Questions for Foreigners

[Emirus]

I'm Australian, before the EU existed we used to fly a Canadian aircraft from New Jersey in the USA to Cologne Germany. If we rented a car in Germany we were not terribly welcome in France, the Benelux, or Denmark (German license plates). Using American, Canadian, or Australian papers we were always welcome.

A few years ago, whilst on holiday, we met a family and asked where they were from. They told us Denmark and I then told them I thought they could have been Danish but didn’t want to upset them in case they were Swedish or Norwegian. That wouldn’t have annoyed them, they told us, being taken for German is what annoys them.

Fifty years ago, in the Mediterranean, we became friendly with another couple of a similar age. I asked what part of America they were from and I was politely told they were Canadian. After my embarrassment subsided we became great friends. Since then I’ve never assumed and always asked, “where are you from?”

 

[Emirus]

Back to sandwiches, in a pub you'd have a cheese ploughman's, ie some lumps of good cheddar, some bread, some salad, and a good helping of Branston pickle or similar homemade chutney. In a packed lunch, just cheese and butter, but some ham and salad would be good with it. Anyone adding the crisps would do so as they eat.

Just reading that has made me hungry. We always have two jars of Branston Pickle in the cupboard. The original and also the small chunks. Yummy.

 

[oggbashan]

Just reading that has made me hungry. We always have two jars of Branston Pickle in the cupboard. The original and also the small chunks. Yummy.

As of Saturday, I have had to eschew Branston. I checked my blood sugar after a sandwich, and then the ingredients of Branston - far too much sugar. Now I am using piccalli.

 

[ishtat]

Now I am using piccalli.

Never, ever Og, touch the Australian version. They don't call it picalili but "sweet pickles" Essentially it is a jar of sugar, coloured yellow with turmeric.

 

[itismeinnz]

Also, as a funny side note, I know one of them had a great affection for having an Aussie friend say the C word over and over (I don’t know how many people that word offends and I’m sorry if mentioning it does!). Apparently that word just looked amazing.

I somehow found myself discussing the C word one lunchtime, in Aussie with a group of work colleagues of varying nationalities. Although they all immediately related to the use of the word to describe a really loathsome person, say "That guys a real c*** so far as I'm concerned," they were all surprised that where I'm from it can alternatively be a real compliment. When said something like "Yeah, I remember him...he's a really, really good c***," it means to me and I think most Kiwis "really solid dependable person, good friend, salt of the earth." It can be the best or worst way to describe someone.

 

[Bramblethorn]

I somehow found myself discussing the C word one lunchtime, in Aussie with a group of work colleagues of varying nationalities. Although they all immediately related to the use of the word to describe a really loathsome person, say "That guys a real c*** so far as I'm concerned," they were all surprised that where I'm from it can alternatively be a real compliment. When said something like "Yeah, I remember him...he's a really, really good c***," it means to me and I think most Kiwis "really solid dependable person, good friend, salt of the earth." It can be the best or worst way to describe someone.

Yep, it's used that way in Australia too.

 

[Bramblethorn]

Eastern European people who come to this country are always welcome, providing they contribute, because they are renowned as hard workers. Nothing to do with Brexit.

lol no.

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...nged-in-2016-poles-in-uk-struggle-with-brexit
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36656348
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...ist-incidents-reported-after-the-brexit-vote/

It's the old catch-22: as a migrant, if you're not "sponging off benefits" you're "stealing our jobs".

 

[SamScribble]

I somehow found myself discussing the C word one lunchtime, in Aussie with a group of work colleagues of varying nationalities. Although they all immediately related to the use of the word to describe a really loathsome person, say "That guys a real c*** so far as I'm concerned," they were all surprised that where I'm from it can alternatively be a real compliment. When said something like "Yeah, I remember him...he's a really, really good c***," it means to me and I think most Kiwis "really solid dependable person, good friend, salt of the earth." It can be the best or worst way to describe someone.

I have a friend from New Zealand who uses the word in that way. But, in his book anyway, only men can be 'good cunts'. A woman with similar qualities is 'a top Doris'.

 

[itismeinnz]

I have a friend from New Zealand who uses the word in that way. But, in his book anyway, only men can be 'good cunts'. A woman with similar qualities is 'a top Doris'.

That's really interesting, and it will be a point of discussion for my next Friday night get together. Oddly, I've never heard that expression used. But thinking about it I've never used "Really good cunt" in reference to a woman, so you've probably nailed it.

 

[XerXesXu]

lol no.

https://www.theguardian.com/politic...nged-in-2016-poles-in-uk-struggle-with-brexit
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36656348
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...ist-incidents-reported-after-the-brexit-vote/

It's the old catch-22: as a migrant, if you're not "sponging off benefits" you're "stealing our jobs".

I’m sure many people who read these posts are unfamiliar with the UK , Brexit and Brexit Derangement Syndrome. The Guardian and the BBC are leading exponents of the latter, amongst other things, laughingly claiming that the Russians had rigged the vote. All their claims have been debunked in court.

If you’re concerned for the welfare of our EU residents you’ll be reassured to know that of the 3,500,000 resident at the time of the Brexit vote 5,500,000 (8% of the UK population) have chosen to apply for permanent residence. Not only does the UK have a reputation as a comprehensive welfare state with free health care, in-work benefits and a generous minimum wage, but also for tolerance.

Count those that have voted with their feet.

 

[Bramblethorn]

I’m sure many people who read these posts are unfamiliar with the UK , Brexit and Brexit Derangement Syndrome. The Guardian and the BBC are leading exponents of the latter, amongst other things, laughingly claiming that the Russians had rigged the vote.

Cite, or it didn't happen.

All their claims have been debunked in court.

Again, gonna need a cite here.

If you’re concerned for the welfare of our EU residents you’ll be reassured to know that of the 3,500,000 resident at the time of the Brexit vote 5,500,000 (8% of the UK population) have chosen to apply for permanent residence.

5.5 million applications from 3.5 million people? That seems improbable. Again, a source would be nice.

Not only does the UK have a reputation as a comprehensive welfare state with free health care, in-work benefits and a generous minimum wage, but also for tolerance.

Count those that have voted with their feet.

Like the 30% increase in emigration of UK citizens to the EU since 2016, you mean?

 

[XerXesXu]

Bds

Quote:
Originally Posted by XerXesXu View Post
I’m sure many people who read these posts are unfamiliar with the UK , Brexit and Brexit Derangement Syndrome. The Guardian and the BBC are leading exponents of the latter, amongst other things, laughingly claiming that the Russians had rigged the vote.

Cite, or it didn't happen.

Russian interference in the 2016 Brexit referendum - Wikipedia

Read the sources.

Quote:
All their claims have been debunked in court.

Again, gonna need a cite here.

Carole Cadwalladr drops truth defence in Arron Banks case Press Gazette
Brexit activist Darren Grimes wins appeal against £20,000 Electoral Commission fine (telegraph.co.uk)

Quote:
If you’re concerned for the welfare of our EU residents you’ll be reassured to know that of the 3,500,000 resident at the time of the Brexit vote 5,500,000 (8% of the UK population) have chosen to apply for permanent residence.
5.5 million applications from 3.5 million people? That seems improbable.

Again, a source would be nice.

Quote:
Not only does the UK have a reputation as a comprehensive welfare state with free health care, in-work benefits and a generous minimum wage, but also for tolerance.

Count those that have voted with their feet.

Like the 30% increase in emigration of UK citizens to the EU since 2016, you mean?

Correct.
Number of EU citizens living in UK is now HIGHER than before Brexit (msn.com)

Lit doesn't seem to enable pasting of links, so, some homework for you - cut and paste.

 

[Bramblethorn]

Lit doesn't seem to enable pasting of links.

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/bullshit

 

[Omenainen]

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/bullshit

- wow, I’ve never seen this message before:

The message you have entered is too short. Please lengthen your message to at least 5 characters.

Okay then! So I’ll say

 

[Lori_the_Hoosier]

In this part of France it's hard to detect any real xenophobia other than the aversion the locals feel for any kind of Parisian, and the 'France is the best place in the world, better even than Disneyland' attitude, but that's cultural rather than racist and pretty much widespread across France anyway. Most regional peoples still cling to and preserve their own identity and their versions of French and push back hard against any central government efforts to change the status quo.

Parisians tend to look down on anyone who doesn't speak pure, unadulterated Académie Français-approved French, which everyone is supposed to speak as part of the French drive to keep their language pure, and almost no-one does, so when Parisians start deliberately over-emphasizing their 'pure' language use against the locals' argot to drive home just how wonderfully, 'properly' French they are, resentment builds.

There's even a Language Minister in the cabinet whose job it is to keep 'La Belle Française' belle by making sure globalization doesn't corrupt the purity of the language with any horrible foreign words slinking into common use, which the French already do anyway; 'le cheeseburger, 'le weekend', 'le TV dinner' are common and make the language minister grind his teeth, but new ones like 'le You Tube', 'le Fit-Bit', 'le laptop' and other weirdities are being heard around and about.

No-one here speaks French, at least not Parisian French; one can wander through Nice or Saint Tropez and hear conversations in English, Italian, Greek, Russian, Mandarin, Occitan, and Brazilian all day long with not a whisper of Académie French, just a machine-gun rattle of local dialect with the occasional recognizable French word thrown in.

Will was at a serious disadvantage when we first came here; he's idiomatically fluent in Académie/Amiens French, in Paris he sounds like a Parisian, but here he floundered because many of the locals ddn't really understand him, and he definitely didn't understand Occitan. After 4 years he's slipped into the local language quite happily and can change up and down from Occitan to French to Russian to English without pause for thought but occasionally word use and some phrases will defeat him by meaning the exact opposite or something other than the conventional meaning.

I have the opposite problem; my 'pure' French is execrable, I see Will wincing when I go there, but Occitan is a lot (a lot...) like Créole, and I could understand the locals and make myself understood almost from day one, so even though I'm obviously of Asian extraction, incoming from England, and an American to boot, I found myself accepted a lot sooner than he did with his Englishness and his perfect Parisian French.

 

[oggbashan]

Many years ago I was part of a French Language Circle at our local evening classes. We would sit around and just talk French all evening. Many were from Francophone countries, but some, like me, were English but advanced students.

At the time I had a very early laptop, bought cheaply because it had a French (Azerty) keyboard, and all the applications were in French - dBase, Supercalc, WordPerfect, etc.

The tutor asked me to give a talk to the group on the use of computers, word processing, etc because NONE of the students owned or used a computer.

I gave the talk - in French, using the computing terms approved by the Academie Francaise. I had to translate every term into English because none of the students had heard of those words in French. Even so, at the end of my half-hour talk and demonstration, the tutor asked me to return next week and do the whole talk again in English. The terms the Academie Francaise insisted on were meaningles to them..

 

[Lori_the_Hoosier]

Many years ago I was part of a French Language Circle at our local evening classes. We would sit around and just talk French all evening. Many were from Francophone countries, but some, like me, were English but advanced students.

At the time I had a very early laptop, bought cheaply because it had a French (Azerty) keyboard, and all the applications were in French - dBase, Supercalc, WordPerfect, etc.

The tutor asked me to give a talk to the group on the use of computers, word processing, etc because NONE of the students owned or used a computer.

I gave the talk - in French, using the computing terms approved by the Academie Francaise. I had to translate every term into English because none of the students had heard of those words in French. Even so, at the end of my half-hour talk and demonstration, the tutor asked me to return next week and do the whole talk again in English. The terms the Academie Francaise insisted on were meaningles to them..

I so get this; when I wanted to buy a replacement Blu Ray DVD player the sales guy had no idea what 'DVD' meant, I called Will, got his word on it, and had to ask for 'lecteur à disque vidéo numérique Blu ray haute définitition - by the time I got all that out while he grinned superciliously at my pronunciation I'd gone off the idea completely, got on my phone, and bought one from Amazon instead. Now at least i know why some French prefer the English shorthand version of names and phrases, you haven't gone insane by the time you get to the end of constructing the description.

 

[oggbashan]

A few years ago, in Calais, I wanted to buy an Azerty keyboard for use on my PC when writing in French.

I went to Carrefour's technology department and had to wait while another (French) customer was buying a new laptop. He and the salesman did all the discussion about the features in English, and the tech guy had to demonstrate how to disable the French version of Windows because the customer would never use it.

Even earlier I was half of the tech support department for my company. The secretaries and typists used a mainframe-based word-processing system but the company was taken over by Norsk Data and the software upgraded.

I had to work on the system about once a week when something went wrong.

When I got the error messages in Norwegian, I knew I was in real trouble...


One of my French friends told me that his basic error messages on Windows were in French but to correct them he had to dig back to the English version and all his blue screens came after an error in English.

 

[AvroAnsonXIX]

No-one here speaks French, at least not Parisian French; one can wander through Nice or Saint Tropez and hear conversations in English, Italian, Greek, Russian, Mandarin, Occitan, and Brazilian ...

LOL, when we were in Europe many years ago we mistakenly brought an Italian phrase book to Venice. We stayed in Jesolo Lido, everybody there spoke German, even the store signs were in German.

 

[Handley_Page]

I so get this; when I wanted to buy a replacement Blu Ray DVD player the sales guy had no idea what 'DVD' meant,
I called Will, got his word on it, and had to ask for 'lecteur à disque vidéo numérique Blu ray haute définitition - by the time I got all that out while he grinned superciliously at my pronunciation I'd gone off the idea completely, got on my phone, and bought one from Amazon instead.
Now at least i know why some French prefer the English shorthand version of names and phrases, you haven't gone insane by the time you get to the end of constructing the description.

I recall the arguments about "le Scotch Tape" but I just love the PC: "Ordinateur personnel"

 

[SimonDoom]

Parisians tend to look down on anyone who doesn't speak pure, unadulterated Académie Français-approved French, which everyone is supposed to speak as part of the French drive to keep their language pure, and almost no-one does, so when Parisians start deliberately over-emphasizing their 'pure' language use against the locals' argot to drive home just how wonderfully, 'properly' French they are, resentment builds.

.

This reminds me of the great Steve Martin routine about visiting France:

Let me give you a warning.

If you’re going over there, here’s an example.

"Chapeau" means hat.

"Oeuf" means egg.

It’s like those French have a different word for everything!

See, you never appreciate your language until you go to a foreign country that doesn’t have the courtesy to speak English.

 

[oggbashan]

5.5 million applications from 3.5 million people? That seems improbable. Again, a source would be nice.

This is dated but shows what has been happening:

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...r-of-eu-nationals-applying-for-uk-citizenship.

More people, since the Brexit vote, have come to the UK than have left but there are variations by nationality. Now that Poland's economy has improved and employment prospects are better, many Poles have returned there to be replaced by Spanish, Portuguese, and Greeks where youth unemployment is horrendous.

Some ex-Pat Brits, particularly from Spain, have been returning because the Spanish requirements for residency are complex, longwinded, and almost impossible.

 

[XerXesXu]

French language and culture.

In this part of France it's hard to detect any real xenophobia other than the aversion the locals feel for any kind of Parisian, and the 'France is the best place in the world, better even than Disneyland' attitude, but that's cultural rather than racist and pretty much widespread across France anyway.

My first contact with the French was when I was 16. I got on the ferry with the intention of awing them with my schoolboy mastery of their language. I got off on the other side and started peddling, only to make three discoveries. No one in France spoke French. The girls were no where as loose as English girls. A boy on a bike was considered by every French youth to be in a race.

Oh, and I don't believe I had ever shaken hands with anyone in my life. They shake hands - a lot.

But they were a generally amiable bunch. If you wanted to get a reaction just drop the subjunctive into a sentence.

Years later, during the Entente Cordiale I acquired an old house at the head of a valley in the foothills beyond the littoral at Nice. It needed 'some work'. The previous owner had installed a swimming pool at the front and, I presume, run out of money. I set to work.

After 3 or 4 days a person claiming to be from some local authority turned up. He'd been sent to tell me that the sound of work was disturbing the repose of the valley between mid-day and 2pm, and that it was not done. I explained that I was English and we were Protestant (many are) and we had a thing called a work ethic (some do). We worked in the day, ate in the evening and slept at night. I told him I would work silently between 12 and 2, but I was amused to find that a stereotype was actually true.

 

[gordo12]

This reminds me of the great Steve Martin routine about visiting France:

Let me give you a warning.

If you’re going over there, here’s an example.

"Chapeau" means hat.

"Oeuf" means egg.

It’s like those French have a different word for everything!

See, you never appreciate your language until you go to a foreign country that doesn’t have the courtesy to speak English.

Or Gordo ordering a female horse instead of a glass of water in Portugal. You should have seen the waiter's face!

 

[8letters]

Or Gordo ordering a female horse instead of a glass of water in A Portugal. You should have seen the waiter's face!

A friend of mine got on a bus in France and thought she was asking the bus driver "Where is the train station?" ("Où est la gare"). What she was asking was "Where is the war?" ("Où est la guerre"). For some reason, the bus driver was very confused.