Japanese culture question: would giri-choco be appropriate in this situation?

[joy_of_cooking]

Suppose a female consultant is doing a client visit in Tokyo on Valentine's Day. Would it be appropriate for her to give giri-choco to her team-mates and to her opposite numbers in the client organization?

By appropriate, I mean, it would be a fun "experiencing local customs" kind of thing, and not cause feelings of unwanted obligation, especially among her opposite numbers. She would not be around on White Day to receive anything back from these people.

Edit: the consultant is a Chinese-American working for an American company engaged by a Japanese company, in case that matters.

 

[vagrantx]

It kind of depends on the situation and giri choco is a bit of a dying custom. If it isn't her first visit to the company in question, you could concider her bringing omiyage from the US to gift to her colleagues at the japanese firm instead? That'd be a sure-fire way of bonding! If it's the first visit, giri choco would be weird in any case.

 

[Jackie.Hikaru]

Outside of school it's not very common. I agree with vagrant that it would seem weird, and depending on the company even undesired aka not allowed, although I'm sure if she does do it, her counterparts will likely politely receive the chocolate and treat it as omiyage then laugh about it at the bar.

 

[joy_of_cooking]

Thanks! Luckily it was only a throwaway line, so you two haven't destroyed my entire story

 

[flynn99]

Not girl-choco, but a Japanese culture question regarding the honorific "-chan"

I have a 16th century MMC who adores his wife... I've written that adoration by him calling her -chan. I know it's typically an honorific for a child, but does it work in the same sense that a Westerner might call his wife "baby" or "babe"?

And to extend the challenge further, when he thinks of her, he also assigns her the honorific -chan in his mind... the 'chan has become part of her name to him.

Does it work as an endearment or is it just weird?

And if it is weird, what might I use instead?

Thanks!

 

[Jackie.Hikaru]

Not girl-choco, but a Japanese culture question regarding the honorific "-chan"

I have a 16th century MMC who adores his wife... I've written that adoration by him calling her -chan. I know it's typically an honorific for a child, but does it work in the same sense that a Westerner might call his wife "baby" or "babe"?

And to extend the challenge further, when he thinks of her, he also assigns her the honorific -chan in his mind... the 'chan has become part of her name to him.

Does it work as an endearment or is it just weird?

And if it is weird, what might I use instead?

Thanks!

how historically accurate do you want to be?
Manga/Anime level of accurate (go for it) <------> Faithful reproduction of the language and social construct of 16th century Japan (not recommended)

And also, what is the nature of their romance? Is it a cutesy crush story or a sweeping tragic romance?

My take is its always better to avoid the use of honorifics unless it is used to establish the tone of a class difference. Normally in intimate language (yobisute), honorifics are dropped altogether, but as a nickname...maybe? As far as the historical accuracy, all I can say is that in what I've read, Japanese literature of the time only use honorifics when speaking third person and in formal tone, so its hard to say how to say how honorifics were actually used in the day to day - its more clear how it was used in courts, but in your average Japanese households, not so much. But I'm not really a history buff, so don't take my word for it. All that to say, if I were to see "someone-chan" written in your 16th century Japanese erotica, I would not be bothered by it.

If it helps to give context - chan comes from san, and it is basically spoken as such to resemble the way a young child might say 'san'.

 

[vagrantx]

I have a 16th century MMC

Faithful reproduction of the language and social construct of 16th century Japan (not recommended)

Correct me if I'm wrong (took japanese in high school, ages ago) but the honorific system didn't even exist during muromachi, no? At least not any written references? So 16th century "chan" would be pretty darn out there, anachronistically speaking. Would have taken centuries for cute suffixes to evolve.

 

[Jackie.Hikaru]

Correct me if I'm wrong (took japanese in high school, ages ago) but the honorific system didn't even exist during muromachi, no? At least not any written references? So 16th century "chan" would be pretty darn out there, anachronistically speaking. Would have taken centuries for cute suffixes to evolve.

I don't want to reveal my (lack of) history knowledge
But... yes I'm pretty sure -chan would not have existed back then. Again, depending on the level of historical accuracy desired, one may or may not choose to use it.

Honorifics existed long before the 16th century (you can see it in Tales of Genji, which was written several centuries before), but not as language in the average village household and not in the same way honorifics are used in modern Japanese.

 

[vagrantx]

I remember reading something about honorifics spreading through the country when the literacy rate shot through the roof thanks to the educational opportunities that sprung up during Tokugawa's reign. I equated this to them not existing before.

I stand corrected! Thank you!

 

[Jackie.Hikaru]

I remember reading something about honorifics spreading through the country when the literacy rate shot through the roof thanks to the educational opportunities that sprung up during Tokugawa's reign. I equated this to them not existing before.

I stand corrected! Thank you!

I think you were correct in the sense that it was not widespread. And certainly -chan would not have been used.

 

[Jackie.Hikaru]

btw, permission given to all in AH to call me 'Jackie-chan'.

 

[flynn99]

Thanks, Jackie-chan , and vagrantX.

If it's a matter of literacy, would it make any difference that the speaker is a Daimyō?

If not, maybe I can accept the Manga level of accuracy if it works there as a loving nickname...

But if not -chan -- what might work and be more historically accurate?

Thank you!

 

[Jackie.Hikaru]

Thanks, Jackie-chan , and vagrantX.

If it's a matter of literacy, would it make any difference that the speaker is a Daimyō?

If not, maybe I can accept the Manga level of accuracy if it works there as a loving nickname...

But if not -chan -- what might work and be more historically accurate?

Thank you!

It's not a matter of literacy. It would be a matter of historical accuracy and the tone of your work. Light hearted, unserious and comedic, using Chan is fine by me. If it's supposed to be a historical fiction, and you're trying to be accurate, I'm honestly not sure what honorific would be alternatively used as a possible "pet name." Certainly the wife or lover would address him as -tono. But the other way around ... Honestly, do as Japanese writers who write or have their work translated into English commonly do and just discard Japanese honorifics altogether. The reality is honorifics in feudal Japan is so dang complicated, especially in the period you're talking about, even Japanese Japan scholars sometimes get it wrong.
Just do what I do, and accept being wrong af

 

[flynn99]

It's not a matter of literacy. It would be a matter of historical accuracy and the tone of your work. Light hearted, unserious and comedic, using Chan is fine by me. If it's supposed to be a historical fiction, and you're trying to be accurate, I'm honestly not sure what honorific would be alternatively used as a possible "pet name." Certainly the wife or lover would address him as -tono. But the other way around ... Honestly, do as Japanese writers who write or have their work translated into English commonly do and just discard Japanese honorifics altogether. The reality is honorifics in feudal Japan is so dang complicated, especially in the period you're talking about, even Japanese Japan scholars sometimes get it wrong.
Just do what I do, and accept being wrong af

Thanks, @Jackie.Hikaru-chan

Sounds like it's so complicated, I can just accept being right-enough. I took your advice and gave her the occasional -tono, but also added a paragraph of her accepting that it was cute -- if not a little odd -- how he called her -chan.

 

[flynn99]

Thanks, @Jackie.Hikaru-chan

Sounds like it's so complicated, I can just accept being right-enough. I took your advice and gave her the occasional -tono, but also added a paragraph of her accepting that it was cute -- if not a little odd -- how he called her -chan.

Well, that didn't work... the little blue head was originally a ninja -- indicating I got your reference