online dom-sub relationship: whats the appeal?

[xoxobunnie420]

an online dom-sub relationship...what is the appeal? i mean, im not bashing it, just wondering? i myself have never had a master, but am considering it, and would like to know the benefits of an online sexual relationship vs one that has skin on skin.

 

[chatguy1122]

I love this type of relationship. It is very erotic. I think if you are open to it, you will find it very fulfilling.

 

[Homburg]

For some, it allows access to the fantasy without all that messy reality to clean up after.

For others, it is the only manner in which they can scratch their itch, so they take what they can get.

If you want more info, I would suggest the Distance Domination Support thread. It is more emotional support than anything else, but it might give some insight.

 

[Bandit58]

I have never had a purely on-line relationship. Sir and I met online, but used it as a means to an end i.e. getting to know each other and exchange info about D/s. I was a total newbie and He an experienced Dom, so He sent me links and encouraged me to read and learn.

I think I would find a relationship that remained online with no intention of ever meeting totally frustrating. I can understand those who for one reason or another cannot realise their dreams finding an outlet for it online, but FOR ME it just wouldn't work. I need the reality of skin to skin, it just wouldn't seem real to me if it was just online.

 

[WhisperingWinds]

I think from my perspective and that of some of my friends, it can be a matter of not being able to find the "right" person within a decent driving distance. It also matters what it is that you are hoping to experience and gain from the activity. In a case where you are more interested in exploring your own discipline, self control, self reliance, ability to follow through or take direction there does not necessarily have to be an in person element to gain the insights. Maybe the lack of personal interaction is the challenge to be gained. How much more would you have to be honest, open yourself up, commit to verbal or textual communication? All of these things have merit.

 

[ForHer2Use]

comes down to giving pleasure. Something special about that.

 

[subwannabe]

If you are able to I highly suggest skin to skin instead of online. I think online is just too dangerous for this type of relationship. I really don't see many ways of being a sub online without it involving things which could compromise your real life situation if the person turned out to be a wacko. Hopefully with skin to skin you can "date" the person first before committing.

 

[Hiliburn]

isn't the appeal for most people what they don't or can't have? Online is a perfect way to explore and investigate something you are not so sure about. You can try out things you would never be able to do in the real world. Then once you learned a bit, experienced a bit, making a transtion into your day to day life would be easier. We all have interests and itches than make us hot or just a bit intrigued that we haven't been able to stratch. I think of the internet as a stepping stone with a learning curve. Once you know more you can make those bigger decisions. Or simply start over.

 

[Lizzie_Borden]

isn't the appeal for most people what they don't or can't have? Online is a perfect way to explore and investigate something you are not so sure about. You can try out things you would never be able to do in the real world. Then once you learned a bit, experienced a bit, making a transtion into your day to day life would be easier. We all have interests and itches than make us hot or just a bit intrigued that we haven't been able to stratch. I think of the internet as a stepping stone with a learning curve. Once you know more you can make those bigger decisions. Or simply start over.

That's pretty much how I did it.

I kind of discovered sex, relationships and bdsm all at the same time, so it was a lot to take in.

I explored online, and had an ol relationship with a man who encouraged me to expand on my fantasies, to accept myself and what I liked, and then ultimately encouraged me to make the leap to a rl relationship.

In doing so, I realised a lot of the ol stuff was strictly fantasy, and for me personally, didn't even come close to what a rl relationship could entail, but it gave me the confidence to actually get out there and try.

 

[asian_princess]

I think that whether an online D/s...or, to be honest, any sort of online...relationship works or not is entirely up to the individual perceptions and outlooks on "online" relationships. Definitely no one size fits all here.

If you consider there are barriers, you will experience barriers.

I have been in both online and, for lack of a better word, "real life" D/s relationships, and I couldn't tell you which were more mentally and emotionally intense.

But that's because, personally, I see no difference between online and r/l - other than the fact that my Dom/sub can't physically touch me and vice versa.

If you're looking for a D/s relationship that is very dependent on the Dominant constantly, physically touching you, and being the one to physically administer...whatever, then no, online won't fulfil you. No shame in that. It's just not what you're looking for.

But if you're looking for, or are open to, a D/s relationship that focuses more (but in no way, in entirety) on the mental (and emotional) aspects of control - then you can find fulfilment though a relationship that is conducted online, just as if it was any other. As for the sexual and physical aspect, I've found little to be as exciting as making my own toys and tools, and then being taught or ordered to use them on myself (as is true of the flip side perspective of a Domme). There is no argument, for those of us who enjoy the more physically extreme aspects as BDSM, that it's unsafe to conduct these on myself, and in fact, oftentimes just impossible (tries to dangle self off a fishhook, unsuccessfully), but a creative Dom/me can compensate by increasing the mental control aspect, the fear, the anticipation in other ways, that may even make the decrease of physical impact seem insignicant.

I won't go into the subject of trust, as it's just easier to leave each to his own on this topic.

My D/s relationships conducted online, simply feel like a continuation of my life when I log off the computer. When we chat and the cam is on, it feels like we're just sitting in neighbouring rooms. And when I'm told to do something, it feels as if he's standing next to me, speaking the same words clear as day. And when I'm going about my day, he doesn't feel 10,000 miles away.

As with all - you have to find someone who views the interaction the same as you. If I felt one way about online relationship and he felt another, there's little I could do to stop it coming to an inevitable end.

And as mentioned by others, but not personally relevent to me - some people have online D/s relationships for the "fantasy". It's comparatively safe, and gives you the space to explore if you're a newbie.

And some of us - just happened to fall for the one person, and for the present, the only way to conduct the relationship is online/long distance.

But yes - there's appeal in it

 

[Homburg]

But that's because, personally, I see no difference between online and r/l - other than the fact that my Dom/sub can't physically touch me and vice versa.

Difference #1 - The Off Button

If my relationship is solely long distance, all I have to do is hit the off button on my computer, and my phone, and the person I am in a relationship with may as well not exist in my life.

Difference #2 - Accountability

Wacko Distance Dom tells his slave to stuff a rusty railroad spike up her ass and leave it there for a week. She has three choices. A) Comply, whee tetanus. B) Tell him no, gasp! or the ever popular C) Don't do it and lie about it. Option C is all too often the choice even with mundane safe tasks that are nonetheless unpleasant when Distance Dom can't check up on it. "Why, yes, sir. I have had my butt plug in non-stop for the past 48 hours. I do feel terribly chastised."

Mentally/eomtionally, sure, it's powerful, but the Off Button is always there, always ready to end that person's existence in your life. That gives either party equal power at the end of the day. And when the other party has no way to check up on what you are doing, you can fuck about and lie all day long about it. Online-only can very quickly become nothing more than a shared creative-writing endeavour, as the bottom doesn't do all of his or her tasks, and the top goes off and does whatever.

Not saying this happens in every relationship, but they are both sharp differences between online-only and face-to-face.

 

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[the captians wench]

I think for a lot of people who have online relationships, they can get just as emotionally involved as a 'real life' one. the people who just turn the computer off, drop the person and then it's over, are just as likely to do that in real life.

This ^

I've always called bullshit on the "off button" case. The fact of the matter is that rl has an "off button" as well, you can just as easily change your phone number to avoid some one you are in a relationship with irl. And you can lie just as easily as well.

In fact I've had more irl people in my life just dissapear with out a word than I have ol people.

There are significant differences, but I don't see "the off button" as any different than ending a relationship irl.

 

[neci]

All of these can apply. for some people it has been a lifeline to sanity and a way of exploring in safety. Also if you live in nowheresville it can provide at least some form of sexual relief. It can also lead onto meat world experiences. but it isn't the same as a meat world relationship.



I think for a lot of people who have online relationships, they can get just as emotionally involved as a 'real life' one. the people who just turn the computer off, drop the person and then it's over, are just as likely to do that in real life.

This ^

I've always called bullshit on the "off button" case. The fact of the matter is that rl has an "off button" as well, you can just as easily change your phone number to avoid some one you are in a relationship with irl. And you can lie just as easily as well.

In fact I've had more irl people in my life just disappear with out a word than I have ol people.

There are significant differences, but I don't see "the off button" as any different than ending a relationship irl.

i think with any relationship, there is a sexual element and an emotional element. you can cut off the sexual element pretty easily, if you stick to that. it's the friendship and emotional attachment involved that can be trickier. in D/s relationships, every couple has a different dynamic. the top has certain needs/expectations both physically and emotionally. the bottom also has certain needs that need to be met both physically and emotionally. when they work together, it can make for a very strong relationship. a good friendship as well as a D/s relationship. the two tied together. the way i see it, and this is just me, the bottom is the pleasure giver. they absorb the top's pain. transfer it physically through the masochism, many times into orgasm. those are powerful chemicals on both sides flowing through the system. the BDSM euphoric glow. it's easy to get wrapped up in. i think that there are ways that you can retrain yourself to cope with the loss of a close emotional partner. rechannel the frustration. people talk about cleaning, writing, reading, exercise, drinking, working, talking with others. just casually reaching out, so you don't feel too alone, as you figure out how to fill the void in a way that works.

if the friendship was real, you want to know if the person's parents die one day. you don't want to lose that. at the same time you need space to work out how things are going to change. you don't want to fall back into old patterns and behaviors. you need time to figure out what are healthy ways to deal with the new dynamic. that takes time. a lot is trial and error. over time skill improves. just like learning a new craft.

the disappearing, for me, is an emotional safety valve. when used well, it can recharge me for the rest of the day. alone time. when coupled with depression or isolating, it can easily get out of hand. during times of lots of stress, it can also be needed to recharge from everything going on. the body and mind need space to heal. you need to create a safe space for that to happen. once that's nurtured a bit, it's easier to go through what you need to do in your day to day life. improves function. reduces stress.

 

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[the captians wench]

My point was more along the same lines as the "does a slave have a right to leave thier master?" argument.

Of course the "real life" actuality of the matter is that leagally, as far as a M/s dynamic goes, a slave has every right to leave; but many will tell you they don't. Just like the "off button" the posibility is there, but that doesn't mean it will be used. It's like saying all subs like pain. Sure a great deal do, but not every one will. Sure a great deal of "online" persons will lie about completed tasks, but shit you can just as easily do that in a "real life" relationship, even with some one you live with. I know all kinds of people who lie to their live in SO and the SO isn't any wizer.

I just don't buy this "off button" argument as the end all of discussion as to how "online" and "real life" D/s is different.

 

[ImOnIt]

If someone says 'You don't have the right to leave', they are actually saying 'I don't want you to leave'.

It helps to filter things this way.

 

[Homburg]

My point was more along the same lines as the "does a slave have a right to leave thier master?" argument.

Of course the "real life" actuality of the matter is that leagally, as far as a M/s dynamic goes, a slave has every right to leave; but many will tell you they don't. Just like the "off button" the posibility is there, but that doesn't mean it will be used. It's like saying all subs like pain. Sure a great deal do, but not every one will. Sure a great deal of "online" persons will lie about completed tasks, but shit you can just as easily do that in a "real life" relationship, even with some one you live with. I know all kinds of people who lie to their live in SO and the SO isn't any wizer.

I just don't buy this "off button" argument as the end all of discussion as to how "online" and "real life" D/s is different.

Uh, why not?

Again, let's look at somewhat extreme cases. You are bound tight and in a "no safeword" scene and things go bad. What do you do? You have no safeword. If the top is not paying attention, or simply doesn't care, badness happens.

In a "no safeword" scene, but online and things go badly? Click, off button.

Little bit of a difference.

And, honestly, if I am dating someone, and in a serious face-to-face relationship, I'm going to know where they live, work, etc in most situations. Unless they pack up and move, I'm going to be likely to be able to find them to get an explanation for the sudden cessation of contact. It's a wee bit more difficult with an online relationship when you might 800 miles or even 3000 miles away. The off button trumps.

and there absolutely nothing in my statement that said it was an issue in every relationship. But the fact that the possibility is there in online-only is definitely a difference compared to face-to-face.

 

[the captians wench]

Uh, why not?

Again, let's look at somewhat extreme cases. You are bound tight and in a "no safeword" scene and things go bad. What do you do? You have no safeword. If the top is not paying attention, or simply doesn't care, badness happens.

In a "no safeword" scene, but online and things go badly? Click, off button.

Little bit of a difference.

And, honestly, if I am dating someone, and in a serious face-to-face relationship, I'm going to know where they live, work, etc in most situations. Unless they pack up and move, I'm going to be likely to be able to find them to get an explanation for the sudden cessation of contact. It's a wee bit more difficult with an online relationship when you might 800 miles or even 3000 miles away. The off button trumps.

and there absolutely nothing in my statement that said it was an issue in every relationship. But the fact that the possibility is there in online-only is definitely a difference compared to face-to-face.

I've been in that situation, when he left be broken, I called my mom, changed the locks on my door, changed my phone number, sent an email saying if he contacted me again I'd call the cops, then blocked his addy. That is a real life off button.

I'm not saying there aren't differences. Doing all of that took a few hours where shutting down your PC takes a few mintues. I just don't hold it as high as others do.

I just feel like people who are willing to just lean over and hit the off switch because something doesn't go their way are just as likely to find the real life off switch when things get messy there.

And your extreme is flawed anyway. According to this "off button" philosophy there's no such thing as a "no safeword" scene, because there is always the posibility of calling a safeword, telling some one to stop, calling rape, running away. Those posibilities always exist. What we can't control is how the other person will react when we use them.

 

[rida]

Perhaps it is just me, but here is my experience:

When I had just arrived in the cyber word and started my first on-line interactions, I never thought for a moment about those relationship as any less than real-life ones. I was honest and totally invested in them. My first on-line-only relationship that went beyond friendship, it felt real, I did not lie, I was totally involved in it. I had to end and it hurt no less than a real-life break up did.

Now, few years later, I still have plenty of on-line friendships and they are as real as real-life friendships.

But I'm now jaded toward on-line-only D/s relationships. Not because I think they are not real, but because I now know that for the suffering they cause when they end, the rewards while they are on, are too little for me at this point in my life.

disclaimer: I do not equate LDR that starts on-line and are on-line in between real-life meet, as on-line-only. Also, if communications go beyond e-mail, and include phone, live-cam on a pretty regular basis, think it stops being on-line only as well, and it moves into real-life relationship.
However I don't think that on-line works for everybody, as D/s or M/s or poly does not work for everybody either. It is a different beast than real-life only, but not less valid for the persons involved.
Yes, there is the risk for lier and pretenders, but there is a similar (albeit different) risk in real life as well.

 

[ecstaticsub]

Difference #1 - The Off Button

If my relationship is solely long distance, all I have to do is hit the off button on my computer, and my phone, and the person I am in a relationship with may as well not exist in my life.

Difference #2 - Accountability

Wacko Distance Dom tells his slave to stuff a rusty railroad spike up her ass and leave it there for a week. She has three choices. A) Comply, whee tetanus. B) Tell him no, gasp! or the ever popular C) Don't do it and lie about it. Option C is all too often the choice even with mundane safe tasks that are nonetheless unpleasant when Distance Dom can't check up on it. "Why, yes, sir. I have had my butt plug in non-stop for the past 48 hours. I do feel terribly chastised."

Mentally/eomtionally, sure, it's powerful, but the Off Button is always there, always ready to end that person's existence in your life. That gives either party equal power at the end of the day. And when the other party has no way to check up on what you are doing, you can fuck about and lie all day long about it. Online-only can very quickly become nothing more than a shared creative-writing endeavour, as the bottom doesn't do all of his or her tasks, and the top goes off and does whatever.

Not saying this happens in every relationship, but they are both sharp differences between online-only and face-to-face.

I call total bullshit on both of these.

1)Turning off my computer does not instantly remove a person from my life. I can't turn off my heart or my mind. If the person goes into a on-line or LDR with the intent of it being roleplay then sure, they may be able to turn off the computer and go on with their lives. But for those of us in committed relationships there is no off-button. That's like saying if a loved one dies it is as if they never existed.

2) I have said this over and over again. Why would I choose to be a submissive if I wasn't going to submit? What would be the point? Why would I lie? If submission puts me in the mindset that I am craving then doing as he asks is what I want to do, no matter how uncomfortable or unwanted. In the 6 years MDS and I have been together I have NEVER lied about anything. There have been times I have forgotten, or for whatever reason had not done as he asked but I have confessed and faced the consequences. Anyone who thinks a person who you are living with can't hide or lie about something and get away with it is fooling themselves.

After all this time on this forum, Fet-life and meeting IN PERSON other people in this lifestyle I have had this discussion many times. I believe it comes down to a difference in how one does TTTWD. I do not have "scenes". My relationship doesn't need floggers, ropes, needles, whips or restraints to make me submit. My Dominant doesn't need to tie me up to control me or to fulfill his Dominant needs. He controls me with his words, and I obey. Scenes don't go bad because I don't have scenes. This is D/s --Domination and submission. There is nothing in there that says anything about performing painful tricks and performing stupid tasks as a requirement for it to be a Real BDSM relationship.

And no, of course I am not saying LDRs are the same as living with someone. If I am ordered to wear a buttplug to bed and my partner sleeps with me then he can check for himself if the plug is in there. But just because my Dominant can't physically check up on me all the time, doesn't mean I am going to lie. I think to a certain extent it makes it more difficult not living with him. I have to have more self control to obey.

It comes down to either a person "gets" on line/LDRs or doesn't. Those that don't get it are the type who would lie or use the "off -button" For those of us who do get it, and benefit from this kind of relationship the off button does not exist.

 

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[JamieJ424]

I think, given the option, two people who are emotionally close would always choose to be together physically. For a variety of reasons, that's often impossible, and (as I'm discovering) an LDR with a strong online component can be very satisfying, emotionally and physically, if two people are truly connected and open with one another. The D/s aspect makes it that much more dynamic and engaging.

Homburg's point about the off-switch is well taken, but if someone switches you off, in the real world or in the cyber world, they weren't what you thought they were to begin with, and regardless of the pain, you're inarguably better off without them.

The really difficult thing about online relationships is finding someone who's being forthright. So many people come to Lit and misrepresent themselves in terms of age, interests, gender, marital status, it's easy to get burned if you put yourself at risk. It makes finding the right person that much more precious.

J

 

[Homburg]

/facepalm

I'm gonna comment on this post and then walk away from this thread. As usual, a coupla people get seriously butthurt when anyway says "Uh, there's a difference between online-only and face-to-face," when a five-year-old could tell you that there is a difference. The reason for this butthurt is that these people either refuse to see the difference themselves, or are conflating "different" with "lesser". Whatever.

See, I've been there, and done that, and it's different, plain and simple.

On to the final reply...

I think, given the option, two people who are emotionally close would always choose to be together physically. For a variety of reasons, that's often impossible, and (as I'm discovering) an LDR with a strong online component can be very satisfying, emotionally and physically, if two people are truly connected and open with one another. The D/s aspect makes it that much more dynamic and engaging.

Absolutely, totally agree that this can be satisfying.

Homburg's point about the off-switch is well taken, but if someone switches you off, in the real world or in the cyber world, they weren't what you thought they were to begin with, and regardless of the pain, you're inarguably better off without them.

The really difficult thing about online relationships is finding someone who's being forthright. So many people come to Lit and misrepresent themselves in terms of age, interests, gender, marital status, it's easy to get burned if you put yourself at risk. It makes finding the right person that much more precious.

J

This is the core of the experience, and why I use the Off Button as the touchstone for the difference. Another factor in internet/LD relationships is not knowing who that person really is. Sure, it happens in face-to-face relationships as well, but it is SO much easier on the internet. How many times have we heard stories of "my Canadian girlfriend" only to find out that it is a 40 year old guy in Kansas?

The Off Button just symbolises the whole thing for me. The entire idea is a construct, and, sure, for some, it is as real/deep/meaningful as it can be. I dig that. Like I said, I've been there, but for so many others? It's mutual creative writing, and when it gets difficult, click. Or they just start lying. Might as well be the same thing.

Y'all have fun. And those of you being butthurt because you think I'm being judgemental, well, you have fun too.

 

[Keroin]

How many times have we heard stories of "my Canadian girlfriend" only to find out that it is a 40 year old guy in Kansas?

Great, blow my cover, see if I care!!