Profiling as Police Work

JazzManJim

On the Downbeat
Joined
Sep 12, 2001
Posts
27,360
In all the threads here which have dealt with the act of profiling, there seems to have been one important question which no one has really asked: If profiling draws such public controversy, why does law enforcement still do it?

Yeah, this is a vanity piece and will probably say things that have been said before, but not all of it's just revoicing of stuff that's already been said. I've worked with law enforcement for nearly 13 years, and it's given me an insight that not a lot of people have, and it's those insights I want to share.

The short answer to the question of why police departments profile is "Because it works". Law enforcement has a small amount of resources compared to the tasks to which it's been assigned by our society. It looks for a way to apply itself most efficiently, while still doing the jobs to which it will be held accountable. Profiling fits that bill very well. Imagine a hypothetical crime, wherein a black male has been killed. Around him, at the crime scene, are pieces of literature from a white supremacy group. Further, there is evidence that other black folks will be killed by this same perpetrator, or by others of his organization. Unfortunately, the organization to which he belongs is rather insubstantial. There is no membership roster and no headquarters to which the investigators can readily go. What does the investigator do? He finds a group of "likely suspects": white males who have professed sympathy to white supremacist groups. He then marks other white males as possible members of this group also, regardless of their outward professions and, further, he looks at *certain* white males: those who match characteristics generally common to members of white supremacy groups. After all, they could be hiding their allegiance. Until the perpetrator is caught, and the organization is disbanded, white males are looked on with suspicion, to one degree or another.

Throughout the case, the investigator will cast a broad net for suspects, narrowing it as he has specific information which warrants it. This is profiling in its most simple form and it's a very effective investigatory technique. You take what you know, or at least strongly suspect, based on your best evidence, and draw up a profile of your most likely candidates. As more information comes in, you can narrow your search - your net becomes smaller and smaller, until it ensnares the suspect(s). But at first, and perhaps for a long while, you have a wide net and a lot of people - most of them completely innocent - are going to be in it.

When it comes to police work in general, the police are at several disadvangates. They are charged not only with solving crimes, but with the apparently telepathic act of preventing them. Unfortunately, at any given time, only the criminal known what crime he'll commit, and where he'll commit it. The police have to work with what information they have, which is precious little. What they do have always, is an outline of various crimes and the profiles of those who have committed them most often. They have history of criminals and one thing they can say for a surety is that history tends to bear itself out, or, a certain type of person tends to commit a certain type of crime. Though we'd like to think it isn't true, it is. FBI crime statistics bear this out every single year: each crime has profile of the suspect which has most often committed that crime. Do you want to catch a serial killer? Better go looking for white males in their thirties who have above-average intelligence. Want to catch marijuana smokers? Most of them are white males, under 30, and tend to live in the suburbs. How about crack addicts? Young black males, who live in the inner cities. This isn't racism - it's police work. It's using a probability curve of those who have committed crimes in the past. It's been tested and tried since the 1920's and it's always borne itself out to be valid. It doesn't seem fair on its face, but it works. More importantly, it's far more efficient than other means of investigating, and it allows the police to spread already thin resources the best way they can.

But profiling has a darker side, and this is where the problems exist. When you use a net to filter through a large group of people, you can use that net for any purpose. Valid investigative police work is just one of them. Crime prevention is another one of them. The darker side of this involves repression, genocide, and the euphemistically-phrased "ethnic cleansing". We all have seen these things take place, and we all know how horrible they can be, if we allow them to happen. In fact, most people's immediate reaction to profiling is negative, simply because of the times in which it has been abused. Such reactions are easily understood, but misplaced. The anger should be directed toward the abusers, and not the practice itself.

The answer is not to abandon profiling. Profiling is a tool like any other. It is, in itself, neither good nor bad. It simply exists to be used, for good or ill. The answer is to watch our law enforcement and our politicians carefully to make sure that they don't abuse this tool. This is even more important now, when there are so many stated threats to our ways of life and our lives themselves. We have an obligation to keep ourselves safe, and to allow our law enforcement greater freedom to pursue evildoers and those who would perpetrate heinous acts, but we also have the same obligation to remain vigilant against excess and repression. Is profiling by itself repression? No. Not by a long shot. But it could be used as a stepping stone toward that, and that's what we must watch carefully.
 
The words profiling and police, when in any sentance together makes me cringe because of it's controversy. I am lucky in the fact that I would rarely be placed in a "profiled group" since I am a 27 year old white female.

I agree that profiling is a great and helpful tool when used properly. I've heard others say that they don't mind being detained or pulled over if it helps keep evil and drugs of the streets the their kids play on. I'd like to think that I would say the same in that situation. But until it happens to me I couldn't say if I would truely feel that way.

That in mind, I think profiling works well when not abused.
 
I like your example and the thought you put into it.

We all profile (or pre-judge). It cannot be helped short of replacing the brain with a computer. And unless some things have changed when I went to bad last night, the police are people.

Does anyone know of instances of note where african-american police officers have said that they felt the profiling on thier job-site was of the rascist variety?
 
SINthysist said:


Does anyone know of instances of note where african-american police officers have said that they felt the profiling on thier job-site was of the rascist variety?

I don't recall facing it when I was on the job. But it is ironic. I can remember having the attitude that when you see a black guy driving an old Olds Cutlass with dark tinted windows and expensive wheels/tires, he was assumed to be a drug dealer. Unfortunately, it was often obvious.
However, we had a guy in our division who drove a sharp looking Olds 98 with dark tinted windows. While we ate at fast food places for lunch, this guy would order out a steak dinner. But yet, he was never suspected to be a drug dealer until a thorough investigation was done.

So for some odd reason, we would profile outside the "force" but never among our own.
 
A linked problem with profiling is that we seem to attach greater importance to catching SOMEONE than to catch the RIGHT person. I personally was profiled, and it wasn't pleasant. I jogged accross a street in the evening near my college dorm, and I was told to freeze, then thrown to the ground surrounded by police who seemed to be pointing guns at me. I was handcuffed and I heard one say "Did you find the crack on him?" They turned me over, and I guess I appeared to be innocent enough, because they took off the handcuffs and apologized. But during the incident petrified me at the time first because I thought I would be shot if I made the wrong move, and second because I feared being framed with drugs. Situations like these are why reasonable black men do not feel they would be safer, all things equal, with racial profiling.
 
The word "profiling" has a negative conotation to it primarily caused by law enforcement offers misuse of it as a tool of enforcement.

JazzMan hit several key points about profiling and as a former law enforcement officer I appreciate the time and effort he put into his post.

I suppose the simplest way to explain it would be to compare it with the process of elimination.

I don't think the public in general is as down on the use of profiling as the media pictures them. Usually when it is discussed on television or read in the newspapers it had been brought to the attention of the media by a defense attorney. The media then jumps on the story and within hours, reguardless of how carefully the tool of profiling was used, profiling is at issue taking the heat off the suspect in question.

Privy:cool:
 
It is one thing to "profile" if that means you search for someone based solely on their ethnicity or some other common factor mostly unrelated to the crime, and another thing to "profile" if you are looking for a 6'1" black male wearing a white t-shirt with a particular design seen killing someone.

There is also the problem of proactive profiling rather than reactive profiling. I ride motorcycles, and I sometimes ride with Harley riders, including Lost Cause. I have seen many cases of proactive profiling where law enforcement officers stop, interrogate and basically hassle someone who rides a Harley Davidson. This is the kind of profiling I object to, and which was not really addressed in your post. I have seen LEOs go after teenagers, blacks, and so on, just because they seem to think that this particular group are misfits, not even because they feel they are criminals.

I have experienced this attitude somewhat myself a number of times in my life. Once LC and I were hassled because we were teenagers, other times I got a lot of attitude from LEOs because I was a teenager (one officer told me to "get my piece of shit truck off the road" - I know he would not have said that to me if I was 10 years older at the time).

Another country sherriff gave me some attitude until I took off my helmet and he saw I was an adult, then when he saw the address on my license (Bellevue has the reputation for having a lot of MS billionaires and millionaires), he suddenly started calling me "Sir" and "Mr." - his whole attitude changed 180 degrees.

This summer I was stopped on my motorcycle, obstensibly I believe because of two decals on my helmet which the officer didn't like. He questioned me at length about them, he asked my why, if I was unemployed, I wasn't out looking for a job instead of riding my motorcycle (I didn't feel it was the best idea to tell him that since I pulled in twice his salary I could afford to go without work while he had to spend his days so bored that he felt the need to hassle bikers). He left without giving me a ticket or warning.

Until you have experienced the improper use of profiling you may think it is just a law enforcment tool, but if you are black, or a member of any other minority that LEOs tend to improperly profile, then you will be very sensitive to its misuse because you experience it all the time.
 
Profiling may have some good points...

but I can see the danger of relying on it too much.

The known facts of a crime are tapped into a computer. Which will then produce a list of, maybe, thousands of people who fit the profile of that crime. Perhaps even hundreds of thousands, nationwide, depending how much data is used to begin with.

Then what?

It would obviously be impossible for the law enforcement agencies to investigate each individual. So what do they do? Sit back and wait for more information.

If the information of all crimes committied in an area are logged continuously, and it would have to be for the system to work, then the incoming data available for use will be ever growing. And if the local information is linked up nationally then the data received will be enormous.

I can see that, after a time, suspects can be reduced by the possibility/probability factor but would there still be enough resouces to investigate every one of them? I doubt it, which means in the end the crime remains unsolved on police records BUT a large numer of innocent people will be listed as possibly being connected to that crime. They will, in effect, have a police record for ever more.

It will no longer be a question of being innocent until proven guilty but rather "where there's smoke there's fire".

Computer malfunctions, software gliches, incorrect data entry can all play their part in seeing an innocent person being convicted.

As JazzManJim says:

"The answer is to watch our law enforcement and our politicians carefully to make sure that they don't abuse this tool."

But individuals won't be able to handle that task. It will have to be entrusted to an independent body. Which, giving the sheer number of suspects involved, would soon get bogged down with beaurocratic paperwork, thus defeating the purpose for their very existence.

As others have already said, the only way profiling can be useful, is as a tool. But a tool that should only be used once an individual suspect has been caught. The profiling can then take place as confirmation, or not as the case may be, that the police have probably got the right person.

Whether they have or not will be the responsibilty of the judicial system.

pp
 
WOW! :eek:

For once I agree with every word PPMan put into a post! :eek:

What is wrong with me? :confused:

I think I must be coming down with a virus or something. I know - I forgot to take my medicine this morning! ;)
 
Some very interesting info on this thread. All well thought and educated opinions. I come from a LEO family and everyone I talk to seems to have a different opinion. I guess the bottom line is that a lot depends on the Officer(s) question...as someone said earlier...Police Officers are human too. Its very easy to say "Just stay out of trouble and they wont BE any trouble with the police" but that obviously isnt alway the case. I come down on the side of profiling as long as there is no abuse....but how do we police that?
 
Tempting1 said:
I come down on the side of profiling as long as there is no abuse....but how do we police that?
Quis custodiet custodiens?

We do, but we have to do that by mandating policy. I think making it clear what is acceptable and what isn't acceptable to the people who serve us is one way.

LC did make a complaint about his recent harassment by a WA state cop, but since he was a biker they turned a deaf ear.

What is needed is documentation; we need to videotape such incidents and then publish them.

Also, we need to let the pols know we will not tolerate other forms of profiling, such as civil forfieture. See www.fear.org for info on that.
 
Shy Tall Guy said:

I guess I'm not the only one that can be surprised :p

I was hassled in CH once because I was eating bread and cheese at a bus stop with my pink hair and my Goth friend from home. No guns or handcuffs (I can't imagine). I'm just glad I spoke the language because it could have been a lot worse. The Swiss are pretty xenophobic. Oops! I'm pigeonholing again! Though it's 7 years later and I think piercings and unnatural hair colors are in style there now.
 
Shy, agreed.....I am a 38 y/o white lady from a very small town so I doubt if I would be on the list of people to be "Profiled". My kids are usually with me and I am sure that if it hasnt happened to us, there is no real way we can understand what it would feel like to be pulled over and yanked out of a car. No one likes to be made to feel inferior based on color, religion, etc, and it shouldnt be that way. Unfortunatly it is sometimes. We had a local county deputy here who liked to pull over attractive women just to see if he can score...when he did it to me, I politely offered to shoot him with his own gun. That worked. Then I went through the proper channels and he is no longer working as LEO. Some really good reading here. I would be interested to see more opinions.
 
Profiling has happened here in CT......Trumbull, CT
for example....I'm' sure one can find out articles or info
about it on the web......

try: www.ctpost.com
 
Thanks GuyJD

That was the kind of thing I was curious about.


Now the guys who crack me up are the ones driving around with the pot leave stickers on thier vehicle. Kinda takes away the question, "Do you know why you're being pulled over...?"

And the "What did I do? How come you're profilin' me?"



Now I have been profiled too because I have long-hair and look vaugly, hispanic, or Puerto Rican, or Indian, or something. In a way you resent it, but in a way, you have to see what the officers are going on...

At any rate, since I now live where everybody knows everybody, I don't have that problem. We profile EVERY outsider regardless of race, creed, or socio-econimic status. Gotta watch out for them rich white types. They'll try to take advantage of you every time! ;)
 
My niece was givin a ticket for wreckless driving andno proof of registration first he tailgated her for three different speed zones he was so close you could see the squares in the grill this was at night and he had no lights on the roof when he finaly pulled her over she and her friend were scared he kept them there for over anhour threatened her with arrest for not haveing her registration her moter had taken it to the bank to get a cheaper loan rate. she took it to court the judge agreed with her story dismissed most off the charges and fond her guilty of speeding then he turned to the police officer and said we will talk later boy. He pulled her over for being a teenager with another teenage at night she was going home rom a football game.
 
If they were scared then they should have kept driving until they found someone they were sure was a police officer I mean if you ignore the sirens then they will radio backup and you can say you were scared you know because of the car-jacking craze a few years ago and with more officers on hand the chances of getting hassled are a lot less and all you know.
 
Re: Thanks GuyJD

SINthysist said:
Now the guys who crack me up are the ones driving around with the pot leave stickers on thier vehicle. Kinda takes away the question, "Do you know why you're being pulled over...?"

And the "What did I do? How come you're profilin' me?"
The helmet sticker my harassing cop had a problem with was "Legalize Freedom". Now tell me, seriously, why would he think that this indicated I was a criminal?

If they were scared then they should have kept driving until they found someone they were sure was a police officer I mean if you ignore the sirens then they will radio backup and you can say you were scared you know because of the car-jacking craze a few years ago and with more officers on hand the chances of getting hassled are a lot less and all you know.
This is bullshit, and anybody that has ever dealt with cops knows this; have you ever seen what happens to people who refuse to be pulled over? Have you ever heard of "contempt of cop"? Cops get very irate when you do not pull over immediately, even when you are just looking for a safer place to pull over (like an off-ramp instead of the side of a very busy super highway). Never heard of cop rage?

I have experienced it - luckily the cop calmed down quickly, but boy was he mad when he thought I had not pulled over fast enough. We were traveling in opposite directions, he was in an S-10 Blazer, and it was a really dark day with heavy clouds. He said he had signalled me to pull over with his hand, and was very irate that I didn't do a stoppie on my bike right there in the middle of the road.

Now I was traveling 75 in the opposite direction, and he was traveling 55 MPH in the opposite direction, for a total combined speed of 130 MPH. The inside of his vehicle was very dark and I am passing him going the opposite direction, and I am supposed to see his hand gesture?

He was yelling at me wanting to know why I didn't stop immediately (as soon as he turned around and turned on his lights I pulled over at a wide spot in the road, which was a narrow two lane mountain pass road).

Can you imagine what would have happened had I kept on going? I probably wouldn't be here now.

I do not recommend not stopping as soon as possible for cops unless you want to wind up on the 10 o'clock news starring in a video of 5 cops wailing on your head with a baton - or worse, in jail for resisting arrest (yes I know people who have had this happen to them).
 
SINthysist said:
If they were scared then they should have kept driving until they found someone they were sure was a police officer I mean if you ignore the sirens then they will radio backup and you can say you were scared you know because of the car-jacking craze a few years ago and with more officers on hand the chances of getting hassled are a lot less and all you know.


LOL...you took the rambling, non-punctuated, impossible-to-read, nonsense sentence right out of my mouth.
 
Let's pigeonhole cops!

My theory: They're the dumbass bullies from HS.
They get off on the authority.
They're not much different in that respect
from schoolteachers.

Yes, I know, there are some great cops and
some great schoolteachers.

groups of people pigeonholed in this post:
teachers, cops, bullies :D

Edit: Topherbane == Typos
 
Probable cause?

I'm sticking my neck out and will probably have a few of you wanting to take my head, so , in advance this is a general comment and I am not singling anyone out who has posted so far.

I have worked with many in law enforcement who did indeed misuse profiling and did pull young girls over or some other bullshit act like that. The thing is, whether it's profiling or not there must be probable cause before any official contact is made!

In profiling the probable cause is already established most of the time, but ther are situations where a potential suspect is watched and contact made based on probable cause in a seperate incident with hopes of finding evidence relating to the actual reason for contact. A very risky procedure which could result in gettin gteh entire case thrown out. This kind of tactic should have the approval of the DA's office first.

All to often judgements of a law enforcement officers actions and the treatment of suspects is based on a third parties interpretation based on what they have seen on tv or in the movies. I cringe at the things I see on the popular tv show "Cops".

Those with the background can probably tell from my slant on PC and profiling that I have lost very few in court. Proper procedure eliminates most of the arguments that arise when you have the right person/s and have acted within the law.



privy:)
 
Re: Let's pigeonhole cops!

I believe most cops are professionals and good guys, and for the most part that has been my experience with them (and I used to work closely with many of them, and I still have a number of LEO friends) - however, there are some cops who shouldn't be cops, and they are all human.

When you get stopped you don't know if you got the professional guy with a level head, or the guy who became a cop because he wanted to carry a gun on the job and be in a position of authority over everyone else.

So I advise caution as it is obvious to me, that despite better screening some of these people still make it through (both the cop who last hassled me, and the cop who hassled LC, were young cops). The cop who hassled me for not stopping fast enough was an older county sherriff who obviously had a hard on for teenagers on motorcycles - once I took off my helmet and he saw I was an adult his attitude changed like someone had flipped a switch.

Additionally, if you are in one of the profile groups, as is LC since he rides a Harley, then don't be surprised that you get hassled for your race or what you wear.
 
I agree Tall Guy

Appearance, Appearance, Appearance!

I had long hair, tattoo's and an earing when I was hired by the county sherrif's dept. When I left law enforcement I let my hair grow long again and put my earing back in. Those whom I worked with over the years knew my background as a scooter bum and still hug my neck and tease me about my long hair. Those that don't know me stare a hole through me waiting for me to fuck up!
By the same token strangers treat me differently now than when I had short hair and was seen in civilian clothes. You see the public profiles also and they don't even realize it!

privy:cool:
 
I agree tall guy

Working at a 7/11 i got to know the officers that came in and they were great bunch. And i have dealt with some non-professional but i believe that most are good hard working and try to be as far as possible.
 
Back
Top