Need info - any small aircraft pilots here?

[jomar]

On a single engine plane, what are the procedures a pilot goes through if the engine shuts down at say, 3000 feet altitude over a vast wilderness area with no clearings for landing. How would the pilot go about trying to restart the engine? (Assume praying has been checked off the list.) Thanks for any information.

 

[Guest]

Engine Failure in Flight

* Trim for Best Glide - 80 MPH
o Pick suitable landing site
o Fly toward landing site
* Carburetor Heat - on
* Mixture - rich
* Fuel Selector - on (both?)
* Magnetos - on/both
* If no restart or an off-airport landing becomes necessary, squawk 7700, announce location/aircraft/passengers on 121.5.Mix, Mags, Master, Fuel Selector - off
* Seats and Seatbelts - secure
* Sharp Objects - stow
* Doors - ajar, just before touchdown

from http://pilot-in-training.blogspot.com/2006/10/cessna-skyhawk-172-i-emergency.html

 

[gauchecritic]

This is pure speculation off the top of my head and may not even apply to modern prop shaft aeros.

The term 'feathering' comes to mind for some reason (maybe saw it in a film or something).

I imagine it's a similar practice to 'bumping' a motorbike (applies to cars too but without the jumping part) where you run along with the machine, clutch in, and at speed jump heavily onto the seat whilst engaging the clutch (in third). The physical act of bouncing the bike will start the action of the piston and hopefully then begin the stroke cycle.

As it applies to aeroplanes: go into enough dive to spin the props (presumably in neutral) and then engage the drive shaft to begin the stroke cycle of the engine.

This assumes that the engine is stalled and unable to start rather than some sort of mechanical/electrical failure.

Maths would know.

 

[jomar]

This is pure speculation off the top of my head and may not even apply to modern prop shaft aeros.

The term 'feathering' comes to mind for some reason (maybe saw it in a film or something).

I imagine it's a similar practice to 'bumping' a motorbike (applies to cars too but without the jumping part) where you run along with the machine, clutch in, and at speed jump heavily onto the seat whilst engaging the clutch (in third). The physical act of bouncing the bike will start the action of the piston and hopefully then begin the stroke cycle.

As it applies to aeroplanes: go into enough dive to spin the props (presumably in neutral) and then engage the drive shaft to begin the stroke cycle of the engine.

This assumes that the engine is stalled and unable to start rather than some sort of mechanical/electrical failure.

Maths would know.

Thanks Ted-E-Bare.

gauchecritic, this is exactly what I wrote in my story. I had the pilot use a strong updraft to scallop the plane higher then used the dive to do what you said. I thought I was making it up, but maybe we saw the same forgettable film.

Thanks guys.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

There is one step on the check list that Ted forgot...if the engine won't restart...

Bend over and kiss your ass good-bye.

 

[Guest]

There is one step on the check list that Ted forgot...if the engine won't restart...

Bend over and kiss your ass good-bye.

I know you're being funny, but actually, a little Cessna you can land on a postage stamp practically. IANAP (I am not a Pilot), but their touch down speed is probably about 50 mpg, and their can land in about 500 feet.

 

[Vermilion]

There is one step on the check list that Ted forgot...if the engine won't restart...

Bend over and kiss your ass good-bye.

Balls to that. If the engine goes you glide it to the ground.
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[TheeGoatPig]

I really wonder what happened to my kung fu instructor that caused his to crash his plane last year, killing him

 

[Zeb_Carter]

I know you're being funny, but actually, a little Cessna you can land on a postage stamp practically. IANAP (I am not a Pilot), but their touch down speed is probably about 50 mpg, and their can land in about 500 feet.

Actually, those little Cessna's almost fly themselves...and yes I was just trying to be funny.

You can probably land that little airplane in a lot less than 500 feet, if you are a good enough pilot. If you handle it right you might be able to touch down just as the plane stalls, there by negating the roll out. I've seen it done a few times at the airbase I was stationed at in Colorado Springs.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

Balls to that. If the engine goes you glide it to the ground.
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Depends on the plane and skill of the pilot and where you are, you can't land on trees, or jagged cliffs. You will need a flat, fairly smooth patch of ground.

 

[jomar]

Actually, those little Cessna's almost fly themselves...and yes I was just trying to be funny.

You can probably land that little airplane in a lot less than 500 feet, if you are a good enough pilot. If you handle it right you might be able to touch down just as the plane stalls, there by negating the roll out. I've seen it done a few times at the airbase I was stationed at in Colorado Springs.

Sorry about your instructor TGP.


The plane in my story is a 1967 DeHavilland Beaver, a workhorse used by bush pilots. The scene calls for an in air restart.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

Sorry about your instructor TGP.


The plane in my story is a 1967 DeHavilland Beaver, a workhorse used by bush pilots. The scene calls for an in air restart.

Does it have pontoons? If it does then you could always do a water landing if the engine doesn't restart.

 

[Guest]

Sorry about your instructor TGP.


The plane in my story is a 1967 DeHavilland Beaver, a workhorse used by bush pilots. The scene calls for an in air restart.

Harrison Ford bought one of those after flying one in the movie, "Six Days, Seven Nights"

 

[jomar]

Does it have pontoons? If it does then you could always do a water landing if the engine doesn't restart.

It does, and in fact it's on the way to a lake, but I want to have the excitement of a close call for the opener.

 

[jomar]

Harrison Ford bought one of those after flying one in the movie, "Six Days, Seven Nights"

That's cool. He's also a helicopter pilot. I love the name of the plane - Beaver. There's a lager version, the Otter, that I just learned pilots called it Twatter. Beaver, bush pilot, all that got me started naming the characters in my story after the naughty bits (Cooder, Woody, Tarse, Pekkar, etc). Silly fun.

 

[Guest]

That's cool. He's also a helicopter pilot.

Although in his interview "Inside the Actor's Workshop" he admitted to breaking his helicopter.

He is doing what I think I'd do if I had the income--take up flying as a way to learning something new and exacting.

The story Honey & I wrote together a couple years back, "Living Well is the Best Revenge" has the lead character doing something like that, but is just alluded to, not described in detail.

 

[jomar]

Although in his interview "Inside the Actor's Workshop" he admitted to breaking his helicopter.

He is doing what I think I'd do if I had the income--take up flying as a way to learning something new and exacting.

Me too. The Actor's Studio...someone should do a celebrity piece with that guy, could be funny.

Thanks for helping me out, folks. And a special thank you to V - for saying "balls to that" (I like that phrase) and for your lovely AV.

 

[Weird Harold]

This is pure speculation off the top of my head and may not even apply to modern prop shaft aeros.

The term 'feathering' comes to mind for some reason (maybe saw it in a film or something).
...
As it applies to aeroplanes: go into enough dive to spin the props (presumably in neutral) and then engage the drive shaft to begin the stroke cycle of the engine.

"Feathering" applies to variable pitch propellers and means to adjust them so that they do NOT "windmill" in the airstream -- it's exactly the opposite of what you would want to do if you're trying to do an airstart by using the prop to spin the motor.

one point about Ted's emergency checklist:

* Fuel Selector - on (both?)
* Magnetos - on/both

The notation "both" refers to the fact that many aircraft -- probably most aircraft -- have redundant systems. In normal operation, the switches would be set to "both" or "auto-select" so that if the primary system fails, the back-up system automaticaly takes over.

The "Magneto" switch is the Ignition Switch and selects the system to provide power to the spark plugs, A, B, Both, or OFF.

The Fuel selector selects which fuel tank to feed the engine from.

 

[jomar]

"Feathering" applies to variable pitch propellers and means to adjust them so that they do NOT "windmill" in the airstream -- it's exactly the opposite of what you would want to do if you're trying to do an airstart by using the prop to spin the motor.

one point about Ted's emergency checklist:


The notation "both" refers to the fact that many aircraft -- probably most aircraft -- have redundant systems. In normal operation, the switches would be set to "both" or "auto-select" so that if the primary system fails, the back-up system automaticaly takes over.

The "Magneto" switch is the Ignition Switch and selects the system to provide power to the spark plugs, A, B, Both, or OFF.

The Fuel selector selects which fuel tank to feed the engine from.

Thanks WeirdH. I looked up feathering and saw it was variable pitch props. My pilot didn't feather, but I guess had a fixed blade prop. I'm probably butchering piloting this plane, but as long as it's not impossible I can live with it. I also thought of having the engine stop and the pilot having to ad oil - apparently in the Beaver you could do that from the cockpit - cool plane.

 

[Weird Harold]

I also thought of having the engine stop and the pilot having to add oil - apparently in the Beaver you could do that from the cockpit - cool plane.

Unfortunately, if the pilot waits until the engine stops from lack of oil, it won't matter whether he can add more inflight. Engines that stop from a lack of oil seldom if ever start running again, even with the services of a fully equipped engine repair shop.

If wanted a dramatic, but not serious engine failure inflight, I'd use a fuel feed problem -- let one tank run dry and require some fiddling and switch toggling to get the fuel feed from the remaining tanks going and then air start the engine.

 

[Vermilion]

Me too. The Actor's Studio...someone should do a celebrity piece with that guy, could be funny.

Thanks for helping me out, folks. And a special thank you to V - for saying "balls to that" (I like that phrase) and for your lovely AV.

Hee hee thanks Jomar

Might change the AV sometime soon, so keep an eye out
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