amicus
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L._E._Modesitt,_Jr.
L. E. Modesitt, Jr.
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Jump to: navigation, search
L. E. (Leland Exton) Modesitt, Jr was born in 1943 in Denver, Colorado. He graduated from Williams College. He lived in Washington, D.C. for 20 years, then moved to New Hampshire in 1989 where he met his wife. They relocated to Cedar City, Utah in 1993.
Previously, he has worked as a Navy pilot, lifeguard, delivery boy, unpaid radio disc jockey, real estate agent, market research analyst, director of research for a political campaign, legislative assistant for a Congressman, Director of Legislation and Congressional Relations for the U.S. EPA, a consultant on environmental, regulatory, and communications issues, and a college lecturer and writer in residence.
He is an author of mostly Science Fiction and Fantasy Novels and is known best for the fantasy series The Saga of Recluce. In addition to his novels, Mr. Modesitt has published technical studies and articles, columns, poetry, and a number of science fiction stories. His first short story, "The Great American Economy", was published in 1973 in Analog Science Fiction and Science Fact.
~~~~~~
I just picked up a novel by Modesitt, a day or so ago, finished it and had some thoughts with no one to share them with, so you are cursed with it…
I had read him before, The Recluce Saga, several books, my son reads a lot of fantasy and sci fi and had this one: “The ParaFaith War” lying around, so I gobbled it.
I ‘dog-eared’ some pages so as to not forget, but before I go back, it is mainly to Pure and several others who insist that the concept of ‘absolute values’ does not exist in the rational, logical world that I thought of when I read the passages. Here is a whole book devoted to the question of whether absolute values exist, or not.
All excerpts are from the “Tor” paperback` published in 1997:
Chapter 20, page 151...”…The Revenants of the Prophet are the declared enemy of the Coalition, but what raised that enmity? That enmity arises from fundamental cultural differences, and those differences from religion, from belief systems dating to antiquity…even from basic economic precepts…and from the Coalition’s emphasis on rationality. Rationality is the enemy of any closed faith. What do I mean by a ‘closed faith? One that relies on a dogma that cannot be questioned without the threat of death or exile. The Revenants are closed to what you might call outside truths, and their culture is so stable internally that change from within is highly unlikely.
…”…the fundamental differences in beliefs between the Revenants of the Prophet and most beliefs within the Coalition lies in two areas. First, the Revenants belief, deeply, in a single set of revealed truths, as expounded by Toren, the Prophet of God while few belief systems within the Coalition are so rigid as to exclude all possibility of entertaining other truths….”
~~~~
That was the first passage that caused me to stop and re-read and eventually mark the page for later reference.
I want to say at this point the Modesitt is by no means a favorite author, nor am I greatly impressed with his skills and it seems, to me, that most of his stories in the Recluce series also had a heavy political framework upon which a story was hung.
The second reference comes from Chapter 43, page 266:
“…should values change from species to species?
“They do, whether they should, is another question.”
“Should your species and mine have different interpretations of what values are the most important?”
“I suspect we do.”
“But should we.”
“Should you and the cultural group you call the Revenants have different interpretations of what values are the most important?”
“We do, some of them are very important.”
“Should you? Are there absolute universal values?”
“Some say so…”
~~~
Of course, you will not be surprised that when I read, ‘absolute universal values…’ outside my own writing or that of Ayn Rand, it is cause for celebration…at least one other person at least , ‘asked’ the question.
~~~
Page 309... “…people are looking for someone to blame. Our heritage comes from two groups that always denied that they were part of the problem. The early ecologists blamed industrialization for the environmental degradation even while they continued to purchase all the goods and services produced by industry. And the forerunners of the Parashinto always looked down on and isolated strangers….”
(This novel, like many of its’ genre, includes a global disaster as a result of environmental degradation, over population and conflict as part of the ‘ancient’ history leading to current circumstances.)
Chapter 71, Page 447: “…Without a deity, the universe is uncertain. But once the deistic faiths have been analyzed, they provide no greater certainty, nor is there any verified evidence that deities have, per se, improved humanity or its institutions. Certainly improvements have occurred , but these improvements have occurred in purely human fashion. These accomplishments have proved that people can bring greater certainty, greater goodness, greater understanding into the universe, and, while they may have been inspired by faith, those good people have done so without the physical help of a deity.
“Thus it can be argued that the invention of a deity only serves as a pretext for human beings to believe in a set of values beyond those merely rooted in self….(continue to last paragraph) : “…That is the greatest danger in theology and deities -- that they create the impression that goodness cannot be created or maintained by mere humans without divine help….”
Page 455: “…You know the answer. Your species seeks absolutes.”
“The only absolute truth is change and death is the only way to stop change. Life is a series of judgments on changing situations, and no ideal, no belief fits every solution. Yet humans need to believe in something beyond themselves. Perhaps all intelligences do. If we do not act on higher motivations, then we can justify any action, no matter how horrible, as necessary for our survival. We are endlessly caught between the need for higher moral absolutes -- which will fail enough that any absolute can be demonstrated as false -- and our tendency for individual judgments, to degenerate into self gratifying and unethical narcissism. Trying to force absolutes on others results in death and destruction, yet failing to act beyond one’s self also leads to death and destruction, generally a lot sooner.”
“That is true, and simple. Yet your species still fails to accept that…”
~~~~~~~~~~
That last comes near the end of the book and is of course, ‘***the author’s message***’ so to speak.
And what is that message, amicus asks?
That humanity can function only with a value system beyond our own existence, that of a deity, or one created within humanity, some “ISM’ that is as destructive if not more than a deistically founded system and thus mankind is doomed to constant failure and unending conflict.
Bullshit!
Like the liberal secularists here on the forum, who bemoan the fate of mankind, Modesitt exposes his moral bankruptcy but excuses it by introducing an alien species, rather like in Contact, the Sagan thing, “We all continue to look but have found nothing beyond each other…”
That should be a clue to even the most fuzzy minded…perhaps looking within might provide a path? Perhaps defining humanity within the terms of that which is human? Perhaps beginning with the most simple axiom of all, namely, that we do exist.
A is A, existence exists, that which is, is… now….what is it? What are our definable characteristics? What are the essential defining characteristics of humanity and how can they be understood and implemented?
Writers and thinkers such as Modesitt are simply intellectual cowards, afraid to face the darkness of time and space and look in the mirror without sensing horror at that they see.
Thas all we have folks, there ain’t no god, there ain’t no prophet, only the efficacy of the mind of man to conquer the unknown.
Let’s get on with it!
Amicus…
L. E. Modesitt, Jr.
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
L. E. (Leland Exton) Modesitt, Jr was born in 1943 in Denver, Colorado. He graduated from Williams College. He lived in Washington, D.C. for 20 years, then moved to New Hampshire in 1989 where he met his wife. They relocated to Cedar City, Utah in 1993.
Previously, he has worked as a Navy pilot, lifeguard, delivery boy, unpaid radio disc jockey, real estate agent, market research analyst, director of research for a political campaign, legislative assistant for a Congressman, Director of Legislation and Congressional Relations for the U.S. EPA, a consultant on environmental, regulatory, and communications issues, and a college lecturer and writer in residence.
He is an author of mostly Science Fiction and Fantasy Novels and is known best for the fantasy series The Saga of Recluce. In addition to his novels, Mr. Modesitt has published technical studies and articles, columns, poetry, and a number of science fiction stories. His first short story, "The Great American Economy", was published in 1973 in Analog Science Fiction and Science Fact.
~~~~~~
I just picked up a novel by Modesitt, a day or so ago, finished it and had some thoughts with no one to share them with, so you are cursed with it…
I had read him before, The Recluce Saga, several books, my son reads a lot of fantasy and sci fi and had this one: “The ParaFaith War” lying around, so I gobbled it.
I ‘dog-eared’ some pages so as to not forget, but before I go back, it is mainly to Pure and several others who insist that the concept of ‘absolute values’ does not exist in the rational, logical world that I thought of when I read the passages. Here is a whole book devoted to the question of whether absolute values exist, or not.
All excerpts are from the “Tor” paperback` published in 1997:
Chapter 20, page 151...”…The Revenants of the Prophet are the declared enemy of the Coalition, but what raised that enmity? That enmity arises from fundamental cultural differences, and those differences from religion, from belief systems dating to antiquity…even from basic economic precepts…and from the Coalition’s emphasis on rationality. Rationality is the enemy of any closed faith. What do I mean by a ‘closed faith? One that relies on a dogma that cannot be questioned without the threat of death or exile. The Revenants are closed to what you might call outside truths, and their culture is so stable internally that change from within is highly unlikely.
…”…the fundamental differences in beliefs between the Revenants of the Prophet and most beliefs within the Coalition lies in two areas. First, the Revenants belief, deeply, in a single set of revealed truths, as expounded by Toren, the Prophet of God while few belief systems within the Coalition are so rigid as to exclude all possibility of entertaining other truths….”
~~~~
That was the first passage that caused me to stop and re-read and eventually mark the page for later reference.
I want to say at this point the Modesitt is by no means a favorite author, nor am I greatly impressed with his skills and it seems, to me, that most of his stories in the Recluce series also had a heavy political framework upon which a story was hung.
The second reference comes from Chapter 43, page 266:
“…should values change from species to species?
“They do, whether they should, is another question.”
“Should your species and mine have different interpretations of what values are the most important?”
“I suspect we do.”
“But should we.”
“Should you and the cultural group you call the Revenants have different interpretations of what values are the most important?”
“We do, some of them are very important.”
“Should you? Are there absolute universal values?”
“Some say so…”
~~~
Of course, you will not be surprised that when I read, ‘absolute universal values…’ outside my own writing or that of Ayn Rand, it is cause for celebration…at least one other person at least , ‘asked’ the question.
~~~
Page 309... “…people are looking for someone to blame. Our heritage comes from two groups that always denied that they were part of the problem. The early ecologists blamed industrialization for the environmental degradation even while they continued to purchase all the goods and services produced by industry. And the forerunners of the Parashinto always looked down on and isolated strangers….”
(This novel, like many of its’ genre, includes a global disaster as a result of environmental degradation, over population and conflict as part of the ‘ancient’ history leading to current circumstances.)
Chapter 71, Page 447: “…Without a deity, the universe is uncertain. But once the deistic faiths have been analyzed, they provide no greater certainty, nor is there any verified evidence that deities have, per se, improved humanity or its institutions. Certainly improvements have occurred , but these improvements have occurred in purely human fashion. These accomplishments have proved that people can bring greater certainty, greater goodness, greater understanding into the universe, and, while they may have been inspired by faith, those good people have done so without the physical help of a deity.
“Thus it can be argued that the invention of a deity only serves as a pretext for human beings to believe in a set of values beyond those merely rooted in self….(continue to last paragraph) : “…That is the greatest danger in theology and deities -- that they create the impression that goodness cannot be created or maintained by mere humans without divine help….”
Page 455: “…You know the answer. Your species seeks absolutes.”
“The only absolute truth is change and death is the only way to stop change. Life is a series of judgments on changing situations, and no ideal, no belief fits every solution. Yet humans need to believe in something beyond themselves. Perhaps all intelligences do. If we do not act on higher motivations, then we can justify any action, no matter how horrible, as necessary for our survival. We are endlessly caught between the need for higher moral absolutes -- which will fail enough that any absolute can be demonstrated as false -- and our tendency for individual judgments, to degenerate into self gratifying and unethical narcissism. Trying to force absolutes on others results in death and destruction, yet failing to act beyond one’s self also leads to death and destruction, generally a lot sooner.”
“That is true, and simple. Yet your species still fails to accept that…”
~~~~~~~~~~
That last comes near the end of the book and is of course, ‘***the author’s message***’ so to speak.
And what is that message, amicus asks?
That humanity can function only with a value system beyond our own existence, that of a deity, or one created within humanity, some “ISM’ that is as destructive if not more than a deistically founded system and thus mankind is doomed to constant failure and unending conflict.
Bullshit!
Like the liberal secularists here on the forum, who bemoan the fate of mankind, Modesitt exposes his moral bankruptcy but excuses it by introducing an alien species, rather like in Contact, the Sagan thing, “We all continue to look but have found nothing beyond each other…”
That should be a clue to even the most fuzzy minded…perhaps looking within might provide a path? Perhaps defining humanity within the terms of that which is human? Perhaps beginning with the most simple axiom of all, namely, that we do exist.
A is A, existence exists, that which is, is… now….what is it? What are our definable characteristics? What are the essential defining characteristics of humanity and how can they be understood and implemented?
Writers and thinkers such as Modesitt are simply intellectual cowards, afraid to face the darkness of time and space and look in the mirror without sensing horror at that they see.
Thas all we have folks, there ain’t no god, there ain’t no prophet, only the efficacy of the mind of man to conquer the unknown.
Let’s get on with it!
Amicus…
