Loving Broken People

[Wild_Honey_66]

Friends, family, lovers, others.

*How do you set boundaries with people who seem hell-bent on self-destruction?
*What's the difference between supporting and enabling?
*How do you know where to draw the line?
*At what point do you stop reaching out?

Recommendations for helpful resources welcome.

 

[EdwardsOtherSide]

Yikes.
I may not be the best person to ask, as I have a track record of "over sacrificing".
(Which makes this a good thread for me to follow)

Probably the single biggest thing for me (for points 2,3, & 4) is "any gaslighting is a red flag" (and no, red flags are not "festive"). The runner-up red flag is any attempt to cut you off from family & friends.

For point one; if there comes a point where "I can't stop you, so is your life insurance paid up?" becomes a thought, you are past the redline.

All hard learned lessons, and I still have a ways to go on this journey.

 

[jaF0]

I'm as broke as they come. Essentially dysfunctional.


Ain't no fixin' it.

 

[twister947]

Don't let a drowning swimmer take you down with them.

 

[IrisAlthea]

Friends, family, lovers, others.

*How do you set boundaries with people who seem hell-bent on self-destruction?
*What's the difference between supporting and enabling?
*How do you know where to draw the line?
*At what point do you stop reaching out?

Recommendations for helpful resources welcome.

Not overly fond of the concept of broken for people, but I get the kind of situation you mean.

First of all, what twister said.
Use boundaries to protect your own sanity, health, relationships, financial situation, those who are your responsibility or whatever may be at risk.
One boundary that is important to me, is that I refuse to be the only one who knows/helps, when the problem is above my paygrade.

Support means helping someone getting out of trouble. Enabling is helping them handle the fallout, so they can keep their problem.

The line is hard to draw. It depends on so many factors. For me, it has been about the boundaries mentioned above. When I can’t keep them up, I need to step back. Sometimes it has been temporary and other times it has been a point of no return thing.

I hope you can figure things out and take care.

 

[Goldenfinger]

Those are very good questions. I believe there are different degrees of broken. I’m broken.

 

[jaF0]

^^^ I'm so broke I break others. I've learned I have to stay far, far away.

 

[wicked woman]

There have been some good points made. A few that I've used successfully are:

It's not my job to 'fix' someone. It's theirs.

I think Al Anon gives a good perspective on this. A lot of things aren't in our control. We need to learn to distinguish what is and what isn't and to protect ourselves, when/where needed.

Put another way, I had a friend who, for good reasons, had difficulty believing in himself. I found myself telling him that 'he was worthy'. I believed it, so told him when I saw him showing his worth. There wasn't method in my madness, it was just how I felt. I wasn't trying to fix him, build him up. He was the one to do the internal work on himself so he could finally feel that way about himself. Years later, he commented on my saying 'he was worthy'...that he didn't believe it then, but he did now.


I'm only prepared to help someone who's helping themselves.

I learned this from my parents. They were very generous, supportive people as long as the person was working to help themselves/improve their situation, but if someone started acting like it was my parents' job to look after/support them, the help/support got cut off...even if it was an immediate family member (adult).


The line is drawn at my nose.

There are very few people choosing to self destruct that I will pay the emotional toll that it would take on me, to support them. Call me cruel or heartless if you want, but I've learned that it's self preservation. Many years ago, I volunteered at a local sexual assault crisis centre. Part of our job was to be on call for 12 hour shifts for the hot line, where people who had been sexually assaulted could call and accompanying them to the hospital and/or court, if needed. I wished that the job wasn't needed but was happy that I could help. Over time, I had to stop taking the 12 hour shifts because the emotional toll on me was just too large for me to take for a stranger.

By the way, not meaning to suggest that people who are sexually assaulted are self destructive. It's an example of where the line is drawn.


I'm hoping this is a hypothetical question but if it's not, sending virtual hugs.

 

[twister947]

I am an enabler; it is a decision I consciously reached after weighing the pluses and minuses.

 

[KatieDoes]

I think it depends on the relationship, the history, and the causes.

Ex: There’s a huge difference between what I would tolerate from a family member with childhood trauma, or a friend/lover that I met as an adult and didn’t have that history with.


It’s a tough balance, but it’s possible to love broken people while still keeping boundaries and loving yourself first.


I think the best possible resource is an unbiased professional therapist. I’m sure there are books and groups and helpful advice givers. But someone detached from the situation offers a perspective that can’t be seen from inside it.

 

[sally_sparrow]

There have been some good points made. A few that I've used successfully are:

It's not my job to 'fix' someone. It's theirs.

I think Al Anon gives a good perspective on this. A lot of things aren't in our control. We need to learn to distinguish what is and what isn't and to protect ourselves, when/where needed.

Put another way, I had a friend who, for good reasons, had difficulty believing in himself. I found myself telling him that 'he was worthy'. I believed it, so told him when I saw him showing his worth. There wasn't method in my madness, it was just how I felt. I wasn't trying to fix him, build him up. He was the one to do the internal work on himself so he could finally feel that way about himself. Years later, he commented on my saying 'he was worthy'...that he didn't believe it then, but he did now.


I'm only prepared to help someone who's helping themselves.

I learned this from my parents. They were very generous, supportive people as long as the person was working to help themselves/improve their situation, but if someone started acting like it was my parents' job to look after/support them, the help/support got cut off...even if it was an immediate family member (adult).


The line is drawn at my nose.

There are very few people choosing to self destruct that I will pay the emotional toll that it would take on me, to support them. Call me cruel or heartless if you want, but I've learned that it's self preservation. Many years ago, I volunteered at a local sexual assault crisis centre. Part of our job was to be on call for 12 hour shifts for the hot line, where people who had been sexually assaulted could call and accompanying them to the hospital and/or court, if needed. I wished that the job wasn't needed but was happy that I could help. Over time, I had to stop taking the 12 hour shifts because the emotional toll on me was just too large for me to take for a stranger.

By the way, not meaning to suggest that people who are sexually assaulted are self destructive. It's an example of where the line is drawn.


I'm hoping this is a hypothetical question but if it's not, sending virtual hugs.

Many good points here and the reference to Al Anon hits home. We cannot fix people, they must fix themselves.

Offering empathy and being a doormat is not the same. Setting boundaries with certain people in my life has saved my sanity. I've learned to be supportive when someone needs me to listen, and I will hear them, but I will not enable their behavior if they have self-destructive patterns. I will offer solutions if they ask, but mostly I will just listen and be present, offering a safe space to vent and heal.

I have a friend that used to be a working partner who I had to distance myself from because she was inserting herself into every facet of my life. It tainted our friendship, left me stressed out all the time, and resentful. She's one of those people that leave you feeling drained without ever getting a word into a conversation because they don't stop talking, and it's nothing but anger and aggression.

You can still love people and not be present in their day-to-day. I love this person immensely but I know if I allow her to be more present it would spiral into chaos again. She never respected my boundaries in the past because I was never firm with them. We have a better understanding of where we are as friends and she has respected the space I need.

Communication is so important.

 

[jaF0]

they must fix themselves.

Ya' still ain't a gittin' it.


Thay ain't no fixin' us.



We're long past done for. Ain't nuthin' coming but the Exit door.

 

[sally_sparrow]

Ya' still ain't a gittin' it.


Thay ain't no fixin' us.



We're long past done for. Ain't nuthin' coming but the Exit door.

I get it. I didn't offer to fix anyone. The question was how to love someone. That is how I love broken people in my life.

 

[IrisAlthea]

Ya' still ain't a gittin' it.


Thay ain't no fixin' us.



We're long past done for. Ain't nuthin' coming but the Exit door.

We’re all walking towards the exit. It’s about what we do on our way there.

 

[TarnishedPenny]

An exceptionally good, exceptionally difficult series of questions.

I’m going to think on this, but for now, most places have a suicide hotline. While you’re not talking quite the same thing, the hotline should be able to advise you where in your area you can find a professional with whom to discuss this.

I hope it works out for you.

 

[Bramblethorn]

I'm late and most of the good answers have already been taken, so I'll try not to repeat the excellent wisdom that's already been provided.

This is one of those things that's tough to give advice on because things mostly come down to "make some effort, but not too much" and in the abstract it's hard to describe just where "too much" lies.

One trick that is sometimes useful for me is to externalise things. Illustration:

Recently I've been thinking about leaving my current workplace - it's a good place in a lot of ways, but I'm not seeing a lot of opportunity for growth here, or not in the directions I want. I felt kind of guilty about that, because I love my colleagues here and if I leave it's going to make some difficulties for them.

Then I remembered that one of my colleagues left recently, for pretty much the same reasons, and I didn't resent her leaving at all! I was glad that she'd found something good, and I knew that even though she was valuable to us, we'd figure something out - and that maybe her leaving might encourage management to think about fixing some of the reasons she left.

And then I asked myself: why should I be tougher on myself about this than I am on her? If I'm not going to think any less of her for leaving, why should I feel guilty about it when it's me?

So it might be helpful to ask "if it wasn't me facing this question, if it was a friend and they came to me for advice, what would I say to them?" and then apply the answer to yourself.

Also, Captain Awkward is fantastic with advice on boundary-setting, I cannot recommend her highly enough: https://captainawkward.com/

 

[HazeyDaze]

^^^ I'm so broke I break others. I've learned I have to stay far, far away.

Same here. I love you

 

[Ssbbw4u1974]

I was with my husband 25 years. He died almost 7 months ago. Mind you, we separated 12 years ago, and we're best friends and co-parented well, but we just were no longer in love.
I was broken before that.
I'm even more damaged now.
It's always been hard to love me, because I have personality disorders.

 

[LourdMorpheus]

Broken

I since this seems to be a safe place for a bit of self revelation…….

I’m so fractured and fucked up only the beauty of a woman is able to quell
The silent tears of my soul.

 

[Wild_Honey_66]

Thank you, everyone, for your input.

I'm currently occupied elsewhere, but I will be back here to continue the conversation when I'm able.

 

[jaF0]

^^^ Pretty much that.

Plus a lot more.