asked you to read what you have written, what would your advice be?

 

[bluebomber]

IMO i would guess you are not the only one he has been with or has been playing and yes that is what it sounds like to me... sorry but if i were you i would move on and cut your losses.

 

[NightL]

I am actually a long-time Lit member, but I'm posting this under a different screen name because I prefer to keep my privacy. Additionally, my question is about my significant other, whom I met on this site, and I don't want to risk him seeing this thread under my normal name.

The thought did occur to me - if he reads this thread he will know exactly who this is about and indeed who wrote it - this may sound cynical - but did you want the How To board to dump him for you? Kind of a calculated no risk approach?

If you are up front about everything here then you are well to be annoyed, but this just seems to be a way to get others to tell him what you should be telling him directly yourself.

Live by the sword, die by the sword. Date by Literotica, get dumped by Literotica. I suppose he deserves it.

 

[LetterToElise]

No, assuming he's not skulking around under some other name (or not logged in), he hasn't been on the site since spring of this year, a few months after we met. I think it's pretty likely he isn't on here any longer. I just didn't want to take the chance. And I really was looking for thoughts and advice. I'm not expecting to "dump" him via Lit. If I make the choice not to continue the relationship, I'll discuss it with him in person.

With all the baggage you write about, the initial stages of your relationship were probably pleasant distractions for him - an escape away into an exciting world away from his problems. The problems are still there however, while the distractions are just not enough to keep him avoiding his life and responsibilities.

It's very difficult to really get into all the details and nuances of a relationship in a short space (despite the length of my post!). But what's quoted above, to me, is probably the most likely explanation for what's happened. I know it may seem hard to believe or understand from my initial post, but I really don't question that his feelings are sincere. I just fear that maybe he indeed has too much baggage, and it is too difficult (and maybe his feelings aren't strong enough) to sustain a close, strong relationship.

At any rate, I am sure it will come to a head sooner rather than later.

 

[Noor]

Some comments

Old men get tired. He may have used up his humor and wittiness and needs to restock. Many men who are in the previous generation have different expectations of relationships.

He is going through his 3rd divorce which means either he is extremely unlucky, has serious problems or makes very bad choices of partners and none of that bodes well for you.

500 miles is nothing, seriously, an 8 hr drive?

He is still married with a daughter. He is not a free agent.

If you don't have a spoken agreement about other people, don't assume there is one. Even if you have a spoken agreement realize that people look at things differently.

Back off, have a life, include him when he is around if you wish but don't wrap your life and happiness entirely around him. That is hard enough to maintain with only 2 people in a commented long term relationship, let alone one that isn't and has more participants.

Enjoy your life, meet other people, have fun, let him miss you. If he doesn't provide you with what you want, his loss... There are plenty of fish in the sea.

 

[njlauren]

Without bashing the guy, since I only know what he is like from what you have written, it sounds to me like he isn't relationship material in the sense that you seem to want it. You sound like you see him as a real primary relationship, where though it is long distance, you have committed or started committing your heart to him. I don't know whether he is simply overwhelmed or honestly just isn't the kind of person to put a lot of effort into the relationship (a lot of guys, especially from older generations, are like that), thinking it just is...and you obviously need more and yes, you deserve it.

What I see with you and this guy is what I saw with friends I had, they were people where we always had to pursue them, they never picked up the call and phoned us, never got in contact with us to get together...and what my therapist called that trying to play tennis by yourself, and it doesn't work, relationships have to be 2 way. I don't think it is he has a lot of other babes on the string, I think he thinks he found something with you and kind of feels like you are that comfortable pair of shoes that is always there for him when he needs them after a long day, you get the drift. Quite honestly, if the guy has been married three times, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to find out from his ex's (or soon to be x) that one of their complaints is he simply never seemed to appreciate them, be into them and so forth. Not saying he is a bad guy or a jerk per se, just saying he may never have learned how to show appreciation and make an effort.

It could be this is just a function of where he is right now, getting divorced, a daughter just turning 18, and so forth, but quite honestly, I agree with others, I don't think that explains why he can't even write an e-mail to you or yes, call. The excuse of "I don't like talking on the phone" sounds kind of bogus, unless he has some sort of trouble talking, where it is physically difficult, it sounds like a copout (hell, if he is worried about the cost, which is kind of idiotic given most plans these days are unlimited long distance, you can use skype to talk...). I think he likes the idea of having you, but wants you as 'low maintenance', someone he can have when he wants but not have to work at it, and I think that is him in a nutshell..and not good for a real relationship IMO.

If you want to be fair, talk to him about it, tell him what the problem is, and see what he says/does, but I would be willing to bet either he will promise to be better, and that will die off, or he will give a ton of excuses.....I think he probably is the kind of person who takes relationships for granted then wonders why they whither and die. If he truly is into you, he damn well better show it, pull his ass into gear, but I would be surprised if he is able to.

 

[Scrubber]

Do you have baggage? If not I don't really get why you would want to pursue this type of relationship, but of course we have little control over affairs of the heart sometimes. I would suggest that you stop chasing him and let him see what radio silence feels like. He'll either start chasing you again or he won't. If he doesn't then you have your answer, unpalatable though it may be. If he does start chasing you, it does not necessarily mean he is as committed to you as you are to him. Could just be the thrill of the chase. But at least you'd be getting some action. Good luck

 

[satindesire]

Old men get tired. He may have used up his humor and wittiness and needs to restock. Many men who are in the previous generation have different expectations of relationships.

He is going through his 3rd divorce which means either he is extremely unlucky, has serious problems or makes very bad choices of partners and none of that bodes well for you.

500 miles is nothing, seriously, an 8 hr drive?

He is still married with a daughter. He is not a free agent.

If you don't have a spoken agreement about other people, don't assume there is one. Even if you have a spoken agreement realize that people look at things differently.

Back off, have a life, include him when he is around if you wish but don't wrap your life and happiness entirely around him. That is hard enough to maintain with only 2 people in a commented long term relationship, let alone one that isn't and has more participants.

Enjoy your life, meet other people, have fun, let him miss you. If he doesn't provide you with what you want, his loss... There are plenty of fish in the sea.

I agree with Noor. He's over his NRE (New Relationship Energy) and now is used to you always being around.

If you want to keep him around, you need to stop letting your universe revolve around him. If you want to renew his interest in you and his drive to see you, it's time to show him that you're not just a thing on the side to occupy his time when HE wants to. YOU have a life too, and it's about time he stops being so damn lazy and passive.

It's time for you to get really busy. And if he can't make time for you, you can't make time for him either. If that leads to you two breaking up, then you two weren't compatible in the first place. If he asks you about your sudden energy in other directions Be Honest With Him...tell him, "Well, since you seem to have so little time for me, I decided to stop waiting around for you and keep myself occupied with something else other than pining for your attention."

Directness, honesty, and giving your partner only as much as they're willing to give you is the ONLY way you're going to either renew his interest in you OR end it cleanly and fairly with no broken hearts in either direction.

 

[silverwhisper]

eloise, i cannot add to what's been done. your relationship is looking a whole lot like you're doing the work and have all the emotional investment.

i'd say it's time to go elsewhere.

it's very easy for someone to be on their best behavior during the honeymoon phase. long-term, relationships take work by both parties, even in the most equitable and healthy ones.

this sounds like neither.

ed

 

[Sweetdaisymae]

You wake up thinking about him and send him a good morning txt first thing right?
Would he txt you if you didn't txt him first? How long would he wait to communicate?in the early stages of a RL relationship (which after 3-4 visits this is) you need to know where you figure in his list of priorities and how far you are likely to slip down it as things progress.
I have to say from what you have written, the alarm bells are ringing. Listen to them. This is your future happiness, it is the most important thing to you. Unless he will talk to you.... And I am sorry, but not speaking on the phone is pure horse manure, this is not a healthy relationship

 

[LetterToElise]

Would he txt you if you didn't txt him first? How long would he wait to communicate?

Well, we'll find out. Yesterday was the first day in as long as I can remember (certainly the last 8-9 months) that I didn't say a word to him. No texts, no emails. He sent me one text message yesterday that I felt was curt, and therefore rude, so I didn't reply.

I am fairly certain he's probably avoiding any meaningful conversation anyway, because in my last email I was asking him (for probably the 3rd or 4th time) if we were going to see each other over the break before I had to go back to work. I will say this: if we do get together, there's another serious conversation to be had. I understand this is likely to not go in my favor. I know I can't force it from him, nor would I want to. The whole point is that I want someone who WANTS me and demonstrates it.

Either I have to accept what he's willing and able to give now and come to peace with it, or move on. Fuck, this is hard.

 

[Noor]

Well, we'll find out. Yesterday was the first day in as long as I can remember (certainly the last 8-9 months) that I didn't say a word to him. No texts, no emails. He sent me one text message yesterday that I felt was curt, and therefore rude, so I didn't reply.

I am fairly certain he's probably avoiding any meaningful conversation anyway, because in my last email I was asking him (for probably the 3rd or 4th time) if we were going to see each other over the break before I had to go back to work. I will say this: if we do get together, there's another serious conversation to be had. I understand this is likely to not go in my favor. I know I can't force it from him, nor would I want to. The whole point is that I want someone who WANTS me and demonstrates it.

Either I have to accept what he's willing and able to give now and come to peace with it, or move on. Fuck, this is hard.

I think you would have gotten a better response if you had told him after the non response to your second time asking about seeing each other if you had made other plans and then told him about them without recrimination.

 

[jman1968]

I am new here and really enjoy this site.I am reluctant to post a lot of times as I am not sure what is Kool and what is not.I don't want to be "that guy".
Anyway this is relationship not sexual so I feel comfortable so here goes,
I am married to my second wife for 11 years.I was married to my first wife for 8 years.
In between I had an "internet relationship".She and I met on a different forum and became head over heals really fast.I lived in Georgia and she in Mississippi.
We talked or emailed everyday(before texts were mainstream) and all seemed well.
We met in Alabama for a weekend and had great sex and a great time together.
Later I went out to her house to meet her Family.She came back with me and took Amtrack home a wekk or so later.
Quickly I discovered it was not what I wanted.I acted like a coward in stead of doing the manly thing and just ending it.
I strung her along as it was nice to have someone to look forward to talking to and not alone every night.
Exept for sex I did not really want to see her it was truly a relationship of convenince.
Sound familiar?
As always I hope I am wrong but I don't think I am.
Sounds like he wants someone there for him and to even have sex occasionally but not really interested in anything more.
I later dated another girl close to home that did not work out then I met my wife.
BOY!!!!!!!!!!I would have walked through fire just to get a glimpse of here or to even smell her body.Never mind getting to touch her,hold her,Caress her,even make love to her.
If this was the real deal there would be no keeping him from you.
Old saying that will always hold tue is "truth hurts".
I am very sorry for you as I know what it feels like to hang it all out there and lose it.
I hope I am wrong and this winds up working out for you.
I am no pervert but am a good listener and talker(as you can see).
If you need an internet shoulder to cry on don't hesitate to pm me.

AJ

 

[Noor]

I am new here and really enjoy this site.I am reluctant to post a lot of times as I am not sure what is Kool and what is not.I don't want to be "that guy".
Anyway this is relationship not sexual so I feel comfortable so here goes,
I am married to my second wife for 11 years.I was married to my first wife for 8 years.
In between I had an "internet relationship".She and I met on a different forum and became head over heals really fast.I lived in Georgia and she in Mississippi.
We talked or emailed everyday(before texts were mainstream) and all seemed well.
We met in Alabama for a weekend and had great sex and a great time together.
Later I went out to her house to meet her Family.She came back with me and took Amtrack home a wekk or so later.
Quickly I discovered it was not what I wanted.I acted like a coward in stead of doing the manly thing and just ending it.
I strung her along as it was nice to have someone to look forward to talking to and not alone every night.
Exept for sex I did not really want to see her it was truly a relationship of convenince.
Sound familiar?
As always I hope I am wrong but I don't think I am.
Sounds like he wants someone there for him and to even have sex occasionally but not really interested in anything more.
I later dated another girl close to home that did not work out then I met my wife.
BOY!!!!!!!!!!I would have walked through fire just to get a glimpse of here or to even smell her body.Never mind getting to touch her,hold her,Caress her,even make love to her.
If this was the real deal there would be no keeping him from you.
Old saying that will always hold tue is "truth hurts".
I am very sorry for you as I know what it feels like to hang it all out there and lose it.
I hope I am wrong and this winds up working out for you.
I am no pervert but am a good listener and talker(as you can see).
If you need an internet shoulder to cry on don't hesitate to pm me.

AJ

Good point, lots of cowards and users out there.
Truth doesn't hurt as much as trusting liars does.

 

[artsmom]

It is a very bitter pill to swallow when you realize that the one you love does not hold you in the same amount of importance as you hold him. This guy seems to have lost interest he once had in the relationship. What's worse is it looks as if he is indeed being cowardly and stringing you along...even to the point of acting like a jerk so that you end things instead of him.

Best of luck in this situation. I think you already know what's what with your guy. Now it's time to put your big girl panties on and handle what he won't.

 

[TeaforMe]

It is also possible that his marriage isn't ending, or that it was never ending. Maybe he reconciled with his wife, which is why he has no weekends free to plan to see you. Either that, or someone else is seeing him during that time and it's a committed enough relationship that he can't break away without it being an issue.

I think AJ hit it on the head when he said if he was that into you, you'd be moving mountains to see you.

As far as him not signing onto Lit with his user name, that is what alts are for. You have no way of knowing if he created a new account and is cruising the site and having his own fun.

Why be someone's effort when you can be someone's universe?

 

[Noor]

What you need to watch out for is when they come back, and in my case they always seem to.

They may have changed, grown up, have new priorities, gotten beyond the noise in their minds, their ex's, the pretty thing that distracted them away from you, their alcohol habit, whatever...

However, don't be taken in!

Most little lost boys do eventually grow up, leopards occasionally lose their spots, doms do dom up, cowards get strong, alcoholics go sober, liars speak the truth but its an internal change within them usually in reaction to something totally out of anyone's control, often this doesn't happen until their death bed.

If you want to, enjoy what they offer but hold onto your heart and/or your benefit of doubt. Give very little, only what you can afford to throw away, expect nothing in return, if you get something it's a pleasant surprise, a one shot deal. Remind yourself of how they were before and know they are capable of that again..

Watch them for a long time and never ever give them more than 50% ever again, make them work to have you and if they don't, NEXT!