Incest... why won't this topic just go away???

[poohlive]

Hello everyone... a few days ago I was reading a certain thread written by a woman who loved incest, and couldn't get enough of it. She was criticized about this, and a more important topic of molestation occured, rather than an issue of incest.
It's basically my job to get the old ball rolling again.
Incest...
Is it accepted in our society?
Well. I answered this question a while ago, but I was basically shooting from the hip. I did a lot of researchsince then... a lot. I mean I dug into everything from the Bible to Art books on this subject.
Let me start by saying I will try to be formal and only use facts in the following paragraphs, I won't voice my opinion until the end.
The bible, as we all know, is a true form of good. This is where people learned that homosexuality is wrong, because it says so in the bible. No one should argue that (well I might later, but not now, this is incest... let me continue). So, my first premise. The bible is a source of righiousness for all mankind.
In the Bible, I recorded two account of incest... although I only read a total of 50 pages, so there is more than likely many more.
The story of Abraham and Sarah, an old couple, were called upon by God, and said that they were going to have a son. They both laughed because the were so old.
In fact, the son's name was eventually Isaac, which in Hebrew means, to make someone laugh.
Anyway, in Genesis 20. A king comes to Abraham, and asks about his wife. Abraham states that it is her sister.
The king becomes outraged and takes his wife/sister away to his country. God then makes the king, and all his people in his kingdom (literally interpreted) Impotent. The King, whose name is Abim'elech, asked God why he cursed him. God said that he took away Sarah from his husband.
The king is puzzled by this, but takes Sarah back to his husband/brother, and gives them oxen and sheep and slaves and things, for an apology. He is then lifted of his impotence problem, and goes off to live a full life. God, then blesses the incesting couple with a child.
God... actually wanted that incesting couple together soo badly that he made a whole kingdom barren until they were returned.
Another example:
Lot, was a person who fled Sodom because God was destroying it. He, and his two daughters, who, as the bible put's it, have not known a man, fled to another city. Lot lived in the hills away from the city, A cave, actually. Well one night the two daughters are talking to each other, and they realize that Lot will have no grandchildren. There are no men nearby, and they are so far away from the city. They decide to get their father drunk, and basically rape him.
So, they do. They give him much wine, he passes out, and they impregnate themselves. Genesis 19, 36 "Thus both the daughters of of Lot were with child by their father."
The two sons, grew up, and God gave them the blessing to both become kings of kingdoms, the Moabites, and the Ammonities.
Lot too became leader of the city. Nothing but good came from this incestful act...
So, I suggest premise two, The bible has many examples of incestual acts being praised, not punished, by God.
Any good thesis will have proof of a statment from more than one source.
Cleopatra, is one of the most famous queen's of all Egypt... she was married to her brother. THey both ruled on high as the leaders of Egypt for a long time. In fact, most Egyptians were married into their family. Brothers, cousins, aunt's, uncles, and so on. It must have been such an interesting reunion party (I am sorry, even a thesis has comedy).
Edgar Allen Poe, one of the greatest writers of all time, married his cousin when he was 25, and she was 15... let's not go into the whole molestation thing again, but it's a fact. Oh, and in case you were wondering, it was his first cousin, not a distant 2nd or third.
To go more on this, most southern states now accept 1rst cousins wedding each other... seems like that society is accepting it to me.
Oedipus Tyrannus, a well formed greek tragedy speaks of a man, who kills his father to take his place as king, and marry his mother.
In fact in the greek culture itself, it was common when the father died, that a son take his field... animals... wife, everything.
Even our beloved Weird Harold has stated that his aunt and uncle were cousins, and have a very happy relationship.
There is a whole category of incest in this, and many other sexual story sites. If it wasn't that accepted in society, then why is it written about so much?
You are probably going to state that just because it is written about doesn't mean it is actually done. I would like you to now considere rape.
Rape is a topic in many sexual stories as well. It is also happening a lot in this day and age. I am not condoning rape, far from it, it is an awful thing for anyone to go through; however, it is written about and it is done.
So, I would know like to suggest premise three, Incest was and is happening.
Now, all three of these premises go toward my conclusion, which is...
Incest is more a part of society than anyone has ever thought before.

Ahah, now time for the opinion part.
Incest was praised in the Bible. Incest was praised in the greek culture, incest was praised with the Egyptians, incest was praised with God....
and beside the whole thing about rape and molestation, which I have before stated is wrong, why do people frown upon it so much?
I would like to go back to an earlier example I used.
We don't accept drugs in our society, and yet 1 out of every 4 teenagers has tried marajuana. ONe quarter of the people do something that society frowns upon... doesn't seem like it is so unaccepted to me.
When I was 12, and my cousin was 14, we experimented, as most young people do. We played "Doctor" and things. We both grew out of it, and she now has a wonderful husband, living in a great house, and has two beautiful children, and I am now in college, going towards a degree in English.
I believe my whole point in this, is why are people so closed minded about this issue? Incest might be a word that people frown upon, but didn't they also frown upon homosexuality a couple of decades earlier. I think it's time we started accepting things that happen in society, and not ignore them.
One final point. I believe I reported my opinion with much maturity and good mannerisms. I wasn't trying to bad mouth anyone, nor was I trying to change anyone's opinion. I simply wanted to share some facts and some opinions that I myself have discovered.
There, now that I am finished, let the mud slinging begin...

 

[Guest]

I would like to start off by saying that was well written hon. You stated many things that earlier WH (and myself) was trying to explain to a few closed-minded people. Some people are so quick to jump to conclusions baised on what they think is fact. As stated, molestation is wrong (and I believe anyone who is caught doing it should be punished to the full extent of the law), incest is not. Incest is not solely responsible for birth defects as once believed. A woman who drinks, smokes, etc. has a higher chance of giving birth to a child with a defect than a woman who bares her biological relation's child. That is fact. I've read many reports and have done research on birth defects for college courses in the past.

As I've stated in the past, I could have sex with any willing adult in my "family" and not be committing incest. However, I could be by having sex with any stranger out there. Naturally I'm not going to stop having sex! Just as, I would not stop having sex with someone just because I found out they were relation. I would never have sex with an under age person, therefore, I would never molest anyone. By having sex with a biological relation, I would merely be conducting an act of incest. Nothing more.

~Tiggs~

 

[KillerMuffin]

Oh good grief you guys. Enough already. Don't make me take my trusty whiffle ball bat to this thread.

 

[Guest]

Last I rememberd this was a free, open site?

 

[KillerMuffin]

Yep its a free open site, you can post anything and everything you want on incest providing it meets the minimum age requirement. The corollary? I can run through the thread smacking people with my fictional trusty whiffle ball bat. Ain't democracy grand

 

[Guest]

~sigh~

At any rate I will wait to talk further when people are willing to have an open, and intelligent discussion. Some of ya have to be out there somewhere?

 

[Nicole]

You know I just found this interesting and thought I would say something.

Laurel once said something about the amount of "Hit's" on certain things. Correct me if I'm wrong but Incest was one of the top things right?

I notice that this thread has had lots of "Hits" on it too. Incest is such a Taboo subject, but I just find it interesting that so many "Hits" are made on it.

So why is Incest so interesting?? I know I read it, and yes the fictional type does turn me on so to speak, but I don't agree with incest, consensual or not. Fiction and Real life are very different.

Role playing is another thing that is brought up when these discussions happen. Role playing is different, you are two adults that are fully aware of what is taking place in your life, you make the decision to do that, you ARE NOT in any way related, that is why it's called Role Playing.

I just wanted to say my thought on this too. Have a nice day

 

[wolfy]

I'm willing to discuss it openly. I have already stated before that I don't think there is anything wrong with any two consenting adults having sex with eachother no matter what the relationship between them is. I thought pooh's post was really good also. Why does anyone think that somethign two people do in the privacy of their own home Is wrong? You might not personally think incest is something you would want to h ave but there is no reason for you to tell others they are sick because they do. Also the whole birth defect thing seems like a really crazy reason not to have a relationship. I mean it's not like there arn't many forms of birth control out there. Btw if we want the subject to really end I guess we should stop replying to the posts. I'm really just repeating myself so thats what i'll try and do from now on

 

[KillerMuffin]

*sigh* Willing to openly discuss incest. Its wrong. And thats a fact. Number 2. This is the what, 4th thread to be started on the subject in a week? Isn't that an exhaustive enough discussion for you considering there are around 100 replies on the other 3?

There is not intelligent discussion on this. Proponents of incest will not agree that it is wrong. Dissidents of incest will not agree that it is right. Why rehash it, the hash was done to death the first 3 times.

Resurrecting an issue thats been beaten to death past the bloody bits stage is slightly less then opening up an intelligent discussion. If you'd bothered to go back and check, you would have noticed there was no intelligent discussion, just a lot of temper on everyones side.

Why? Because the subject of incest is entirely one of opinion. You can't prove or disprove opinion no matter how many so called "facts" you may choose to cite. An agreement to disagree on this issue has been reached. Lets let sleeping dogs lie, dead horses rot, and any other stupid cliche you can think of.

Don't be surprised when this thread degenerates into another argument, because thats all this is. Intelligent discussion on incest, thats funny.

 

[Roll-One]

I may be speeking out of turn, but here goes....

Since i have been coming in here, i have seen alot of subjects, some more than others, this subject comes up alot, and i have noticed that alot of ppl look and or respond to it... some see nothing wrong with incest, and others don't like it very much. as for me, i'm very opened minded, i see nothing wrong with two consenting adults no matter what there relationship is, i have a problem if there under age, that shouldn't happen...

I like the different views ppl have, but everyone has a right to there opinion, and i have always tried to respect there opinion, whether or not i agree or disagree with it....

If i don't care for the title of there post, i simply don't read it.
its as simple as that...
well, thats my opinion i guess..

 

[Guest]

Poohlive and Tiggs, you need to go talk to Rolly, get your stories straight and report back to us in 25 words or less what you all think (I don't think so).

Poohlive, aren't you the person who got bounced off the board for talking to yourself about 100 times in one night? Deja vu.

Tiggs, it is indeed unfortunate your brain isn't as big as your clit.

 

[Dudley]

Jesus Loves the Little Children

First off, I don't give a rat's ass about incest. I don't like any of my relatives well enough to talk to them, let alone fuck them.

Let's talk about logic here for a moment:

The bible, as we all know, is a true form of good. This is where people learned that homosexuality is wrong, because it says so in the bible. No one should argue that (well I might later, but not now, this is incest... let me continue). So, my first premise. The bible is a source of righiousness for all mankind.

Right there your argument falls apart. The bible is a book, one of many, that people use for spiritual guidance. You may believe it is a "true form of good" and a source of righiousness (sic), and you may wish it were so for all mankind, but it ain't. Ergo, your premise is faulty, therefore your conclusion is faulty. Expand your "research" to include the Koran, the Torah, the Baghavad Gita, the Book of Mormon, the Tao Te Ching, the works of Confucius and Buddha and maybe the Big Book of AA, then get back to me.

Oh, yeah. While you were citing Poe and Oedipus, you forgot all about Jerry Lee Lewis. I'm sure this would explain all the inbreeding in Louisiana.

 

[Oliver Clozoff]

You make some good points, Poohlive (along with a few not-so-good ones; can it really be argued that Oedipus the King demonstrates societal acceptance of incest? After all, it's a tragedy in which Oedipus marries his mother not knowing her identity and then pokes out his eyes with sharp sticks when he discovers the truth, right? Then he curses himself, banishes himself from the city and the chorus drones on for about 10 pages about what a pathetic bastard he is).

I've sat back and enjoyed the debate on several different threads over the last week or so and soaked in a number of the good arguments. The law and ethics aren't my fortes, but I've learned a lot from what's been said. They've been discussed ad nauseum here, so I think I'll address your examples and the sociobiology of the issue.

You bring up a number of historical examples (and quasi-historical examples that I don't necessarily put any faith in) of civilizations in which incest has existed and even flourished. The historical truth of much of what you state is undeniable. The pharohs did marry their sisters. There have been other societies whose ruling classes have practiced incest. The royal families of Europe were so inbred that much of world history has been the consequence of what doctors euphemistically refer to as "consanguineous mating". The fact that the son of Czar Nicholas and Alexandra had hemophilia from cross-breeding set off the chain of events that led to Alexandra's recruitment of Rasputin as a faith-healer to cure the boy's illness, which in turn led to the fall of the czar, the revolution, and the eventual establishment of Communist Russia... if you look at it that way, you can blame much of the evil of the twentieth century on incest.

The truth is, though, that the acceptance of incest throughout history has been rare, and when accepted at all, it's been almost exclusively the prerogative of the royal or ruling classes. If you do any serious anthropological research, you'll find that virtually every civilization in recorded history has had a prohibition against incest among the common people. These societies range from the most primitive to the most advanced; the most ancient to the most modern.

The question then is why have all these civilizations, separated by time and great distances all come up with the same prohibition against sex with relatives? Can it be that hundreds of societies arrived at the same prohibition by coincidence? Logic suggests not, but rather that there's probably some inherent value in the prohibition of incest that, consciously recognized or not, benefits each society in which it's imposed. The argument is founded on the idea that societal practices are subject to the same evolutionary "survival of the fittest" pressures that life is, and that the practices which benefit a society are retained, while the ones that harm it are discarded.

So, what's so inherently damaging to society in incest that would have it rejected in virtually every instance? I suspect part of it is that sexual relationships among family members threaten the family unit, society's fundmental structure. And aren't families fragile enough as they are without adding an additional layer of boyfriend/girlfriend conflict on top of it all?

That idea's just a theory of mine and I have no evidence to support it. However, there is obvious evidence (mentioned again and again in arguments) that incest breeds defective individuals. It's very simple genetics well-supported by hard scientific evidence. The likelihood of autosomal recessive diseases increases along with the similarity between the parents' genomes.

Simply explained, most of us carry "bad genes" inherited from one parent which could potentially cause disease, but don't cause harm because they're masked by a corresponding "good gene" from our other parent. Mating with individuals genetically different from you decreases the likelihood of receiving 2 "bad genes", while mating with someone genetically similar (i.e. a relative) increases the likelihood. When you get two "bad genes" you get the disease.

The closer two parents are related, therefore, the more likely they bear a child with an autosomal recessive disease (hemophilia, sickle cell, cystic fibrosis, etc.)

I'm doing a pediatrics rotation now, and we're taking care of one child from a backwater town with a bizarre genetic disease seen almost nowhere else in the world. He'll die before he's 3. He's the result of his parents staying a bit too close to home.

We live in a day and age of effective contraception, so perhaps this prohibition against incest isn't as beneficial to society as it was before. Incestuous lovers' risk of bearing children is decreased. Maybe we'll come to accept it eventually, but I suspect not.

Families are messed up enough already.

 

[Guest]

Poohlive and Tiggs, you need to go talk to Rolly, get your stories straight and report back to us in 25 words or less what you all think (I don't think so).

Poohlive, aren't you the person who got bounced off the board for talking to yourself about 100 times in one night? Deja vu.

Tiggs, it is indeed unfortunate your brain isn't as big as your clit.

1.) What would either Pooh or myself talking to Rolly have to do with this actual thread or our personal opinions?

2.) Obviously Pooh did not get "bounced off" the board since he is still here.

3.) I am a rather intelligent woman. My clit size has nothing to do with my "brain size", or my smarts if you will. Thank you.

4.) I'm curious to know, dear Troll, if you are indeed a registered member feeling the need to "hide"? If not, hell, register. Make a place for yourself here. I'm sure the Dee-Cole-i troll thingy could always use a "friend".

~Tiggs~
http://smilecwm.tripod.com/sd3/lise.gif

 

[poohlive]

Killermuffin: Thanks for being brutally honest. I know that the topic of incest has been brought up quite a lot the past few days... hence the title, but I did create this thread in particular to have an open honest and mature discussion, not a fight.

Dudley: Ok, I admit I put the word true in that statement, and it was wrong. The Bible isn't a true form of good, but if you look at the 2 major religions in the world, christianity and catholic, they both use the bible as a reference, and a damn good one. So, I adjust my first premise to be A form of good, and not a true form of good.
Premise 1 Valid, and conclusion Valid...

Oliver: It's true. Oedipus gouges his eyes, his wife/mother kills herself, and Thebes goes to hell in a handbasket. lol, and there is more than ten minutes of chorus cackling, but the play is one of the most famous in all the world... a tragedy or not, that says something.
I like tha fact that there are many societies in which incest isn't a part, or against the law to do. This is a good point, as much as it was accepted, it was also denounced, probably moreso, more research is definitally in order.
Yet, I do have a life, and I can't go running all over every single piece of literature ever made for incesting tribes of the Yukatan for this website, I do have a life. I just came across these few points, and decided to show them to you...
Whats that ancient saying go, "Don't shoot the messanger."

I just want to say again, I don't want to change anyone's mind. I simply stated a few facts, and my opinion in reference to those facts.
I myself don't have a religion, and am only reading the Bible because I am bored, and I can't spend all my time online.
I thank everyone, who favors Incest or not, that participated in this thread. Every opinion does count.


[Edited by poohlive on 10-08-2000 at 11:30 PM]

 

[poohlive]

Scarf... I don't actually have any desire to talk to Rolly, she seems to have a closed mind thing about this whole incest topic. I probably would too if I were molested when I was 5... although I don't know her story, so I am not going to post any opinions about them.
If you would like too though, I would love to get your e mail address, and maybe we an exchange those 25 words... my e mails is easily accessable... I am calling your bluff.
Bounced... no Pooh's don't bounce, we giggle. And, I was warned about talking to myself. Actually, I am proud to say, I posted about 400 times before I got cut off so unexpectedly. I just want to add, everyone keeps saying this is a free board, but when I posted that, someone explained to me that it was costing Laurel money to keep my post up there....
so, does it cost money or not? That is what I want to know.
I asked, because it was my opinion, or rather my rantings of a multiple personality, that it could still be on. I didn't even want credit for so many posts, but I did want people to see it.
But people didn't like it, and it usually goes the majority rules, even if the majority is wrong sometimes (I wrote the word sometimes... not most of the time or all the time, but sometimes), so I let it slide... as I am doing now.
I am glad you were able to think that far back though, it means I am stuck inside your mind. After about 3 months you still remember it, you must really like me, or really hate me. Either way I am flattered.

 

[goddess_euphoria]

.

[Edited by goddess_euphoria on 10-09-2000 at 12:03 AM]

 

[goddess_euphoria]

If you do any serious anthropological research, you'll find that virtually every civilization in recorded history has had a prohibition against incest among the common people. These societies range from the most primitive to the most advanced; the most ancient to the most modern.
-not sure if that will quote it self, but it came from Oliver Clozoff

Being an anthropology major, I had to add a little to this... It's true that all most every society, civilized or not, has an "incest taboo." Though that depends on what you'd classify as incest. Aboriginal tribes are structured on cross-cousin marriages (i.e. a girl would marry her father's sister's son, or her mother's brother's son) First cousins, blood related, considered incest in America. Just a thought.

 

[Siren]

DIE SUBJECT MATTER DIE...!!!!!!

 

[Deborah]

Thanks people. You just helped me polish off my new story "Goodbye Sis." I needed something else between where Slut_boy, on the eve of our wedding, tells me of his incestuous relationship with his sis and the next day when Slut_boy marries his sis at the point of my shotgun. So after I hear Slut_boy's slutty story, I call my minister and Dr. Oliver to get the scoop on this incest business.

Incidentally, Slut_boy and his sis, 'er wife, then have three little boys. Real little; all three are midgets. The three little midgets, Larry, Curley and Moe also have a panty fetish and they hang out with dad at Victoria's Secret.

Slut_boy's sis, 'er wife, meets a tragic end. That's what for the title "Goodbye Sis." She chokes to death on a big pickle. Well, actually, it was Bobtoad's penis, the part he didn't want. After the penis reduction surgery, Bobtoad gave me the extra six inches and I stuck it in the pickle car. The gift was due to Bobtoad's gratitude for me writing his biography, "The Boy with the Monster Dick."

Of course my story "Goodbye Sis" is absolutely the truth and nothing but the truth.

 

[Xander]

Deborah is back!!!

 

[Guest]

The Bible isn't a true form of good, but if you look at the 2 major religions in the world, christianity and catholic, they both use the bible as a reference

Heehee. Hello, Poohlive. You know, Christianity and Catholicism aren't two different religions. The Catholics invented Cristianity. I'd even dispute the fact that Christianity is the major world religion. I think I read that the world's biggest population is Chinese. Judaism, Islam, Buddhism and Hinduism are just as popular with their many millions of followers.

But, of course, I'm just nitpicking.

Here are some of my thoughts on incest and why I think it can, in the majority of cases, be damaging to individuals. As has been mentioned, the genetic defects caused by in-breeding become less relevant when there's no intention of starting a family and reliable contraception is being used.

But there are still psychological factors involved which can be extremely damaging.

In the majority of reported cases, incest involves an older family member (usually an adult) sexually abusing, raping or coercing a child or teenager. As Weird Harold says, this is molestation. He asks, what difference it makes whether the molestor is a relative or not. Rape, sexual abuse and coersion of a minor is a brutal, terrible thing whoever does it. Victims of abuse are left traumatised, their self-esteem badly damaged. Many turn to damaging habits - drugs, alcohol or self-harming - to try and block out the painful memories. Often victims of abuse feel they can't cope with the distress any more and turn to suicide as a way out.

Coersion of a minor is damaging because a child or teenager does not have the mental or emotional ability to make an informed choice about sex. They are therefore unnable to give true consent. They don't fully realise the implications of what they are doing. That's why this is seen in law as Statutory Rape.

But here's the answer to Harold's question - what difference does it make whether the molestor is a relative or not? When it's a family member who has raped, sexually abused or coerced you into having sex, there is an added level of torment - the feeling of betrayal. A child grows up unconditionally trusting that their older relatives - mother, father, brothers, sisters, uncles, aunts etcetera - love them and have their best interests at heart. By raping, sexually abusing or coercing, an incestuous father, uncle or whoever is betraying that trust. The victim of incestuous molestation is often left feeling completely alone in the world. "If I can't even trust my own father then who can I trust?"

Now, even in the case of consenting adults there are strong family dynamics involved. Unless the incestuous couple are twins / the same age, there is going to be an imbalance of power in the relationship - kind of like the imbalance of power you have between a teacher and a pupil or a psychiatrist and their client.

Because of the hierarchy that families have, an older family member tends to exert more influence and power over younger children or teenagers. Think of a teenage girl, just reached puberty. As she edges towards womanhood, she's learning how to think and act like an adult, tentatively exploring her changing emotions, sexuality and attraction to potential partners. Sometimes she'll even feel like her emotions are too strong and she's losing control of them - just look at footage of The Beatles's screaming fans in the '60s, most of them teenage girls. It's this exploring of new emotions that leads many teenage girls to have crushes on teachers or older pupils. This is natural - the girl is learning about herself and her sexual attraction so that she'll be better able to cope with being a woman when she reaches adulthood. But if a teacher uses the girl's confused emotions - her "teenage crush" - to persuade her to have sex, then this is a betrayal of trust. He's used his power and influence over her to manipulate and coerce her into doing something she might not agree to if she was three or four years older and able to make an informed choice.

Now, imagine that the teenage girl has a crush on her older brother or uncle. If he uses this crush to manipulate her into bed while she is still underage, then that is clearly molestation / sexual abuse. The law would see it that way, as would the majority of the general public. If he waits until her 18th birthday, before he makes his move, there is still, I think, an imbalance of power between them, which could be damaging to her psychology.

I'd say it's still a little dubious for a teacher to have sex with his 18-year-old ex-pupil. The school would definitely frown on the bahaviour and I'm sure the Parent Teachers Association would have a few things to say. I guess, though, that they're both consenting adults and legally there's nothing stopping them.

With a family member in a similar situation, though, it's a bit different. It doesn't matter how old you get, the group dynamics and family hierarchy tend to stay in place. Often, an overbearing father will still exert strong influence over his sons and daughters even when they're well into their thirties. (I still don't use my Dad's pens or coffee cup. Haha.) Even when this girl reaches her 18th birthday, there'll probably still be part of her that "looks up to" her elder brother, uncle or father. There may still be quite a strong imbalance of power between them, which the older family member can use to manipulate the woman. This could do some damage to her psychology. She may begin to feel mistreated, even abused. She may also find it hard to break off the relationship if she changes her mind because of the strong family ties and that imbalance of power.

But, another damaging aspect to this, is Society's general distaste for the idea of incest.

Weird Harold asked what the difference between anal sex and incest is. Both are illegal in many US States. Both are done in the privacy of the home. The big difference is the level of disgust that society in general feels towards incest. WH could just have easily used cannabis as an example. Smoking pot is illegal but, certainly in Britain, if you did a survey you'd find that most young adults have either tried cannabis at some point or at least don't see it as particularly evil. Hell, even the President of the United States of America has tried it. "I didn't inhale," he said, and the American public thought, 'Oh, well, that's ok then'. Do you think he would still have become President if he'd said "I fucked my sister but it's ok - I didn't ejaculate"? In the '60s and '70s there were quite a few Legalise Pot rallies. There weren't too many Incest Is Best campaigns.

Anal sex may well have been just as much of a taboo as incest in the 1920s, '30s, '40s, even '50s but in this day and age it's becoming less and less of a taboo. You're probably not going to discuss it with your Grandmother but, still, if you go out and buy or rent any hardcore porn video you're liable to see actual anal sex. Not too many of those videos are going to contain real live incest: 'Mother Fuckers VI (That's My Boy!)' Apart from the illegality, the reason for that is because anal penetration is more and more becoming an acceptable aspect of sex. People want to see it in videos. Not so many think of incest in the same way.

So, anyway, even if you do have an incestuous couple who love each other and are both consenting adults, the amount of disgust and horror that society in general feels towards them is liable to cause them extreme stress and possibly even lead to emotional or psychological problems. Not only have they become criminalised - having to hide away their relationship for fear of being arrested - but they have also marginalised themselves.

The first two responses to the 'Sex With Uncles' thread were people writing, "That's sick!". Not exactly an intelligent or supportive way of replying but you'll probably find that that's the attitude of the majority of the general public. They may not all put it in such crude terms but there are definitely strong anti-incest feelings throughout society. There always have been. I'd argue that the Oedipus Rex tragedy wasn't written to show how accepted incest was amongst Greek heroes. I'm pretty sure it was trying say, 'Don't do it! Incest is wrong! You're only going to end up like poor old King Oedipus.'

So, if the majority of society is telling you - through jokes, insults, the law (and even mythology) - that what you're doing is "sick" then it can't be doing too much for your self esteem. Not only are you treated as a criminal- you're also treated as though your "abnormal". That must surely be damaging to someone's sense of self worth.

I'm not writing this in any way to attack people. All I'm saying is that, if you're considering getting involved in an incestuous relationship please think carefully about all these points before you go ahead.

roger

 

[Guest]

Or in other words...

surely incest is more hassle than it's worth. Why not get out and about a bit, meet some new people? (Why keep it in the family - there's plenty more fish in the sea?)

BTW - sorry Siren.

 

[Slut_boy]

Deborah, you are fucking odd!!

 

[Randyrandy]

There is one quote that I always have to chuckle about. "Incest is great as long as you keep it in the family"