Language barrier questions

[muttley44]

First off, a bit of background about me: I was born and raised in the Philippines up until 17. I moved to the States 26 years ago and have lived in Florida, L.A., and now Colorado. Although I don't speak my native tongue (Tagalog) anymore, I've found myself somewhat perplexed sometimes between the English language I know and the English language I'm exposed to.

Here are three questions I have for the writers around here:

1) Disagreements and decisions: I was having a conversation with my wife yesterday and we were going back and forth trying to decide where and what to eat for dinner. She asked if we should go out or eat in. My response was eat in, and let's go to so-and-so for take out. She says that restaurant is closed on Mondays, could I think of anywhere else. My reply was the take and bake pizza place. Without acknowledging my pizza suggestion, she suggests a romantic dinner out.

She's done this before (where I say something and then seems to totally ignore it and says something contrary), and I find it insulting and dismissive. We go back and forth about this and we finally come to the realization that this is the way she's spoken all her life and never realized anyone could take insult. I guess my question to you would be; Is this an East Coast thing (she's from New England), is this an American thing, or is this just the normal decision making dynamic that I'm just unaware of?

2) Reminiscing and context: When talking about someone from your past, is it important to frame the context? Here's my example: My wife has mentioned this guy several times (maybe 7 or 8 times in the last 4 years we've been married) that she went to college with who used to shave with a straight razor. She's also mentioned how she thought that made him look cool. Not thinking too much about it, I asked her last night if she slept with him. She said the they dated for a bit and she slept with him a handful of times. I'm not sure if this is important to you or not, but telling me a story about someone you knew for conversation's sake is one thing, but telling me about the guy you went out with (albeit 25+ years ago) changes the whole context of the story.

She and I discuss our ex-spouses all the time. It's a normal part of our conversations, and I'm pretty sure we hold nothing back. We've known each other for 20 years now and most of our stories are with people we already know. Maybe this is residual baggage from my second wife; we talked about our past as well and always made sure we clarified whether or not it was about someone we were intimate with.

3) Definition of foreplay... This may be a more personal one rather than a dictionary definition question. My wife said that I don't spend enough time with foreplay. I know the time quantity is purely subjective, but when I told her that I feel that I do kiss and fondle her plenty, and that I always make sure she has at least one orgasm from oral before we actually have sex, she replied that cunnilingus is not foreplay. It isn't??

Now, we've settled the whole foreplay issue itself (she promised to tell me if I was going too fast next time), but my question here is, "Do you consider oral sex foreplay?"

I'm not sure now if these are language questions or a relationship questions.

(Maybe I should change my handle from muttley44 to TheNotSoCunningLinguist.)

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

I'm reviewing a book I used when I was a practicing psychotherapist many years ago. The title is SHIFTING CONTEXTS; it's about how we use and abuse language.

Muddled language causes all kinds of relationship problems because of presuppositions that cant be true, unspecified referential indices, cloudy meanings, and words used as anchors to trigger specific reactions (our buttons).

But here's a pearl of wisdom by Joseph Conrad (HEART OF DARKNESS)

"It's queer how out of touch with truth women are. They live in a world of their own, and there has never been anything like it, and never can be. It is too beautiful altogether, and if they were to set it up it would go to pieces before the first sunset. Some confounded fact we men have been living contentedly with ever since the day of Creation would start up and knock the whole thing over."

 

[3113]

I don't speak my native tongue (Tagalog) anymore, I've found myself somewhat perplexed sometimes between the English language I know and the English language I'm exposed to.

Everything you're discussing is more cultural or just male/female than language. Let's go through them....

She's done this before (where I say something and then seems to totally ignore it and says something contrary), and I find it insulting and dismissive. We go back and forth about this and we finally come to the realization that this is the way she's spoken all her life and never realized anyone could take insult. I guess my question to you would be; Is this an East Coast thing (she's from New England), is this an American thing, or is this just the normal decision making dynamic that I'm just unaware of?

Twenty years together and you don't get this? This is a Mars/Venus American or Western culture thing. Not all women do it, but a lot do. It's a cultural idea that's still around that a girl should be polite and "selfless," meaning ask for other people's opinions rather than boldly state her own, or offer other people the last slice of pie before taking it herself, etc. A lot of parents instill this into their girls, or if they don't, it's sometimes instilled in them by boys in high school. But this causes a problem if there is something the girl really wants. How does she selfishly ask for it?

The result is that a lot of girls learn a round-about way of asking for things rather than saying straight out, "I want to go out to a romantic dinner!" That's "selfish" and girl's aren't supposed to be selfish. They're supposed to at least appear selfless, and defer to the man. In some cases, they want the guy to "read their mind" and take charge. This isn't fair or right, but it's how they've been raised to think or, often, how they want things to be.

This isn't a matter of disrespect. She wants something and her lifetime habit isn't to ask for it outright. This is why she ignores your suggestions, because she's aiming for something. She wants you to guess your way to what she wants. Now the question is, if she did say, "I want to go out to a romantic dinner." No asking your opinion at all...how would you respond? If you'd be upset, then you can understand why she can't get past asking for your opinion, even if she doesn't want it--she wants what she wants. Are you willing to assure her that if she wants something she can just ask for it?

Also, keep in mind, that sometimes a person doesn't know right off what they want. Asking for ideas from you allows them a chance to know what they don't want, and by process of elimination, discover what they do want.

2) Reminiscing and context: When talking about someone from your past, is it important to frame the context?

This isn't language or culture, it's personality. Some people think and talk about things out of context, some thing and talk about things in context. If context is important to you and not her, then you need to ask for context.

Now, we've settled the whole foreplay issue itself (she promised to tell me if I was going too fast next time), but my question here is, "Do you consider oral sex foreplay?"

Well, if you recall, there was a famous argument about this. Is oral sex foreplay or is it sex? Did you "have sex" with that woman if it's only oral sex? Foreplay is not considered sex. So if oral sex is sex, then it's not foreplay. In the end, the important thing is to know your wife's definition. Ours is immaterial.

 

[lesbiaphrodite]

I don't have the answers to these questions, but I would offer an observation: You think too much.

 

[Boxlicker101]

First off, a bit of background about me: I was born and raised in the Philippines up until 17. I moved to the States 26 years ago and have lived in Florida, L.A., and now Colorado. Although I don't speak my native tongue (Tagalog) anymore, I've found myself somewhat perplexed sometimes between the English language I know and the English language I'm exposed to.

Here are three questions I have for the writers around here:

1) Disagreements and decisions: I was having a conversation with my wife yesterday and we were going back and forth trying to decide where and what to eat for dinner. She asked if we should go out or eat in. My response was eat in, and let's go to so-and-so for take out. She says that restaurant is closed on Mondays, could I think of anywhere else. My reply was the take and bake pizza place. Without acknowledging my pizza suggestion, she suggests a romantic dinner out.

She's done this before (where I say something and then seems to totally ignore it and says something contrary), and I find it insulting and dismissive. We go back and forth about this and we finally come to the realization that this is the way she's spoken all her life and never realized anyone could take insult. I guess my question to you would be; Is this an East Coast thing (she's from New England), is this an American thing, or is this just the normal decision making dynamic that I'm just unaware of?

2) Reminiscing and context: When talking about someone from your past, is it important to frame the context? Here's my example: My wife has mentioned this guy several times (maybe 7 or 8 times in the last 4 years we've been married) that she went to college with who used to shave with a straight razor. She's also mentioned how she thought that made him look cool. Not thinking too much about it, I asked her last night if she slept with him. She said the they dated for a bit and she slept with him a handful of times. I'm not sure if this is important to you or not, but telling me a story about someone you knew for conversation's sake is one thing, but telling me about the guy you went out with (albeit 25+ years ago) changes the whole context of the story.

She and I discuss our ex-spouses all the time. It's a normal part of our conversations, and I'm pretty sure we hold nothing back. We've known each other for 20 years now and most of our stories are with people we already know. Maybe this is residual baggage from my second wife; we talked about our past as well and always made sure we clarified whether or not it was about someone we were intimate with.

3) Definition of foreplay... This may be a more personal one rather than a dictionary definition question. My wife said that I don't spend enough time with foreplay. I know the time quantity is purely subjective, but when I told her that I feel that I do kiss and fondle her plenty, and that I always make sure she has at least one orgasm from oral before we actually have sex, she replied that cunnilingus is not foreplay. It isn't??

Now, we've settled the whole foreplay issue itself (she promised to tell me if I was going too fast next time), but my question here is, "Do you consider oral sex foreplay?"

I'm not sure now if these are language questions or a relationship questions.

(Maybe I should change my handle from muttley44 to TheNotSoCunningLinguist.)

3 Pretty much nailed the first parts, IMHO opinion. As for oral sex being foreplay or not, that depends on what else you do. If you follow it by penile-vaginal sex, or anal sex, it was foreplay. If you both cum from the oral action and don't do anything else but cuddle, then it was sex.

 

[muttley44]

Everything you're discussing is more cultural or just male/female than language. Let's go through them....

I showed my wife all the responses to my post and yours was what she related to the most. Boxlicker was right, you hit the nail on the head.

Thanks, and the other posts were very good as well. Yes, I do think too much sometimes.