One heart, Two people... Help?

[chamelion]

I've got a problem.
I love two people, one of whom I live with, the other is a man I have loved for many years.
I have never had the opportunity to be with this third person except for as a part-time lover, but I do know that my feelings are a lot more than just lust. They always have been.

I'd better go back to the beginning.

When I was a teen, I had the chance to 'go out' with this guy, and I felt something, a spark. We never had more than a few 'dates', but the impact he had on me was huge.
I ended up leaving the country, and although I dated a bit, and had various boyfriends (still a teen here), I always compared every guy I met to him.
No-body quite measured up.
It happened that i met someone while overseas, that I thought might be OK, and I ended up marrying him.
But I never really felt that 'spark'.
Somehow I came to be back in the town of my youth, and I met up again with my ex.

Now the problems began. I started a wild affair with him - he also had a girl at the time - and all the feelings I'd had as a teen came rushing back.
I couldn't bear for my husband to touch me after I began sleeping with this other guy - there was no way my husband could make me feel the way he did.
It wasn't just sex, there were other things involved as well - he made me feel 'alive', he made me feel 'complete', we had many things in common, and the sizzle when we were together was just incredible.
It came time for this person to leave, and thinking I could never have anything more than what I'd had, I quietly let him go.
And because I stopped sleeping with my husband, eventually my marriage self-destructed.

Now's when this gets harder.....

In the last few months, I have been in contact with my childhood/early adulthood 'love', and I find that not only have the feelings resurfaced, they are stronger than ever.
Except now, I am in a much more complicated position - I have children, and a more complex life.

But recently, he said he had always loved me, always would.
I know I have never changed my feelings either.
He's in a marriage, I'm in a relationship.
Neither of us is totally happy where we are.

I have the chance to see him again, soon, and although i know we will both be betraying our respective partners, I somehow cannot bring myself to feel any guilt.

My problem is this - I really don't want to hurt my partner, but I also know that there is no way I can stop myself from going to be with this other man...... even if it is only for a short while.

I have never felt the degree of love that I have for this ex with any other person, including my current partner.
But my partner is such a nice person, so warm and loving and caring, that I am scared of hurting him.

I am so confused and upset by the situation I am in.
I never asked for this to happen to me.
I'm not sure what I'm even putting this in here for....
Just that I've watched this site for a couple of weeks, and people here always seem to be able to give good advice.

Chamelion

 

[nymphette]

Wow, what a whiny dumb bitch you are. First of all, this didn't "happen to you," you made it happen. You chose to marry someone who you thought was just "OK," and you chose to cheat on him. Of course, you didn't just cheat on him, you also cheated on your children. Thanks to you, your children get to grow up in a broken home.

Assuming you don't have any children with your current boyfriend, you should break up with him. It sounds like he deserves much better than you.

If you and your dream man are so perfect for eachother, why did you guys break up in the first place?

 

[Mstrskey]

A few things

first off you need to end the relationship you are currently in. You state that you don't want to hurt the person you are with now and that he is a warm and caring individual. You also stated that you do not have enough will power to keep yourself from going to this former lover. If what you said about your partner is true then how can you NOT hurt him by continuing to lie to him about the reality of your relationship.
If you truly care for this man allow him to find a relationship in which his partner can be fully comitted to him and fully appreciate what he brings to the relationship. This isn't the case with you. By staying with him to " not hurt him" you are really doing him a hugely selfish diservice.

secondly you and this other guy need to sit down as the adults you presumably now are and find out why you've been playing relationship tag for all these years. You need to make sure the feeling are running as strong both ways. I am concerned that they may not be as you say your relationship consists mainly of a few adolescent " dates" and some extra-marital sex, and that you let him " slip quietly away." This is not something you let happen with the love of your life. I fought tooth and nail, and upheaved my whole life to make certain I could be with my husband. I would never have let him slip away. He says he loves you, but he's apparently in an unhappy marriage and the grass always looks greener on the other side of the fence. If the spark is mutual and genuine then screw up your courage and take a chance on having a real and honest relationship together. One in which nobody's spouse ends up getting screwed over. By continuing this cycle of cheating and deception you doom your relationship to failure before it has a chance to start.

Lastly I will say this, when you are unhappy in a relationship things always seem like they're going to be better with somebody else. It's easier to deal with the fantasy of your perfect man/woman then to deal with the reality of your real relationship problems. You and this man have only had the thrill of secretive encounters together and never tried your hands at a legitimate relationship. Trysts are always more exciting and more thrilling then the daily grind of bills and babies and broken appliances, but when the thrill of the affair is ended what do you really have left to build upon?

 

[Etoile]

Wow, what a whiny dumb bitch you are. First of all, this didn't "happen to you," you made it happen. You chose to marry someone who you thought was just "OK," and you chose to cheat on him. Of course, you didn't just cheat on him, you also cheated on your children. Thanks to you, your children get to grow up in a broken home.

Assuming you don't have any children with your current boyfriend, you should break up with him. It sounds like he deserves much better than you.

If you and your dream man are so perfect for eachother, why did you guys break up in the first place?

Your first sentence was entirely uncalled for. Why did you feel the need to be so rude right off the bat?

 

[James G 5]

I have to say it
Here's another reason why, for many people, monogamy is just a bad idea (Note that I say "for many people", not ALWAYS)
What's wrong with loving or being with more than one person?
NOTHING
And it would resolve so many situations like this *sigh*

 

[PinkOrchid]

 

[James G 5]

My argument with you in an instance like this isn't with the concept of polyamory, but with the fact that if a person isn't mature enough to deal with one relationship with integrity, what makes you think there's a chance on god's green earth they can handle two or more?

Ok, you have a point there
In this case, my quibble would be with the monogamy MENTALITY
People feel like they HAVE to be in a relationship
She's in a relationship that she admitted she "settled" for
Why?
Because our society & standards & the monogamy mentality and the memes behind it make people feel like they HAVE to be in a relationship or need someone else
Lile I've said again & again, it's not monogamy itself that I have an issue with so much as the negative mindsets & thought processes that go with it as it is practiced in our society today

 

[ReadyOne]

In my humble experience (and I've been REAL close to where you are now), what caused the most people the largest amount of pain was not being honest with everyone.

I would start by making damn sure that both old bf and you want to drop your current relationships and be with each other. Given that commitment, I'd then gently let everyone know about the history and attraction. After time for people to get used to it, then I'd start winding down the current relationships.

Try not to cause the people involved any more hurt than you have to. Slow them that you love them all, even if you want to only be with old bf.

 

[ReadyOne]

PS: I'm all for poly, but have found there are very few people that can do it. The idea that love should expand, not focus to exclusion or others, flies in the face of most people.

 

[SexyChele]

You might receive some harsh feedback, but most of it is going to be given in the spirit of trying to let you see how others veiw your situation. I sincerely hope you can see that.

I, too, used to have a "forever love" that I just knew I would never be able to resist. In my case, I came out of an extremely bad relationship and he was in a marriage he called unhappy. It was a recipe for disaster on both sides, and we ended up hurting more than just ourselves. Today? I hope he has found his way in life, but I no longer want to be a part of it and have no desire to even speak to him.

The idea that one cannot resist seeing another person is simply not true. You have choices in your life. How you make those choices determines the outcome of your own happiness or misery. You are in charge, not your emotions. Unless you chose to allow them to be.

First, I would state that the relationship you are in is hurting. If you could so easily thinking of stepping out on your current partner even though he is nice, thoughtful, considerate, etc, then you need to reconsider what it is in the relationship you are missing. Perhaps you need a break from the relationship? But you need to seriously consider how important it is for you.

Second, the ex has a wife. Unless the wife is willing for him to fool around with you, it is not a wise thing to do. And if children are involved, it is even less wise. Remember, he also made a choice and decision. Is he a man of his word? Does he have integrity? Or is he the type that says he's unhappy and wants to get back together with an ex to make everything all better? If he makes the decision to leave his wife for you, how secure are you in that? What if another ex of his comes along and he decides he is no longer happy with you?

It is a sad story when our first loves don't work out, but there seems to be a reason why things didn't work out. That you haven't stated. To carry the torch for a man who is inaccessible is futile. Unless you want to spend your life waiting around for him to be single, well, that is another choice you need to make.

As for me? I wouldn't meet with him. Period. I would discontinue all communication with him, as it seems you cannot seem to cross that barrier into friendship. I know you stated you don't feel guilt. I imagine he doesn't, either. But what about his wife? Even if his marriage is unhappy (which is the major excuse most men give to cheat and most of the time is simply not as true as they want women to believe), how would you feel betraying another woman? What if another woman did this to you? It's not always a matter of guilt. Guilt is something we give to ourselves, and I personally rarely feel guilty over anything. It's not an indicator of anything to me. However, empathy can be. Do I want to trample on another woman's feelings just to satisfy some physical longing? Can I handle ripping out my partner's heart just follow a long lost dream? How would I feel under these same circumstances?

Relationships are about feelings, yes. But feelings are not the sole thing in relationships. We make choices about who we are with and why. We can also look at bad relationships and make a decision to stay away, even though the attraction is strong.

It would seem to me you have a lot of thinking to do. It also seems to me that you will do exactly as you please. I may be wrong. I hope I am.

Good luck.

 

[SexyChele]

Just to echo somewhat what Pink Orchid and ReadyOne have stated in a way: why is that whenever anyone comes here with relationship problems it must always turn into a debate about whether or not monogamy is good or bad? It truly gets tiring when it invades every thread that people start who simply have issues with their relationships. If folks want to debate the good and bad about monogamy vs poly, then start a thread on it where people who are interested can discuss it.

Just a suggestion....

 

[peachykeen]

Your first sentence was entirely uncalled for. Why did you feel the need to be so rude right off the bat?

etoile I see what you are getting at in this response but I have to say I don't entirely disagree with nymphette's reaction. It's harsh, but I don't know if I would say 'totally uncalled for'. I think it was a shock tactic to get the thread starter to see how ridiculously self centered and "oh poor me" she is coming over as. (A tactic not likely to work, which is why I would not have said it, but I see where it came from.)

 

[Bobmi357]

Oh what a tangled web we weave....

My advice to you is simple. Gently drop your current boyfriend, and forget about Mr PastLover. Then seek counseling to find out why you can't seem to keep a relationship going without destroying it.

Nymphette might have been brutal in her approach, but she is right about one thing. You made this mess, its up to you to fix it.

According to your own words, you've held every man up to a standard founded by your experience with this guy, and yet you know nothing really about him. A few dates and a few trysts do not provide a complete picture of a person. And whats worse is you've plowed through the lives of at least two other men, wreaking havoc in your wake. You've brought children into this world, then turned against the fathers because they couldn't live up to some ideal standard? You should be ashamed of yourself and your actions.

Gently drop the current boyfriend. Forget Mr. Past and let him live out his own life, with or without his wife as he can. He doesn't need your help to destroy his marriage.

Stay away from any relationship until you can mature enough to handle one. In the meantime concentrate on your children, you've deprived them of a father, at least try to be a decent mother. Get professional help.

 

[lovechild27]

You do in fact dig your own holes.


Maybe its just better to cut your losses and start over. I personally wouldnt trust someone who cheated on his current love for me.

I wonder how old the poster is...this sounds like an awful prime time tv drama plot.

Are you really in love with this other guy or are you in love with the excitement of the situation?

 

[warrior queen]

Wow, what a whiny dumb bitch you are. First of all, this didn't "happen to you," you made it happen. You chose to marry someone who you thought was just "OK," and you chose to cheat on him. Of course, you didn't just cheat on him, you also cheated on your children. Thanks to you, your children get to grow up in a broken home.

what a judgmental phrase this is!
definately uncalled for - there are much better ways to say something like this!

and as for actually having cheated already - well, i went back to read the original post again, and i couldn't find mention of having cheated yet!
perhaps Chamelion was asking for advice on how to resolve this before she does get into that situation?

first off you need to end the relationship you are currently in

again, it looks to me that Chamelion is trying to fix this without losing her current partner?
i may be wrong here.

You need to make sure the feeling are running as strong both ways. I am concerned that they may not be as you say your relationship consists mainly of a few adolescent " dates" and some extra-marital sex, and that you let him " slip quietly away." This is not something you let happen with the love of your life.

the first bit i agree with.
the last bit tho - sometimes things happen in peoples lives, and depending on the level of maturity and/or self-confidence to deal with any ramifications to a decision, the wrong decisions can be made quite easily.
Chamelion doesn't say what age she was when this happened.
could be any number of reasons why she never felt able to pursue this?

The idea that one cannot resist seeing another person is simply not true. You have choices in your life. How you make those choices determines the outcome of your own happiness or misery. You are in charge, not your emotions. Unless you chose to allow them to be.

again, this depends entirely on whether or not the attraction is stronger than personal reason.
sadly, i have been in this position myself, and so i KNOW how hard it can get.

It is a sad story when our first loves don't work out, but there seems to be a reason why things didn't work out. That you haven't stated. To carry the torch for a man who is inaccessible is futile.

absolutely in agreement with this.
Chamelion, it seems you're after something you might be feeling is lacking in your relationship.
maybe it's time to address what your needs and wants are within your existing partnership, and then actively work to rectify any problems?

I wonder how old the poster is...this sounds like an awful prime time tv drama plot.

and then again, this could also be someone thinking they might get some real, helpful answers to what must surely be a very difficult situation?

personally, i hope that you get your situation sorted Chamelion, and without causing too much pain for anyone involved.

good luck.

 

[Phaos]

It's certainly an intriguing story... I am tempted to say that it's more her love of the thing she doesn't have: the old "The grass is always greener on the other side" sort of thing. It's easy to say "oh well clearly you should do this... or this...." after reading a short summary of the events, but I'm sure there's much, much more going on with it, and a lot of complex emtional baggage to sort through on her part. You have a husband that (I assume) loves you very much and children as well. I don't reccommend you give that up over your old flame, but I do think that you should seek counseling about it. What is it you really feel for your family? Is it really just a sham that you assembled in the absence of your old lover? It may look like that from the picture you painted, but I'm betting you have deeper attachments to them than you think you do. Is your ex wreckless or wild? What is that certain 'spark' in him that made you love him so much? You need to identify what these things are and not just fall back on the justification that "no man" can measure up to your ex. If you don't WANT them to, they never will.

 

[sheath]

Re: Oh what a tangled web we weave....

Stay away from any relationship until you can mature enough to handle one. In the meantime concentrate on your children, you've deprived them of a father, at least try to be a decent mother. Get professional help.

Hear, hear!

I agree totally. You don't need to be attaching yourself to ANY man at this point. You need to know why you are hanging onto a man who has obviously moved on to marry someone else. You need to know why none of your relationships have made you happy. You need to understand yourself first.

Once you have gone through counseling, and if this guy is still exactly what you want and no one else will do, then you have some serious decisions to make about entering into a relationship with him. But know damn well what you are doing first. You've destroyed more than enough relationships already.

Also, please realize that it seems, from your initial post, that you are pining after a man who is probably using you. Think about it. He's married now. And there is this woman who happens to pop up every few years, unhappy and longing for him. The brutal truth is, you are making things very easy for him.

You are always the Plan B.

If you are cool with that, fine. But recognize the reality for what it is. Let go of the fairytale, babe.

My two cents...

S.

 

[warrior queen]

It's certainly an intriguing story... I am tempted to say that it's more her love of the thing she doesn't have: the old "The grass is always greener on the other side" sort of thing. It's easy to say "oh well clearly you should do this... or this...." after reading a short summary of the events, but I'm sure there's much, much more going on with it, and a lot of complex emtional baggage to sort through on her part. You have a husband that (I assume) loves you very much and children as well. I don't reccommend you give that up over your old flame, but I do think that you should seek counseling about it. What is it you really feel for your family? Is it really just a sham that you assembled in the absence of your old lover? It may look like that from the picture you painted, but I'm betting you have deeper attachments to them than you think you do. Is your ex wreckless or wild? What is that certain 'spark' in him that made you love him so much? You need to identify what these things are and not just fall back on the justification that "no man" can measure up to your ex. If you don't WANT them to, they never will.

i'm wondering how much hasn't been included in the original post?
seems to me that situations like this are usually far more complicated than the few words on a page.

i agree with you tho, Phaos, this is an internal struggle that needs to be addressed.

 

[nymphette]

warrior queen wrote:

what a judgmental phrase this is!

Everyone is judgemental. There is no way of getting around it. You just judged me. So what's your point?

and as for actually having cheated already - well, i went back to read the original post again, and i couldn't find mention of having cheated yet!

The 4th paragraph in chamelion's post starts with, "Now the problems began. I started a wild affair with him."

 

[warrior queen]

warrior queen wrote:

Everyone is judgemental. There is no way of getting around it. You just judged me. So what's your point?



The 4th paragraph in chamelion's post starts with, "Now the problems began. I started a wild affair with him."

lol - you're right!
i did judge you.

the 4th paragraph seems to be referring to the past, i was talking about the situation as it appears now.
seems Chamelion has NOT YET gone outside her new relationship.

 

[Noor]

okay just so you know my bias:
I don't believe that love can necessarily conquor all.
I am, so far, fairly non-monogamous by nature.
I truly believe that you can love and have relationships with more than one person.

That being said if I make a committment I keep it or change it. Chamelion seems to be in a committed monogamous relationship, and I think if she wants to explore outside of it, she should be honest and leave it.

I understand the pull first loves have. My first love and I were lovers off and on for about 7.5 years. We did not, as far as I know, break any committments to others in our being lovers, although we had and were aware of each others relationships. My other lovers during that time knew him and were very fond of him as well.
One of the things that separated us in the end was our not wanting to disturb each other lives, which was basically what happened when we saw each other. I still love him and probably will forever, maybe someday we will both be in a time and place in our lives where we might be together but I am not looking or hoping for that.
I think great relationships require not only love and willingness of each party but for each person within the relationship to be at the right a time and place in their lives, to be free to enter the relationship without reservations.
Neither Chamelion or her former lover are free to do that and as long s they are not truly free, their interaction will not work out and just cause pain for them and those around them.

Chamelion, I would also consider how much sex and passion has a pull on you. I have a man who is like my sexually other half, when we get together it is magic, when we even talk it is magic but it is not the stuff that makes me want to leave my home permanently to be with him, I would be happy to have him here with me because he is a good freind but I would not give up my home to be with him. He once said to me "I know you, I know if you wanted to be here with me, you would be, nothing would stop you. Maybe someday you will be, but not right now" and he was right.

We make choices everyday that display our underlyng priorities, I know if I put my mind to it I can be anywhere I choose to be, the money, the lease, my family, my freinds none of them truly could stop me if I wanted to be somewhere.

 

[James G 5]

PS: I'm all for poly, but have found there are very few people that can do it. The idea that love should expand, not focus to exclusion or others, flies in the face of most people.

Beauase most people don't love even one person to exclusion, they focus too much on themselves *shrug*
And the bias towards one is part of the "monogamy mindset" I mentioned, which is why I always fight against the ideas of it
It reduces love and makes it so narrow *shudder*
Homosexuality used to fly in the face of most people as well, it was voices crying out int he dark to change paradigms that brought gains about
That's all I can hope to be

 

[James G 5]

Just to echo somewhat what Pink Orchid and ReadyOne have stated in a way: why is that whenever anyone comes here with relationship problems it must always turn into a debate about whether or not monogamy is good or bad? It truly gets tiring when it invades every thread that people start who simply have issues with their relationships. If folks want to debate the good and bad about monogamy vs poly, then start a thread on it where people who are interested can discuss it.

Just a suggestion....

Gee, was this directed at anyone?
Up to a point this was valid Chele (re other threads at least)
But in THIS thread she starts off with "I've got a problem.
I love two people, one of whom I live with, the other is a man I have loved for many years.
I have never had the opportunity to be with this third person except for as a part-time lover, but I do know that my feelings are a lot more than just lust. They always have been." and continues with "I have the chance to see him again, soon, and although i know we will both be betraying our respective partners, I somehow cannot bring myself to feel any guilt." and then states "I am so confused and upset by the situation I am in."

If that's not a place in which to bring up the idea that you CAN, in fact, love more than one person and that perhaps a monogamous situation will not work for you, then I don't know what the place for such commentary IS. Of course some of you would say there is never a place for such a comment, and to you I say

My point was that, for Chamelion and others in her place if they can achieve the level of maturity and balance necessary in thensleves AND find ways to work it out with the respective partners these situations might be able to find resolution happily thru non-monogamy

It was never intended to turn in to a good or bad debate, merely a piece of advice uniquely suited to the issue at hand

 

[Bobmi357]

But in THIS thread she starts off with "I've got a problem.
I love two people, one of whom I live with, the other is a man I have loved for many years.
I have never had the opportunity to be with this third person except for as a part-time lover, but I do know that my feelings are a lot more than just lust. They always have been." and continues with "I have the chance to see him again, soon, and although i know we will both be betraying our respective partners, I somehow cannot bring myself to feel any guilt." and then states "I am so confused and upset by the situation I am in."

This is not really the place for a poly vs monogomy debate. Especially when you consider the damage this one poster has caused.

1 Ex Husband
1 Current boyfriend whom she's considering cheating on.
1 Ex Boyfriend who is married, not that she seems to care that she might be ruining that.
? Children, plural, supposedly given to her by either ex-husband or current boyfriend.

This isn't exactly a model case for a poly lifestyle if you know what I mean.

 

[James G 5]

This is not really the place for a poly vs monogomy debate. Especially when you consider the damage this one poster has caused.

1 Ex Husband
1 Current boyfriend whom she's considering cheating on.
1 Ex Boyfriend who is married, not that she seems to care that she might be ruining that.
? Children, plural, supposedly given to her by either ex-husband or current boyfriend.

This isn't exactly a model case for a poly lifestyle if you know what I mean.

Like I said, no debate was intended
And I acknowledged further back in the thread that this person is not at a place in her life RIGHT NOW for managing ANY sort of relationship
BUT
Addressing the IDEA of poly suggests a method of dealing with her issue of feeling conflicted for having feelings about more than one person, and pointing out as she works to develop new paradigms for herself that maybe she doesn't need to focus on those that says she can't or shouldn't love more than 1 person