Intent and Obstruction - The Big Difference.

[Lazaran]

So the gaslighting and obfuscation continues as the RWCJ tries to equate / conflate the orange traitor’s classified documents investigation with President Biden’s classified documents investigation.

To clarify;

The BIG DIFFERENCE, as the thread title suggests, is INTENT and OBSTRUCTION.

The only thing similar in the two investigations is the actual possessing of classified documents and the unauthorized locations where they were located.

That ^ is where ALL similarities end.

Full Stop.

A couple links for context and clarification of potential crimes committed and the side by side comparison of the two investigations.

https://cvvnews.com/the-three-crimes-trump-committed-for-taking-classified-documents-to-florida/

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/how-the-trump-biden-classified-documents-situations-compare

Hope that ^ helps.

RWCJ

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

Nobody knows what Biden’s intent was. All we know is documents have been mishandled so a criminal investigation has commenced. Lots of unanswered questions.

 

[Lazaran]

You try to help some people……



BabyBoobs

 

[ll74]

Intent of obstruction is also different.

 

[Lazaran]

Nobody knows what Biden’s intent was.

Quoted for posterity AND irony.

BabyBoobs

 

[KeithD]

I'm quite sure that his intent was to trust what his staff did in packing boxes. That he has fallen short of realizing what problem existed speaks to him not knowing it existed.

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

I'm quite sure that his intent was to trust what his staff did in packing boxes. That he has fallen short of realizing what problem existed speaks to him not knowing it existed.

It’s nice that you’re sure his intent was to trust movers with law degrees, but classified documents were moved more than once and have surfaced in at least three unsecured locations. He’s now the subject of a criminal investigation.

 

[Lazaran]

I'm quite sure that his intent was to trust what his staff did in packing boxes. That he has fallen short of realizing what problem existed speaks to him not knowing it existed.

I just can’t bring myself to hold President Biden to almost impossibly high standards, while the MAGAts have NO standards and hold their representatives to NONE.

(That ^ is not suggesting that I think the discovery of classified documents at various locations associated with Joe Biden should not be investigated.)

I also cannot bring myself to be diverted / distracted from the main point of this thread:

The ultimate justification for criminal indictment in the orange traitor’s case is the demonstrated / exercised willfully intentional illegal possession of classified documents / government property and the obstruction involved in the orange traitor’s attempts to retain the illegally possessed classified documents / government property.

That ^ is THE difference between the two cases.

*nods*

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

I just can’t bring myself to hold President Biden to almost impossibly high standards, while the MAGAts have NO standards and hold their representatives to NONE.

(That ^ is not suggesting that I think the discovery of classified documents at various locations associated with Joe Biden should not be investigated.)

I also cannot bring myself to be diverted / distracted from the main point of this thread:

The ultimate justification for criminal indictment in the orange traitor’s case is the demonstrated / exercised willfully intentional illegal possession of classified documents / government property and the obstruction involved in the orange traitor’s attempts to retain the illegally possessed classified documents / government property.

That ^ is THE difference between the two cases.

*nods*

You and Karine are working overtime this week!

 

[Lazaran]

BabyBoobs forgets that the “Left-wing Deep state” media was going to ignore this, and that the “Left-wing Deep State” DOJ wasn’t going to assign a special counsel to President Biden’s case.

BabyBoobs

 

[Fuzzy1975]

He’s now the subject of a criminal investigation.

He is? I have read a bunch of reports and announcements, so far they lack the word criminal. Bit of your standard RWCJ hyperbole eh?

It might turn into a crime, and if it does convict him, or anyone else who miss handles secret documents.

 

[BluesDriver66]

I'm no fan of Biden. But to believe he is involved in nefarious spy type activity like he is some international criminal mastermind stealing classified documents in order to gain money or power is ludicrous. Biden is exactly what he appears to be. A dottering old man. An out of step, way past his prime, party hack who finally got his turn to be President. More interested in eating ice cream and listening to oldies on the record machine than anything else.

 

[Chobham]

So the gaslighting and obfuscation continues as the RWCJ tries to equate / conflate the orange traitor’s classified documents investigation with President Biden’s classified documents investigation.

To clarify;

The BIG DIFFERENCE, as the thread title suggests, is INTENT and OBSTRUCTION.

The only thing similar in the two investigations is the actual possessing of classified documents and the unauthorized locations where they were located.

That ^ is where ALL similarities end.

Full Stop.

A couple links for context and clarification of potential crimes committed and the side by side comparison of the two investigations.

https://cvvnews.com/the-three-crimes-trump-committed-for-taking-classified-documents-to-florida/

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/how-the-trump-biden-classified-documents-situations-compare

Hope that ^ helps.

RWCJ

You are seriously full of shit. The judge take that into account during the sentencing phase.

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

He is? I have read a bunch of reports and announcements, so far they lack the word criminal. Bit of your standard RWCJ hyperbole eh?

It might turn into a crime, and if it does convict him, or anyone else who miss handles secret documents.

Lol. Why do you think a special counsel was appointed? Merrick Garland laid out the facts of the case very clearly. Classified documents were transferred and stored in multiple unsecured locations.

 

[icanhelp1]

You and Karine are working overtime this week!

You and Karine are working overtime this Laz and Karine just don’t get it. Twelve years of a two tier justice system, Dems looking down their snooty noses, accusing Trump and his allies of doing exactly what they themselves have been doing behind the scenes with the blessings of a complicit media and tyranny by party majority and getting away with it. There is no defense for Trump’s behavior just as there’s no defense for Biden. Need to fix the system not throw patriots in jail. Hillary running the state department on an unsecured server, exonerated by an FBI director acting outside of his purview, massaging the interpretation of US code to avoid prosecution of an obvious violation of law. Impeaching a president for requesting an investigation into corrupt dealings of a VPs son employed by a corrupt energy company with zero qualifications surfing on the old man’s coat tails. Gone are the days of Sam Nunn, Bob Dole

 

[KeithD]

I just can’t bring myself to hold President Biden to almost impossibly high standards, while the MAGAts have NO standards and hold their representatives to NONE.

As a lifelong politician--quite successfully so--he gets held to a standard by me of being aware of what was getting "the other guy" in trouble and covering his own butt on this issue, especially knowing how the opposition does its propaganda campaigning. I think Biden dropped the ball on this one.

 

[Lazaran]

There is definitely a criminal investigation (multiple in fact) directly involving / targeting the orange traitor.

Special Counsel Robert Hur, on the other hand, is currently investigating the mishandling of classified documents by SOMEONE from the Obama / Biden administration.. Not specifically President Biden. Aides of then Vice President Biden who likely / probably / could have packed up the classified documents have been / are being interviewed by the FBI.

I’m sure BabyBoobs will break the news when it becomes indisputable fact that then Vice President Biden personally exercised / demonstrated willful intent / obstruction of justice related to the illegal mishandling / possessing of classified documents.

BabyBoobs

 

[Lazaran]

As a lifelong politician--quite successfully so--he gets held to a standard by me of being aware of what was getting "the other guy" in trouble and covering his own butt on this issue, especially knowing how the opposition does its propaganda campaigning. I think Biden dropped the ball on this one.

Even a master juggler drops a ball once in a while.

Of all the balls President Biden was trying to keep in the air at the time, dropping the one related to potentially mishandled classified documents would appear to be the least concerning. imho.

*nods*

 

[icanhelp1]

There is definitely a criminal investigation (multiple in fact) directly involving / targeting the orange traitor.

Special Counsel Robert Hur, on the other hand, is currently investigating the mishandling of classified documents by SOMEONE from the Obama / Biden administration.. Not specifically President Biden. Aides of then Vice President Biden who likely / probably / could have packed up the classified documents have been / are being interviewed by the FBI.

I’m sure BabyBoobs will break the news when it becomes indisputable fact that then Vice President Biden personally exercised / demonstrated willful intent / obstruction of justice related to the illegal mishandling / possessing of classified documents.

BabyBoobs

Nobody believes that, nobody believes willful intent but that will be decided in a court of law if it gets to that point.

 

[jomar]

You are seriously full of shit. The judge take that into account during the sentencing phase.

Huh? Please elaborate. Obstruction would be the nut of the case. trump lied about having them then wouldn’t give them back

 

[KeithD]

Even a master juggler drops a ball once in a while.

Of all the balls President Biden was trying to keep in the air at the time, dropping the one related to potentially mishandled classified documents would appear to be the least concerning. imho.

*nods*

Yes, but I don't see why that means to pretend this wasn't a serious Biden administration miscue. This doesn't have to be a "nothing to see here, only look over there" issue. The Biden administration could have prevented it from going there. They haven't, letting it spin out of control as recently as two days ago.

 

[Lazaran]

Huh? Please elaborate. Obstruction would be the nut of the case. trump lied about having them then wouldn’t give them back

That ^ AND the orange traitor demonstrated / exercised willful intent by knowingly illegally possessing the classified documents and government property before obstructing the investigation and recovery of those illegally possessed classified documents and government property.

*nods*

 

[Lazaran]

Yes, but I don't see why that means to pretend this wasn't a serious Biden administration miscue. This doesn't have to be a "nothing to see here, only look over there" issue. The Biden administration could have prevented it from going there. They haven't, letting it spin out of control as recently as two days ago.

The mishandled classified documents existed, so they were always going to be an issue.

That ^ is why I don’t see the actual timing of the search, discovery, and announcement as a major blunder.

Tell me when a better time for the search, discovery, and announcement would have been.

The understandable delay involving the Obama / Biden administration’s potentially mishandled classified documents search, discovery, and announcement actually gave the orange traitor the time and the rope to do a really competent job of hanging himself.

I’m fine with that ^.

 

[KeithD]

The mishandled classified documents existed, so they were always going to be an issue.

That ^ is why I don’t see the actual timing of the search, discovery, and announcement as a major blunder.

Tell me when a better time for the search, discovery, and announcement would have been.

The understandable delay involving the Obama / Biden administration’s potentially mishandled classified documents search, discovery, and announcement actually gave the orange traitor the time and the rope to do a really competent job of hanging himself.

I’m fine with that ^.

They only needed to be returned to a logical storage site, Then they'd just be considered misfiled. Or, if the chain of command didn't end in Biden's hands (which it likely wouldn't. I've already noted how documents move), they could be destroyed and wondered about. To evaporate the comparison issue they only needed to be found somewhere other than where Biden worked or lived. If they were traceable to Biden's office/home, they could have been returned last spring with no consternation about them. Which leads to that I'd already posted what a better time for search and discovery was--last spring was best, when it was evident Trump would be in trouble over taking, hoarding, and not giving back documents. And early November would have been second best.

The point is that the best people to discover any of it would be the Archives people. As of last Thursday it was uncleared personal lawyers doing the searching. The best time to have it discovered anywhere in Biden's orbit is NEVER. There was time and opportunity to do that. What apparently was missing was the political savvy to connect the dots in that time.

It's January, and the administration has continued to have new document turnups as late as last Thursday--and in an obvious location that it apparently didn't occur to them to get locked down. THEY DID NOT GET THIS CLEANED UP/TAMPED DOWN FOR THREE MONTHS.

How many times do I have to repeat the obvious?

Are you such a partisan that you can't acknowledge how long they've been screwing up over this?

 

[icanhelp1]

They only needed to be returned to a logical storage site, Then they'd just be considered misfiled. Or, if the chain of command didn't end in Biden's hands (which it likely wouldn't. I've already noted how documents move), they could be destroyed and wondered about. If they were traceable to Biden's office/home, they could have been returned last spring with no consternation about them. Which leads to that I'd already posted what a better time for search and discovery was--last spring was best, when it was evident Trump would be in trouble over taking, hoarding, and not giving back documents. And early November would have been second best.

The point is that the best people to discover any of it would be the Archives people. As of last Thursday it was uncleared personal lawyers doing the searching.

It's January, and the administration has continued to have new document turnups as late as last Thursday--and in an obvious location that it apparently didn't occur to them to get locked down. THEY DID NOT GET THIS CLEANED UP/TAMPED DOWN FOR THREE MONTHS.

How many times do I have to repeat the obvious?

Are you such a partisan that you can't acknowledge how long they've been screwing up over this?

Not to worry, Biden’s a democrat. I’m sure the DOJ will use prosecutorial discretion or drag the case on till after the 2024 elections. I’m sure Special counsel findings will amount to a hill of beans, they’ll blame Trump.