Interesting Gender Perspective

[Selena_Kitt]

Biologist Who Underwent Sex Change Describes Biases Against Women

Interesting perspective!!

 

[cloudy]

I love this:

Barres said he has realized from personal experience that many men are unconscious of the privileges that come with being male, which leaves them unable to countenance talk of glass ceilings and discrimination.

 

[minsue]

After he underwent a sex change nine years ago at the age of 42, Barres recalled, another scientist who was unaware of it was heard to say, "Ben Barres gave a great seminar today, but then his work is much better than his sister's."

*sigh* So typical.

 

[matriarch]

My favourite:

"I can even complete a whole sentence without being interrupted by a man."

Indeed.

 

[matriarch]

"Is it essential to women's progress that women be indistinguishable from men?" he asked.

No. We simply wish the same visibility. An entirely different concept.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

You all know you belong in the kitchen, barefoot and pregnant!

Having had many bosses who were women I still see the bias in some men. Although in the industry I'm in there is less and less of a bias as more and more women are taking the reins of the corporate hierarchy.

Then again in other industries the bias is even noticible to the general public.

 

[impressive]

My favourite:

"I can even complete a whole sentence without being interrupted by a man."

Indeed.

So true.

ETA: There ARE exceptions (before anyone gets all huffy).

 

[LadyJeanne]

One of my friends has a research lab at a major university...half of the grad students and post-docs he's hired are women. But...he's gay, so perhaps he also has a different perspective on people's innate capabilities.

I'm glad Dr. Barres spoke out, and that it's sparking some debate in the scientific community. Good on him!

 

[LadyJeanne]

My favourite:

"I can even complete a whole sentence without being interrupted by a man."

Indeed.

I remember someone doing a study on how often Maggie Thatcher was interrupted when speaking in Parliament...astronomically more often than when men spoke. Good ole Maggie didn't let that stop her, though. She just raised her voice and kept right on talking over the interruptions.

 

[Quiet_Cool]

No. We simply wish the same visibility.

You're all every bit as visible, we're just staring at your titts.

Q_C

 

[Lucifer_Carroll]

I got a new hero.

Seriously though, much of what he describes is much of what makes me so rabid in that respect. As a man, you are indeed taken in confidence and given a slice of what men truly believe about women and want from them because you're all just guys and must think the same way. Even writing it off as bravado, the fantasy it becomes is still stark and frightening and sexist in extremis.

I rather believe he is right in that most men are unconscious (or rather do not pay attention) to better treatment because they have always been treated like such and how women are treated in similar situations is not always immediately apparent. It is why anti-feminists have been acting like martyrs. Because they do not want to lose any advantage and may even be deliberately ignorant to their advantage, but equality demands it. I also like the one scientist's point that the problem with the inherent difference studies is that there needs as well be a control for the biases of the researchers conducting it. Double blind is strictly important in subjective tests or any test with any subjective component as the old psychic debunkings have shown.

Overall though, a man who can make people sputter that hard just by stating what he's seen and what he's been with no fear is a man to admire.

 

[Selena_Kitt]

You're all every bit as visible, we're just staring at your titts.

Q_C

You are so, so bad...

 

[AthenasFury]

After he underwent a sex change nine years ago at the age of 42, Barres recalled, another scientist who was unaware of it was heard to say, "Ben Barres gave a great seminar today, but then his work is much better than his sister's."

*sigh* So typical.

It is sad, but it is also deeply ingrained in society. Men don't realize they're doing it, and I don't think many women realize it's even occurring. It's a little like comparing two pieces of similar merchandise and assuming that because one is more costly that it is of greater quality. It's what we've come to expect as truth.

To be fair, however, I believe the evolution towards equality has begun and is still in motion. I have not lived enough to be able to say for certain, but I can recall certain standards of behavior between men and women and see that things are different today. Perhaps it is not changing as quickly as some would like, but all hope is not lost.

 

[impressive]

I got a new hero.

Seriously though, much of what he describes is much of what makes me so rabid in that respect. As a man, you are indeed taken in confidence and given a slice of what men truly believe about women and want from them because you're all just guys and must think the same way. Even writing it off as bravado, the fantasy it becomes is still stark and frightening and sexist in extremis.

I rather believe he is right in that most men are unconscious (or rather do not pay attention) to better treatment because they have always been treated like such and how women are treated in similar situations is not always immediately apparent. It is why anti-feminists have been acting like martyrs. Because they do not want to lose any advantage and may even be deliberately ignorant to their advantage, but equality demands it. I also like the one scientist's point that the problem with the inherent difference studies is that there needs as well be a control for the biases of the researchers conducting it. Double blind is strictly important in subjective tests or any test with any subjective component as the old psychic debunkings have shown.

Overall though, a man who can make people sputter that hard just by stating what he's seen and what he's been with no fear is a man to admire.

Luc!!! *POUNCE* Good to see you!




Okay [/threadjack]

 

[Jenny_Jackson]

I do wonder if he is able to look back and see what he thought of men who have their ball lopped of in a sex change.

 

[Tom Collins]

Harvard cognitive scientist Steven Pinker and Peter Lawrence, a biologist at Britain's Laboratory of Molecular Biology in Cambridge, said convincing data show there are differences between men and women in a host of mental abilities.

While bias could be a factor in why there were fewer women at the pinnacles of science, both argued that this was not a primary factor.

They say that women aren't reaching the pinnacles of the scientific professions because they aren't as good at it as men, due to biology, and it has nothing to do with social bias. Ok...fine...let these pricks explain why there are practically no female pilots, in and out of the Armed Forces, when it's been proven, scientifically, that women have finer hand eye coordination and quicker refexes.

But even as he played down the role of sexism, Lawrence said the "rat race" in science is skewed in favor of pushy, aggressive people -- most of whom, he said, happen to be men.

The problem with this statement is that a pushy, aggressive man is seen as motivated, driven and just trying to get his due, where as a pushy, aggressive woman is seen as a grasping, dyke bitch who's trying to push her way in where she has no business being. Not to mention that a woman has to be twice as agressive as a man to get close to where he could get with much less effort so she becomes even more offensive to the conciously or unconciously misogynistic pricks that surround her.

 

[minsue]

I do wonder if he is able to look back and see what he thought of men who have their ball lopped of in a sex change.

Are you assuming everyone looks down on transexuals until they themselves have a sex change?

 

[Tom Collins]

Are you assuming everyone looks down on transexuals until they themselves have a sex change?

I'm betting she was thinking that this guy's wondering how someone could give up what he wanted so badly when he didn't have it...not to mention dropping in social/professional status from "one of the guys" to "that broad".

 

[minsue]

I'm betting she was thinking that this guy's wondering how someone could give up what he wanted so badly when he didn't have it...not to mention dropping in social/professional status from "one of the guys" to "that broad".

That makes more sense. I read it three or four times and couldn't figure out where she was going with that. (I can be a wee bit slow sometimes )

 

[Tom Collins]

That makes more sense. I read it three or four times and couldn't figure out where she was going with that. (I can be a wee bit slow sometimes )

Don't you go trying to hog all the ditzyness in the room...I demand my fair share!

 

[minsue]

Don't you go trying to hog all the ditzyness in the room...I demand my fair share!

Nope, too late. I demand my full blonde ditzyness ration.

 

[Tom Collins]

Nope, too late. I demand my full blonde ditzyness ration.

The only reason I'm not blonde is because I have this rare, genetic disorder that makes my scalp produce minute quantities of Preference by L'ORÉAL. [/THREADJACK]

 

[AthenasFury]

Nope, too late. I demand my full blonde ditzyness ration.

*laughs*
Does that work? Maybe I should try sometime.

 

[rgraham666]

Thinking of a line from one of the first female mayors of one of Canada's major cities.

"A woman has to be twice as competent as a man to be considered half as good. Fortunately, it's not difficult."

On the other hand, she made it illegal for unmarried couples to sit together on public transit.

 

[Tom Collins]

Thinking of a line from one of the first female mayors of one of Canada's major cities.

"A woman has to be twice as competent as a man to be considered half as good. Fortunately, it's not difficult."

On the other hand, she made it illegal for unmarried couples to sit together on public transit.

Dude...I had no idea that Canada had slid back into the Dark Ages. Are they excecuted if they kiss while sitting next to each other?