London calls in the Army...

[Brunne]

...to fill seats?!

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2012/jul/29/olympics-empty-seats-locog-army

And we thought the swarm of Mary Poppinses coming to defeat the 600ft Voldemort was going to be the weirdest thing about this Olympics.

 

[amicus]

The Olympics are possibly a thing of the past. When they took out women's softball, I said, okay, not watching anything til you put it back.

Four years from now, in Rio, I think, soccer riots are a sure bet.

ami

 

[bashfullyshameless]

Well, to be fair, a lot of matches simply won't have a whole lot of attention. I'm not surprised that nobody's interested in watching games for silver and bronze in basketball... or, for that matter, watching the US just mug all the other teams.

It was cool in '92 or whenever when we wanted to tell the world, "Hey, this is our sport, just so you know," with a resounding slap to the face... but since then it has just gotten kind of obnoxious of us. I think we've made our point.

 

[Noor]

I heard that corporations bought up seats but never dispersed the tickets. Other people were waiting in line for tickets to those events and couldn't get them.

 

[gentledemands]

Here's a thought. Why don't we make it so that amateurs get to play rather than pro's who have been re-classified as amateurs. Then maybe reduce the price of the tickets?

 

[Brunne]

Well, to be fair, a lot of matches simply won't have a whole lot of attention. I'm not surprised that nobody's interested in watching games for silver and bronze in basketball... or, for that matter, watching the US just mug all the other teams..

True, but when have you ever seen a Serena Williams not play to a packed stadium?

 

[Verdad]

And we thought the swarm of Mary Poppinses coming to defeat the 600ft Voldemort was going to be the weirdest thing about this Olympics.

That was brilliant, I thought. Especially because the idea must have been taken from Alan Moore’s League of Extraordinary Gentlemen.

In the latest volume of this comic book populated with characters from fiction and pop culture, Harry Potter (that is, someone who’s very obviously him even if he’s not called that) appears as the mega villain, growing so huge as to threaten to bring the apocalypse to the comic book’s world. (Clearly a comment on ‘franchising’ of everything in pop culture.) The catastrophe is diverted and the monster Potter defeated only by Mary Poppins, who does away with him while calling him ‘a nasty little boy.’

It was really cool how the opening ceremony honored JKR at the same time as it nodded at this scathing commentary by Moore. A lot of it worked like that, always on more than one level, earnest and ironic at the same time. Great fun. I didn’t expect to enjoy it as much as I did.

 

[ishtat]

The Olympics are possibly a thing of the past. When they took out women's softball, I said, okay, not watching anything til you put it back.

Four years from now, in Rio, I think, soccer riots are a sure bet.

ami

Betcha watch the Women's Beach Volleyball Ami, - and the Swedish womens Soccer team.

 

[ishtat]

Well, to be fair, a lot of matches simply won't have a whole lot of attention. I'm not surprised that nobody's interested in watching games for silver and bronze in basketball... or, for that matter, watching the US just mug all the other teams.

It was cool in '92 or whenever when we wanted to tell the world, "Hey, this is our sport, just so you know," with a resounding slap to the face... but since then it has just gotten kind of obnoxious of us. I think we've made our point.

Don't be too hasty, the way the Chinese are now winning almost everything, the US might be grateful for the basketball medals in a few years time.

 

[topace]

I really don't care about the Olympics.

 

[Recidiva]

That was brilliant, I thought. Especially because the idea must have been taken from Alan Moore’s League of Extraordinary Gentlemen.

In the latest volume of this comic book populated with characters from fiction and pop culture, Harry Potter (that is, someone who’s very obviously him even if he’s not called that) appears as the mega villain, growing so huge as to threaten to bring the apocalypse to the comic book’s world. (Clearly a comment on ‘franchising’ of everything in pop culture.) The catastrophe is diverted and the monster Potter defeated only by Mary Poppins, who does away with him while calling him ‘a nasty little boy.’

It was really cool how the opening ceremony honored JKR at the same time as it nodded at this scathing commentary by Moore. A lot of it worked like that, always on more than one level, earnest and ironic at the same time. Great fun. I didn’t expect to enjoy it as much as I did.

Verdad, I love you but...

Don't you think this is a little too much subtext for an international audience who just see a really bad Voldemort?

 

[Verdad]

Verdad, I love you but...

Don't you think this is a little too much subtext for an international audience who just see a really bad Voldemort?

Hey, great to see you!

Well, I've heard an occasional complaint about 'obscure references', but I can't say I agree.

Okay, so the Alan Moore thing may qualify (and if it got any obscurer than that, it went right over my head, so I was good in any case!), but overall I thought Boyle struck an admirable balance in creating a spectacle that has to be executed in a very particular medium (a live stage act of Gargantuan proportions) and has to address every kind of audience, young and old, cultured and less so, domestic and abroad.

That kind of thing is practically guaranteed to come under criticism from both sides—either for stooping to mere platitudes or for providing amusement only to those who are in on the jokes—but I felt he sailed smoothly in between and forged a narrative that was entertaining and even meditative at times, but always accessible, at least in broad strokes, to every kind of audience. If somewhere in that huge collage there’d been, I dunno, a visual reference to a painter I've never heard of, I can live with that and I'm happy for those who got to appreciate it.

Truth be told, though, I did expect someone to comment unfavorably, though not so much on the artistic side as on the political. The prominent place given to the celebration of socialized medicine immediately made me go, “I wonder what Ami's thinking right now!”

It is a kind of an interesting question whether Boyle depicted the UK/the modern world as it is or as we'd like to believe it is, but the lovely thing was, I thought it an intelligent and self-aware presentation that allows you to pick either answer, or none.

Apologies to anyone who's here to talk about the actual games—I'm afraid I'm not watching any competitions because earlier this summer I got hooked on Euro 2012, and there's only so much sports I can take in a year.

 

[Recidiva]

Hey, great to see you!

Well, I've heard an occasional complaint about 'obscure references', but I can't say I agree.

Okay, so the Alan Moore thing may qualify (and if it got any obscurer than that, it went right over my head, so I was good in any case!), but overall I thought Boyle struck an admirable balance in creating a spectacle that has to be executed in a very particular medium (a live stage act of Gargantuan proportions) and has to address every kind of audience, young and old, cultured and less so, domestic and abroad.

That kind of thing is practically guaranteed to come under criticism from both sides—either for stooping to mere platitudes or for providing amusement only to those who are in on the jokes—but I felt he sailed smoothly in between and forged a narrative that was entertaining and even meditative at times, but always accessible, at least in broad strokes, to every kind of audience. If somewhere in that huge collage there’d been, I dunno, a visual reference to a painter I've never heard of, I can live with that and I'm happy for those who got to appreciate it.

Truth be told, though, I did expect someone to comment unfavorably, though not so much on the artistic side as on the political. The prominent place given to the celebration of socialized medicine immediately made me go, “I wonder what Ami's thinking right now!”

It is a kind of an interesting question whether Boyle depicted the UK/the modern world as it is or as we'd like to believe it is, but the lovely thing was, I thought it an intelligent and self-aware presentation that allows you to pick either answer, or none.

Apologies to anyone who's here to talk about the actual games—I'm afraid I'm not watching any competitions because earlier this summer I got hooked on Euro 2012, and there's only so much sports I can take in a year.

Good to see you too!

I was actually kind of appalled by the ceremonies. I can't really fathom the inclusion of Mr. Bean and any of the subtext I might have enjoyed understanding was left out in favor of having the queen jump in from a helicopter.

I found it distracting and distasteful and didn't really understand why the interesting things like the connection of GOSH to Barrie wasn't explained in a movie to outside audiences. Everything else silly got movies. The message to the rest of the world was - if you don't get it, you're ignorant, fuck off. It might have been wonderful for GB citizens who were already in on it, but it's a bit like overhearing a conversation between friends who have no interest in including you and seem to have purposely lowered their voices until you go away.

I would have liked to be in on it. I was absolutely excluded. I've never experienced that in a games, where I feel like I'm being included in understanding a culture. This was exclusive and somehow more cynical and judgmental politically than any other ceremonies. I felt the best thing to do was avert my eyes (press pause) and go to bed.

I'm not that cynical about the world. I don't get dancing in neon and house on fire as any sort of social commentary other than exploitative of exactly what they appear to be criticizing?

How do you criticize MTV by obviously being MTV? It was weird.

Anyway, outside audience criticism with the understanding that it might have been wonderful for GB audiences. All I saw was the trappings of branded corporate logos and movies, and fully embracing them and selling them, not commenting on them.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

The whole shebang comes off as a clustrefuck and further evidence that the Limeys gave the Queen their national balls to store in her jewel collection.

 

[Verdad]

Good to see you too!

I was actually kind of appalled by the ceremonies. I can't really fathom the inclusion of Mr. Bean and any of the subtext I might have enjoyed understanding was left out in favor of having the queen jump in from a helicopter.

I found it distracting and distasteful and didn't really understand why the interesting things like the connection of GOSH to Barrie wasn't explained in a movie to outside audiences. Everything else silly got movies. The message to the rest of the world was - if you don't get it, you're ignorant, fuck off. It might have been wonderful for GB citizens who were already in on it, but it's a bit like overhearing a conversation between friends who have no interest in including you and seem to have purposely lowered their voices until you go away.

I would have liked to be in on it. I was absolutely excluded. I've never experienced that in a games, where I feel like I'm being included in understanding a culture. This was exclusive and somehow more cynical and judgmental politically than any other ceremonies. I felt the best thing to do was avert my eyes (press pause) and go to bed.

I'm not that cynical about the world. I don't get dancing in neon and house on fire as any sort of social commentary other than exploitative of exactly what they appear to be criticizing?

How do you criticize MTV by obviously being MTV? It was weird.

Anyway, outside audience criticism with the understanding that it might have been wonderful for GB audiences. All I saw was the trappings of branded corporate logos and movies, and fully embracing them and selling them, not commenting on them.

Weird, I really perceived it completely differently. I don’t think I’m overly cynical, but sometimes I think laugh at things even as you keep doing them is all you can do.

I think I see the horror you saw if you took the whole thing as played dead straight, and I don’t know if I can ‘prove’ to you it wasn’t. Perhaps I was just more willing to amuse myself and see it as drifting in and out of self-spoofing. But, I mean, take that very Mr. Bean and the fact that his act takes the star role, with the orchestra and the conductor and the whole sports pathos of Chariots of Fire reduced, in a figure/background reversal, to mere supporting noise. Isn’t there a built-in, self-evident joke in the decision to stage it like that, kind of like in those “no comment” cartoons?

I can also see how you can perfectly get that and still accuse it of sitting in both chairs, but given the venue, I wonder how else it could have been. If you feel like it, I’d be curious to hear what you expected or what would have pleased you.

 

[mynameisben]

I like watching the women's swim competitions, especially when the reporters interview the winners while they are still all panting and out of breath. You can see their nipples through the wet, clingy fabric of their ingeniously engineered swimsuits. The women all have names and stuff, and they come from different nations. It's rather educational when you think about it.

 

[Recidiva]

Weird, I really perceived it completely differently. I don’t think I’m overly cynical, but sometimes I think laugh at things even as you keep doing them is all you can do.

I think I see the horror you saw if you took the whole thing as played dead straight, and I don’t know if I can ‘prove’ to you it wasn’t. Perhaps I was just more willing to amuse myself and see it as drifting in and out of self-spoofing. But, I mean, take that very Mr. Bean and the fact that his act takes the star role, with the orchestra and the conductor and the whole sports pathos of Chariots of Fire reduced, in a figure/background reversal, to mere supporting noise. Isn’t there a built-in, self-evident joke in the decision to stage it like that, kind of like in those “no comment” cartoons?

I can also see how you can perfectly get that and still accuse it of sitting in both chairs, but given the venue, I wonder how else it could have been. If you feel like it, I’d be curious to hear what you expected or what would have pleased you.

No, I know it wasn't dead straight, and it was obviously poking fun at itself. I think the Olympics deserve better and you'd be better off giving all the money for the opening ceremony to charity if you're just going to dick around with it and waste people's time.

If the US had done something where the Three Stooges were making fun of "Citizen Kane" I'd be appalled as well. Yes, some Americans might think it's funny, but is it really...appropriate?

Mr. Bean and The Three Stooges are equally lowbrow and beloved (to some), but completely distasteful to others as being slapstick brainless. Chariots of Fire and Citizen Kane are classics that shouldn't really be subjected to the juxtaposition. I'd go see Chariots of Fire, I'd go see Citizen Kane. I'd avoid Mr. Bean and The Three Stooges. I'd even avoid 007.

Compare it to elements of Athens or elements of Beijing. It wasn't complicated inside-jokes that were bewildering to others. It was an expression of culture in a visual medium done with respect (not lacking humor) but not demeaning, either.

It's an insider's language without translation. Funny between friends, perhaps, but a dismal representation of genuine culture or respect.

It's a visual medium. Instead of being a piece of art that is self evident and self expressive, it turned into a cartoon that requires some cynical inside story hipster to explain it to everyone. And even after the explanation, I just think it's bad art. Art that has to be explained by an outsider is incomplete and needs more elegant expression.

I thought it trashed the entire idea of the Olympics being a cooperative endeavor for the world and turned into "Corporate Sponsorship and Product Placement Go To The Olympics"

I'd like to see Beijing again

 

[bashfullyshameless]

I'd like to see Beijing again

I had the exact opposite feeling. I thought that going for humor was exactly the path to take after Beijing, because there were going to be inevitable comparisons and therefore a lot of panning of ANYTHING the British did.

Britain has a well-informed, free-thinking populace. A great many people disagree with the value and appropriateness of having the Olympics there at all. China has a command economy and a huge population of people who will do as they're told. I'm not dogging the patriotism of the Chinese, which I'm sure is genuine, but the fact is that China has a major logistical advantage that simply can't be beat (and the economy was probably better for China in the run-up to 2008 than Britain's has been recently). You simply aren't going to see another Beijing anytime soon.

I was really impressed by the stage spectacle in London. I was happy to see some humor injected into the whole thing--to the point that even the Queen herself was happy to participate in a farce directed on herself. And London, too, showed some real logistical triumphs, what with the fastest "parade of nations" ever and, again, a really cool stage changeover.

 

[Recidiva]

I had the exact opposite feeling. I thought that going for humor was exactly the path to take after Beijing, because there were going to be inevitable comparisons and therefore a lot of panning of ANYTHING the British did.

Britain has a well-informed, free-thinking populace. A great many people disagree with the value and appropriateness of having the Olympics there at all. China has a command economy and a huge population of people who will do as they're told. I'm not dogging the patriotism of the Chinese, which I'm sure is genuine, but the fact is that China has a major logistical advantage that simply can't be beat (and the economy was probably better for China in the run-up to 2008 than Britain's has been recently). You simply aren't going to see another Beijing anytime soon.

I was really impressed by the stage spectacle in London. I was happy to see some humor injected into the whole thing--to the point that even the Queen herself was happy to participate in a farce directed on herself. And London, too, showed some real logistical triumphs, what with the fastest "parade of nations" ever and, again, a really cool stage changeover.

That's cool. I know it resonated with a lot of people, I'm just a minority report.

 

[TE999]

Let's face it, a lot of Olympic sports aren't that popular with Americans and to be honest they're kinda boring. I'm thinking of wrestling, fencing, archery, cycling, canoeing, etc.

I'm sure the current state of the European economy (economies) isn't helping either.

 

[Verdad]

No, I know it wasn't dead straight, and it was obviously poking fun at itself. I think the Olympics deserve better and you'd be better off giving all the money for the opening ceremony to charity if you're just going to dick around with it and waste people's time.

If the US had done something where the Three Stooges were making fun of "Citizen Kane" I'd be appalled as well. Yes, some Americans might think it's funny, but is it really...appropriate?

Mr. Bean and The Three Stooges are equally lowbrow and beloved (to some), but completely distasteful to others as being slapstick brainless. Chariots of Fire and Citizen Kane are classics that shouldn't really be subjected to the juxtaposition. I'd go see Chariots of Fire, I'd go see Citizen Kane. I'd avoid Mr. Bean and The Three Stooges. I'd even avoid 007.

Compare it to elements of Athens or elements of Beijing. It wasn't complicated inside-jokes that were bewildering to others. It was an expression of culture in a visual medium done with respect (not lacking humor) but not demeaning, either.

It's an insider's language without translation. Funny between friends, perhaps, but a dismal representation of genuine culture or respect.

It's a visual medium. Instead of being a piece of art that is self evident and self expressive, it turned into a cartoon that requires some cynical inside story hipster to explain it to everyone. And even after the explanation, I just think it's bad art. Art that has to be explained by an outsider is incomplete and needs more elegant expression.

I thought it trashed the entire idea of the Olympics being a cooperative endeavor for the world and turned into "Corporate Sponsorship and Product Placement Go To The Olympics"

I'd like to see Beijing again

Hey, I feel I have to put in a good word for Mr. Bean. I mean yeah, absolutely, the movies were dreadful, and they make him into precisely what you say, a corporate brand name, an insipid cultural export packaged as the famed ‘Brit humor’ even as it’s purged of anything funny. Mr. Bean skits actually were pretty funny, though (if you’re at all receptive to his kind of humor), and when you add Black Adder to that, you kind of have to recognize Rowan Atkinson as a bona fide icon. I thought maybe the Queen bit took the ‘self deprecating’ and ‘proudly irreverent’ perilously close to ‘in exceedingly bad taste’, but I was fine with Bean.

Fair enough on the rest. I get your reasoning and agree with you in principle—had I found it either so snooty or so pandering as to dismiss me as audience, I’d have felt the same. I just didn’t perceive it that way at all.

I also agree that if something depends on external explanation, it’s poor art and a poorer joke, but even there some caveats apply. Given the medium, how, without an explanation, do you convey the dude on the stage represents Isambard Kingdom Brunel? The good thing is, though, little really depends on that explanation. If all one got was, “and then Kenneth Branagh smoked a cigar, which apparently kick-started the industrial age,” one still got the point. The additional info adds something if you’re interested, but the whole act doesn’t hinge on it.

Or so I thought.

 

[Recidiva]

Hey, I feel I have to put in a good word for Mr. Bean. I mean yeah, absolutely, the movies were dreadful, and they make him into precisely what you say, a corporate brand name, an insipid cultural export packaged as the famed ‘Brit humor’ even as it’s purged of anything funny. Mr. Bean skits actually were pretty funny, though (if you’re at all receptive to his kind of humor), and when you add Black Adder to that, you kind of have to recognize Rowan Atkinson as a bona fide icon. I thought maybe the Queen bit took the ‘self deprecating’ and ‘proudly irreverent’ perilously close to ‘in exceedingly bad taste’, but I was fine with Bean.

Fair enough on the rest. I get your reasoning and agree with you in principle—had I found it either so snooty or so pandering as to dismiss me as audience, I’d have felt the same. I just didn’t perceive it that way at all.

I also agree that if something depends on external explanation, it’s poor art and a poorer joke, but even there some caveats apply. Given the medium, how, without an explanation, do you convey the dude on the stage represents Isambard Kingdom Brunel? The good thing is, though, little really depends on that explanation. If all one got was, “and then Kenneth Branagh smoked a cigar, which apparently kick-started the industrial age,” one still got the point. The additional info adds something if you’re interested, but the whole act doesn’t hinge on it.

Or so I thought.

I adore Rowan from "The Tall Guy" and "Black Adder" and I can never be in the same room with Mr. Bean without the urge to flee.

Isumwho?

The whole "We're Hobbits and now we're slowly doing a set change" was lost on me, as well as why you'd want to turn a whole stage into a smoking hulk of ugly. But I could appreciate that as interpretive history, sure. I think it could have been interpreted...in a more interesting way...but okay. It's still Olympian.

I'll give an example of something that worked on its own and benefited from explanation:

The stage was a map of London, and the circle was East London. That would need to be explained. But it takes those little sentences to do it. Forging the ring was visually very cool and I think it took timing and technical innovation to do it. That's Olympian.

A deaf Scots drummer? Awesome Olympian.

Kids singing? Olympian. The Queen staring at them as if she's about to say "Off with their heads!" Not Olympian.

Mr. Bean and the Queen jumping out of a helicopter, Olympian fail.

Also, picking the flattest performance of a Beatles song to pipe through and then inflicting Paul McCartney on us was just mean.

 

[Verdad]

I adore Rowan from "The Tall Guy" and "Black Adder" and I can never be in the same room with Mr. Bean without the urge to flee.

Isumwho?

The whole "We're Hobbits and now we're slowly doing a set change" was lost on me, as well as why you'd want to turn a whole stage into a smoking hulk of ugly. But I could appreciate that as interpretive history, sure. I think it could have been interpreted...in a more interesting way...but okay. It's still Olympian.

I'll give an example of something that worked on its own and benefited from explanation:

The stage was a map of London, and the circle was East London. That would need to be explained. But it takes those little sentences to do it. Forging the ring was visually very cool and I think it took timing and technical innovation to do it. That's Olympian.

A deaf Scots drummer? Awesome Olympian.

Kids singing? Olympian. The Queen staring at them as if she's about to say "Off with their heads!" Not Olympian.

Mr. Bean and the Queen jumping out of a helicopter, Olympian fail.

Also, picking the flattest performance of a Beatles song to pipe through and then inflicting Paul McCartney on us was just mean.

Inflicting Paul McCartney on an audience is cruel under any circumstances! I was willing to forgive it only because it was offset by the appearance of Dizzy Rascal.

Not that I care for Dizzy Rascal in particular any more than you’re likely to, but he’s a representative of the dub step scene, which is the current iteration of the two step/UK garage scene (they do love to coin new names for branches of electronic dance music), and as such represents the sound of London clubs as they are at this moment.

Underground is a relative term here—how underground is something that draws out tens of thousands of people every weekend?—but I couldn’t help but think “This would never have happened in the US. Nothing short of the most mainstream bestsellers would be acknowledged.” Indeed, I waited in advance to see if any nod would be made in the direction of that scene and would have been disappointed if it hadn’t. If it risked being a tad obscure, it also honored the live beat of the city/century, in counterpoint to McCartney’s, to put it charitably, nostalgic act.

 

[Recidiva]

Inflicting Paul McCartney on an audience is cruel under any circumstances! I was willing to forgive it only because it was offset by the appearance of Dizzy Rascal.

Not that I care for Dizzy Rascal in particular any more than you’re likely to, but he’s a representative of the dub step scene, which is the current iteration of the two step/UK garage scene (they do love to coin new names for branches of electronic dance music), and as such represents the sound of London clubs as they are at this moment.

Underground is a relative term here—how underground is something that draws out tens of thousands of people every weekend?—but I couldn’t help but think “This would never have happened in the US. Nothing short of the most mainstream bestsellers would be acknowledged.” Indeed, I waited in advance to see if any nod would be made in the direction of that scene and would have been disappointed if it hadn’t. If it risked being a tad obscure, it also honored the live beat of the city/century, in counterpoint to McCartney’s, to put it charitably, nostalgic act.

I think that's part of it. Despite Americans being those corporate lackeys who drink the lifeblood of the masses and bathe in oil and spend all day at McDonalds...

We do know that putting McDonalds in the Olympics opening ceremony would be crass. We put McDonalds in the commercials that finance the Olympics and plaster their brands all over the athletes, you know, where it belongs.

I'm aware that the Olympics are in reality a celebration of personal ambition and corporate sponsorships. I get that.

But I'm a traditionalist and I actually indulge in pure nostalgia and idealism. I get about two hours every two years to feed that on an international level and get to believe that people all over the world are doing it with me.

And...we had Muhammad Ali light a torch, not box someone.

 

[Weird Harold]

I heard that corporations bought up seats but never dispersed the tickets. Other people were waiting in line for tickets to those events and couldn't get them.

And meanwhile, the nosebleed seats are standing room only.

As soon as an event starts, they should move people down from the nosebleed seats to the ringside seats. Any latecomers with tickets for ringside can fill-in the nosebleed seats.