"Islamization" or Brainwashing?

[Sammael Bard]

I don't think that any religion would promote violence as its core value but I think there must be a reason behind the rise of so many terror groups based on this very religion.

Is it brain-washing within the organizations or is it something within the Quran itself?

I don't know anything about the Quran or even read it. But I interact with people of this faith on a daily basis. Most of them are really great persons.

So my heart would rather believe that brain-washing is a key factor in terrorist organizations.

Someone just point out the thread in which such a debate (or similar) where it has been concluded, which I'm sure exists. I'll do the rest of the soul searching myself.

 

[Devilius]

A thread?

Dude, there are several threads here on Islam and other Bullshit. You just have to search for it.

Back to the topic,

Yeah, a lot of brainwashing goes on in the terror camps. The prose and quotes are taken outta context and stuff like that.

We shouldn't confuse between Terrorists and Muslims. They are two different people.

 

[BotanyBoy]

We shouldn't confuse between Terrorists and Muslims. They are two different people.

That's like saying don't confuse between Nazi's and Germans...they are two different people. Like most things in REALITY it's just not really black and white, now is it?? So let's clear that up shall we.

Not all Muslims are terrorist indeed....BUTT!!! the landslide majority if not ALL of the terrorist and terrorist organizations currently posing a threat to the US and it's people? ARE Muslims....and they will yell Muslim prayers as they cut your fucking head off given the chance. So cut the bleeding heart bullshit, very few of the fucking savages in that part of the world are friends of the western 1st world. They want to kill you....because theocratic conservative extremism is just that kinda bat shit.

 

[BotanyBoy]

I don't think that any religion would promote violence as its core value

You must not read very many religious text then......they are all pretty barbaric, ESPECIALLY the Abrahamic religions.

I mean Jesus gives a lesson on how to properly beat your slaves for fucks sake...

but I think there must be a reason behind the rise of so many terror groups based on this very religion.

Yea, theocratic conservatism gone un-checked......ISIS = Tea party with no rules or limitations.

 

[Devilius]

That's like saying don't confuse between Nazi's and Germans...they are two different people. Like most things in REALITY it's just not really black and white, now is it?? So let's clear that up shall we.

Not all Muslims are terrorist indeed....BUTT!!! the landslide majority if not ALL of the terrorist and terrorist organizations currently posing a threat to the US and it's people? ARE Muslims....and they will yell Muslim prayers as they cut your fucking head off given the chance. So cut the bleeding heart bullshit, very few of the fucking savages in that part of the world are friends of the western 1st world. They want to kill you....because theocratic conservative extremism is just that kinda bat shit.

I think that "Anti-Americanism" arises from the fact that the United States has to meddle in everyone else's BS.

You're crying foul now that the bitch is coming back to bite you in the ass.

Talking about Nazis, your argument reminds of the Holocaust where all the Jews were culled or imprisoned because "all of them" were "greedy pigs with big, hooked nose".

 

[Que]

Abraham was given the right to inherit the Earth by God Almighty. Two sons and their progeny believe that they inherited that birthright.

From this you get Islam and the Israelites. The Israelites consisted of 12 tribes. 10 of them were dispersed and live everywhere basically and the two remaining Joseph and Judah are folded together into what we call Judahism these days. Christianity is the offshoot of Judaesim. The only difference being that Christens believe Christ was the promised Messiah come to inherit the earth spiritually, and the Jews are still waiting for him to appear.

Muslims were instructed that they are the arm of the God here on earth and that through them the Earth is cleansed and purified as they convert or conquer.

All Abrahamic religions believe in eventual world domination. Muslims believe they make it happen by their physical actions in purifying the world of unbelievers, Jews and Christians believe that God is supposed to do the actual converting. They do seem enthusiastic about helping that along, and in the past with some of the same sort of mindset as the Muslims idea that the are the scourge wielded by the righteous hand of God.

Muslims do not all relish the thought of being personally the ones on the gruesome pointy tip of the spear but they all have some degree of reverence those that are. None of this was created in a vacuum of US foreign policy.

These things are not taught in "terror camps" that misplaced youth wander into. It is closer to an Irish Catholic mother bragging to her friends that Francis has joined the seminary.

Jihad is taught in their version of Sunday School.

 

[BotanyBoy]

I think that "Anti-Americanism" arises from the fact that the United States has to meddle in everyone else's BS.

No argument there...all the more reason for us to smoke a billion mother fuckers and enslave another half billion to be worked to death.

You're crying foul now that the bitch is coming back to bite you in the ass.

Where did I cry foul?

I'm gut checking your bullshit about Muslim terrorist not being Muslim....your a fucking lying piece of shit. They are every bit Muslim as the KKK is Christian and the Nazis German....you fucking twit.

Talking about Nazis, your argument reminds of the Holocaust where all the Jews were culled or imprisoned because "all of them" were "greedy pigs with big, hooked nose".

Because you're an illiterate fucking moron....

 

[Sammael Bard]

You must not read very many religious text then......they are all pretty barbaric, ESPECIALLY the Abrahamic religions.

I mean Jesus gives a lesson on how to properly beat your slaves for fucks sake...

You're right. I'm not familiar with the Abrahamic religious texts.

What I've read are mostly Eastern Religious texts (courtesy of my Dad). Although the dogmas left a bad after-taste, I liked the passive idea behind it.

Yea, theocratic conservatism gone un-checked......ISIS = Tea party with no rules or limitations.

That Tea party should be blown up.

 

[BotanyBoy]

That Tea party should be blown up.

Only if getting paid...otherwise they should just be ridiculed for the idiots they are and kept at bay via social pressure, because cheaper.

 

[Sammael Bard]

Abraham was given the right to inherit the Earth by God Almighty. Two sons and their progeny believe that they inherited that birthright.

From this you get Islam and the Israelites. The Israelites consisted of 12 tribes. 10 of them were dispersed and live everywhere basically and the two remaining Joseph and Judah are folded together into what we call Judahism these days. Christianity is the offshoot of Judaesim. The only difference being that Christens believe Christ was the promised Messiah come to inherit the earth spiritually, and the Jews are still waiting for him to appear.

Muslims were instructed that they are the arm of the God here on earth and that through them the Earth is cleansed and purified as they convert or conquer.

All Abrahamic religions believe in eventual world domination. Muslims believe they make it happen by their physical actions in purifying the world of unbelievers, Jews and Christians believe that God is supposed to do the actual converting. They do seem enthusiastic about helping that along, and in the past with some of the same sort of mindset as the Muslims idea that the are the scourge wielded by the righteous hand of God.

Muslims do not all relish the thought of being personally the ones on the gruesome pointy tip of the spear but they all have some degree of reverence those that are. None of this was created in a vacuum of US foreign policy.

These things are not taught in "terror camps" that misplaced youth wander into. It is closer to an Irish Catholic mother bragging to her friends that Francis has joined the seminary.

Jihad is taught in their version of Sunday School.

This. This mindset is pretty much the bullshit you find in every religion.

Thanks for the history, BTW.

 

[sufisaint]

I look at it this way...what would you rather be a poor person being fucked over by the rich few who control the government or a warrior of God who wants fairness, justice and order if you prevail? Which gives purpose and meaning to your life and suffering?

 

[Sammael Bard]

I look at it this way...what would you rather be a poor person being fucked over by the rich few who control the government or a warrior of God who wants fairness, justice and order if you prevail? Which gives purpose and meaning to your life and suffering?

Great words, but the problem is there isn't any fairness, justice or order when the "warrior" prevails. Women get raped and children are dragged into propaganda shit to name a few things in the areas where those terrorists are (sort of) ruling.

Purpose is a great thing to have but results like this aren't.

 

[BotanyBoy]

a warrior of God who wants fairness

Show me one.......LOL

 

[Sammael Bard]

Show me one.......LOL

Ha!

 

[eyer]

I look at it this way...what would you rather be a poor person being fucked over by the rich few who control the government or a warrior of God who wants fairness, justice and order if you prevail? Which gives purpose and meaning to your life and suffering?

Some say God became man to be the "warrior of God"...

...his mission was to defeat man's most lethal enemy of all: death.

Before doing so, he preached his message that the age of his Law was passing, and that with him a new age was born in which words like "fairness, justice and order" would never mean again what they were originally created to mean, and that his new age of Grace would reside so much more gloriously far above such mere mortal doublespeak...

...and that the "poor" would suffer the world's wrath - just as he was fated to - and that they, the meek, would verily inherit the earth no matter the suffering they must endure to achieve eternal life, while those who claim to kill in God's name would suffer eternal damnation.

Some say that that mission was accomplished on the 3rd day, that the war has been won, that there is nothing left to fight for, that the mother of all spoils from that mother of all victories is God's loving grace of eternal life itself...

...and then some don't believe any of that at all.

A Muslim's spiritual jihad is their individual struggle to completely surrender to that truth, man's total submission to God's will...

...that personal struggle is no different within any human who holds God spirit deep in her or his soul.

This jihad, spiritual jihad, is the occupation of the poor, the meek...

...no matter what flavor of religion any tribe desires to claim as its bigoted banner, all veterans of spiritual struggle are simply named children of God.

The worldly, physical, jihadists know nothing of totally submitting to God, for they choose to submit to man; they do, indeed, massacre other humans with the weapons of their bigoted "fairness, justice and order" blazing and swinging away...

...all ordered by men, not God.

No matter the particular flavor of religion any tribe desires to fly as its bigoted, hate furled banner, all worldly jihadis are sentenced to the very same fate as the rest of things of this world:

Death.

Child of God, fated to Death...

...you are what you hope for.

 

[sufisaint]

Great words, but the problem is there isn't any fairness, justice or order when the "warrior" prevails. Women get raped and children are dragged into propaganda shit to name a few things in the areas where those terrorists are (sort of) ruling.

Purpose is a great thing to have but results like this aren't.

And this was not happening under Saddam or any other dictator...to them the are avenging... when it's over they believe there will be peace...how german women were raped by the red army...

 

[sufisaint]

Show me one.......LOL

I cannot look into any man heart until I see him and talk to him.but show me one honest politician in the US government. Even Rand Paul whom I support is bending under public opinion.

 

[BotanyBoy]

I cannot look into any man heart until I see him and talk to him.

Riiiiight.

but show me one honest politician in the US government.

I never said their was one....just laughing at your suggestion that a theocratic religious rule would be better because religion and it's leadership so honest, fair and just. Because that whole 1800+ years where it wasn't ANY of those things EVER. I guess you kinda skipped over that bit of history eh?

Even Rand Paul whom I support is bending under public opinion.

That's what a representative is SUPPOSED to do....REPRESENT....not dictate.

 

[sufisaint]

Some say God became man to be the "warrior of God"...

...his mission was to defeat man's most lethal enemy of all: death.

Before doing so, he preached his message that the age of his Law was passing, and that with him a new age was born in which words like "fairness, justice and order" would never mean again what they were originally created to mean, and that his new age of Grace would reside so much more gloriously far above such mere mortal doublespeak...

...and that the "poor" would suffer the world's wrath - just as he was fated to - and that they, the meek, would verily inherit the earth no matter the suffering they must endure to achieve eternal life, while those who claim to kill in God's name would suffer eternal damnation.

Some say that that mission was accomplished on the 3rd day, that the war has been won, that there is nothing left to fight for, that the mother of all spoils from that mother of all victories is God's loving grace of eternal life itself...

...and then some don't believe any of that at all.

A Muslim's spiritual jihad is their individual struggle to completely surrender to that truth, man's total submission to God's will...

...that personal struggle is no different within any human who holds God spirit deep in her or his soul.

This jihad, spiritual jihad, is the occupation of the poor, the meek...

...no matter what flavor of religion any tribe desires to claim as its bigoted banner, all veterans of spiritual struggle are simply named children of God.

The worldly, physical, jihadists know nothing of totally submitting to God, for they choose to submit to man; they do, indeed, massacre other humans with the weapons of their bigoted "fairness, justice and order" blazing and swinging away...

...all ordered by men, not God.

No matter the particular flavor of religion any tribe desires to fly as its bigoted, hate furled banner, all worldly jihadis are sentenced to the very same fate as the rest of things of this world:

Death.

Child of God, fated to Death...

...you are what you hope for.

And if a heart is sincere...the soul will rise further...if not the soul will have to amend

 

[Ishmael]

And if a heart is sincere...the soul will rise further...if not the soul will have to amend

Sufi, I think the mystical is going to fly over their heads.............sorry to say.

Ishmael

 

[sufisaint]

Riiiiight.



I never said their was one....just laughing at your suggestion that a theocratic religious rule would be better because religion and it's leadership so honest, fair and just. Because that whole 1800+ years where it wasn't ANY of those things EVER. I guess you kinda skipped over that bit of history eh?



That's what a representative is SUPPOSED to do....REPRESENT....not dictate.

I am not suggesting that as my personal beliefs I am saying that those who believe in sharia law do.... I believe in personal liberty...

 

[eyer]

And if a heart is sincere...the soul will rise further...if not the soul will have to amend

No man's heart can be sincere, saint...

...that's the point.

 

[sufisaint]

No man's heart can be sincere, saint...

...that's the point.

Through a lifetime no but in your last moments... going into the next existence... yes it can in my belief.

 

[smoothg103rd]

One act of someone of a religion doesn't define the religion. How many times has pastors and priests molested little boys? Don't you still go to church? Muslims practice peace, and really aren't as bad as people make them to be.

 

[BotanyBoy]

I am not suggesting that as my personal beliefs I am saying that those who believe in sharia law do.... I believe in personal liberty...

Ah....I thought you were one of those Biblical law in M'uricuh b/c it's a "Christian" nation and Moses wrote the constitution types.

But I can honestly say I would much rather use a greasy car salesman politician than a man of god controlling my life.

No man's heart can be sincere, saint...

...that's the point.

I don't think that's true...I think some hearts are sincere...but they are largely the exception and extraordinarily rare.