Reason #685,241 That I Despise the Anti-Abortion Lobby and Jesse Helms

[lavender]

 

[Weevil]

Well, lav, if it makes you feel better it looks like the anti-abortionists in Ireland are going to get hit with a tough loss today.

 

[Andreina]

pardon me if i start to scream.

how can people be so dumb and get away with it?
<<< banging head against wall >>>

Halo

 

[Dillinger]

This is just sad. It really horrifies me how blinded people are to the effects of "single issue" mentality. Things are not simple! Yet because people want simple answers - and because they don't THINK for themselves - they allow themselves to be manipulated into a false sense of self-righteousness rather than actually trying to understand the ramifications of what they are advocating. They deny the incredible amount of good that can come from programs such as the United Nations Population Fund because of their one issue blindness regarding abortion policy. It is really sad.

If they want simple... how much plainer can it be stated then:

"The basic right is for women not to die while they are having a baby," said Obaid, executive director of the United Nations Population Fund (UNFPA).

And yes... all rights ARE interconnected.

Sad isn't even it... We have basic issues of human rights being violated by fucking idiots.

 

[Pinklady]

What I don't understand is how something that is LEGAL in this country can be used to deny funding to anyone at all.

Religious beliefs aside, (as they should be in politics), the fact is that people are dying, this fund may save some of them, and the anti abortion lobby has its head too far up its collective ass to even bother to care.

Hmmm... apparently the weirdness is still on.

This post has been brought to you by PCG.

 

[Todd-'o'-Vision]

"THERE LIVES, in Thoraya Ahmed Obaid's mind, the story of one Afghan woman who turned up in a refugee camp.
She was 32 years old. She'd had 16 pregnancies. Eight of her children survived. The woman, herself, is lucky to be alive, given that one out of 15 Afghan women dies in childbirth.

"The basic right is for women not to die while they are having a baby," said Obaid, executive director of the United Nations Population Fund (UNFPA).

I am going to go off on a wild tangent here and not evenaddress the pro or cons of abortion.

but maybe it might be a thought in a 3rdworldish country such as Afghanistan the right of abortion shouldn't be the focus but maybe birth control.

shes 32 years old and been knocked up 16 times, 8 kids have survived, no doubt some died at child birth no doubt some probably also died of starvation.

in a country where food aid is constantly being needed wouldn't it be wiser to posibly conrtol curb the population a little bit with birth control rather than abortion.

just a stray random thought

 

[Weevil]

Hand in hand, Todd, hand in hand.

 

[lavender]

 

[Calamity Jane]

Re: Re: Reason #685,241 That I Despise the Anti-Abortion Lobby and Jesse Helms

I am going to go off on a wild tangent here and not evenaddress the pro or cons of abortion.

but maybe it might be a thought in a 3rdworldish country such as Afghanistan the right of abortion shouldn't be the focus but maybe birth control.

shes 32 years old and been knocked up 16 times, 8 kids have survived, no doubt some died at child birth no doubt some probably also died of starvation.

in a country where food aid is constantly being needed wouldn't it be wiser to posibly conrtol curb the population a little bit with birth control rather than abortion.

just a stray random thought

Todd. The funding (I don't think) isn't specifically for abortion. No one here is advocating that we round up a bunch of pregnant women and termintate thier pregnancies.

The point is that birth control, education, and yes even abortion, should be options for people.

And, just as an aside. The term 'knocked up' implies a strong lack of respect for the woman who endured 16 pregnancies. How do you know she wasn't raped? That she wasn't married to a wonderful man and wanted to have his children? That she didn't have multiple miscarriages?

 

[Todd-'o'-Vision]

Re: Re: Re: Reason #685,241 That I Despise the Anti-Abortion Lobby and Jesse Helms

Todd. The funding (I don't think) isn't specifically for abortion. No one here is advocating that we round up a bunch of pregnant women and termintate thier pregnancies.

The point is that birth control, education, and yes even abortion, should be options for people.

And, just as an aside. The term 'knocked up' implies a strong lack of respect for the woman who endured 16 pregnancies. How do you know she wasn't raped? That she wasn't married to a wonderful man and wanted to have his children? That she didn't have multiple miscarriages?

I don't know whether she was raped or married I was assuming from the unbiased news and educational information of CNN that she would likely to have been impregnated against her will, because from what I have watched and read of CNN, well it seems women are entirely treated as equals or human by men there.

and if in marriage well then the male should be educated to take some responisbility

but as i said in my first post it is just a wild and random tangent in my mind, and as lavender pointed out i am just an ignorant illiterate fuckehead

 

[Calamity Jane]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Reason #685,241 That I Despise the Anti-Abortion Lobby and Jesse Helms

but as i said in my first post it is just a wild and random tangent in my mind, and as lavender pointed out i am just an ignorant illiterate fuckehead

Easy there... she didn't use those words.

Implying that the money would be used specifically for abortion is the same as me saying that because you mentioned birth control meant that you advocated wide spread use of non-consensual sterilization.

Do you?

 

[Guest]

Here's an article I found regarding this same issue.....I won't post the whole thing, but will post a couple of excerpts.

http://www.newsday.com/news/opinion...560196jan22.column?coll=ny-opinion-columnists

The president just signed a foreign-operations funding bill that included up to $34 milion for the UN program. The money came after the usual row in Congress between the most extreme opponents of abortion - those who use it as a pretext to stop all family planning - and the bipartisan majority that favors money for women's reproductive care, short of U.S.-financed abortion. The House vote in favor of funding was 357 to 66. In the Senate, it was unanimous.

It doesn't. Nor does it perform abortions, though it supports treatment of complications from unsafe abortion.

Pretty ridiculous reason for holding the funds, I'd say.

Moon

 

[lavender]

 

[Todd-'o'-Vision]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Reason #685,241 That I Despise the Anti-Abortion Lobby and Jesse Helms

Easy there... she didn't use those words.

Implying that the money would be used specifically for abortion is the same as me saying that because you mentioned birth control meant that you advocated wide spread use of non-consensual sterilization.

Do you?

No but I also know that the larger percentage of abortion supporters prefer abortion over birth control education according to polls on the nonbiased CNN the last several years

 

[Dillinger]

Todd. Geez dude. Its been about a year since I've gotten into a political or religious debate. I think you're a good guy but sometimes I think you relish obstinately sticking to very narrow viewpoint and watching how people react.

Can you take a step back here for a minute. And really look at the issue. The bigger issue - not whether you you are pro-choice or anti-abortion but the idea that a very strict and inaccurate interpretation of this particular issue is the basis for denying some real, true and desperately needed help in a part of the world that is hurting desperately?

 

[Ishmael]

The UN

If everyones so damn worried about the women in Afghanistan, or China, or the AIDS epideminc in Uganda, get your ass on an airplane and go do something about it.

Cultures civilize themselves, something the Romans knew long before we thought we were smarter. Until the population of a region WANTS to do something about their life style, nothing of substance will happen. And what can happen will only do so under a structure of government that provides for individual freedom.

That is precisely the reason that third world countries are called third world countries. Freedom has NEVER been successfully exported. Can anyone here say "Haiti"?

The UN has never accomplished a thing with regard to third world countries beyond lining the pockets of petty dictators and their henchmen. I, for one, don't want to see one penny of my tax dollar used in such a manner.

What ever it takes for Jesse to shut off the tap to the UN is just fine by me.

Ishmael