Is BusyBody a Racist?

[Recidiva]

nobody out-skeeves me and gets away with it, by the gods...

Skeeving is an excellent reason to put someone on ignore.

It wasn't menacing. He isn't threatening and I'm not afraid of him, it's just skeevy in the way that a flasher only flashes the women and to other guys he just looks like someone with a really big trenchcoat and likes to open it sometimes and why are those women freaking out?

 

[Byron In Exile]

I don't think he recognizes the condescension dripping from those comments. I hadn't thought about the accompanying skeeviness. That surfaces in some of his posts when he tries to make up to Kate for coming down so harshly on gays by objectifying her. Weird logic.

Okay, I just had to revisit this... because in any contest, I am the acknowledged King of Condescension.

I am wearing the crown, and unless my eyes deceive me, I am holding the scepter as well.

 

[Sean]

I don't think he recognizes the condescension dripping from those comments..

Of course he does. It's completely in character with his entire attitude to women.

 

[Byron In Exile]

Not a mystery that vette resorts to abuse. I called him on calling me dear once. He persisted, I put him on ignore.

It's not equivalent to, but is in the tone of a white guy calling a black guy boy.

It assumes a superior social relationship in the sense that a white guy talking to the black guy assumes that being white is superior to being black and therefore boy is justified because of implied social status.

It's an attempt to belittle by assuming an intimate relationship with a woman and trying to use it in a conversational tone to mimic the conversations a couple might have, of a husband chastising his wife and correcting her. I find it immediately offensive and haven't yet met anybody who does it who isn't either an avowed misogynist or someone who is just willing to tromp on any hot button someone might have. Neither is an admirable tactic and I avoid them.

Vette and I never developed an actual friendship, many of his comments were directed, complimentarily or non-complimentarily toward my ownership of boobs and it always comes back to that in a pinch.

It's jolting enough to want to write him off as a person to avoid it happening again. He defended himself disingenuously, I put him on ignore.

I'm noticing that.

He knows what he's doing.

Maybe he doesn't.

What's scarier?

 

[Recidiva]

Okay, I just had to revisit this... because in any contest, I am the acknowledged King of Condescension.

I am wearing the crown, and unless my eyes deceive me, I am holding the scepter as well.

You condescend to someone's intellect, not their boobs.

 

[Byron In Exile]

Not recent. Has always been there. He starts as a respectful gentleman, in a southern sort of yes ma'am tone. I met him first in my Visiting Hours thread.

But once I'd moved into political discussions, the yes ma'am was gone and was replaced with dear.

Both indicate an inability to stop addressing a female as a female and speak to them as if they were just a person.

The strategy is not directed toward men. But to Vette, you're a madonna or you're a whore. It's pretty obvious in its delivery. As a guy you likely don't pick up on it and just think he's being courtly and then prickly.

That's... interesting.

As a male, it does sort of slip by...

You're one type of object, or the other type of object.

So funny, because men ought to be able to see that...

 

[Byron In Exile]

Boobs are awesome. But with great boobs come great responsibility.

Every woman needs to realize this fact.

 

[Byron In Exile]

Hah. I've yet to detect skeeve in you.

Well, I'm trying my best...

Skeeving ain't easy.

 

[Recidiva]

I'm noticing that.

Maybe he doesn't.

What's scarier?

Yes, he does. Same way that someone calling a black person boy knows what he's doing.

"What, he's male, he's a boy. It doesn't MEAN anything."

"What, she's a girl, and she's dear to me. It doesn't MEAN anything."

It's code and it's malicious not only in its delivery, but in its defense.

He's not scary. He's just icky. He's not going to have a good point in a conversation or say something funny enough to want to have to wade through vats of ick.

If you don't understand the social mindset and convention, watch "Mad Men" - any five minutes of it will do most likely.

Women must be condescended to and have things explained in small words and kept in their place, or they get uppity.

 

[cjh]

Okay, I just had to revisit this... because in any contest, I am the acknowledged King of Condescension.

I am wearing the crown, and unless my eyes deceive me, I am holding the scepter as well.

Your condescension tends to be grounded in you mastery of the matter at hand. Big difference.

 

[Byron In Exile]

You condescend to someone's intellect, not their boobs.

I... well, yes.

But it's condescension, in any case.

And I'm the best closer.

Ever.

And, here we go...

 

[Recidiva]

That's... interesting.

As a male, it does sort of slip by...

You're one type of object, or the other type of object.

So funny, because men ought to be able to see that...

Well, I did test the theory. I made a male alt and went into the "dear" threads and said exactly the same thing as a male that I would have said as a female. The same content, only with a switch in gender. I got virtual back slapping and a cigar from Ish and Vette and no reference to my gender. I used the same character in one of Olivia Yearns' thread about gender inequality. Said the same thing Reci said, but as a male, and Olivia tried to rip me a new one. It absolutely matters to some people, if the content is the same, but the gender is swapped. I did tell Olivia after, and she found it interesting and she thought about it. I didn't bother to tell Ish or Vette. Thought isn't their intended goal.

Men get it in a different way. Then it's just someone trying to be alpha and treating you like a beta. That's pretty standard. Then it's just "my penis is bigger than yours."

For a woman, it's not alpha/beta, but man/woman and the dripping undertone is "I have a penis! Submit, woman!" They sound like Ferengi.

It's most prevalent in the guys that grew up during the Mad Men phase and never grew out of it. Younger guys do it, but without the courtly madonna whore thing. You're just all whores.

 

[Recidiva]

I... well, yes.

But it's condescension, in any case.

And I'm the best closer.

Ever.

And, here we go...

Well, you condescend with facts and passion. You can imply that I'm an ignorant moron. You never imply that I'm an ignorant moron because it's my nature due to the boobs thing.

 

[Very_Bad_Man]

Well, you condescend with facts and passion. You can imply that I'm an ignorant moron. You never imply that I'm an ignorant moron because it's my nature due to the boobs thing.

You have boobs?

 

[Byron In Exile]

Yes, he does. Same way that someone calling a black person boy knows what he's doing.

"What, he's male, he's a boy. It doesn't MEAN anything."

"What, she's a girl, and she's dear to me. It doesn't MEAN anything."

It's code and it's malicious not only in its delivery, but in its defense.

He's not scary. He's just icky. He's not going to have a good point in a conversation or say something funny enough to want to have to wade through vats of ick.

If you don't understand the social mindset and convention, watch "Mad Men" - any five minutes of it will do most likely.

Okay, right there. I've seen three episodes, curse me. But now I suddenly get it.

That is... a show I refuse to watch anymore.

Women must be condescended to and have things explained in small words and kept in their place, or they get uppity.

Category 1, Men.

Category 2, Women and household kitchen appliances.

Why do my friends tell me that this show is even good? My best friend's wife loves it.

 

[Byron In Exile]

Your condescension tends to be grounded in you mastery of the matter at hand. Big difference.

Well, I just pick battles that I know I'll win.

That's not rocket science.

However, rocket science can be awesome, too : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5QS3JSRGk3o

 

[Recidiva]

Okay, right there. I've seen three episodes, curse me. But now I suddenly get it.

That is... a show I refuse to watch anymore.

Category 1, Men.

Category 2, Women and household kitchen appliances.

Why do my friends tell me that this show is even good? My best friend's wife loves it.

Yes, that's why I can understand why you haven't seen it and just consider him to be a curmudgeon. You wouldn't see it unless you knew where to look.

Actually I don't like Mad Men at all, but it does demonstrate this principle to a stereotypically ridiculous extent that makes it impossible to miss, since it's seen from the viewpoint of not men together always, but women and men individually dealing with each other.

To me it's soul crushing. Good performances, can't take that away. But it's like Breaking Bad and Deadwood and Sons of Anarchy...it's one note. One crushing note that sucks all the diversity out of the world and hammers on it.

Yes, "Catcher in the Rye" is a masterpiece, apparently, but it's got no variety. These shows all Salinger me to apathy and then sleep.

 

[cjh]

Well, I just pick battles that I know I'll win.

That's not rocket science.

However, rocket science can be awesome, too : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5QS3JSRGk3o

That's part of it. But there's more to it than that, as Reci rightly noted.

I tried a case a long time ago in Orlando. Seemed like half the jurors worked for NASA. They dressed like they were going to church, and they took copious notes.

They might be fun as scientists, but damn they were tough as jurors.

 

[Byron In Exile]

Well, I did test the theory. I made a male alt and went into the "dear" threads and said exactly the same thing as a male that I would have said as a female. The same content, only with a switch in gender. I got virtual back slapping and a cigar from Ish and Vette and no reference to my gender.

omg...

I used the same character in one of Olivia Yearns' thread about gender inequality. Said the same thing Reci said, but as a male, and Olivia tried to rip me a new one. It absolutely matters to some people, if the content is the same, but the gender is swapped. I did tell Olivia after, and she found it interesting and she thought about it. I didn't bother to tell Ish or Vette. Thought isn't their intended goal.

People complain about alts, but this is virtual brilliance.

Men get it in a different way. Then it's just someone trying to be alpha and treating you like a beta.

Well, I do know that I tend to trust those on the board that I perceive to be females more. I... don't know why that is. But maybe the guys are just more into fighting and not much else, idk.

That's pretty standard. Then it's just "my penis is bigger than yours."

Oh, yep. George Carlin's epic monologue about war being a bunch of guys waving their pricks at each other! lol The Bigger Dick Foreign Policy.

"Their dicks are bigger??? Then let's fucking bomb them!!"

For a woman, it's not alpha/beta, but man/woman and the dripping undertone is "I have a penis! Submit, woman!" They sound like Ferengi.

A vagina would be fairly useless without a penis.

I loved this line from Fiona on Burn Notice: "I want to show you something you can't do without me."

It's most prevalent in the guys that grew up during the Mad Men phase and never grew out of it. Younger guys do it, but without the courtly madonna whore thing. You're just all whores.

I suppose I'm lucky to have been born later...

 

[Recidiva]

omg...

People complain about alts, but this is virtual brilliance.

Well, I do know that I tend to trust those on the board that I perceive to be females more. I... don't know why that is. But maybe the guys are just more into fighting and not much else, idk.

Oh, yep. George Carlin's epic monologue about war being a bunch of guys waving their pricks at each other! lol The Bigger Dick Foreign Policy.

"Their dicks are bigger??? Then let's fucking bomb them!!"

A vagina would be fairly useless without a penis.

I loved this line from Fiona on Burn Notice: "I want to show you something you can't do without me."

I suppose I'm lucky to have been born later...

I came to the board with a history of roleplaying men and women and trying to make them as accurate as possible. I even had Hester try to check me out in private conversation and see if she'd think I was a guy or a girl. I would have failed at seducing her, but she wouldn't have doubted I was a guy. Damn that Hester. I got close...but...awwww. It's part of me trying to write with integrity. I have to get rid of stereotypes and just build a demeanor that is subtly different, even though content is exactly the same. The main differences would be that I'd certainly avoid the Recidiva "several sentences in a row all separated by spaces" giveaway, a little more aggression, a little less "uncool" humor to the extent that I'm still funny, but less self deprecating and more aware of social status, more willing to swear, less willing to give ground unless I see an actual advantage in the future of the argument. Less silly, more strategic with an eye to establishing social pecking order. No emoticons. I get a good guy that can deliver what I say as Reci. I established the character in the BDSM boards and didn't leap directly to the GB, deflected all Bisexplicit's accusations of being an alt, purposely misunderstood the slang and the references and got angry of being accused of being someone that I didn't fucking know to begin with. Took a couple of days.

That's the mindset I roleplay with and the mindset I write with when I'm writing for male characters.

I didn't have an agenda other than to blend in and test only gender issues, nothing else, so I didn't really have an easy agenda to out me. I flirted heavily and playfully with the women and ignored the guys mostly until they noticed I was flirting with "their" woman and then I bit back at them.

I don't trust women more than men. I don't trust men more than women.

Any apparent woman who calls another woman "sis" or "hon" is almost certainly a man. We don't do that. Not really.

There are lots of rules as to how to not be a dead giveaway as an alt, and I guess I'm well on guard to them because I've used them myself a hundred times over, concealing gender, agenda or user behind the character.

 

[hogjack]

Any apparent woman who calls another woman "sis" or "hon" is almost certainly a man. We don't do that. Not really.

So my 5,000+ lesbian-action DVD collection does not capture authentic relationships?

Good try. But I know women and THEY do call othe women "sis" and "hon" and a whole lotta other names. I've seen it and heard it.

 

[unregistered]

 

[unregistered]

 

[Recidiva]

So my 5,000+ lesbian-action DVD collection does not capture authentic relationships?

Good try. But I know women and THEY do call othe women "sis" and "hon" and a whole lotta other names. I've seen it and heard it.

Well...I'm not a lesbian, I dunno.

It's not a hard and fast rule, surely. But I swear...it's a good indicator. If you just met someone and they're going out of their way to form a sisterhood bond really quickly by trying to flash some sort of sisterhood symbol...

Just a funny thing. Hell, I had a friend where we just called each other bitch all day. Sis or hon is just as likely a thing among friends, but you have to be friends first before you do it. Jumping straight to the sis or hon...or the bitch...well...be suspicious.

I dunno if there's a male correlary. Sport? Buddy? Anything Tommy Lee Jones calls Will Smith in a Men in Black movie?

 

[hogjack]

Well...I'm not a lesbian, I dunno.

Jumping straight to the sis or hon...or the bitch...well...be suspicious.

Well, from what I can tell friendships develop very quickly amongst females. It seems like women have doubleheaded dildos tucked into every storage and hiding spot feasible for convenient access.

Just an observation from a guy but that's been my experience.