Names you hate?

[zeb1094]

What is a name? A rose by any other name smells as sweet!

 

[JamesSD]

What is a name? A rose by any other name smells as sweet!

And I'd rather date a "Rose" than an "Ester"
(no offense to the Ester's of the world. To me it's an old lady name, and reminds me of chemistry)

 

[Colleen Thomas]

LOL! Come on, you know exactly what I mean. And it's not just feminine names. That dreamy, sensitive name for that dreamy sensitive male character some writers decide on isn't one that most little boys (or men) would want to have. Not if they don't want to get picked on at school.

After Frances Hodgeson Burnett (of "Secret Garden" Fame) wrote Little Lord Fauntleroy about an angelic little boy, Cedric, who calls his mother "Dearest" (hm...incest category anyone?) all these moms who loved the book wanted to name their baby boys "Cedric." And the Dads all went "No one is naming a son of mine 'Cedric!'"

Those Dads who didn't protest ended up with really unhappy sons.

You mentioned marion. It's rather interesting, of the two famous marions I can think of, one was John Wayne the other was Marion Motley, an absolutely bruising tailback for the cleveland browns in the 50's/60's. I'm not quite sure how that one became feminine.

I think some names carry certain connotations with them. The temptation is strong to aply them to a character that you know is going to fit that connotation. Francis, for the sensitve poet type of man for example. It's sometimes fun, to throw such a minker on a character with an diametrically oppsed personality. At other times, I think we select some of them subconciously in development of a story. I know my character abigail was Abigail, before the first word hit the screen. Her opposite developed over time and went through a couple of renames.

I will agree abou tusing similar names, it can get confusing to a reader. I've made the mistake before and I got an ear full. Even names that just start withthe same letter can be overly cumberson. T'larin and Tess, for example.

 

[zeb1094]

And I'd rather date a "Rose" than an "Ester"
(no offense to the Ester's of the world. To me it's an old lady name, and reminds me of chemistry)

Well Rose is also an 'old ladies name'. I know a lot of Rose's and Rose Mary's, all where hot in their day, a few still are. So, 'Don't Judge a Book by it's Cover!'

Oh, I had a good time in chemistry, had the hotest girl in school as a lab partner! Her name was Eileen.

 

[JamesSD]

Well Rose is also an 'old ladies name'. I know a lot of Rose's and Rose Mary's, all where hot in their day, a few still are. So, 'Don't Judge a Book by it's Cover!'

Oh, I had a good time in chemistry, had the hotest girl in school as a lab partner! Her name was Eileen.

I still do chemistry. So it reminds me of work.

And yeah, I realized Rose is a bit of an old lady name. But I know a Rose, and she's a busty sex-pot. So that balances it out, and also goes to show how our own experiences shape our opinions of names.

 

[JamesSD]

You mentioned marion. It's rather interesting, of the two famous marions I can think of, one was John Wayne the other was Marion Motley, an absolutely bruising tailback for the cleveland browns in the 50's/60's. I'm not quite sure how that one became feminine.

Marion sounds like Marian or Mary Anne.

Traditionally once a name becomes popular for girls, it becomes feminized. It's very hard for it to go back. Leslie is one example off the top of my head.

This is part of why there are fewer men's names overall. It's either "masculine" or "bad".

 

[Stella_Omega]

You mean what her mum would have named her? A valid point, I suppose. It just never made sense to me. I would think that mothers would look up actual African names, not politically correct ones. But I grasp what you mean, I think.

hey, I've had African American girlfriends named; Chiara, Tanika, Tangarine, Grace, and Gladys.
I've known men and boys named; Rico, Rammellzee, Africa Bombataa, Dwayne, Deisel, and Quanzikari (who is the son of Chiara, and my own godson, so watch what you say)
And I think that Moesha is in fact authentic North African. I know several Lebanese Moishe-es....


Aside from that, I seem to have an affinity for "A"s in my names; Tracy, Stella, Alegra (two in that one!) Jessamine, Charley....

I got into a lot of hot water for suggesting that "Ashlee" like trailor trash in a critique once. Evidently, there really was an Ashlee, who had passed away, and the writer loved and revered the name for his sake. Didn't make the work any more readable to me- but it does show the kind of thing that you might want to use as backstory for a character.
I like to think about the parents a little bit, when I name a character. What were their aspirations for baby Delphinium?

In my musings about Tracy's family (Now, there's an effeminate name for a guy, and he is in many ways, feminised) I came up with these names for his siblings, in order of birth;
Thomas, B. 1952
Laetitia (Teesha) B. 1953
Tamara B. 1959
Tracy B. 1960
Trina B. 1963
Tamika B. 1965

The idea being that the baby, Tamika, was named during the first flush of "back To Africa" naming movement.

I had some other thought but I can't remember what it was...

 

[Guest]

.....

 

[Colleen Thomas]

Mergatroid

heavens to

Exit, stage left!

 

[Rumple Foreskin]

For anyone writing a story set in the US, the US Census Bureau site is a blessing. First names, divided into male and female, are listed by their popularity for each decade. This is especially handy if a story has characters of different generations. "Rose" might not be a logical choice for a contemporary teenager but work fine for her grandmother.

Rumple Foreskin

 

[Guest]

heavens to

Exit, stage left!

Snagglepuss.

 

[Colleen Thomas]

Snagglepuss.

And Major major

 

[3113]

I will agree abou tusing similar names, it can get confusing to a reader. I've made the mistake before and I got an ear full. Even names that just start with the same letter can be overly cumberson. T'larin and Tess, for example.

To be fair, you can get away with two names starting with the same letter if you make sure that they're not on the same "level" reading-wise. So Joan and Jane: four bads here. Both start with "J", both have 4 letters, both have "an" and none of those letter dip down or rise above. Level names, as it were.

But if we change Jane to Jayne, then it's not so bad. Joan and Jayne. That one "y" does a lot. It gives Jayne 5 letters, breaks up the "an" and gives a dip-down "y" to the name making it look different than the level "Joan."

Your example of T'larin and Tess could be saved if we add another up/down letter to one of them. Like T'laryn or T'larhin. The eye going up and down helps separate it from Tess even more than the apostrophe + L.

Not, mind you, that I'd have those characters be together if it could be avoided. Sometimes you can't stop yourself from having two characters with a names that start with the same letter...but you can do your best to make sure they don't often end up in the same room with each other

 

[Colleen Thomas]

To be fair, you can get away with two names starting with the same letter if you make sure that they're not on the same "level" reading-wise. So Joan and Jane: four bads here. Both start with "J", both have 4 letters, both have "an" and none of those letter dip down or rise above. Level names, as it were.

But if we change Jane to Jayne, then it's not so bad. Joan and Jayne. That one "y" does a lot. It gives Jayne 5 letters, breaks up the "an" and gives a dip-down "y" to the name making it look different than the level "Joan."

Your example of T'larin and Tess could be saved if we add another up/down letter to one of them. Like T'laryn or T'larhin. The eye going up and down helps separate it from Tess even more than the apostrophe + L.

Not, mind you, that I'd have those characters be together if it could be avoided. Sometimes you can't stop yourself from having two characters with a names that start with the same letter...but you can do your best to make sure they don't often end up in the same room with each other

T'larin and Tess end up in bed together

 

[JamesSD]

But if we change Jane to Jayne, then it's not so bad. Joan and Jayne. That one "y" does a lot. It gives Jayne 5 letters, breaks up the "an" and gives a dip-down "y" to the name making it look different than the level "Joan."

Your example of T'larin and Tess could be saved if we add another up/down letter to one of them. Like T'laryn or T'larhin. The eye going up and down helps separate it from Tess even more than the apostrophe + L.

I respectfully disagree. Jane and Jayne are the same name to me. They're pronounced the same way, aren't they? While Jayne is a hair better, it's still very close to Joan.

Plus, I'm what I like to call a "lazy reader" when it comes to character names. I've read entire books and later discussed them with a friend, and became very confused by how they pronounced a character's name. Usually their way is way closer to how the name is spelled than I heard in my head.

I actually think T'larin and Tess are ok. I guess I really notice the e in Tess. Plus, one has an apostraphe, the other doesn't!

(If nothing else I've realized I don't really look at y's)

 

[zeb1094]

I still do chemistry. So it reminds me of work.

And yeah, I realized Rose is a bit of an old lady name. But I know a Rose, and she's a busty sex-pot. So that balances it out, and also goes to show how our own experiences shape our opinions of names.

That's true! I know that someone named Susan wouldn't be my cup of tea, nor would I use it in a story as a character name unless I was going for someone evil. (long story, don't ask!) Even though I know not all Susans are evil.

 

[Colleen Thomas]

I respectfully disagree. Jane and Jayne are the same name to me. They're pronounced the same way, aren't they? While Jayne is a hair better, it's still very close to Joan.

Plus, I'm what I like to call a "lazy reader" when it comes to character names. I've read entire books and later discussed them with a friend, and became very confused by how they pronounced a character's name. Usually their way is way closer to how the name is spelled than I heard in my head.

I actually think T'larin and Tess are ok. I guess I really notice the e in Tess. Plus, one has an apostraphe, the other doesn't!

(If nothing else I've realized I don't really look at y's)

I think it's all in how I hear those two in my head. t'larin sounds like TaLauren. The t is soft, almost just a stutter before Lauren. So i didn't notice any problems, but if you are pronouncing the T like tee, I can see where it would make a difference.

 

[3113]

I respectfully disagree. Jane and Jayne are the same name to me. They're pronounced the same way, aren't they? While Jayne is a hair better, it's still very close to Joan.....(If nothing else I've realized I don't really look at y's)

If you don't look at "y's" and you sound out the names, then, no, Jane to Jayne won't help at all. They are pronounced exactly the same.

Mind you, I'm not saying you should have a Jayne and Joan, just that if, for some reason, you had to, then spelling it with a "y" would save you, whereas without the "y" you're pretty much doomed. The reader is going to curse you for that lesbian sex scene between Joan and Jane, the one where there's no keeping straight who's doing what to whom.

This, of course, presupposes that the reader cares who's doing what to whom

 

[yui]

Amy Tan - "The Joy Luck Club": Chinese immigrant chooses the names for her sons - Matthew, Mark, Luke ...

... and Bing.

Sorry! Not really related, but been looking for a place to share this info. <cough>

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

I have a collection of Baby Name books, about 50.

They don't make naming my characters any easier because I have thousands of choices.

I still tend to use vanilla names or just simple identifiers 'mana', 'manb', 'womanc' in the early drafts until the characters have developed enough to give me a sense of which names might be appropriate and which would not be.

I try avoid any names that have associations with TV shows that are popular in the UK.

So many names have characteristics built in.

For example: what are your impressions of these names?

Male:
Augustus
Drew
Eugene
Marmaduke
Oscar
Ralph
Sidney

Female:
Abigail
Ayesha
Biddy
Christabel
Gladys
Lavender
Ursula

Which would you use for the handsome but stupid hero? Which would you use for the beautiful and talented heroine?

And Yes. I do have favourites from those lists for the roles.

Og

My slave uses a baby naming site or two for her characters. I just go by preference and impulse myself. Oddly enough, both approaches work fairly well.

 

[BlackShanglan]

And Major major

Corporal Snark?

(Now that is one of the all time great names.)

(Come to think of it, Heller's damned good with names. What else could Yossarian be but Yossarian?)

Shanglan

 

[Weird Harold]

Interesting thread. Some of these points have been made before, but were glossed over a bit.

1: IRL, growing up with a "bad" name shapes a person's personality. Any "John Smith" goes through life dealing with "yeah, right, what's your real name," and tends to either develop a sense of humor about it or get overly sensitive about it. Names spelled unconventionally tend to make people sensitive about people spelling their name wrong. For that reason, I tend to choose names that help to explain character traits I want the character to have.

2: Names are very context sensitive; the name has to be appropriate to the setting and time period. "Adolf" was very popular name prior to WWII, but it's very rare since then. No proper Victorian parents would name a daughter "Honeysuckle Valentine," but any number of 1960's hippies would.

3: Multiple characters with the same or similar names can cause confusion, but if you want to confuse the characters and/or the reader that can be a reason for giving characters the same or similar names. I once had three roommates named "Frank" and some of the situations that resulted from having three people with the same name in the same room are things that make good stories. (Especialy since Cheech and Chong's routine about "Dave's not here" was popular and easlily adapted to "Frank's not here")

Duplicate names aren't something to use in every story, but it's a useful plot device for either humor or pathos.

4: Names often carry certain preconceptions of personality. A wise author uses those preconceptions to facilitate characterizations -- especially of incidental characters. If I need a hulking bodyguard type, He's probably going to be named -- or at least called -- Bruno, Vito, Tiny, Tank, Lurch or something similar. "Biff and Buffy" are obviously social climbing airheads with more money than sense -- A useful derogatory label for other characters to use even if "Biff and Buffy" or "Barbie and Ken" have other names.

5: The real world is filled with thousands of names of all types and if your stories aren't, then you lose a bit of realism. It isn't necessary to fill your stories with strange names with strange spellings, but if you avoid them completely, you sacrifice a lot of oportunities for character and plot development. The names people have reveal a lot of things about them, their parents and their culture and with a well-chosen name, it takes much less to expand on those points to build exacty the character you want the readers to see.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Good thing I'm past my childbearing years, or "Honeysuckle Valentine" would be on my baby name list as of now!
For a boy- "Valentine Satori"

 

[BlackShanglan]

I have always loved the name Vittorio, as well as the short version of Vito. It's a name that converts wonderfully, I think; the full name has (to me) a strength and presence, dignity and grace at once, while the short version is laid-back, grinning, and unflappable.

As far as names shaping a personality goes - I have long loved Johnny Cash's "A Boy Named Sue."

Shanglan

 

[glynndah]

Anachronistic names drive me nuts. I don't think an 18th century serving wench would be named "Tiffany" (no matter how big her tits are!). I can't read the rest of the story without thinking about what else might not be "true".

As an aside: I remember hearing someplace that couples with alliterative or near alliterative names (Deanna and Dwayne, Clem and Glynnis) are more likely to stay together than "clashing" names.