Numbers Being Rigged.

[Guest]

I do not visit this site as much as I use to, however, it is clear to me that many that were on the top list for poetry are knocked back, and possibly pulled themselves out. It also appears that the great writers numbers are down, I am most positive there were more votes on some of those authors then what is showing up in the ranks. Someone is fudgeing the votes. The only one I know of that can knock the number of per votes down is the owner of the site. For what reason though. Is there favortism going on amongst the writers and the owners?



It is too bad that people can not be honest.


I also see that people like to complain about the critisism they get on some of their poems, but are all too proud and arrogant when they get praised. If one stops and thinks about it, critisism can only make you a better writer for the most part.

 

[Debbie]

Laurel takes a stern view on this subject of voter fraud. And deals
with it accordingly.
To make this statement," Someone is fudgeing the votes. The only one I know of that can knock the number of per votes down is the owner of the site. For what reason though. Is there favortism going on amongst the writers and the owners? "

My, my what a nasty little creature you are. Accusations of
favouritism? In my opinion Laurel is a fair minded, honest person.


Voting to me is unimportant. At first it was important. I watched my votes everyday. LOL Thank goodness I moved on.

What is important to me is being a worthwhile member of this
community. I try my best to give as much feedback and input as I can on lit and in private. Sometimes I have a lot of time on my hands, sometimes not. R/l has a strong hold on me.


"I also see that people like to complain about the critisism they get on some of their poems, but are all too proud and arrogant when they get praised. If one stops and thinks about it, critisism can only make you a better writer for the most part."


I have yet to see anyone here get arrogant when they get praised. In fact, if anything? I have seen people react with
grateful acknowledgement. Yes, criticism helps to make one
grow as a writer. If I know not of my mistakes/weaknesses how can I correct them.

I believe in balance and try to show this in my feedback.

 

[Guest]

This has been done before and before and once again...

Read through the old threads and you'll see that all this has been discussed to death, to death, to death!

 

[WickedEve]

there's one in every crowd

This all sounds so familiar.
Oh, well! At least, things haven't changed much around here. lol

 

[Guest]

As stated earlier, I do not visit often so I do not know if this subject has been brought up. I do not have all that much time to go though old posts. However, since you mentioned that it has been discussed to death, then I am not the only one that feels this way if it has been brought up before.


I do not care if poems and stories are voted on. However, since they are, what I do care about it fair play. It is great to have the discussion board for feedback, however, is voting on things necessary when the votes can not be kept fair?


Also I see critisism that goes on about peoples poems and stories that are just plain mean and ugly. Why people need to do this is beyond me. Granted, there are many writers that need help, and those that don't, but make the critisism constructive, instead of out right mean. Also, some of those writers that get critisised should get a A for EFFORT.


Just this readers opinion, and that last time I checked, everyone is entitled to one.

 

[just pet]

I am new to this site and am thrilled that any of my poems are read. The voting is not an issue with me except I would love to hear the reason for any particular vote, only wanting to improve.

just pet

 

[tigerjen]

There was a big discussion about this

quite awhile back.....and there were issues of "trolling votes",
meaning that certain people would score a "1" to a poem that
many readers in the majority had thought was very good or
better. I know I've got bitten by the "1" monster.....and it doesn't
make me very happy.

There was quite a stir back in November/December about
why some of the newer poems weren't getting the attention on
the toplist, and that the "regular mainstays" (WickedEve,
Debbiexxx....you remember) such as myself were "hogging the
toplist"......anyhow, after only a couple of poets decided to shut
off the voting option on some of their poems, notably their
older poems, I refused only because I felt that I was being
"forced" to do it to accomodate the new ones. With that, a
certain someone or others started knocking my poems down......
and after listening to diff. poets here, I decided out of good faith
to turn off the voting option on the poems I posted up here in
July and August 2001, w/ the exception of a few. I am still not
happy about it, though I am sure it has made room for newer
poems, which is a good thing.......

The toplist only shows how many people read and vote on what
poems they enjoy.........believe me, if the poetry toplist got expanded
to more than 100 poems as I have suggested in the past, I'd turn
the voting option on my poems back on, no matter what anyone
says. And to be honest, I have not even looked at the poetry
toplist since at least before Christmas.......plus I haven't posted
anything of my own in quite a long time (w/ the exception of
the Poetry Olympics, being on a team) so I have no reason at the
moment to check to see if whatever poems of mine that still have
the voting option turned on, because, for all I know, they may or
may not be on the list.......I'm not worried about it......

I'll also add something else....I have not been on the Poetry
board as much as of recent.......been busy with other pursuits such
as my "new cafe" located on the Lit. Personals......but my creative
juices for poetry haven't been flowing lately...but I will be back
w/ a new poem sometime very soon.....I'm not going away .......



tigerjen

 

[lovetoread]

I think,and what people dont seem to understand, is that if your poem and/or story gets any attention at all, your rating will go down.

When that many people see it,and decide whether or not it is just crap,or maybe that you are too big for your britches,the numbers go down.

I made the top list twice.

As soon as real poets read my stuff,the votes went wayyyyy down.

Tis life and it will go on.

I'm am just so tired of someone whining about cheating. Send a pm or email to Laurel to talk about it,dont come bitching about it here. We have no power over the way the votes go.

 

[Guest]

RE:There was a big discussion about this

Thank You for you post on the subject. As opposed to others comments you took the time to explain things.


You stated. "quite awhile back.....and there were issues of "trolling votes",
meaning that certain people would score a "1" to a poem that
many readers in the majority had thought was very good or
better. I know I've got bitten by the "1" monster.....and it doesn't
make me very happy. "


Now in my opinion those that you say were very good or better poems may be true,and they were knocked down to a 1. Now what everyone has to remember is no one has the same taste in what they read, or what they like. If everyone liked the same thing, or thought the same way, it would lead to a rather dull world. Now, I have written some things myself, the thing is, my friends either come out and say, well that is good or it sucks, because people have thier own opinions and know their likes and dislikes. So all I am saying is everyone does not like the same thing.

Why is there a need for voting at all. What is wrong with the most read poems or stories and leave it at that. To me, again, only my opinion, this messege board would be good enough for praise and critisism and its a fair deal as opposed to the numbers being messed with by whomever.

Best of luck with your new cafe tigerjen.


As for LOVETOREAD: "I'm am just so tired of someone whining about cheating. Send a pm or email to Laurel to talk about it,dont come bitching about it here. We have no power over the way the votes go."

It is people like you that have no cooth in not understanding or excepting others opinions. I have a right to mine, as you do yours. As far as bitching, who is bitching, I was just stating what I seen in my eyes. So please do not whine when others speak their peace. It does not make you look good.

 

[WickedEve]

Unregistered, it's "couth" not "cooth." And you have no tact. You can have your opinions, but the issue you brought up about "fudgeing the votes" should be discussed privately with Laurel. And I'm quite sure Laurel will tell you the same thing about such matters.

Wicked Eve

 

[Blue Dolphin]

Laurel takes a stern view on this subject of voter fraud. And deals
with it accordingly.

Interesting.
One of my poems had votes mysteriously dissappear. I mailed Laurel, weeks ago
still awaiting reply.
Sorry it has been raised again
P

 

[Debbie]

Laurel takes a stern view on this subject of voter fraud. And deals
with it accordingly.

Interesting.
One of my poems had votes mysteriously dissappear. I mailed Laurel, weeks ago
still awaiting reply.
Sorry it has been raised again
P

Laurel has been extremely busy. Things have been very
hectic around here lately for them with everything that has been going on. Adding the new forums etc.
I wouldn't want to be clearing out her emails or PM's. LOL
I would never be seen again!

 

[Guest]

EXXXXXXxxxxxxxxxxxcuseeeee ME.

Unregistered, it's "couth" not "cooth." And you have no tact. You can have your opinions, but the issue you brought up about "fudgeing the votes" should be discussed privately with Laurel. And I'm quite sure Laurel will tell you the same thing about such matters.

Wicked Eve

That was constructive to the last posts. To pick out spelling errors. No the issue should not have been brought up privately, not when the issue at hand has to do with everyone.


I am so sorry I got your knickers in a twister.

 

[Debbie]

Re: EXXXXXXxxxxxxxxxxxcuseeeee ME.

That was constructive to the last posts. To pick out spelling errors. No the issue should not have been brought up privately, not when the issue at hand has to do with everyone.


I am so sorry I got your knickers in a twister.

You're excused. And the correct saying is, knickers in a twist or panties in a bunch.

BTW I peeked, WE wasn't wearing any.

Come on unreg, I get your point. PM or email Laurel
and express your concerns.

 

[WickedEve]

I am so sorry I got your knickers in a twister.

I don't wear knickers, but if I did, I would hate to have them caught up in a twister! (perhaps, they'd land in Oz) That's hysterical, unregistered! LOL

 

[smithpeter]

intelligent remark

'round here we say, "don't get your unzers up your bunzers"

 

[tigerjen]

Re: intelligent remark

'round here we say, "don't get your unzers up your
bunzers"

Smithpeter.....

You slay me!! *giggling*

Now THAT was funny!!!



tigerjen

 

[RisiaSkye]

Laurel takes a stern view on this subject of voter fraud. And deals
with it accordingly.

Interesting.
One of my poems had votes mysteriously dissappear. I mailed Laurel, weeks ago
still awaiting reply.
Sorry it has been raised again
P

So disappointing to watch this shit happening again. (Nothing personal, pleasureu or Unregistered) It seems every few days/weeks/months someone else takes it into their heads that the whole thing is just hideously unfair. Usually, that "unfairness" is nothing more than a few mean spirited one votes from competing poets--the same people who then show up here full of condolences and well wishes for the complaining writer. Occasionally, there is real voting fraud, and when Laurel can prove it conclusively, it's reversed every bit as much as is humanly possible.

I'll say now what I said when the total numbers of votes first went down dramatically, some weeks ago. Laurel fairly recently caught a vote de-frauding team rather red handed. As I understand it, in the aftermath, all questionable votes (whether high or low) were removed in an effort to put everybody back where they were before these people took it upon themselves to restructure the toplists to their own liking.

 

[Guest]

Voting

I have to agree with the individual who stated that a forum for praise and criticism is enough. The contest mentality is childish and petty. But that is just the way the earth spins and is one of the reasons I will not submit any poem or story to Literotica.

 

[KillerMuffin]

You won't submit because you have a childish contest mentality? I don't blame you there. I used to have that mentality. It's a horrible way to conduct yourself as a human being. I used to be a very BadMuffin. Don't you just love people who refer to themselves in the third person?

Kudos to you on your choice to maintain your self-righteousness. It shows character.

 

[Guest]

You won't submit because you have a childish contest mentality? I don't blame you there. I used to have that mentality. It's a horrible way to conduct yourself as a human being. I used to be a very BadMuffin. Don't you just love people who refer to themselves in the third person?

Kudos to you on your choice to maintain your self-righteousness. It shows character.

Whatever. You win. Feel better? I apologize. You have so much more character than anyone here. I keep forgetting.

I am not the one who suggested the numbers are rigged. I live a highly competitive life and wish not my art to be drawn into it.

As you wish, your Highness, as you wish.

A very pity that people cannot submit and make the voting that stimulate so many, yet not all, optional.

 

[KillerMuffin]

You can make voting optional. None of my how-to submissions allow voting to them. I used to have it that way with poetry. You can also turn off the features that allow you to receive anonymous feedback and you can withhold your email address if you like. When you submit a story or poem you are presented with the option to allow voting or not. In the view submissions area you have the option to change a submission's voting status at any time.

The problem here isn't the system or the abuse of the system. There is no way to secure it against voter fraud and maintain a free and anonymously open site.

The problem is how people view votes and scores. I used to get into a dither over it and act atrociously. Now I pretty much ignore it. I'm not on the top lists and I never will be. I've accepted it and I'm much happier.

Voting and your own personal reaction to it is the only problem here. Some people get all bent out of shape because they perceive fraud or there actually is fraud going on. Voting and scores are useful only in that they tell the writer if they are going in the right direction or not. The top lists are hopelessly riddled with people who vote themselves up and others down.

If you don't like self-righteous condescension tossed right back into your face, don't spew it in the first place.

 

[Guest]

Re: Re: EXXXXXXxxxxxxxxxxxcuseeeee ME.

You're excused. And the correct saying is, knickers in a twist or panties in a bunch.

BTW I peeked, WE wasn't wearing any.

Come on unreg, I get your point. PM or email Laurel
and express your concerns.

No wonder you people are getting only 1's for votes. It may not be so much your writing as it is your BaD AtTtItUdEs. The funny thing is. It is probably all you people voting against each other too.

I guess you are another one whose knickers are in a TWISTER.

 

[Laurel]

Someone is fudgeing the votes. The only one I know of that can knock the number of per votes down is the owner of the site. For what reason though. Is there favortism going on amongst the writers and the owners?

One question: why? Why would we do that? What exactly would we have to gain from playing with numbers? And what makes you think we'd have the time or the effort to do this?

Yes, we do remove fraudulent votes from stories and poems as they are detected. If you had votes removed from your poem, they were votes that were put there by someone to mess with the system. If you like, you can contact me with your author name and I will look into it for you. I can even go through the trouble of tracking down who put those fraud votes there, if that's what you want me to do. Let me know.

I don't think literature is a contest, and ranking stories to me is a little odd to me. Literotica originally had no voting system whatsoever. We added the voting at the request of many authors, who wished to use it as a method of feedback. And while it is a rather clumsy method of feedback, it is a method that can help you gauge reader response so long as you realize its limitations and don't take it as the end-all-be-all decider of story/poem quality.

We have since added a way for you to submit stories and poems without allowing readers to vote on them. That way, those who do want voting on their submissions can have it. Those who don't, won't.

I hope this clears everything up. I'm sorry for not answering my email as promptly as I should. I'm a Gen-Xer - I'm doomed to always be a slacker. hehe

 

[KillerMuffin]

Bitch. You know how hard it was to give all my poems that many 5's??? It took me about four days of painstaking labor! I was the top! The top I tell you! I had 587 votes and a 5.00! No one was going to displace me. No one! Do you hear me! I was number one. Number one I tell you. Now it's gone, down the drain.

Well, back to the grind. I'm going for over 1000 votes on each poem this time.