Multiple POV

[Writer61]

I am currently working on a story that needs multiple POV, at least 3 and could be up to 6. At the moment, it is written in first person, but that could be changed.

My concern is balance. Some characters are getting more page time than others. Does that matter?

 

[BeechLeaf]

Definitely not. Is your goal artistry? (I hope so.) Different balances are different artistic choices. I immediately thought of different lengths of narration: one voice narrates for a long time, two more alternate, another chimes in for a short time. There is so much possibility of showing things with that technique. Balance is one artistic choice, imbalance another. As long as they are (more or less) clearly marked - and anything like this will baffle the Neanderthals, but you can't write for them.

 

[NotWise]

I'm toying with a similar problem but with only two points of view. I'm looking for a novel solution.

In your case with so many points of view, omniscient third person might be less confusing to readers than changing the point of view.

 

[Britva415]

My concern is balance. Some characters are getting more page time than others. Does that matter?

Do you want it to? You can make it matter or not matter.

 

[Britva415]

You know, honestly, the questions I would ask would be from the total other direction.

Does it matter if I don't switch to this POV at all?
Why does it matter if I do or if I don't?
Does it matter if I don't tell that POV in a different character's voice?
Why does it matter if I do or don't just use third-person perspective and grammatical person globally, instead of switching?

(Those last two are based upon what may be a mistaken assumption on my part. "POV" isn't the same as "grammatical person," nor is it necessarily the same as the identity of the particular narrator at any given point. But I'm taking a wild guess that you mean to write multiple POVs in multiple first-person perspectives, because if you didn't, then I don't expect "switching POVs" would be something you'd be conflicted over.)

Knowing and feeling convinced of the answers to those questions will have the nice side effect of erasing any doubt about your original question.

 

[Writer61]

You know, honestly, the questions I would ask would be from the total other direction.

Does it matter if I don't switch to this POV at all?
Why does it matter if I do or if I don't?
Does it matter if I don't tell that POV in a different character's voice?
Why does it matter if I do or don't just use third-person perspective and voice globally, instead of switching?

(That last one is based upon what may be a mistaken assumption on my part. "POV" isn't the same as "grammatical voice," nor is it necessarily the same as the identity of the particular narrator at any given point. But I'm taking a wild guess that you mean to write multiple POVs in multiple first-person perspectives, because if you weren't, then I don't expect "switching POVs" would be something you'd be conflicted over.)

Fair questions which I will think about. The story (involving three couples) feels as if it should be told in a very personal way. Focusing on one of each pair might work, but creates some sequencing problems.

 

[AlinaX]

I think it’s fairly normal to have two or three main characters who carry most of the POV and then dip into others as the story demands.

 

[Britva415]

The story (involving three couples) feels as if it should be told in a very personal way.

I think you mean three to six very personal ways.

 

[BobbyBrandt]

Characters can have a presence without a POV.

Consider when the story is being told from character A's perspective. Are they alone, or are there other characters with them that will have their own perspective at some point? Figure out if the presence of a character is equal, not just their perspective.

 

[BeechLeaf]

It would be more difficult in first person. The example I am thinking of, where I thought it worked perfectly, is in sub_marine's series The Stooges. At some point the narrators switched and told the readers so: something like 'Hi, it's Connie here, I'll be doing the narration now.' If you don't want that sort of overt sop to the reader, you'd need a scene break and something introductory. Like 'I am Irene. I am watching my husband, I have been wondering what he is thinking.' (Crude and exaggerated: it would have to be subtle, but it could be done.)

 

[SimonDoom]

I wouldn't do it in first person. This would work better in alternating limited third person. Alternating first person is tricky; it can work when you have limited POV characters. But with 6 or so you're better off switching to third person. It's going to be jarring and weird to keep switching back and forth to completely different people telling the story by using the "I" pronoun.

 

[Britva415]

Just gonna say it -

You didn't address my presumption of first-person narration, my presumption of a collection of three to six separate first-person narrations, so, that makes me presume that my presumption was right.

But I'm just gonna say: Needing to tell the subjective experiences of three to six separate POVs really screams for having an omniscient narrator tell it in third person. Unless the third-person narrator is an actual character inside the story universe, then they're omniscient. Even if they're telling the story extremely closely, they're still omniscient. And the omniscience is what lets them (A) know the various characters' subjective experiences, and (B) switch among telling different POVs, even if each of the POVs is told in a very close fashion.

But if you want first-person because you really feel like that's how to tell a story in a "very personal" way, that tells me that what you need is to pick one character's story and have them tell it from their POV.

 

[Writer61]

Thanks, all. I feel a major rewrite coming ...

 

[WittyUserName]

I am currently working on a story that needs multiple POV, at least 3 and could be up to 6. At the moment, it is written in first person, but that could be changed.

My concern is balance. Some characters are getting more page time than others. Does that matter?

I don't think so. Each POV should serve an important purpose. I do a lot of POV changes. I've had some POV's last a few pages, then one is only a few paragraphs. Resist the temptation to put in a bunch of pointless fluff to extend a POV. Just make sure the POV has a purpose and that you address that purpose. You'll be fine.

 

[NotWise]

Fair questions which I will think about. The story (involving three couples) feels as if it should be told in a very personal way. Focusing on one of each pair might work, but creates some sequencing problems.

My WIP follows three couples. It's in limited 3rd person mostly from the POV of a man in one of the couples, and much of the story is about a woman in one of the other couples. A lot of information is exchanged in dialog.

 

[Britva415]

It would be more difficult in first person. The example I am thinking of, where I thought it worked perfectly, is in sub_marine's series The Stooges. At some point the narrators switched and told the readers so: something like 'Hi, it's Connie here, I'll be doing the narration now.' If you don't want that sort of overt sop to the reader, you'd need a scene break and something introductory. Like 'I am Irene. I am watching my husband, I have been wondering what he is thinking.' (Crude and exaggerated: it would have to be subtle, but it could be done.)

Well, it can be done in "meta" ways too, like section-breaks using the character's name instead of a content-less typographical section break indicator. This way, none of the actual in-character-voiced storytelling would have to self-consciously say "pay no attention to the previous narrator, you've got me now," not even at a really successful level of subtlety.

Nevertheless - I agree that it would be more difficult in first person, because that would require one of the following:

Something else in the narration makes clear who's now narrating, without the narrator self-consciously clueing the reader. Maybe all they have to do is narrate hearing someone address them by their name. Or they start their section by stating something which lets the reader know they're in a different setting now, one which they know this character was in last time they were narrating. Or other things along these lines, where it's really the author, not the narrator, providing the narrative clue of the POV change to the reader.
or
All of the various narrators manage to fit into an overall story arc which each of them have awareness of, and of how their own section fits into it.
or
The out-of-universe author (really, an omniscient third person) has to make an overall story arc work with pieces told by characters who aren't aware of it. This can be done, but places a different level of demand for both subtlety and imagination upon the author.
or
There just isn't any "superstory" at all, and the entire piece instead only purports to be a collection of different people's tellings of their own experience of the events. To me, this requires an in-universe justification for how their separate stories came to be recorded and compiled into a single manuscript and what the reader's position is, in such a universe, such that they have access to this collection.

That last one is something a lot of 1p authors push back on. And I usually concede "okay, that's fair, maybe you don't need it," but in this scenario, I as a reader would really have a hard time getting past the lack of justification for the contrivance.

 

[anthrodisiac]

Good criteria for whether to include a POV:
1. Does it serve the story? (Why am I including this POV?)
2. Does it offer the reader some new insight into the story? (What new facet of the story is the reader gleaning from this POV?)
3. Is the purpose solely to get information to the reader? (If so, see if there's another way to get that info without a new POV.)
4. How much time is going to be spent in that POV? (The less time, the less I'm inclined to include it.)
5. How distinct are the voices? (Especially in first-person POV, if all the characters sound the same, then it defeats one of the majors draws of having first-person, which is to provide a unique voice to the story.)
6. How many POVs do I have already? (The more POVs, the more headhopping, the more the reader is being yanked around, the greater the case to switch to omniscient.)

Six first-person POVs sounds like a nightmare. You need distinct voices for each one, or they all blend together, the use of "I" makes it harder to track without doing something like character headers to specify whose head we're in. Third-person is probably better, but even then, six people is a lot. What might be better is three POVs, and you have close third with each couple. At that point, you don't need to worry about distinct voice (third-person narrator tone can be what it is), you're sticking close to a pair of people who know each other pretty well, so you have discrete sections, and you can provide new insights to the reader for each pairing.

Now, the question is, how important is each of those insights and facets? Is this a story about couples experiencing something together? About how each of them are interpreting events? That would strengthen the case for multiple POVs over an omniscient narrator. Another question: when are those POV changes happening? If it's literally in the middle of the action, you need to be careful that it doesn't interrupt flow.

I'd probably sit and give a real good think about which POVs are TRULY necessary to tell this story the way you want it. It might seem like more POVs is better, but in reality, anything more than three, epecially if it isn't a novel, is going to mean readers don't get to sit with characters and really get a feel for them from the inside, harder to connect if you're constantly switching POVs. Not impossible, mind you, and nothing I've said is a hard rule, more guidelines for how to approach and think about POV, but POVs are the lens through which the story is experienced, and so this deserves fair consideration for how important, whose to include, which styles, and when to switch.

 

[BeechLeaf]

It would certainly be hard to do it without tricks. But Writer61's initial idea felt inspiring: it's a technical challenge I would love to do. There would probably need to be an overt scene break, but I wouldn't begin the new narrator with an overt identification as I did in my comment above. Something about it must say "I am a new/different person". So the first narrator describes a scene, which includes another person, and details. The second narrator provides a different perspective on that, making clear that they were the other person seen, and re-narrates it in another way. Thus you establish your artistic trick, so that the reader clearly sees you have moved from one to another. Then it will become easier to do it for more perspectives.

 

[BeechLeaf]

I don't think this is a trick or an appeal to readers, just a tiny bit of tagging, and if well done it's enough to set it up:

I like that, thought Isabel. I wish I knew him better,

 

[Britva415]

It would certainly be hard to do it without tricks. But Writer61's initial idea felt inspiring: it's a technical challenge I would love to do. There would probably need to be an overt scene break, but I wouldn't begin the new narrator with an overt identification as I did in my comment above. Something about it must say "I am a new/different person". So the first narrator describes a scene, which includes another person, and details. The second narrator provides a different perspective on that, making clear that they were the other person seen, and re-narrates it in another way. Thus you establish your artistic trick, so that the reader clearly sees you have moved from one to another. Then it will become easier to do it for more perspectives.

I think it's 100% about how much the audience can see the puppet strings, and how much they react to it.

The better the story is, the less they're going to care or react to seeing the strings.

The better the writing is, the less they're going to see the strings at all.

They can never be hidden 100%. So, both story and the writing are levers the author can pull.

 

[anthrodisiac]

If you're going to do six 1P POVs, best practice would simply be to mark each section (that way you don't have to go into convoluded techniques about trying to clarify whose POV we're in each time, you just tell the reader, then tell the story):

John
I saw my wife...
<rest of POV>

*****
Martha
I saw my husband...
<rest of POV>

*****
Tim
I saw God...
<rest of POV>

*****
God
I saw everything...
<rest of POV>

 

[Stanfield2025]

I did a series with 3 POVs, though the main character's POV takes up 90% of the story. The other two POVs show up only a little bit. Probably not the proper way to do things, but eh.

 

[Britva415]

Probably not the proper way to do things, but

"Proper" my ass. If it was what the story called for, then you might as well say it wasn't a proper story to tell!

 

[Writer61]

It would certainly be hard to do it without tricks. But Writer61's initial idea felt inspiring: it's a technical challenge I would love to do. There would probably need to be an overt scene break, but I wouldn't begin the new narrator with an overt identification as I did in my comment above. Something about it must say "I am a new/different person". So the first narrator describes a scene, which includes another person, and details. The second narrator provides a different perspective on that, making clear that they were the other person seen, and re-narrates it in another way. Thus you establish your artistic trick, so that the reader clearly sees you have moved from one to another. Then it will become easier to do it for more perspectives.

My initial idea was to use each character's name as a title (in bold) at the start of each section, but I am not sure that it works.

 

[Britva415]

I am not sure that it works

Why do you say that? Are you talking about how it's working in your story specifically, or, have you never seen a story that does that, or, have you seen them and feel like it doesn't work?

I'm just asking because there are many stories that do this, and if the story isn't working, it probably isn't because of how the section breaks are labeled.

Though, it might be because of having too many 1p narrators