No wonder Sharon wants to talk...

[p_p_man]

Source: Guardian 24 February 2002

"Ariel Sharon suffered a humbling finish to the most bruising week of his prime minstership yesterday with opinion polls charting a deepening disenchantment with the Israeli leadership.
A poll conducted for the Yedioth Ahronoth newspaper, Israel's largest Hebrew daily, showed that 61% of Israelis were dissatisfied with Mr Sharon's performance, and just 38% would give him a passing grade for his handling of the 17-month Palestinian uprising.

His credibility score fell to 54%, a staggering drop from his approval rating of 70% in December and 77% last July."

I suppose this shows that unless you're winning, or at least seen to be achieving peace and not just killing for killing's sake, then the people will eventually have their say.

If the poll is correct we should soon see his coalition partners deserting the sinking ship...

And then what?

 

[bored1]

I think that all Israelis should move back to Europe,But before they go destroy everything they have built in the last 50 years or so,salt the fields and then give the whole place to everyones favorite terrorist Mr. Arafat. Didnt he mastermind the murder of the Israeli Olympians in 1972? And while were at it give Ireland back too the Irish.

 

[Weevil]

I think that all Israelis should move back to Europe,But before they go destroy everything they have built in the last 50 years or so,salt the fields and then give the whole place to everyones favorite terrorist Mr. Arafat. Didnt he mastermind the murder of the Israeli Olympians in 1972? And while were at it give Ireland back too the Irish.

Why end there? Why don't all of us white folk move back to europe? Forcibly evict all immigrants in North America back to their countries of origin? How bout it England? You ready to accept about 200 million people? I mean, we've got just as much right to North America as the Israelis have to Israel. Why don't we all just move back to the dirty, dank caves that humanity spewed out of. Then no one can be accused of stealing land.

 

[bored1]

Why end there? Why don't all of us white folk move back to europe? Forcibly evict all immigrants in North America back to their countries of origin? How bout it England? You ready to accept about 200 million people? I mean, we've got just as much right to North America as the Israelis have to Israel. Why don't we all just move back to the dirty, dank caves that humanity spewed out of. Then no one can be accused of stealing land.

Great idea! Quess I wasnt thinking clearly with my first post. Maybe England should pay reparations to all there former Colonies that they exploited when they were an empire at everyone elses expense.

 

[Weevil]

Great idea! Quess I wasnt thinking clearly with my first post. Maybe England should pay reparations to all there former Colonies that they exploited when they were an empire at everyone elses expense.

Forget exploited, try genocide.

I'll do you one better. How about England pays retroactive retributions to every country they've treated as bad or worse than the Israelis treat the palestinians.

That's, let's see, the USA, Ireland, Scotland, Wales, Canada, South Africa, India. A couple dozen carribean islands, A whole bunch of african nations, China, Australia, New Zealand.

Am I forgetting anyone?

 

[bored1]

Forget exploited, try genocide.

I'll do you one better. How about England pays retroactive retributions to every country they've treated as bad or worse than the Israelis treat the palestinians.

That's, let's see, the USA, Ireland, Scotland, Wales, Canada, South Africa, India. A couple dozen carribean islands, A whole bunch of african nations, China, Australia, New Zealand.

Am I forgetting anyone?

Did you know that after WW2 the Brits executed low level Nazis that they knew would never be brought to trial? They would hunt these guys down and shoot them out in the woods like dogs. Didnt the Brits have something to do with Hong Kong? I wonder if I could get reparations for a Triumph TR8 I once owned.Great car when it ran!

 

[Weevil]

Did you know that after WW2 the Brits executed low level Nazis that they knew would never be brought to trial? They would hunt these guys down and shoot them out in the woods like dogs. Didnt the Brits have something to do with Hong Kong? I wonder if I could get reparations for a Triumph TR8 I once owned.Great car when it ran!

I'm fairly sure the brits had something to do with HK. At least, that's what Rush Hour led me to believe.

Hey, can we include Russia for their betrayal of the Cossacks?

 

[bored1]

I'm fairly sure the brits had something to do with HK. At least, that's what Rush Hour led me to believe.

Hey, can we include Russia for their betrayal of the Cossacks? -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------If you include the Russians you must include the Italians for all the stuff the Romans did.What about Atilla the Hun he messed with with a few people and you cant forget those peace loving Vikings.

 

[Weevil]

I'm fairly sure the brits had something to do with HK. At least, that's what Rush Hour led me to believe.

Hey, can we include Russia for their betrayal of the Cossacks? -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------If you include the Russians you must include the Italians for all the stuff the Romans did.What about Atilla the Hun he messed with with a few people and you cant forget those peace loving Vikings.

no, I just meant that the English betrayed the Russian cossacks. We should add russia to the list of England-aggrieved countries.

yeah, can we sue the vikings though?

 

[bored1]

no, I just meant that the English betrayed the Russian cossacks. We should add russia to the list of England-aggrieved countries.

yeah, can we sue the vikings though?

Seems that our English friends have there dirty little hands in everyones pie.If we sued the Vikings how would the plunder be divided?Could this suit take place in the world court?Right after Milosivic is found not guilty.

 

[Weevil]

Seems that our English friends have there dirty little hands in everyones pie.If we sued the Vikings how would the plunder be divided?Could this suit take place in the world court?Right after Milosivic is found not guilty.

Well, I don't know exactly how we'd divy up the pie. I'd for sure want one of those cool hats for all the grief they put my celtic ancestors through.

 

[bored1]

Well, I don't know exactly how we'd divy up the pie. I'd for sure want one of those cool hats for all the grief they put my celtic ancestors through.

The hats are indeed cool,I want one of those thick coats to go with the hat. I would also like to have a Viking boat with crew to float around my favorite lake.Those colorful sails are so colorful!

 

[Weevil]

The hats are indeed cool,I want one of those thick coats to go with the hat. I would also like to have a Viking boat with crew to float around my favorite lake.Those colorful sails are so colorful!

So, I figure I'm owed a hat by the vikings, a toga by the russians and some, uh, do the English have anything cool? Maybe some beer?

 

[bored1]

So, I figure I'm owed a hat by the vikings, a toga by the russians and some, uh, do the English have anything cool? Maybe some beer?

The Brits make this stuff called Golden Syrup its kinda like honey, but im not sure what it really is,Anyway its great on toasted muffins. They used to make cool sports cars but the labor unions destroyed the industry so thats out. Whats left?

 

[p_p_man]

slower, slower...

I'm writing all this stuff down so that we can get a proper shopping list typed up!

Right let's start again...

english syrup
russian toga
a viking hat
viking boat with crew
Triumph TR8
a thick coat (to go with the hat)

Is that it?

Doesn't seem much to pay for 1500 years of turbulent history.

I think America could beat us on that and only after 200 years...

What do two atom bombs equal?

 

[Lost Cause]

Past Wisdom

Look to the past for today's solutions..people are still the same only time changes.

"If you will not fight for right when you can easily win without blood shed; if you will not fight when your victory is sure and not too costly; you may come to the moment when you will have to fight with all the odds against you and only a precarious chance of survival. There may even be a worse case. You may have to fight when there is no hope of victory, because it is better to perish than to live as slaves."
--Winston Churchill
**Thanks Winnie!**

 

[p_p_man]

That Winston!

He got everywhere...

 

[SINthysist]

I'd say the terrorists are getting close to achieving thier goals

And you're fucking making it happen! You and the rest of the Isreali bashers.


One of the purposes of terrorism is to demoralize the enemy. Another is to create a leadership vacuum.

I think he should have sent the full force of his military, locked down Palestine, deported every POTENTIAL trouble maker to that garden spot SYRIA, set up a government and give them the land that that bastard TERRORIST Arafat turned down under YOUR HERO Clinton's terms and his brokered deal.

The Isreali PM (whomever) has been put in a lose-lose situation and cannot ever be popular for very long, BECAUSE ARAFAT WILL NOT STOP MURDERING! NOT WHILE HE'S WINNING!

 

[sch00lteacher]

P_man P_man, question, if Sharon is ousted, who would take his place? Serious question, I don't know, I am not following world news these days like I need to due to the drugs.

My guess is another hard-liner would take over. If so, and he had the public support, wouldn't things get worse instead of better?

 

[p_p_man]

P_man P_man, question, if Sharon is ousted, who would take his place? Serious question, I don't know, I am not following world news these days like I need to due to the drugs.

My guess is another hard-liner would take over. If so, and he had the public support, wouldn't things get worse instead of better?

Judging by the opinion poll I mentioned above, published in today's Guardian, it looks as though the Israeli people are becoming heartily sick of Right wing, meet threats with might. policy. And who can blame them? At the same time the Palestinians also seem to be fed up with the constant killing that has resulted from Sharon's policies. Both peoples want a future for their children.

If Sharon doesn't reverse his policy soon I can see the coalition breaking up completely with the Labour Party the first to go, as they nearly did in December.

Labour is traditionally linked to the peace movement, and Mr Peres insists that he can still be a moderating influence on Mr Sharon.

Labour objects to the Palestinian Authority being called a "terrorist-supporting entity" because it seriously compromises the position of Mr Peres, who clings to the hope that the government can still negotiate with the authority's president, Yasser Arafat.

Although Mr Sharon would have a parliamentary majority without Labour, the departure of Mr Peres would weaken him, since he would become more dependent on the religious parties and the right.

Up until now Labour's dilemma is that it is afraid of the electoral consequences of deserting the government of national unity at a time when the country's security is in jeopardy. But with the poll result published today their fear may diminish.

With the public's mood being what it is I can see support swinging behind Labour. If that happens they will be in a strong position to form a coalition of their own with Peres, a stong critic of Sharon and his policies, at its head.

There are other, equally capable Labour members who could take over. But at this stage they don't have the global presence that Peres commands.

And there is one more factor which I think can be important in this situation. Both Peres and Arafat are of the same age. They know each other well having been adversaries for years. And neither wants to leave a legacy behind them of death and destruction. They would like to go down in history as the harbingers of peace.

So schOOlteacher to give you a straight answer to a straight question.

I'd come down on the side of Peres.

 

[bored1]

Re: slower, slower...

I'm writing all this stuff down so that we can get a proper shopping list typed up!

Right let's start again...

english syrup
russian toga
a viking hat
viking boat with crew
Triumph TR8
a thick coat (to go with the hat)

Is that it?

Doesn't seem much to pay for 1500 years of turbulent history.

I think America could beat us on that and only after 200 years...

What do two atom bombs equal?The bombs ended ww2,and put an end to what those pleasant Japanese guys were doing to allied pows not to mention what they did to the people in China and the rest of south east asia.They got what they deserved and I shed a tear for none of them considering they butched my grandfather.

 

[SINthysist]

Sch00lTeach...

Actually, p_p_ would prefer the job to go to Bill Clinton, at least, that is, until Tony Blair needs a new job in this Brave New World.

First Isreal, then the WORLD! Muah-hahahaha

OUR FORD!

 

[p_p_man]

Re: Re: slower, slower...

The bombs ended ww2,and put an end to what those pleasant Japanese guys were doing to allied pows not to mention what they did to the people in China and the rest of south east asia.They got what they deserved and I shed a tear for none of them considering they butched my grandfather.

That's one version.

A couple of other versions is that the Japanese had already sued for peace and there was no reason for America to drop one bomb let alone two, except to:

show its new weapon off and prove to the Russians that they were now inferior in the destruction stakes.

see the effects, on human beings and buildings, of dropping an atomic device on a densely populated area.

Who knows why America did it.

The fact remains that she did...

ppman

 

[bored1]

Re: Re: Re: slower, slower...

That's one version.

A couple of other versions is that the Japanese had already sued for peace and there was no reason for America to drop one bomb let alone two, except to:

show its new weapon off and prove to the Russians that they were now inferior in the destruction stakes.

see the effects, on human beings and buildings, of dropping an atomic device on a densely populated area.

Who knows why America did it.

The fact remains that she did...

ppman

Works for me---------------------The US bombed the Japanese mainland around the clock up to and after dropping the atomic bomb-----------Killing more people then both of the atomic blasts. The facts also show that the British lead the charge to firebomb Dresden killing thousands------When the American barrage came after the Brits,there was nothing left, as it had all burned. It was the deliberate burning of a German city that had zero military significance.So firebombing 1000s with many bombs, dropped by many planes is more humane than killing 1000s with one plane and one bomb.-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Dead is Dead and war is hell------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

[p_p_man]

Re: Re: Re: Re: slower, slower...

Works for me---------------------The US bombed the Japanese mainland around the clock up to and after dropping the atomic bomb-----------Killing more people then both of the atomic blasts. The facts also show that the British lead the charge to firebomb Dresden killing thousands------When the American barrage came after the Brits,there was nothing left, as it had all burned. It was the deliberate burning of a German city that had zero military significance.So firebombing 1000s with many bombs, dropped by many planes is more humane than killing 1000s with one plane and one bomb.-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Dead is Dead and war is hell------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Are you deliberately switching the discussion from Japan to Germany to show that there's blood on everyones' hands.

There's no need.

We all understand that.

But it doesn't make something right because someone else committed a similar act beforehand.

Otherwise every murderer in the world will be set free.