On abortion

[Ishmael]

Another political season, another round of the discussions regarding abortion.

Abortion is murder, there is no other word that fits. You may call it the elimination of an 'nonviable tissue mass', or any other phrase you want, but it's still murder.

Why?

Human life begins at conception because that is the only place it can start. From the fertilization of the egg you are dealing with an individual human being. As far as being nonviable, the same can be said of any child up to a certain, and variable, age. Take a toddler to the wilderness, abandon them, and they exhibit all of the traits of a nonviable tissue mass. They are going to die and the individual(s) that dropped them off are going to be charged with murder. That being the case why not allow postpartum abortions as well? The same logic applies.

I happen to be pro-choice, at least during the first trimester. Not because I believe that abortion isn't murder, but merely because that women have been practicing abortion and birth control throughout recorded history and I can see no value to society by criminalizing a 3000 year old tradition.

That being said, you women can vote your uterus or you can vote for the best for the nation. And if you think your uterus is what the future of the nation hinges on.......God help us all.

Ishmael

 

[warrior queen]

Aaaaaaaaannd....
Another MAN comes into the debate.

 

[Ishmael]

Aaaaaaaaannd....
Another MAN comes into the debate.

Got an opinion? Voice it.

Ishmael

 

[warrior queen]

Got an opinion? Voice it.

Ishmael

I just did.
You're a man. You have zero say in what a woman chooses to do with her body and her [first trimester] pregnancy, with one exception.... if you are the father, you get to tell her what you think, but in the end it doesn't make a difference to her choice.
How come men don't understand that?

 

[Jaystorme]

I wouldn't ask a woman to do it, but I wouldn't judge if she did!

 

[alice27]

what is interesting is that you have never experienced being pregnant or having to deal with the issue of bringing life into this world

 

[Disgustipated]

Another political season, another round of the discussions regarding abortion.

Abortion is murder, there is no other word that fits. You may call it the elimination of an 'nonviable tissue mass', or any other phrase you want, but it's still murder.

Why?

Human life begins at conception because that is the only place it can start. From the fertilization of the egg you are dealing with an individual human being. As far as being nonviable, the same can be said of any child up to a certain, and variable, age. Take a toddler to the wilderness, abandon them, and they exhibit all of the traits of a nonviable tissue mass. They are going to die and the individual(s) that dropped them off are going to be charged with murder. That being the case why not allow postpartum abortions as well? The same logic applies.

I happen to be pro-choice, at least during the first trimester. Not because I believe that abortion isn't murder, but merely because that women have been practicing abortion and birth control throughout recorded history and I can see no value to society by criminalizing a 3000 year old tradition.

That being said, you women can vote your uterus or you can vote for the best for the nation. And if you think your uterus is what the future of the nation hinges on.......God help us all.

Ishmael

Women, throughout history, have aborted past the first trimester. Why do you post when you have obviously been drinking?
Your "logic" about the wilderness crap is dumb at best.

 

[CHNOPS]

I don't see what this has to do with Lance doping.

 

[Disgustipated]

I don't see what this has to do with Lance doping.

Stem cell research, dummy!

 

[Jaystorme]

I don't see what this has to do with Lance doping.

Lance doped? Off to burn my livestrong bacelet.

 

[CHNOPS]

Stem cell research, dummy!

I posted that because I like to moron.

 

[Ishmael]

what is interting is that you have never experienced being pregnant or having to deal with the issue of bringing life into this world when ou have no one to support you. And maybe you can blame the woman for getting her self into this mess, for opening her legs, but life happens. And i'm not advocating killing the child. I'm just saying that the child won't survive if the mother's environment isn't safe. And she has to make a choice. I made a choice. And I regret it everyday. But it happened to me, and it's something I live with everyday. You can't tell me that I'm evil, or going to hell, or have no morals, because I'm pathetically sorry, and i'll never forget what I did, but I would not have survived otherwise. And I wans't a teen or a child. I was grown.

Another with reading comprehension issues.

Of course I have never born a child, or ever will. But what you are doing is avoiding the entire discussion in a fit of emotionalism.

Did you miss my pro-choice statement? Or did you miss the inference that if it's a choice between the mother (still living) and the child, I choose the life of the mother?

Not being of a religious bent I'm certainly not going to condemn you to Hell, it seems to me that you've already done that to yourself.

You made your choice and you're going to have to live with it, just as 3000 years of women, high born or not, have had to do.

Ishmael

 

[Ishmael]

Women, throughout history, have aborted past the first trimester. Why do you post when you have obviously been drinking?
Your "logic" about the wilderness crap is dumb at best.

Is it? How, you of such superior intelligence?

Fucking moron.

Ishmael

 

[CHNOPS]

What is the significance of 3000 years here?

Are you a young-Earther?

 

[Disgustipated]

Is it? How, you of such superior intelligence?

Fucking moron.

Ishmael

I don't fuck morons.

 

[Phelia]

Well, murder means unlawful killing. Given that abortion is perfectly legal, the word "murder" actually fits very poorly. I'd also say that leaving a toddler in the woods is a weak analogy, but I suspect that you knew that. Until fetal viability, that "individual human being" is also a part of the woman's body, and what happens to her body is her choice.

No one is saying that abortion is nice or fun or a decision that ought to be taken casually, but the right to make decisions regarding my own body has just as much impact on my life as the state of the economy.

Do you have similar words of advice for people who allow a constitutional amendment restricting marriage to heterosexual couples to sway their votes?

 

[Disgustipated]

I don't fuck morons.

So VatAss, as much as he'd like, would never have a chance with me.

 

[Ishmael]

Well, murder means unlawful killing. Given that abortion is perfectly legal, the word "murder" actually fits very poorly. I'd also say that leaving a toddler in the woods is a weak analogy, but I suspect that you knew that. Until fetal viability, that "individual human being" is also a part of the woman's body, and what happens to her body is her choice.

No one is saying that abortion is nice or fun or a decision that ought to be taken casually, but the right to make decisions regarding my own body has just as much impact on my life as the state of the economy.

Do you have similar words of advice for people who allow a constitutional amendment restricting marriage to heterosexual couples to sway their votes?

True, just a matter of semantics. One of the reasons it's so hard to find executioners.

Ishmael

 

[Disgustipated]

True, just a matter of semantics. One of the reasons it's so hard to find executioners.

Ishmael

Had you have known VatAss would have grown up to be a waste of oxygen would you have tried again?

 

[Phelia]

True, just a matter of semantics. One of the reasons it's so hard to find executioners.

Ishmael

There are lots of reasons, to be sure.

Could you please answer my last question, re: allowing your vote to be swayed by the gay marriage issue? Maybe you were joking, but I found the tone of your post condescending, i.e. "sure hope them womens know better than to vote with their lady parts come November!"

As I stated, I don't think it's outrageous to favour a politician who respects my right to make decisions regarding my own body. At any rate, I think it makes a heck of a lot more sense than voting to outlaw something that has literally no bearing on your life in the name of protecting the sanctity of marriage. I am curious to know where your opinions fall in that regard.

Finally, aside from the fact that I don't find abortion to be morally wrong, I think your pro-choice justification is very rational. It doesn't give you any pause when a politician disagrees?

 

[zipman]

Another political season, another round of the discussions regarding abortion.

Abortion is murder, there is no other word that fits. You may call it the elimination of an 'nonviable tissue mass', or any other phrase you want, but it's still murder.

Why?

Human life begins at conception because that is the only place it can start. From the fertilization of the egg you are dealing with an individual human being. As far as being nonviable, the same can be said of any child up to a certain, and variable, age. Take a toddler to the wilderness, abandon them, and they exhibit all of the traits of a nonviable tissue mass. They are going to die and the individual(s) that dropped them off are going to be charged with murder. That being the case why not allow postpartum abortions as well? The same logic applies.

I happen to be pro-choice, at least during the first trimester. Not because I believe that abortion isn't murder, but merely because that women have been practicing abortion and birth control throughout recorded history and I can see no value to society by criminalizing a 3000 year old tradition.

That being said, you women can vote your uterus or you can vote for the best for the nation. And if you think your uterus is what the future of the nation hinges on.......God help us all.

Ishmael

If you support abortion even though you truly believe it to be murder all I can say is that you have a ridiculously poor moral compass. At least stand up for what you believe to be right.

Personally, I don't think it's murder and I also think in this case, voting wtih your uterus is also what's best for the nation.

 

[bg23]

I just did.
You're a man. You have zero say in what a woman chooses to do with her body and her [first trimester] pregnancy, with one exception.... if you are the father, you get to tell her what you think, but in the end it doesn't make a difference to her choice.
How come men don't understand that?

saying that a man has zero say in what a woman chooses to do with her body is a silly thing to say.

someone being a man doesn't preclude them from having them opinion, nor a right to express it.

other men, and other women, are constantly telling us what we can, and can't do - with and without our bodies.

ultimately it's not the person's gender that dictates their right to impose their will on another human being, it's either a legal or ethical imperative.

him being a man doesn't make his opinion moot.

 

[Sean]

him being a man doesn't make his opinion moot.

Him being a cunt, however, does.

 

[bg23]

entirely different matter.

 

[warrior queen]

saying that a man has zero say in what a woman chooses to do with her body is a silly thing to say.

someone being a man doesn't preclude them from having them opinion, nor a right to express it.

other men, and other women, are constantly telling us what we can, and can't do - with and without our bodies.

ultimately it's not the person's gender that dictates their right to impose their will on another human being, it's either a legal or ethical imperative.

him being a man doesn't make his opinion moot.

If you read what I wrote, I did say the man had the right to say what he thinks.
He does not, however, have the same right to choose [or not] an abortion.
Only the woman has that.