Question.........

[CuriousRed]

Ok, I'm gonna throw this one out there.

I'll have to give some background info first to make sure there's enough info for opinions, but I'll try to do the reader's digest version.

My wife is bi. She didn't let me in on this until well after we were married. She actually never acted on it until we were married and I gave my blessing. She had several encounters with her best friend. I let them do things too many times to count. Her friend did it all behind her husbands back, but not mine. I was never involved. At some point, the whole "unfairness" of my not getting to do anything with anybody else started coming up (not by me) so the wife stopped because she felt guilty. Then, a couple years later, they had a few more encounters. Finally, the grand hurrah was a group session with the three of us. I only got to perform orally on her and they both took care of me the same way; she was still with her husband and that's all the farther she wanted to go. I greatfully took whatever I got. I was honestly happy to sit on the bed and watch them go at it, that's what I remember most about the whole encounter.

Now, fast forward, gf has left her hubby. Of course, she jumped right into the arms of another man, but that's another story. He doesn't want her to do anything with wifey. My wife went through these scenerios in this order:
1) Not going to do anything with her period. (No fuel for gf's soon to be ex)
2) Well, maybe they'll do some stuff (not talking to me about it)
3) Not going to do anything with her because it'd be behind gf's new boyfriend's back.
4) Suddenly, openly talking between them about doing stuff. (Still not taking in my opinion)
--an aside: I guess wifey assumed it was OK with me, just never asked.
5) Suddenly it was OK to do things.
6) She had an encounter with her one evening. Nothing too big, but enough to consider sexual.
--another aside: She told me as soon as she entered the house, as was the agreement from the sessions years ago.
7) That night, we finally had a discussion and she said, and I quote:"I'm just not going to do anything without you; it's not fair to you". I agreed and said OK.
8) (Guess what this is gonna be) Apperently wifey has totally forgot our agreement and openly stated Wed and Thur to her GF that if the kids weren't her they'd have done stuff.

I was in denial. I consider this to be wrong. If we had an agreement, then if she does something with her gf I would consider it her lying to me (from the agreement) and cheating on me. I know she wants to do this bad, but I think it's wrong. Either way I go, I'm hosed. I'm either gonna stop her from enjoying that part of her life (and I'm depressed from that) or she gets to do all these things with somebody else and I get nothing (and that's not fair to me and depressing). I'm too afraid to bring up our agreement (which was totally her idea; no prompting from me) as I know it'll end up in an argument. How severe depends on her mood.

I feel that no matter what I do, I'm hosed; I can't win. It's either let her play and be upset, or not let her play and be upset. I feel I can't win.
I also have NO BODY to talk to about this. I don't trust anybody enough to discuss this but it's driving me crazy. I'm so messed up by all this for the last week. Part of me wants to wait to see what happens. I'd be willing to be money that something will happen next Sat. They get some time alone every other Sat.

Should I wait for her to do it and share all the above points or should I head it off now and get into a big blow up. If I tell her they're done, she'll stop but I will feel totally bad. I don't know what to feel honestly; I'm lost.

I hope this is not to indecipherable.

 

[CorsetLvr]

I think you both need to communicate about it. Not as a fight, but more of a problem solving session where you both have input. Try thinking outside the box for a moment. Is she only attracted to the gf or is she attracted to other women as well. Maybe you need to consider swinging or some other alternative lifestyle that allows you to do some playing too.

You're situation is not unusual for a lot of men in relationships with bi women. I have seen it frequently over the years. I was in several relationships where I had to hide my bisexuality and its not something I ever want to do again. On the other hand I can say that I have never limited my hubby on playing outside of our relationship either. We allow each other a certain amount of freedom. Admittedly, our situation is not going to be right for every couple. I sense that your wife is somewhat frustrated by this situation as well. Maybe the time is right for you to work out something that will make both of you happier and more fulfilled.

I can see that you want to give her the freedom to explore her bisexuality, but at the same time you are experiencing a certain amount of frustration because its something you can not share in. Again, I think you need to sit down with her and discuss the limits of what is acceptable and see if there is some run to expand on what you are currently doing.

 

[CuriousRed]

Your post makes sense, thanks. I can see your points.
She is attracted to many women, not unlike a horny guy LOL.
However, she only does things with her friend.
Where we live, swinging might not really be an option. (Small town, bible thumpers everywhere, not an area where it's done) though it isn't something that is ruled out for the future.
I wouldn't want her to hide it either. It's just that she HAS had certain freedoms outside the confines of the relationship but I don't get those myself (almost a double standard; it's OK for her but not me). The only concession I could ever get is if I wanted to do stuff with a guy I'm free to but she knows that's not gonna happen (based on many different factors).
I'd very much wanna open the discussion with her, but if I don't catch her in the exact, right mood it would be a fight. And with the many comments she's making with her friend (letting me know it's on both their brains big time), if I suggest changes now (limiting her) then she'll take it wrong at it will be a fight. (This is based on experiences of our 10+ years, not me being a butt head, just to clarify )
I do thank you for your post, it very good!! I'm kind of glad to be able to talk about this to someone, get it off my chest (so to speak).

 

[CorsetLvr]

Where we live, swinging might not really be an option. (Small town, bible thumpers everywhere, not an area where it's done) though it isn't something that is ruled out for the future.
I wouldn't want her to hide it either. It's just that she HAS had certain freedoms outside the confines of the relationship but I don't get those myself (almost a double standard; it's OK for her but not me). The only concession I could ever get is if I wanted to do stuff with a guy I'm free to but she knows that's not gonna happen (based on many different factors).
I'd very much wanna open the discussion with her, but if I don't catch her in the exact, right mood it would be a fight. And with the many comments she's making with her friend (letting me know it's on both their brains big time), if I suggest changes now (limiting her) then she'll take it wrong at it will be a fight. (This is based on experiences of our 10+ years, not me being a butt head, just to clarify )
I do thank you for your post, it very good!! I'm kind of glad to be able to talk about this to someone, get it off my chest (so to speak).

Well, it sounds like a communication problem rather then a sexual one. You can't work out your issues without it becoming a fight? It sounds like you both need to work on your communication and negotiation skills.

You'd be surprised where there are swingers and what makes you think that swingers would be any more indiscrete then your wife's gf? One of the foundations of the swinging lifestyle is indiscretion. In addition, I never said you had to swing in your home town. We have been a swinging couple for over 10 yrs. and have friends scattered all over the state. Just for the record, a majority of women in swinging are bi, or bi curious.

 

[Batman4ever71]

Yu two can't fix it if she doesn't know it's broken, so to speak. I'm guessing that she's not a mind reader and cannot tell that these things bother you unless you speak up. Like Corsett, I think you need to address these issues in a non-argumentative fashion. If she's half as caring as you portray her, she'll see the validity of your points and want to work out a deal that benefits you both.

After all, your wishes are just as important as her's. I'd bet good money that she'd see it that way as well.

Best of Luck in a Tough Spot,
Batman

 

[CuriousRed]

Corserlvr: Thanks. I don't mean to imply that we can't talk. In all other things we're spot on. I think it's just this particular subject. I'd say based on history (of this subject) that there's a 50% to 75% the talk could go south. I just need to catch her in the right mood. (hypothetically, if she was really horny and talking to gf about it; that'd be a bad opportunity)

Batman4ever71: Yeah, you're right too.

It's just I feel I've painted myself in a corner now. I get the impression that this time her gf doesn't want to do things with me (I think it's because she's with someobody she wants to be this time). I'm ok with that too, I completely understand.

I think the choices would be:
1) We all get to do something (which I don't think will happen)
2) Nobody does anything (which will have 2 upset women, and I'll feel bad for not letting wifey do stuff)
3) They still do stuff without me (and I'm back to square one)

Realistically, #3 is the best option as it only hits me, and not them (as again, I don't honestly believe #1 will happen again). It just makes me unhappy. But history dictates I generally put others before me which is why I previously let her do stuff; I think the onesidedness (is that a word LOL) is just finally eating away at me; it's kind of depressing.

Thanks again to both of you, great advice and I'm glad to discuss this. I'm trying to work out a plan of discussion, I just need to figure out the best way (AND TIME) to start it. I guess it just helps to hear that I'm not crazy for feeling this way.

 

[fgarvb1]

Huh, Several things wave to me.


Number one and it is number one because it has been used on me before, and I am very sensitive to it, is that she is using keeping you confused as a tool to do what she wants.

Number two, is that she is a lier, because she is willing to lie to get what she wants. The rest of that crap is window dressing. She is cheating on you with this other person...what sex the other person is doesn't doesn't matter. You see it all boils down to a matter of trust, and you know you can't trust her. Or, rather you know you can trust her to put herself and her wants above you and your marriage.

Number three, Being a little bit of a lier is like being a "little bit pregnant" somebody is getting smoke blown up there ass.

Number four, you are getting ripped off and abused. You deserve a better relationship than that. You have the right to change your mind.

Now as to what to do...That is up to you, your descision...your choice.

One thing I am sure of is that "When you get enough of it, You will do something about it."

 

[Scepter]

Choice number four might be: You can continue to have a lesbian relationship with your friend, but I get to watch even if only passively, I can understand your friends reluctance to engage in sex with me, but I feel this would be a fair compromise.

Or choice number four "B".

You can continue to have a lesbian relationship with your friend but it has to be in our home, and I have to be in the house, even if I'm not watching I want to know where you are.

In either case you have the right to fuck her brains out after she and her friend are finished.

 

[CuriousRed]

More great advice. I like those choice number 4's, and I've thought of that too.

As for the lying part, I don't feel she's intentionally lying. With every other aspect of our relationship, there's absolutely no problems. I love my wife dearly, but sometimes she can be a tad "scatterbrained" or forgetfull. She has LOTS on her plate right now so I would be inclined to say she's forgotten the conversation we had as it was a quick one minute thing before I went to bed one night. She wouldn't do this to spite me. The fact she mentioned it on the phone in front of me tells me that she thinks it's ok; therefore the grappling of do I remind her and risk pissing her off (and all that above stuff I've talked about) or let it go and see what happens. She actually hasn't done anything yet, so there's no cheating involved. It's been a couple off remarks. So, it's not a scenerio like that. I don't feel abused. I may have back when it first started (in the late 90's) but I don't now. I know if I was a real "dick" and stated that they were done and nothing was too happen again she'd adhere to that. I just can't bring myself to be that way (I guess I have to really, really pissed to be that way) So in that, you are right. When I have enough, I'll probably "blow" my stack, but they'd have to do stuff for that to happen or she'd have to intentionally just go against the rules.

Again, thanks for ALL the opinions!!!!

I guess I'm just gonna have to find the right time and have the "remind you of the conversation we had" conversation. I'm just gonna have to be in an all ready pissy mood so as to not care if she gets mad or time it very well.

Thanks again to ALL!!!!!

 

[SweetErika]

I was in denial. I consider this to be wrong. If we had an agreement, then if she does something with her gf I would consider it her lying to me (from the agreement) and cheating on me. I know she wants to do this bad, but I think it's wrong.

I agree with you...breaking the agreement is wrong and cheating. However, I'd encourage you to consider the positives, as well. She doesn't want to be dishonest, hide things, break agreements, or cheat. She loves and respects you. She wants it to be equitable, but probably just doesn't know how to make it so without serious problems that could hurt and/or destroy your relationship. I've been there, and to some extent still am.

I think stepping back and trying to gain new perspectives might be helpful. I'm certainly not saying your thoughts and feelings are wrong or bad in any way, but I've found kind of tossing out my ideas and being completely open to new ones has opened a lot of doors in similar situations. So, instead of thinking 'Wrong, bad, cheating, unfair, hypocrisy, lying, hosed, I can't win, depressed, upset, etc.,' could you try something like, 'We've overcome, problem-solved, and have a lot going for us (in terms of the aforementioned positives, a desire to find a good solution, I'm assuming a good relationship, etc.). Many couples go through this and find something that makes them both happy, and by keeping an open mind, we're going to do the same.'? I hope that doesn't sound patronizing or condescending...it's simply a huge part of what has helped my husband and I deal with this.

Either way I go, I'm hosed. I'm either gonna stop her from enjoying that part of her life (and I'm depressed from that) or she gets to do all these things with somebody else and I get nothing (and that's not fair to me and depressing). I'm too afraid to bring up our agreement (which was totally her idea; no prompting from me) as I know it'll end up in an argument. How severe depends on her mood.

So, with the above in mind, I'm going to suggest that you're not hosed, nor does this have to be an either/or situation.

Last year, after a couple of years of thinking and looking, I met a woman to have my first real FF experience with. I was terrified to tell my husband that I actually wanted to do this, in large part because I would be asking him for permission to go outside our relationship alone, and especially do something that I knew he really wanted to be a part of (though we talked and agreed on me trying alone one to a few times before he'd ever be included). It seemed completely unfair, and I felt horribly guilty for wanting this. However, when I finally worked up the courage to ask, he smiled, gave me a hug, a kiss, his blessing, and told me to have a good time.

Recently he told me he felt conflicted and had some trouble doing that and mixed feelings while I was gone. He didn't express them at the time (though we talked a lot then and I asked over and over if he was sure) because he knew the guilt would be too much and I'd never have gone. He's never regretted or resented it; he just looked at it as something to overcome.

When I got home, I gave him all of the details, and we started talking about how we were going to handle this in the future. I felt guilty because I didn't want to stick to just a few times alone...having a man even just watching was fun and very hot, but completely different and not satisfying in the same way as being alone with another woman. I bit the bullet and told my husband this, and again, he was completely understanding and supportive. He said this was my sexuality, part of who I am, he loved me, and just wanted me to be myself and be happy. One of his main points was that my sexuality wasn't a choice...sure, I could choose to deny, suppress, or not act on my desire for women OR men/him, but that wouldn't be good or bring me happiness. So, at the time we both felt it was fair for both of us to be monogamous with the opposite sex, but also have relationships with the same sex. He's not bi, so yes, it might seem unfair, but we were going on the principle that sexual orientation just is what it is, and it was best to embrace and be flexible about it. We agreed if the opportunity presented itself, he'd definitely be involved, but that wasn't going to be the only option.

The way my husband has handled this has made me very happy. His generosity and willingness to find solutions has made me want to work even harder to give back and fulfill his needs whenever possible. He's noted that I'm happier as a person, we appreciate eachother more, and our sex life and marriage is all the better for it. We've done some other stuff, but I'm getting to a place where I can feel good about supporting him in having relationships with other women if he wants; I wouldn't have started on this path had he said, "No, either I need to be involved when you're with women, or you can't do it at all."

So, my point is that you have the power to decide how you feel about and handle this. Choosing to view it as something that would add to your wife's life and happiness (which will undoubtably spill over to your relationship) could very well be your best solution, or at least you'd be no worse off for giving it a try.

There's a newer word that's used widely in polyamory, though I think it applies to any loving relationship: compersion. Compersion is the feeling of content that comes with seeing your partner happy from having their wants and needs met by others. You love your wife, and want her to be as happy as possible, whether she's with you, at work, alone, or with friends, correct? Her happiness makes you happy. It's likely the ability to express her sexuality with her girlfriend will make her happy, and seeing and knowing you have a huge part in that will make you feel really good. I think you might identify and find a lot of wisdom in this article .


I'm not suggesting you should lie or pretend to be okay with it. I am saying this is something to seriously consider because it might be the mutually agreeable solution you're looking for (or at least a starting point to finding it). Think about why you're really against giving her permission, what you might be afraid of, and why you feel it's unfair. Also think about what your happiness means to eachother, and what the potential pros of supporting her would be. Talk with her about what you're considering, and ask her for what you need, whether it's her support, to take it slow, give it a trial run and then re-evaluate, etc. I think if you can approach this from a new, cooperative standpoint (as opposed to telling her what she can or viewing it as an argument waiting to happen), only good will come of it.

I apologize for the length, but much of this is what I heard from the community here when we started on this journey last year. Lit's a great place to talk things out, get support, and find new ideas. I hope you find the same, whether you consider this post or not.

 

[TBKahuna123]

You know, this thread really got me thinking last night and my wife and I had an interesting conversation about this. Here's what the conclusion I came to: she's not the least bit interested in other women, but I wouldn't care if she were.

I think the first think you need to do, Red, is to decide exactly what it is about this that bothers you. Obviously the main problem seems to be that you aren't involved, but what is it about that which bothers you? Here are a couple things that I can see:

1.) It's not fair to you because she gets to do something with someone else and you don't.

OK, so do you feel this way because you really want a threesome or because you are selfish about letting her have something and you not getting as much as her? Reading your post, I doubt this it is selfishness or you'd be able to be a dick about it in the first place. This is easy to deal with. If you really want a threesome, tell here, I'll bet it'll happen. If you are just being selfish, stop! Don't do that! Also, is this really the issue, or is it just at the front of your mind because your wife suggestted it's unfair to you? Do YOU really think this?

2.) You are jealous because she's having a new experience without you.

I can understand this one. It is quite natural to be envious of a spouse when they experience something new alone and you aren't able to share in that part of their life. This isn't just sexual either. My wife and I have had to face this issue as I have had many opportunities int he last couple years which she has not, and which she hasn't been able to be a part of. The key here is communication by the person who is feelign jealous of their feelings and why, then understanding on the person having the experiences and trying to find a way to comfort the other person. For me it was encouraging my wife to search out a new challenge, then helping her find something.

3.) You are afraid she'll leave you.

I get this one too, but it's not very likely. More likely she's just needing/wanting to explore the other side of her sexuality. As Erika said, supressing who she is will not make her happy, or you.

4.) You're afraid it may hurt things sexually between you two.

Again, I'm a guy and I get this fear. I think realistically if you two have a good sexual relationship, the chances of this being a factor are small. Rather I think that this might actually enhance your sexual relationship.

5.) You feel like your marriage should be monogamous and going outside it for any reason would be cheating.

This is the realy tough one, because there is not compromise. If this is how you feel and she is not able to live with that fact, then you need to deal with it now, because it will destroy your marriage. I'm not going to say this is wrong in any way, because I totally feel this way when it comes to my marriage. I may be pretty open about things, but I am a staunch believer in monogamy. I'm not saying it's right or wrong, mind you, just saying that for me, this is the relationship I have to be in.


The key here is though, you have to talk to her. Will she be pissy? Perhaps, but there is an easy way to stop that. If she starts getting angry and defensive just tell her that if she wants to do this she better talk to you about it because she owes you that respect. Tell her that you care about her and about your relationship and that this is something you need to talk through before it hurts things. It sounds to me like she doesn't want to hurt you and that she values your marriage. The key here is not broachign the subject in a way which makes her defensive. The other key is that even if she turns it into a fight, stay calm and continue to talk your way through it. if she starts raving at you it's because she feels guilty for her feelings. If you don't deal with that it will eat her alive.

The biggest thing here is that she respect you and your marriage. Not hiding it, no doin it on the sly, no going outside whatever clearly defined ground rules you both set. At the same time, you ahve to be respectful of her. Understand that she has these feelings and that she desires to explore them. I'm not saying that if you can't live with her being with other women that you should cave in, that's as bad as forcing her to stop. What I'm saying though is that you should really look at your reasons for wanting her to stop. Is it something about the way it's happening? Is it a legitimate feeling or just petty jealousy? Is it something that you can work through or is it a deal breaker for your marriage?

I understand what Erika is saying about it being different without a man even watching, but I'd never really thought of it that way. So often we men think of lesbian sex and cool wanking material and miss the delicate intimacy of it.

As I said, my wife and I had this discussion and I came to the conclussion that while I am very pro monogamy and I wouldn't be able to let her be with another guy, I could let her be with another woman. I also came to the conclusion that were we to ever have a MFF threesome, that I wouldn't want to do fuck the other woman, because I would feel like I was cheating on her. Wierd, eh?

On a final note, because I'm not sure how this long ass post is going to sound, I am not saying your feelings are wrong. I've just learned after many years of marriage to really look deeply at my feelings before trying to solve a problem. Marriage is about compromise, but you have to make the right compromise for both parties involved. This can only be accompllished when you uncover the true source of your feelings, because sometimes the easy answer hides the key to what's really bothering us.

 

[CorsetLvr]

I think you are both torn between feelings and emotions of your own personal interests and desires and those that are best for your relationship.

I have been in your wife's shoes in a the past. On one side, I didn't want to deny my own needs and on the other I wanted what was best for my relationship. Admittedly, this was when I was younger and still coming to terms with my bisexuality and I wasn't in a LTR.

My current situation is different than yours for 1 major reason. That being that we are not in a monogamous relationship. We both have lovers outside of our primary relatuionship with each other.

I found Erika's post to be very enlightening. I have found there are basically 3 kinds of men in relationships with bi women, and her hubby is almost the stereotype for one of them. Here is my opinion on the 3 types of men when it comes to having a bifem partner.

1. Sexually threatened and clueless - "What can she do for you that I can't?"

2. The sexual user - "Great! When can we have a 3-sum with your girlfriends?" This type is more interested in what he can get out of the deal then the needs and emotions of his partner. Sadly, they are generally totally unequiped for the reality of a 3-sum. They expect it to be like some sort of porn movie with them being both the director and the male star. In my opinion, they are usually just not able to keep up with two horny women.

3. The supportive & sensitive partner - "That nice, I hope your awakening will allow you to more fully explore your sexuality." This guy, like Erika's (and my hubby for that matter), understands that the rewards of having a sexually aware and satisfied partner will come back to visit him. Erika's description really hit home with me. In a lot of ways it reminded me of my search of "Mr. Right."

When i was single and was dating someone that I thought had LTR potential, my disclosure of my sexuality was always a pivotal moment in the relationship. Unfortunately, a majority of men either fall into group 1 or 2 above. As soon as I found this out, the relationship was basically over. Type 3's are as rare as hen's teeth. The reaction of the men I dated to this disclosure told me a lot about them, especially about their outlook on sex.

When I was in my 20's I usually hid my sexuality from men I dated. With maturity I cme to the conclusion that if they couldn't accept me for what I am then I was wasting my time with them. I went through a period in my 30's where I basically gave up on finding the perfect Type 3 "Mr. Right." I had a few "fuck buddies" but I never considered them as potential relationship material. Most of my serious relationships during this period were with women. Interestingly enough, a lot of these women were in relationships with Type 3 guys. When I did meet a Type 3, there wasn't the attraction or chemistry needed for a LTR.

As I said earlier, I had given up on finding Mr. Right. When I did, it was a total surprise and I actually fought my attraction to him. When I gave him the "I'm bi" test he passed with flying colors. It wasn't something new to him. His ex-wife, that had passed away in a car accident, had been bi.

Anyway, I hope this little insight into my own life has helped in some small way.

 

[CuriousRed]

I agree and understand with both of you, and I believe I'm #3, but I think the 2 or so years of being #3 and her having a pseudo relationship while I'm not isn't very enlightning anymore. Maybe it's just sour grapes, but at this point I feel "left out" or "neglected". It probably is just sour grapes I guess. Why does she get to do things when I don't? Her being with another woman doesn't really add much to our sex life. She is very sexually aware and I don't see how it could get any better between us that way (I'm saying it's awesome and if it got any better I'd probably just explode).

I guess in a round about way I'm jealous that she does stuff and I don't. Maybe that's just it. That's why I don't think it's "fair". She gets "candy" and I don't.

I hope that makes sense.

And I blame nothing on wifey. She's great and I love her with all my heart. I really do think we are soul mates. And I honestly believe she'd never intentionally do anything to hurt me. If I wanted her to stop, she would. She wouldn't like it, but she would. Again, it's the old painted in a corner thing.

Thanks again for the conversations, it really is good to talk about this stuff!

 

[TBKahuna123]

First off, let me say you're one helluva guy. You are honest enough to say you're jealous, but you still don't want to stop her because it wouldn't make her happy. It's called taking one for the team and that's cool. However, be wary, because after a while it can come back to haunt you.

That's what's goingon now. You are starting to get those feelings of jealousy, of being left out. Is it that you aren't getting candy or that you aren't involved in this part of her life? Being jealous of either one is perfectly natural, I think.

You two need to talk it out. Even if making her stop isn't an answer, there are other ways that you can "get candy" too. You need to talk through this and work it out between you. You can be the good guy, let her have her way, and still get some excitement yourself. It sounds to me like you are looking just to have the same freedom that she has. Do you want to be with other women? This might be something you need to discuss with her.

The key is communication, as always. There's a compromise and a solution to every problem. You can find it together.

 

[CorsetLvr]

Personally I don't think the problem is with you or your wife. The problem may be with the girlfriend. I'm not saying anything is wrong with her personally, just that she has become the issue because of her unwillingness to play with both you. Considering she is married, that is understandable.

The answer to this issue may not be that you need to make a big change in your relationship with you wife, but rather find a new playmate that you both can share. That may not be as easy as it sounds. For every bifem looking for a couple, there may be 100 couples looking for a bifem. On top of that you have attraction and compatibility issues to take into account.

 

[LadyFunkenstein]

Why is it that on Lit, "bisexual" means you have a license to fuck other people, your spouse be damned? Like you have this insatiable need to have a certainly sexual experience, and the world should just deal with it. On Lit, bisexuality never seems to have anything to do with "love" - it is always about making the lives of the people & the world around you your own sexual petri dish.

Now I am not saying I am perfect, but I call a spade a spade when it comes to my actions.

I totally agree with fgarvb1.

Curiousred and his wife discussed it. She claimed it would stop - she won't do anything without him.

But she lied. And she is a cheater.

There is nothing left to communicate folks, he already voiced his feelings on the matter, and she disregarded them.

If it were me, I'd be thinking that YES it is time to head it off and give her an ultimatum. I deserve to be happy, same as her. The deal was changed AFTER I got married, AFTER we made a marital agreement. SHE changed things, and I am not happy. I don't have to sit at home and wait for her to "explore" - that's bull.

 

[phoenix1224]

Why is it that on Lit, "bisexual" means you have a license to fuck other people, your spouse be damned? Like you have this insatiable need to have a certainly sexual experience, and the world should just deal with it. On Lit, bisexuality never seems to have anything to do with "love" - it is always about making the lives of the people & the world around you your own sexual petri dish.

Now I am not saying I am perfect, but I call a spade a spade when it comes to my actions.

I totally agree with fgarvb1.

Curiousred and his wife discussed it. She claimed it would stop - she won't do anything without him.

But she lied. And she is a cheater.

There is nothing left to communicate folks, he already voiced his feelings on the matter, and she disregarded them.

If it were me, I'd be thinking that YES it is time to head it off and give her an ultimatum. I deserve to be happy, same as her. The deal was changed AFTER I got married, AFTER we made a marital agreement. SHE changed things, and I am not happy. I don't have to sit at home and wait for her to "explore" - that's bull.

Thank you!

It's about time someone said it...

 

[TBKahuna123]

Why is it that on Lit, "bisexual" means you have a license to fuck other people, your spouse be damned?

On the one hand you ahve a really good point, but I don't think that's just her on Lit. Often times women feel like being with another woman is fine because they know that guys get turned on by seeing two chicks together. Well, that doesn't make it ok unless your partner says it is. I think you might be a little harsh about it, but I hear what you are saying. There's nothing wrong with exploring your sexuality, but not at your partner's expense.

I guess as I read back through my post, maybe I came across as though I was saying he should learn to deal with it and let her go. That's not at all what I was trying to say. It sounds to me like he has conflicting feelings about whether it's a problem or not for him and why. I think that if he really looks deeply nad understands what HE'S feeling, then he can present those feelings to his wife clearly. When you are starting conversations like htis, it's better to have a really clear understanding of what you are feeling before you start pinning down your partner on a problem you want to address.

 

[CuriousRed]

I agree with the last three posts; wholeheartedly, but I would like to point out that she has NOT cheated nor lied. If she does do something, she'll tell me, and at that point it would be cheating but not intentional. I really believe she's just forgotten the agreement. It was not this huge conversation we had. Part of me wants to wait to see if she does or doesn't.

That being said, I'm waiting for the right time to have the "reminder" conversation. I don't wanna get into it about it. The last week or so has been a really, really, really good time with us. We've been getting time away from the kids and getting some good QT in. I don't wanna risk ruining the "moment" by bringing it up. I'm sure it'll get mentioned in the next week.

I do REALLY agree with the statement that just because she (or anybody) is bi does not give them a free license to do things. That's also one of the things that perplexes me with SOME people on this board (NOT ALL).

Thanks again!!!

 

[LadyFunkenstein]

Ah, yes. How does this hypothetical sound:
**************************
I am really attracted to male bodybuilders. It is just the way I am, it is a part of who I am. I can't change me.

My husband is not a bodybuilder, he is a "regular joe" but he knows I have this specific desire. I told him a year after we married: "Honey, I have to fuck body builders. You can watch if you like, play along a little." He needs to learn how to deal with it, and I thought he was doing so. Anyway, I see a lot of "Loving Wives" stories on Lit, so most men must want to see their wife banged by other men.

So in discovering my sexuality, I slept with a couple of bodybuilders, and I loved it. At first I used to let my husband watch, but not anymore.

My husband started getting little uncomfortable, so last week I told him I'd stop.

But two nights ago, I met that guy with a big muscular chest, so I fucked him. It's a natural part of who I am, so I did it. But it isn't cheating, because I told my husband as soon as I got home. I merely "forgot" I wasn't supposed to do it.

****************************
Who will stand up and say my husband would need to get over & deal with my behaviour? That I am just fine as is?

 

[TBKahuna123]

I agree with you totally, but there's something different about this situation. This is by all accounts a happy marriage. There is one problem, albeit a potentially huge one, but other than that it sounds like things are good. You are missing a big point, this guy stated right off the bat that their agreement was a passing comment, not an indepth conversation, and he doesn't think it registered. They had a previous arrangement which she is sticking to. If this is the case, how can you call it cheating?

This is an issue they HAVE to talk through if he wants to save the marriage, which he obviously does. I'm not conding her actions, saying he's stupid for feeling how he feels, or anything like that. It's obvious to me that other than this he's happy with their relationship and this is something that they can work through. All they have to do it talk about it.

And even if it is cheating, is that a reason to toss an otherwise happy marriage? Some people may thing so, I don't. I think a marriage is something that should be taken seriously and not tossed aside needlessly. There are times when that IS needed, but I just don't think this situation is to that point. If he talks to her and she reacts selfishly, THEN I think he needs to seriously look at their relationship, but I don't think that's the case.

 

[Guest]

 

[LadyFunkenstein]

I agree with you totally, but there's something different about this situation. This is by all accounts a happy marriage. There is one problem, albeit a potentially huge one, but other than that it sounds like things are good. You are missing a big point, this guy stated right off the bat that their agreement was a passing comment, not an indepth conversation, and he doesn't think it registered. They had a previous arrangement which she is sticking to. If this is the case, how can you call it cheating?

This is an issue they HAVE to talk through if he wants to save the marriage, which he obviously does. I'm not conding her actions, saying he's stupid for feeling how he feels, or anything like that. It's obvious to me that other than this he's happy with their relationship and this is something that they can work through. All they have to do it talk about it.

And even if it is cheating, is that a reason to toss an otherwise happy marriage? Some people may thing so, I don't. I think a marriage is something that should be taken seriously and not tossed aside needlessly. There are times when that IS needed, but I just don't think this situation is to that point. If he talks to her and she reacts selfishly, THEN I think he needs to seriously look at their relationship, but I don't think that's the case.

First of all, the initial agreement was their marriage. She didn't mention her "needs" prior to the wedding.

Next, I must say agreeing to one sentence is the same as agreeing to the results of a long, drawn out all-nighter of a conversation. If one doesn't like a "passing comment" one shouldn't agree to it. He didn't say his wife is mentally handicapped, she "gets it," which is why she comes home and admits her wrong intentions -- it's a form of absolution.

Note, curious said she *isn't* sticking to the agreement. It's right in his post:

Apperently wifey has totally forgot our agreement and openly stated Wed and Thur to her GF that if the kids weren't her they'd have done stuff.

She's on the move, and doesn't care about the agreement. "Forgot?" I think not.

I am not telling the guy to toss out his marriage, but I am not telling him to stay in it either. I just think that there is a little too much sugar-coating on this thread simply because it is a so-called bisexuality issue. If his wife were sleeping with another man, the responses on here would be different. He needs to see it for what it is, and come to his own decision.

One more thing, note, I am not judging either party. I have my own indiscretions in my past. But I call it what it is, I don't pretend somehow it is justified. Or that I didn't understand a throw away comment. I just dealt with my actions, no crutches allowed.

 

[firefighter02]

At first thought being a guy I said..Hey..your babe is bi? Sweeeeeet..

After reading through the various posts a few thoughts that need to be restated I believe.

First- I think you classified yourself a #3 earlier..what I get is that you want to be a #2.

Second- I agree that your wife doesn't have amniesia when it comes to the agreement..she's catting around to be catting around.

Third- I have a sneaking suspicion that if it weren't for where you all live (you, wife, slut gf) that you would find yourself alone with wife and Gf setting up shop in a little white house with a picket fence..

Finally- Quit worrying and fretting over picking the "right time" to have a discussion about what is going on. Decide what it is you want..WHAT YOU want..not what you think will make all the parties happy..WHAT YOU WANT..and tell her.. There's gonna be a war no matter what so ya might as well get on with it.

Or at least make a new agreement where you get to bone the GF on the side as well without the wife being around. Hey..may not be a popular choice, but what's good for the goose is good for the gander isn't it?

 

[TBKahuna123]

I just think that there is a little too much sugar-coating on this thread simply because it is a so-called bisexuality issue.

Hmm....again I think I have to agree with you here. I guess for me having my wife sleep with another woman would be less of a violation of my trust than sleeping with another guy. Now, on the other hand, my brain tells me that makes no sense whatsoever, but upon examination I can see how I'd react differently to that. I'm sure it's a male ego penis envy thing, but that's what my head tells me.

First of all, the initial agreement was their marriage. She didn't mention her "needs" prior to the wedding.

True, but CrusiousRed also said this: "She actually never acted on it until we were married and I gave my blessing. She had several encounters with her best friend."

He gave his blessing, so she didn't break that initial agreement. He's also said more than once that this NEW agreement was not a clear cut discussion and it sounds like this is a woman who is currently having mixed emotions about what she's feeling. Does this give a license to cheat? hell no, but it does mean that if she's dealing wiht how/what to proceed, any agreements or disagreements need to be crystal clear because she's already confused. That's not sugar coating it, that's not justifying anything, it's simply the way humans work mentally and emotionally.

That's why I'm not quick to jump on the condemnation train, not because it's a bi-sexual thing. You're right when you say that has nothing to do with it, but I think the emotions of a sexually-conflicted person might muddy their judgment, requiring a CLEAR and to the point discussion of Curious's feelings on the matter. I don't think that's been done yet, not clearly.

Finally- Quit worrying and fretting over picking the "right time" to have a discussion about what is going on. Decide what it is you want..WHAT YOU want..not what you think will make all the parties happy..WHAT YOU WANT..and tell her.. There's gonna be a war no matter what so ya might as well get on with it.

You're absolutely right, there is no right time and the longer you let it go the harder it's gonna be. You need to just do it. I understand you're worried about upsetting her, but remember one thing: you have the moral high ground. If you really want to go there, she's the one who is hurting you, regardless of her intentions or reasons why, she's hurting you. You aren't wrong by bringing this up and if she reacts negatively, that makes her the smaller person. You can stay on that moral high ground through the whole conversation because you actually are the victim here.

That said, just be careful you don't come across as accusatory. When I say sieze the high ground, I mean more as a confidence booster for you. Know that you are right to bring this up and know that you are voicing realistic concerns. That will help you weather the initial emotional outburst and get through to the real discussion.

Trust me, I've been married long enough that I know how this works. My wife is a wonderfully emotional woman, but after that initial defensive blast she calms down and we get right to the real discussion. We've worked out some tough issues this way.