Racial Context

[phillyinjun]

First of all, a bit about me. I grew on four different continents and in at least as many cultures.

I have had the opportunity to be in a country where the majority were Caucasian and in countries where the majority were Black or Asian. Teachers and authors of all different races. So the racial context in my stories is very flexible.

My question is: does race matter in an erotic tale? I am writing to be read and not to make a statement; if race does matter, then I would write the same story in multiple racial contexts for different audiences.

Any thoughts?

(BTW, the US rocks! I love the diversity here.)

Charlie

 

[Epmd607]

First of all, a bit about me. I grew on four different continents and in at least as many cultures.

I have had the opportunity to be in a country where the majority were Caucasian and in countries where the majority were Black or Asian. Teachers and authors of all different races. So the racial context in my stories is very flexible.

My question is: does race matter in an erotic tale? I am writing to be read and not to make a statement; if race does matter, then I would write the same story in multiple racial contexts for different audiences.

Any thoughts?

(BTW, the US rocks! I love the diversity here.)

Charlie

The stories where race matters, or is emphasized, usually end up in the interracial category here. Pretty much any story where it's clear that there's multi-racial sex will end up in that category. Race matters in America, it's still something people think about if you have black and white, white and Asian. I don't think most sex stories in the interracial category are trying to make statements though. I think a lot of people still feel it's sexy and/or taboo to put stereotypes together, with stereotypical conflict. The audience is primarily American, then there's the British and Canadian readers. An Asian girl with a black guy seems odd to most of us, out of context with everyday experience. But that's the stuff that makes for good erotic story, little taboo, little conflict because of desire.

 

[phillyinjun]

The stories where race matters, or is emphasized, usually end up in the interracial category here. Pretty much any story where it's clear that there's multi-racial sex will end up in that category. Race matters in America, it's still something people think about if you have black and white, white and Asian. I don't think most sex stories in the interracial category are trying to make statements though. I think a lot of people still feel it's sexy and/or taboo to put stereotypes together, with stereotypical conflict. The audience is primarily American, then there's the British and Canadian readers. An Asian girl with a black guy seems odd to most of us, out of context with everyday experience. But that's the stuff that makes for good erotic story, little taboo, little conflict because of desire.

Since my objective is to sexually arouse the average reader and if the audience is overwhelmingly Caucasian, I should keep the character White then. Unless, as you say, I am trying to aim for the interracial category.

 

[emap]

Well no actually you should leave your characters whatever the heck you want them to be. Most of the readers of literotica don't care what color the two or more people having sex are, they just care they are having sex and want it described in glowing detail, or rather detail upon detail so they can make it glowy. Eeeeeewwwwww factor there but that's what you got, for the most part the readers here want sex and lots of it, story is secondary to that.

Trust me on the story part, I got as much feedback for my just a blowjob story as anything else. It's nothing but a blowjob, no story, no conversation just sucking a guy off.

 

[Epmd607]

Since my objective is to sexually arouse the average reader and if the audience is overwhelmingly Caucasian, I should keep the character White then. Unless, as you say, I am trying to aim for the interracial category.

I probably wasn't clear. You don't reveal race on Literotica unless you want your story posted in the Interracial category. You don't really have a say what category they put your story in, if there's multi-racial sex the story 90% of the time will get put in interracial.

 

[phillyinjun]

That may be true, but you write good stories in addition to the great sex details.

You are right, of course.

Well no actually you should leave your characters whatever the heck you want them to be. Most of the readers of literotica don't care what color the two or more people having sex are, they just care they are having sex and want it described in glowing detail, or rather detail upon detail so they can make it glowy. Eeeeeewwwwww factor there but that's what you got, for the most part the readers here want sex and lots of it, story is secondary to that.

Trust me on the story part, I got as much feedback for my just a blowjob story as anything else. It's nothing but a blowjob, no story, no conversation just sucking a guy off.

 

[phillyinjun]

No, you were very clear, thank you. I didn't word my response accurately.

Thanks!

I probably wasn't clear. You don't reveal race on Literotica unless you want your story posted in the Interracial category. You don't really have a say what category they put your story in, if there's multi-racial sex the story 90% of the time will get put in interracial.

 

[emap]

That may be true, but you write good stories in addition to the great sex details.

You are right, of course.

Oh my, does that mean you are a fan?

Oh goody goody, that means I have a whole three fans. Course I am a little warm darn you fans wave faster.

Don't mind me I'm just a little loopy with the whole waiting for christmas and what I'm gonna get.

 

[Penelope Street]

My question is: does race matter in an erotic tale?

Just like most everything else in fiction, if it's an issue for the characters or otherwise changes the story, then it matters; otherwise, probably not.

 

[phillyinjun]

I do like your stories!

What are you going to get for Christmas?

Oh my, does that mean you are a fan?

Oh goody goody, that means I have a whole three fans. Course I am a little warm darn you fans wave faster.

Don't mind me I'm just a little loopy with the whole waiting for christmas and what I'm gonna get.

 

[driphoney]

First of all, a bit about me. I grew on four different continents and in at least as many cultures.

I have had the opportunity to be in a country where the majority were Caucasian and in countries where the majority were Black or Asian. Teachers and authors of all different races. So the racial context in my stories is very flexible.

My question is: does race matter in an erotic tale? I am writing to be read and not to make a statement; if race does matter, then I would write the same story in multiple racial contexts for different audiences.

Any thoughts?

(BTW, the US rocks! I love the diversity here.)

Charlie

All racially diverse stories are not posted in IR, so that isn't an absolute. I think there is a readership for multi-ethnic and multi-racial stories, and if you were specifically looking for that type of reader, IR is your best bet when posting. It doesn't hurt and it doesn't help if you're looking for numbers. It's really how well the story is written, I think.

I think you can look through the Top Lists and see the numbers the top writers of each genre garner. I'm not a prolific writer, and I'll never be able to write for 'the market', so it really hasn't mattered too much to me how many people view my stuff. I do wish I had higher vote totals along with scores (high vote totals and low scores would do nothing for me!) but a lot of that comes from submitting decent material consistently and building a fan base. If you develop that fan base, they'll probably follow you to whichever cat you post in.

Good luck.

 

[Bo_Kaye]

Tricky one. I'm a newbie to the forums here, but I've been reading at Literotica for years and have read widely across the categories.

I suspect that a lot of the people who read the Interracial stories here are looking for something similar to what they might see if they wanted to watch Interracial porn, that is, well-hung black men pumping tiny white girls...

Having said that, there are several fantastic authors here who write in the Interracial category writing stories where the plot doesn't revolve so much around the color of skin / stereotypes - they're just great stories which I personally think would be equally at home in Erotic Couplings or Romance.

As others have said, if the interracial aspect is somehow important to the story, then place it in the Interracial category. But if that's only a side issue, put the story wherever the main focus lies.

Bottom line - if your stories are good, over time you'll develop a fanbase who'll read your stories no matter what category you post in.

 

[Samuelx]

First of all, a bit about me. I grew on four different continents and in at least as many cultures.

I have had the opportunity to be in a country where the majority were Caucasian and in countries where the majority were Black or Asian. Teachers and authors of all different races. So the racial context in my stories is very flexible.

My question is: does race matter in an erotic tale? I am writing to be read and not to make a statement; if race does matter, then I would write the same story in multiple racial contexts for different audiences.

Any thoughts?

(BTW, the US rocks! I love the diversity here.)

Charlie

I believe we're ALL human, underneath it all.

 

[Iftheshoefits]

The IR category bores the shit out of me for the most part. Most of the stories there are centered on making a big deal about the difference in races, usually black and white.

Maybe it's just a genrational thing. I don't know how old the average lit reader is, but being a Gen X'er at 32 years of age, I can say that I have never thought of interracial dating as a big deal, nor do I know anyone who would even blink at the thought of it. When they write those stories acting like it is so freaking taboo, it just seems corny and out of touch to me.

I am white and I abosolutely love exotic women of different ethnicities and cultures, and you would not have to make the characters white to appease me. Diversity is good. How many stories can we read about blondes with big tits?...yaaaawwwwwn.

I simply don't like it when race is the basis of the story, but love to see diversity in characters.

 

[lennythelion]

Surely it should depend on what YOU want. If you're writing to express your fantasies, and you have a specific idea of what the protagonists look like, then say so.

Personally I like to not describe because I want my readers to see people they relate to. If it's blondes with big tits, then all well and good, if it's "exotic women" (Iftheshoefits - eeeww!!) or black men with big dicks or whatever, then they can be my guests. I don't find it necessary to mention the colour of that person's eyes or skin. On the other hand, a "soul-invading gaze" or "skin as smooth as an ocean-washed pebble" is far more evocative.

 

[CMatthews]

First of all, a bit about me. I grew on four different continents and in at least as many cultures.

I have had the opportunity to be in a country where the majority were Caucasian and in countries where the majority were Black or Asian. Teachers and authors of all different races. So the racial context in my stories is very flexible.

My question is: does race matter in an erotic tale? I am writing to be read and not to make a statement; if race does matter, then I would write the same story in multiple racial contexts for different audiences.

Any thoughts?

(BTW, the US rocks! I love the diversity here.)

Charlie

No, it does not

 

[al_Ussa]

Actually, I'm going to go on record and say that a large number of characters in my works have been Asian. I have two short stories which were just published in recent months, both with Asian protagonists.

Anyway, as an international traveler myself, I will say that the idea of "race" is an odd thing in America. Essentially, you have white, black, Latino and "everyone else." There are some stereotypes I see thrown about, but unfortunately, it does seem to me that Desi characters are not a big theme in American consciousness.

And race relations in America are rather complex, given the history and social context. You had periodic genocides against the American Indians, slavery and civil rights struggles for blacks, and successive waves of immigration from both Europe and elsewhere over the centuries. Then you have the successive "culture wars," with self-identified conservatives trying to champion a "white" and "Christian" American society, in opposition to modern ideas of "multi-culturalism."

One thing that I've talked about recently is something a friend once told me. He said that for many European immigrants, they were discriminated against themselves, and adopted the prejudices and attitudes of earlier immigrants in order to attain status and "fit in." Therefor, the Irish, Poles, Italians, Germans, Ukrainians or whoever started to dress and act like Anglo-Americans, and became much more racist towards later immigrants as a result.

An interesting theory.

One thing that I will point out, especially since you should be aware of this, is that "racism" becomes hazy outside of the US. This is not to say that people don't have prejudices, but those prejudices change to reflect other values. In the US, social status has historically been linked to how "white" someone is, and thus, the racism you see here.

In Asia, things are a little different. For one thing, religion becomes much more important, along with "ethnicity." And religion may very well be associated with ethno-linguistic identity, incidentally. Would a Gujarati and a Punajbi getting it on count as "interracial"? What about a Punjabi and a Tamil? Tamil and Singhalese? Or Indian Sikh and Pakistani Muslim? Indian and Burmese?

Even outside of the US, interracial relationships can (and will) have a context. I've known plenty of friends, even second generation mind you, who have had problems with their families because of relationships with whites or blacks. Families might be racist themselves, or they might (legitimately) be concerned about their culture, language and religion disappearing in future generations. So yeah, it does come up.

I remember a case actually a few years back where an Egyptian woman had married a white American, and wound up fleeing the country back to Egypt. It wasn't a big story in the US, but apparently he had been abusing her and nobody had done anything. She also wanted to raise the children as Muslims and he didn't. She knew that American courts would more than likely side with him.

So that sort of thing happens in the real world. I think that, if done sensitively and intelligently, it can be an interesting thing to explore in fiction. Perhaps even make people question themselves.

 

[Epmd607]

Actually, I'm going to go on record and say that a large number of characters in my works have been Asian. I have two short stories which were just published in recent months, both with Asian protagonists.

Anyway, as an international traveler myself, I will say that the idea of "race" is an odd thing in America. Essentially, you have white, black, Latino and "everyone else." There are some stereotypes I see thrown about, but unfortunately, it does seem to me that Desi characters are not a big theme in American consciousness.

And race relations in America are rather complex, given the history and social context. You had periodic genocides against the American Indians, slavery and civil rights struggles for blacks, and successive waves of immigration from both Europe and elsewhere over the centuries. Then you have the successive "culture wars," with self-identified conservatives trying to champion a "white" and "Christian" American society, in opposition to modern ideas of "multi-culturalism."

One thing that I've talked about recently is something a friend once told me. He said that for many European immigrants, they were discriminated against themselves, and adopted the prejudices and attitudes of earlier immigrants in order to attain status and "fit in." Therefor, the Irish, Poles, Italians, Germans, Ukrainians or whoever started to dress and act like Anglo-Americans, and became much more racist towards later immigrants as a result.

An interesting theory.

One thing that I will point out, especially since you should be aware of this, is that "racism" becomes hazy outside of the US. This is not to say that people don't have prejudices, but those prejudices change to reflect other values. In the US, social status has historically been linked to how "white" someone is, and thus, the racism you see here.

In Asia, things are a little different. For one thing, religion becomes much more important, along with "ethnicity." And religion may very well be associated with ethno-linguistic identity, incidentally. Would a Gujarati and a Punajbi getting it on count as "interracial"? What about a Punjabi and a Tamil? Tamil and Singhalese? Or Indian Sikh and Pakistani Muslim? Indian and Burmese?

Even outside of the US, interracial relationships can (and will) have a context. I've known plenty of friends, even second generation mind you, who have had problems with their families because of relationships with whites or blacks. Families might be racist themselves, or they might (legitimately) be concerned about their culture, language and religion disappearing in future generations. So yeah, it does come up.

I remember a case actually a few years back where an Egyptian woman had married a white American, and wound up fleeing the country back to Egypt. It wasn't a big story in the US, but apparently he had been abusing her and nobody had done anything. She also wanted to raise the children as Muslims and he didn't. She knew that American courts would more than likely side with him.

So that sort of thing happens in the real world. I think that, if done sensitively and intelligently, it can be an interesting thing to explore in fiction. Perhaps even make people question themselves.

'Racism' has a pretty specific North American context. White bigotry and subjugation of Blacks. It's a real loaded term and it isn't useful bringing it into other multiracial contexts. Even Anglo-American 'racism' against Arab-Americans is a misuse of the term. In terms of stories on Lit there's a reason why the most popular interracial pairing is white female and black man, it's been the most powerful conflict in our history and therefore still the most racially taboo.

You can write stories about an Asian with an Anglo and they might not automatically stick it in IR, unless you request it, or Arabs, Persians, Africans with Asians. For something to get posted to IR you really have to hit on stereotypes where a white or black is the focus. But if you have a clearly black man and white woman in a sexual relationship, no matter how well the story is told, how little stereotyping there is, the story will likely get posted in IR.

 

[al_Ussa]

White bigotry and subjugation of Blacks.

Which is completely ignoring other racism, not the least of which being the American Indians (and native Hawai'ians) who had an actual genocide against them, down to the point of trying to destroy their very languages, religions and cultural identities.

But you also are ignoring discrimination against Jews, Poles, Italians, Irish, Chinese and various other immigrant groups. Ever heard of the Japanese internment camps? The "dot busters" on the East Coast? Korean grocery stores being targeted by black protesters?

Race is not a black vs. white thing.

Even Anglo-American 'racism' against Arab-Americans is a misuse of the term.

If someone is discriminated against because they are Arab, how is that NOT racism? By the very definition, it is discriminating against someone because of their ethnicity. That's racism!

In terms of stories on Lit there's a reason why the most popular interracial pairing is white female and black man, it's been the most powerful conflict in our history and therefore still the most racially taboo.

Maybe for some people. Maybe even most of the target audience here. But your kind of ignoring the fact that there are other racial pairings which are equally controversial, and the fact that there are many parts of America where a black woman and a white man (or vice versa) wouldn't cause anyone to bat an eye. I see that fairly often out here in Chicago, for what its worth.

Like I said, I've known people who got in trouble with their families for dating blacks or whites. And in some parts of the world that is still a big thing... Hell, in the last century there were RIOTS in Burma over Indian men "stealing" Burmese women. In Japan, one of the big gripes about the American military presence in Okinawa is Americans seeing Japanese women. And blacks... good God! There is far more prejudice against blacks in some corners of the world.

You can write stories about an Asian with an Anglo and they might not automatically stick it in IR, unless you request it, or Arabs, Persians, Africans with Asians.

I've never had any stories stuck in categories other than what I submit them, but if I did write a story about a black and Asian couple, I might put it in interracial because of the issues it raises. And because I've seen that first hand. Ditto for Asian and white.

Hell, I can think of lots of DECENT stories where such conflicts could be interesting themes to explore. One such story I had worked on - featuring a Jewish woman and a Palestinian man - would fit in such categories, despite both groups being "Semitic." Of course, I'd have to re-work that story, but still.

But if you have a clearly black man and white woman in a sexual relationship, no matter how well the story is told, how little stereotyping there is, the story will likely get posted in IR.

I've never had that happen, and I'm tempted to write such a story just to see if it winds up in interracial anyway.

I think that the categories in Lit are based on what best fits the theme. Except for Novels/Novellas. But if you write a story that happens to concentrate on anal sex with a couple that just happens to be interracial, then maybe it belongs in Anal instead. On the other hand, if you focused more on, say, what she was wearing... it might be Fetish.

 

[Epmd607]

Which is completely ignoring other racism, not the least of which being the American Indians (and native Hawai'ians) who had an actual genocide against them, down to the point of trying to destroy their very languages, religions and cultural identities.

But you also are ignoring discrimination against Jews, Poles, Italians, Irish, Chinese and various other immigrant groups. Ever heard of the Japanese internment camps? The "dot busters" on the East Coast? Korean grocery stores being targeted by black protesters?

Race is not a black vs. white thing.



If someone is discriminated against because they are Arab, how is that NOT racism? By the very definition, it is discriminating against someone because of their ethnicity. That's racism!



Maybe for some people. Maybe even most of the target audience here. But your kind of ignoring the fact that there are other racial pairings which are equally controversial, and the fact that there are many parts of America where a black woman and a white man (or vice versa) wouldn't cause anyone to bat an eye. I see that fairly often out here in Chicago, for what its worth.

Like I said, I've known people who got in trouble with their families for dating blacks or whites. And in some parts of the world that is still a big thing... Hell, in the last century there were RIOTS in Burma over Indian men "stealing" Burmese women. In Japan, one of the big gripes about the American military presence in Okinawa is Americans seeing Japanese women. And blacks... good God! There is far more prejudice against blacks in some corners of the world.



I've never had any stories stuck in categories other than what I submit them, but if I did write a story about a black and Asian couple, I might put it in interracial because of the issues it raises. And because I've seen that first hand. Ditto for Asian and white.

Hell, I can think of lots of DECENT stories where such conflicts could be interesting themes to explore. One such story I had worked on - featuring a Jewish woman and a Palestinian man - would fit in such categories, despite both groups being "Semitic." Of course, I'd have to re-work that story, but still.



I've never had that happen, and I'm tempted to write such a story just to see if it winds up in interracial anyway.

I think that the categories in Lit are based on what best fits the theme. Except for Novels/Novellas. But if you write a story that happens to concentrate on anal sex with a couple that just happens to be interracial, then maybe it belongs in Anal instead. On the other hand, if you focused more on, say, what she was wearing... it might be Fetish.

You misunderstand what I mean by 'loaded term'. There are suitable synonyms for racism, but the word itself: 'Racism', in the American vocabulary means white bigotry against blacks. I'm not saying ethnocentrism, racialism, bigotry doesn't exist between other groups. But it's important understanding the difference between 'Racism' and 'racialism'. When you say 'racism against Japanese or Arabs' you mean to say 'racialist bigotry against Japanese or Arabs'. It's a very important distinction and it has bearing for this thread and the reasoning behind the Interracial Category on this site.

'Racism' should only be used with a capital 'R', because it means something very specific in American English language usage. White racialism against blacks. Someone can check me on this, but the British don't even use 'Racism' they usually use 'racialism'.

 

[Lost_Yonder]

You misunderstand what I mean by 'loaded term'. There are suitable synonyms for racism, but the word itself: 'Racism', in the American vocabulary means white bigotry against blacks. I'm not saying ethnocentrism, racialism, bigotry doesn't exist between other groups. But it's important understanding the difference between 'Racism' and 'racialism'. When you say 'racism against Japanese or Arabs' you mean to say 'racialist bigotry against Japanese or Arabs'. It's a very important distinction and it has bearing for this thread and the reasoning behind the Interracial Category on this site.

'Racism' should only be used with a capital 'R', because it means something very specific in American English language usage. White racialism against blacks. Someone can check me on this, but the British don't even use 'Racism' they usually use 'racialism'.

While racism has a particular history in the US, your singallying it out as Racism while everything else is racialism is a bit pedantic and to my knowledge no base in scholarly studies on race. Racism is universal, though takes on different colors, if you will, in different parts of the world.

Racism in the west has a much wider history than slavery in the US - don't forget the Brits also practiced slavery. Indeed, the whole colonial project of European countries is inherently racist and most of the attitudes/stereotypes we have of other "races" are direct decendents of that encounter and the subjugation.

The interesting thing with racism is that, scientifically speaking, race doesn't exist. Races are socially constructed categories, not scientific classifications (though some tried to make it that way).

Many negative stereotypes/encounters we have with others are not all racism - there can't be racism against Jews, for example, as Judaism is a religion - not a social race and Jews come from all different races (there are black Jews and Indian Jews and Chinese Jews).

Yes, the racism against blacks in the US is different than other forms of racism - such as against blacks in Egypt or dark-skinned tribals in India, but that doesn't mean it isn't racism...

 

[Epmd607]

While racism has a particular history in the US, your singallying it out as Racism while everything else is racialism is a bit pedantic and to my knowledge no base in scholarly studies on race. Racism is universal, though takes on different colors, if you will, in different parts of the world.

Racism in the west has a much wider history than slavery in the US - don't forget the Brits also practiced slavery. Indeed, the whole colonial project of European countries is inherently racist and most of the attitudes/stereotypes we have of other "races" are direct decendents of that encounter and the subjugation.

The interesting thing with racism is that, scientifically speaking, race doesn't exist. Races are socially constructed categories, not scientific classifications (though some tried to make it that way).

Many negative stereotypes/encounters we have with others are not all racism - there can't be racism against Jews, for example, as Judaism is a religion - not a social race and Jews come from all different races (there are black Jews and Indian Jews and Chinese Jews).

Yes, the racism against blacks in the US is different than other forms of racism - such as against blacks in Egypt or dark-skinned tribals in India, but that doesn't mean it isn't racism...

"In 1995, Jonathan Marks published Human Biodiversity, to date the most complete work summarizing the history of science’s treatment of the concept of human races, and current thinking regarding human biological variation. Almost all anthropologists and biological anthropologists today subscribe to the views professed by Dr. Marks. Human races are understood to be social constructs—products of the human mind’s indelible wont to classify phenomena into some meaningful semblance of order.

"The reason the biological concept of races is not valid and is of little if any use when applied to modern humanity is simple. It is not possible, with reproducible consistency acceptable to scientists, to classify even a majority of humans into an agreed upon finite number of races. Our biological variation is simply not consistent across space, partly because of prehistoric and historic migrations. Such migrations were often culturally mediated through such institutions as slavery and conquest; they resulted in considerable admixture, often between groups that were quite different in their patterns of biological variation. These circumstances spread far back into our past and because they have been taking place for so many millenia, the net result is an extremely muddled pattern of human biological diversity across geographical space today. We in the United States are just unable to see and grasp it, because the biological variation observable to us in our everyday lives is relatively finite, at least in most cities."

I have a degree in Physical Anthropology, but I'm not talking about science and the point of the thread wasn't to debate the existence of race. The thread's point was 'Should I care about the human constructs of race when I write my stories', the very real constructs of 'black' 'latino' 'white' 'arab' and even 'Jew'.

I've said that you should recognize the readership is primarily North American, white, English speaking, and the Interracial Category reflects that. Our view on Racism reflects that. The taboo and stereotypical triggers occur in the sex scenes between white and black, and then to lesser degrees white or black with Asian/Latino/Arab... If anyone wants to know why we can go over the North American construct of 'Racism' vs. racialism/bigotry.

 

[Lost_Yonder]

Epmd607, in the end we probably agree on most issues, the only problem being you did your degree in physical rather than social anthropology!

where we do disagree is the use of the term of "racialism" for their racism while labeling ours "racism". There are two different issues here, one is what we as readers, predomantly from the US, can relate to as race relations and thus "interracial stories"; the second, which you raised yourself, is how we understand what racism is and to differentiate it, in your perspective, from racialism.

In WWII the Japanese "rape of Nanking" was racist, as was their use of other Asian women as "comfort girls". As an American, I might not be able to relate to the historical power dynamic of Japanese racism towards other Asians, but that doesn't mean it isn't racism. Thus, as a story goes, Japanese-Chinese, or Japanese business men going on sex tours to Bangkok I would not see as interracial, though, for the Japanese, Chinese, and Thais involved it very much is racist dealing with all kinds of historical and sociological issues, just as black and white relationships in the US.

In short, I disagree with your narrow defination of racism, even in the US context.

Race just isn't black and white in the US. In college I dated a Chinese-American girl which was quite acceptable and normal to everybody - except her parents. They saw it as interracial and very problematic and were not happy at all and made it quite known.

The Irish, the Italians, eastern Europeans all experienced racism when migrating to the US that some of us may not even be aware of, as do Latinos today. Racism is racially blind, particularly from the perspective of victims.

from my understanding, racialism doesn't mean race-based bigotry, but merely the belief that races exist...

 

[Epmd607]

Epmd607, in the end we probably agree on most issues, the only problem being you did your degree in physical rather than social anthropology!

where we do disagree is the use of the term of "racialism" for their racism while labeling ours "racism". There are two different issues here, one is what we as readers, predomantly from the US, can relate to as race relations and thus "interracial stories"; the second, which you raised yourself, is how we understand what racism is and to differentiate it, in your perspective, from racialism.

In WWII the Japanese "rape of Nanking" was racist, as was their use of other Asian women as "comfort girls". As an American, I might not be able to relate to the historical power dynamic of Japanese racism towards other Asians, but that doesn't mean it isn't racism. Thus, as a story goes, Japanese-Chinese, or Japanese business men going on sex tours to Bangkok I would not see as interracial, though, for the Japanese, Chinese, and Thais involved it very much is racist dealing with all kinds of historical and sociological issues, just as black and white relationships in the US.

In short, I disagree with your narrow defination of racism, even in the US context.

Race just isn't black and white in the US. In college I dated a Chinese-American girl which was quite acceptable and normal to everybody - except her parents. They saw it as interracial and very problematic and were not happy at all and made it quite known.

The Irish, the Italians, eastern Europeans all experienced racism when migrating to the US that some of us may not even be aware of, as do Latinos today. Racism is racially blind, particularly from the perspective of victims.

from my understanding, racialism doesn't mean race-based bigotry, but merely the belief that races exist...

The meaning of 'racialism' is more contested than 'Racism' in sociology. I just used it to mean race-based bigotry outside of the dominant mode of Racism in America, because we're talking about the narrow category of interracial stories here at Literotica -- and I wanted to point out that an Arab sleeping with a Brazilian in a story will go unnoticed.

If you go down the list, most stories will have black male and white female. That pairing used to represent the most taboo sexual relationship outside of incest. I don't think you'll find more than one or two stories in the top fifty Most Read in that category, where at least one character isn't black or white. White and Indian, Black and Jewish occur, but Asian and Latin, Arab and Asian won't, because of how we've constructed race over the last few hundred years. Italian on Irish hate can be described with plain old 'bigotry' or 'ethnocentrism'.

Where skin color arouses hate you have a recognition of difference, and hate has primarily been aroused by whites against blacks where the English word 'Racism' is spoken. The justification for the slave trade, the word itself, the birth of 'scientific' study of race occurs because the construct is white over black. Whites didn't deem American Indians as inferior as blacks, because there weren't enough of them around, they couldn't use them for anything.

The taboo and sexiness of a story in IR category relies on the vestiges of North American Racism. A black male and white female together isn't especially sexy unless Racism still exists in its capital 'R' form. That is, the category relies on traditional race constructs to elicit forbidden lusts, desires that are still not allowed out in the open. The black or white is the prime character in IR for a reason, especially black man with white woman, but that's not to say there isn't white with asian, black with jew.

It tells you on the front page what the category contains in order of importance, in order of North American construct of most taboo: Interracial Love - It's all black & white, and white & Asian, and...

 

[Cattypuss]

First of all, a bit about me. I grew on four different continents and in at least as many cultures.

I have had the opportunity to be in a country where the majority were Caucasian and in countries where the majority were Black or Asian. Teachers and authors of all different races. So the racial context in my stories is very flexible.

My question is: does race matter in an erotic tale? I am writing to be read and not to make a statement; if race does matter, then I would write the same story in multiple racial contexts for different audiences.

Any thoughts?

(BTW, the US rocks! I love the diversity here.)

Charlie

I don't tend to mention my or my lovers' races in my stories. It doesn't occur to me to do so.