I just need to vent ...

[an_angels_wings]

I'm so fucking fed up.

Now that I gave birth, I had another heart-to-heart with DH about our lacking sex life. I've been trying to be really nice with giving hand/blowjobs trying to jump-start his sex drive and get him craving more. Well, he said he was totally interested and wanted to get back into having sex more often, what-have-you. This was the other night. Well, last night was the night before he went back to work; when we were having our conversation, he said he was planning on having last-night-before-going-back-to-work-sex. That didn't happen. I was upset because I felt let down and disappointed and was afraid that he was all talk and no action.

He just said that he was really tired (and I knew he was, we'd had a rough night with the baby before) and we'd do it tomorrow (which is tonight).

Well, I was exhausted today. Had a rough day with the kid, didn't get to sleep in bed either last night or for a nap this morning (I took the baby shift so he could get a decent night's sleep before his first day back to work -- not going to be a regularly recurring thing, mind you, just for the first night). I went to bed early, but he still promised that we'd have 'fun' later. I said okay -- I was excited to spend that time with him and also get some stress relieved through orgasm.

He takes first baby shift (stayed up while I went to bed). And comes in and gently wakes me up. He barely does anything to get me in the mood -- plays the coquette. Fine, whatever. I deal with it. I'm not cleared yet for vaginal intercourse, so we've just been manually stimulating each other. Give him a blowjob, he's all content. And then he's too fucking tired to help me out.

Oh yeah, this is a WONDERFUL way to start our new and improved sex life. Then he starts getting all pouty and, "Now I feel bad. I feel selfish." Yeah, well, YOU SHOULD, ASSHOLE. Not like I wanted him to help me out after that -- Jesus effing christmas, because now I feel like you don't want to and it'd be like fucking pity sex. Yeah, I want THAT.

Fuck off.

I'm such a fucking idiot. I had said to him that if he didn't feel like reciprocating that I'd still love to give him a BJ, etc., to continue to stimulate his sex drive, and that I could take care of myself -- but that of course this wasn't going to be an all the time thing. The past few times, he's laid there with me and played with my boobs a little and kissed me while I manually brought myself to climax (he was "afraid of hurting me"), so it's not like he had to do all that much to begin with. So now I feel like I have no right to be upset at this, even though I thought it was originally implied it would be mutual fun and that because we had had that discussion things would be fun for a little while.

Boy was I wrong. At this point, right now, probably because I'm so heated, I don't even feel like it's worth it. Do I love giving blowjobs? Hell fucking yeah. But you know what? I feel like I'm being played, whether he's doing it intentionally or not. Now I have to sit here and worry that me being upset and him feeling guilty is going to negatively impact his sex drive.

Fucking A. Are you fucking shitting me?

What the fuck have I done in my past sexual lives to deserve this fucking shit? Huh? Answer me that.

Anyway. Sorry. I just had to vent. I don't know what to do anymore. I want to ream him the fuck out and say to fuck our sex life, that it's not even worth it. But I'm miserable without it. But I'm miserable right fucking now, too. And now I can't even go to sleep because I'm so fucking pissed off.

Ugh. Whatever. I don't know what to do. Maybe I'll feel completely differently tomorrow morning. But for right now, I want to rip his dick off and beat him over the head with it. I just don't know how to handle this without being a complete bitch and shooting myself in the foot even more.

Here's the previous thread: http://forum.literotica.com/showthread.php?t=656660

 

[Vixandra]

Its okay to vent. If you don't, it bottles up and explodes somewhere it shouldn't... I remember a family Thanksgiving I learned things I DID NOT want to know about an aunt of mine and her husband.

Stress does funny things to one's sex drive. It sucks, and not in a good way. However, it seems like he is leaving you high and dry, which is not fair in any way. If you've helped him off he should return the favor.

However, howling at him, beating him with his own bleeding penis or other violent trauma probably won't help much.

After you've cooled down, try writting him a letter telling him how you're feeling. Some people don't understand things if you tell them verbally. Be open, honest and a bit gentle. Harsh critisism isn't going to help.

Lashing out may feel good at the moment, but later on, when you're both upset and hurting, it'll make things worse.

The letter format also gives him time to formulate his response, rather then being "cornered" into giving an immediate answer.

If any of this doesn't make sense, I'm sorry. Tis late.

 

[CherryBomb24]

howling at him, beating him with his own bleeding penis

this sounds like a wonderful idea to me.

 

[an_angels_wings]

Unfortunately I've already done some things I probably shouldn't.

However, to the point of the writing a letter: we seem to resolve so many things via text message, that I feel he is doing so to take the easy way out. I've tried talking so many times -- you'd think there'd be a combination of talking and written word, wouldn't you?

I'm sick of feeling like I'm compromising too much of myself to make him comfortable. I, right now, am extremely uncomfortable. I don't want to continue hurting myself like this by giving in to making him feel better.

I don't regret what I've done tonight so far -- but who knows about tomorrow. I ended up going into the bedroom and turning the light on. That didn't wake him up. So I asked him if he knew where my new book was, because I couldn't find it and didn't know if he moved it. He didn't know where it was, and looked over his side of the bed (where I later found it), and couldn't find it (because men don't fucking LOOK). Then I took out our scrabble game and started setting it up so we could both play. I told him I couldn't sleep and that I thought maybe some stimulation (y'know, mental stimulation of course), might help.

I've remained completely calm throughout the whole ordeal (minus a few tears I couldn't hold in), and he was quite upset as you can imagine.

I wanted to teach him a lesson. I wanted him to know that he needs to keep his word to me -- not just sexually. I wanted him to know that I was through compromising myself to the point where I feel like I'm going to keel over. And I wanted him to know how utterly and completely hurt I was.

Talking hasn't gotten through to him in the past. I figured I'd try something different. If this fucks up our sex life further -- well, it already sucks and has sucked for some fucking time. So what the fuck difference does it make?

God, I can't believe how upset and angry I still am about this.

 

[ImOnIt]

Talking hasn't gotten through to him in the past. I figured I'd try something different.

Do not mess with him. Take some responsibility. Your own communication is YOUR responsibility.

After you've cooled down, try writting him a letter telling him how you're feeling. Some people don't understand things if you tell them verbally. Be open, honest and a bit gentle. Harsh critisism isn't going to help.

Lashing out may feel good at the moment, but later on, when you're both upset and hurting, it'll make things worse.

This advice is both politely worded and accurate. Noone else will say it clearer.


Quivering with rage does not help one bit. Somewhere, you failed to communicate. Accept that, and try again

 

[an_angels_wings]

How can I have failed to communicate for four years? I feel like I have tried a million times. When one thing said doesn't work I try to explain it to him in a different way. Please, God, then tell me how I'm supposed to communicate to a fucking male, because clearly I'm failing. I'm very good at communicating -- I don't have a problem talking about my feelings or trying to explain things. I don't get embarrassed and shy away from talking about issues because they're uncomfortable, especially with my husband. Of course, if I have erred in some way in my communication then fine, I will accept responsibility for that -- but if I'm at the end of my rope, how the fuck to I figure out where to go next?

And then how do I "not mess with him" without -- yet again -- giving him the easy way out?

 

[popcorn2721]

How can I have failed to communicate for four years? I feel like I have tried a million times. When one thing said doesn't work I try to explain it to him in a different way. Please, God, then tell me how I'm supposed to communicate to a fucking male, because clearly I'm failing. I'm very good at communicating -- I don't have a problem talking about my feelings or trying to explain things. I don't get embarrassed and shy away from talking about issues because they're uncomfortable, especially with my husband. Of course, if I have erred in some way in my communication then fine, I will accept responsibility for that -- but if I'm at the end of my rope, how the fuck to I figure out where to go next?

And then how do I "not mess with him" without -- yet again -- giving him the easy way out?

Being a parent myself, I do have to say that it is rather rough working and coming home doing Mr. Mom in the evening. He has to understand that you cannot pour 100% of everything you have into your work and leave nothing for home (it sounds like exhaustion to me)... if that means he has to take an hour nap when he gets home, then that's what he needs to do instead of watching TV or doing whatever.
The one thing that you do have to do, in no uncertain terms is let him know that he has an obligation to you, a personal interest in making you happy, and that your not going to let him ignore you anymore. You will have to take control, but after a short time he should be able to recoup his sex drive and interest in you in general.

 

[unregistered]

 

[CherryBomb24]

i have been there and my situation didnt turn out so good.
I can honestly say my situation was almost the same, only differences that i can see are that i couldnt communicate. I think if i were able to communicate more, things would have been different. Since i wasnt able to communicate properly, things turned to violance and i ended up getting a restraining order.
My way of communicating was basically saying "fuck you then i'll do it myself"
So trust me hun, making him pay or "not get off easy" is a bad idea.
You HAVE to force him to communicate with you. WRITE him a letter, if that doesnt work -make him sit his ass down at home and make him hear you out. Dont be a bitch about it, make sure he knows how hurt it makes you feel and/or unnattractive.
He has to realize that you're not going to sit here and feel like shit so he can be happy. You're his wife, not his maid.

 

[bobsgirl]

I think writing a letter is a good idea, if only for you to gather your thoughts together.

I know first hand how frustrating it is to try to communicate with a spouse who either can't or won't understand what you're trying to say. But you have to try. The only piece of advice I have is that there are some people who for whatever reason are unable to make the first move. So you have to do it, or all the hurt and resentment will continue to build until it hardens into a big brick wall that you can't knock down. Don't do what I did and stay silent.

 

[StrayKat]

Then he starts getting all pouty and, "Now I feel bad. I feel selfish." Yeah, well, YOU SHOULD, ASSHOLE.

Well, honestly, I would just tell him exactly what is in caps here. And I would tell it in caps.

 

[Ravenwind]

I'll be honest, sex life post-childbirth sucks. Everyone's exhausted, nobody sleeps. But being angry about it isn't going to solve anything. You've had a communication breakdown for only four years... took me 15 years to get my head out of my ass and figure out what exactly it was I wanted, and how to say it effectively. I learned it doesn't take much to get a guy to do what you want, but it takes a way that's somewhat contrary to the way women think.

First, no amount of making him feel worse is going to make things better... in fact, he will only withdraw further, making him feel inept in pleasing you, and therefore, less of a man. It may make you feel good now, but it will make both of you feel worse over time. Guys pride themselves on their masculinity, so instead of saying concepts like "you're doing it wrong", instead, say things like "you wanna know how to make our sex life better? here's how...". Instead of breaking things down, treat what you currently have as 'level ground', and build up from there.

I'm assuming you mean a text message means something like "i miss u plz come home soon <3". Instead of that, write a full fledged note, or better yet, *handwrite* him a note. Make it something worth thinking about, instead of being glance-worthy. State your feelings clearly, and in no uncertain terms. Also state *why* you feel that way... If you say something like, "I feel undersexed", the average guy's brain says "and...?" while his mouth says something like "I'm sorry" or "I'll make it better"... he will want to fix the situation that's occurring right then so that you're happy with him. Instead, you need to explain the *why* as well, and *what* he can do to make it better. No offense to guys, of course, but he is no mind reader, and unless you tell him *exactly* what you want, he will *never* figure it out on his own.

Next, guys, stereotypically, are done when they're done. I know my Husband is. Either they roll over and go to sleep, or ask for a sandwich (Can someone *please* explain *what* the post-sex sandwich fetish is all about?). I don't know about you two, but with us, it takes me a lot longer to be satisfied than him. So, we worked it out so that I am satisfied first, and then it is his turn. That way, we both get our fair share, and neither of us go to bed still wanting. You might want to consider a similar proposition to him.

Also, positive reinforcement is a must. When he does something right, praise him for it then, and thank him later. (I really hate to say it that way, it sounds like I'm training a dog or teaching a child here, but... it works...). If something is really good for you, let him know *right then and there*, and he'll keep doing it. When you thank him after, it reinforces the idea of how much it pleased you, and he'll want to do it again- be it for the sake of his desire to please you, or for the sake of his ego and hearing you thank him for how wonderful he was. Either way, it works.

You also have to consider that he does have a genuine concern about hurting you. The last thing he wants is to see you in pain. You have to respect that. But it falls on your head to reinforce the concept that it's okay, and if it hurts, you'll let him know.

Finally, talking *will* work. But you have to learn *how* to talk to him. Playing Scrabble to 'tell' him "I need at least mental stimulation" isn't how he 'hears' it... he 'hears' "let's play a game". Come right out and say "I'm horny" instead. We have a million different things running through our head at any given time, and a billion different ways of saying it... men... the only things that run through their heads is "I want a beer, and I wanna see something naked", and that's how they'll say it, too. When we try to be subtle, they'll read it exactly how we make it seem... we blink our eyes seductively at them, they think "oh, she wants to look pretty for me". We make a 'come hither' gesture, "where are we going?". Of course, that's oversimplified, but I hope you see my point. Our way of communicating does not work in ways guys understand easily. And don't get me wrong, I'm not saying 'women are smart/guys are dumb', I'm saying that we speak two separate languages that use the same words... we communicate in metaphors and examples, they communicate exactly what they're thinking.

 

[bambikiller]

Been there done that.
Ravenwind is right on the mark.
I'm a guy yeah we are beat but we horny too.
When the kids a sleep grab it, not the kid the other little guy.
(We are male, subtle hints don't work)
Jump on top and tell us what you need.

We can be a bit lazy too if you'r going to satify us with out us having to do any work yeah that sounds good to me.

Tell us what you what a need and do not put us down, bitching how we do not do enough, how we wanted the kid and now we aren't doing our fair share.
Telling us how exhusted you are as soon as we walk in the door from work.
Yeah I'm fucking tired too I worked all day you were home with the kid how hard is that. (That's what we're thinking as you start your rant)
Yeah we don't like that, we don't want to fuck you then.
We just want to get away. Will work late just to stay away from you ragging on us.
Told you been there done that.

I sincerly hope you work this out.
Absolutely nothing better then haveing a kid, this is just the beginning.

 

[Ravenwind]

I'm a guy yeah we are beat but we horny too.
When the kids a sleep grab it, not the kid the other little guy.
(We are male, subtle hints don't work)
Jump on top and tell us what you need.

We can be a bit lazy too if you'r going to satify us with out us having to do any work yeah that sounds good to me.

Tell us what you what a need and do not put us down, bitching how we do not do enough, how we wanted the kid and now we aren't doing our fair share.
Telling us how exhusted you are as soon as we walk in the door from work.
Yeah I'm fucking tired too I worked all day you were home with the kid how hard is that. (That's what we're thinking as you start your rant)
Yeah we don't like that, we don't want to fuck you then.
We just want to get away. Will work late just to stay away from you ragging on us.

^--- Poster boy for my example. ^_^

*nitpicks* Sure, lots of examples, but not one of them is 'an example representing another example representing a larger issue'... no replacing 'scrabble' for 'lack of attention' or 'level ground' for 'what's currently going on in the relationship'. It's all direct and to the point, and ambiguities are explained.

You have a rare moment here, Angel's Wings... he just exposed the inner workings of men's brains to you. Take the moment while you can, and learn from it... learn to *think* like a guy, and you can communicate with them better.

I know... easier said than done....

 

[littlebabyclit]

I'm probably the last person on earth to give you husband advice. I've had a difficult marriage for years, very up and down for me. I've had a lot of problems with sex itself being satisfying. But I find your story interesting, an_angels_wings, because I'm at a similar stage in my marriage where I'm trying not only to re-negotiate the frequency of sex, but actually re-vamp everything we do together. So I feel for you, I really do. I'm engaged in a similar uphill battle with my own husband. Therefore I can totally relate to your frustration and anger as I've had a lot of that myself.

At the very least, I think your husband owes you some make-up time on the pleasing YOU-only kind of sex, since you've been doing it for him. If he's unwilling to do that, then he just might be getting lazy and/or selfish in the sex department. Sex aside, it might be time for some kind of marital help book about how to negotiate things better in marriage. Sometimes, those kind of books can really help a lot. At least you could get some psychological tools you might not already have at your disposal to try and negotiate better with him regarding the sex issue. Your other thread said that otherwise, you have good communication with him and have a loving marriage.

I've done what you did, gotten angry and maybe I've done even worse, really lashed out at my husband. Everybody is right, it doesn't work very well at all.

If I were you, I'd find other ways to pleasure yourself, hell, take up the solo masturbation yourself with/without porn and leave him out of mutual sex and see how he feels about it after a while. Sometimes, people don't start to miss something until it's gone or until they realize they really blew it.

Ah hell, that won't help either 'cuz it's so damned retaliatory, but don't you wish it would work ??

 

[Eilan]

There's been some (mostly) wonderful advice given in this thread, and I don't have much to add to that.

However. . .

I know that I may be way off-base here, but is it possible that there's also some postpartum depression going on? I understand that there are some ongoing issues in this relationship, but when I read the initial post I saw myself as I was nine years ago after the birth of my second child, minus any desire whatsoever for postpartum sex. Every "wrong" that my ex committed was magnified by my mental state at the time.

 

[gloriann]

My last partner was horrible about sex. We did the same thing, over and over, no matter what I said or bought or cried about, it never changed. And I can't tell you how many times I heard, once we did finally decide to jump in the sack, "Let's make this quick." Years of this.

So, yeah... left her.

Not that I'm advocating ending a relationship. And I know from experience it's hard not to go on the attack when you feel personally rebuffed.

Two points: 1. I like the letter idea. Lets you get your thoughts organized, lets some time pass. 2. Quit giving him blowjobs and handjobs. He's getting off, you're not. Stop that.

 

[an_angels_wings]

1) I've tried to approach this in a number of different ways -- all of them have been with me trying to be sensitive of his temperament about sex and because he is male. Sometimes I get frustrated and "lose it" like last night. Please understand that I'm not some weirdo psycho-bitch ragging on him every second of every day. I really have tried to approach this kindly and understandingly and from a "what can I do to help?" point of view.

2) The text messages, were long actual conversations and they were not initiated by me. I try to talk, but he tends to wait until he gets to work and tries to text me to talk it out/apologize, etc. If that resolves things, then it resolves things, but it bothers me because sometimes I feel like he's taking the easy way out.

3) I guess I want to believe that my husband isn't the typical male as laid out by bambikiller (shame on me, eh?! lol)

4) I will masturbate if I need to. But part of the fun of being married is being sexually intimate with your partner. I miss that. We did a lot in the beginning of our relationship and it had begun to dwindle significantly even BEFORE I got pregnant. I've been working on trying to help fix whatever underlying issues there may be there. That's where the me stimulating him thing comes in -- I was trying to give him good experiences so he'd want more.

5) Thank you all for your replies, insights and advice. I did end up writing the letter. It's 11 pages long. I used "I feel" and did not make accusatory statements -- all of that conflict management stuff I know you're supposed to use when fighting fair.

6) Am I ALWAYS going to have to be the one do to EVERYTHING? Just asking ... because if I am, I'd like to know that as soon as possible. I feel kind of like I'm getting conflicting information.

7) I'm sure my hormones are playing a role in what I am feeling. It's hard to tell the difference though, and it's also really upsetting to sit here and feel like anything I say right now is going to be blamed on my hormones and possible PPD -- even when I've had this legitimate concern before I even got pregnant.

Thanks again, everyone!! I feel a little bit better, but not 100%. It's really hard for me to not have a resolution at hand, you know? I will update later with what occurs after he reads the letter.

I'm not perfect ... I try to be as close as I can, but we all fall short sometimes, eh?

 

[curiousgeo62]

Hormones out of whack * lack of sleep* lack of confidence in yourself image. There are so many things against you right after the baby is born. Us guys get to go to work, and well, work. But we also get to socialize with adults. We get to go to the bathroom with the door closed. We talk on the phone without the baby in our arms. We only have to worry about us. A new mom has to care for that baby every second of every minute of every hour. There is laundry to do. The dishes need to be done, etc. There is no rest. Yet, as men, we come home all "stressed" out and we want to relax.

My wife and I have 4 kids. It wasn't until the third child that I finally got it. We changed our routine so that before I left for work in the morning, my wife got an hour to take a shower, get dressed and put her make up on. This was her time to be an adult woman. She was always concerned about me being around other women that had time to look their best. She wanted the same and she got it. But I never knew that until she told me. I also cooked our meals - every night. It is very hard to try and prepare meals so that the food is done at the same time and doesn't burn. Her first priority was tending to the every need of our babies. Besides, it was the least I could do. She had a much more important task than I did. We also took at least one night a week and got away from our kids. You have to date. You have to take time to maintain your relationship. Otherwise, resentment and anger will take over (hint hint). Remember your love that brought that beautiful baby to you and try to focus on that. Good Luck!!

 

[littlebabyclit]

how about giving husband classes ?

My wife and I have 4 kids. It wasn't until the third child that I finally got it. We changed our routine so that before I left for work in the morning, my wife got an hour to take a shower, get dressed and put her make up on. This was her time to be an adult woman. She was always concerned about me being around other women that had time to look their best. She wanted the same and she got it. But I never knew that until she told me. I also cooked our meals - every night. It is very hard to try and prepare meals so that the food is done at the same time and doesn't burn. Her first priority was tending to the every need of our babies. Besides, it was the least I could do. She had a much more important task than I did. We also took at least one night a week and got away from our kids. You have to date. You have to take time to maintain your relationship. Otherwise, resentment and anger will take over (hint hint). Remember your love that brought that beautiful baby to you and try to focus on that. Good Luck!!

That's beautiful ! You sound like a really great guy. Your wife is lucky to have you.

 

[curiousgeo62]

That's beautiful ! You sound like a really great guy. Your wife is lucky to have you.

Thank you, but it took me awhile to figure it out and we too, had our heated discussions, but it just came down to real communication.

 

[hatsoff]

You are an independent woman who needs to get her freak on from time to time and this baby is getting in the way of you and your husband. From how I see it, there is only one thing that can be done to relieve you of this stress. You must not let this baby win. It has been doing nothing but constantly crying and begging for attention without doing so anything useful around the house, except maybe make some fertilizer for the plants from time to time. Sure, it is technically your responsibility to take care of this baby, but seriously, why should the responsibility be left to you and only you. You need to teach this baby how to sew or cook or at least garden for Christ sakes. I had a baby once, and I instantly saw what he was doing to my sex life. Before anything happened between me and my spouse, I quickly told my baby to work for his share of the household. I can proudly say that he is not featured in many internet adds across many prominent sites as youtube, google video, and many more.

http://www.burningpixel.com/Baby/Babygif.htm

Theres a picture of my darling at work.

 

[an_angels_wings]

That's beautiful ! You sound like a really great guy. Your wife is lucky to have you.

Ditto. I'm 23 ... perhaps we're just at that point where we're still trying to figure everything all out.

The letter apparently helped. I had no idea it would because I guess I feel like I'd done it before. He said it helped him to see things in writing, he remembers things better that way than if I were to have told him. He was able to organize his own thoughts off of it and we had an extensive conversation.

It's getting better. Talking is just the start. But at least I understand him a little bit better -- I guess I thought I'd had him figured out because before when I'd tell him my perception of his actions, etc., he never articulated his reasoning in a way that I understood. Well, I thought I understood then, but now it makes more sense.

Er, if that makes any sense.

I'm hoping this means we're on our way. I'm also putting a call into my doctor today. I don't know what they can do, I've been on anti-depressants before pregnancy, which I stopped when I learned I was pregnant, and then started up again my third trimester. But we'll see. They're the medical professionals, not me!

Wish us luck ... I feel a lot better now that we've talked. Thanks for the excellent thoughts, advice, and experiences.