How to: take on this situation?

[Ravin the Poet]

Yes, I am in fact 20 (good guess on the age).

Yes, it was naive of me to think that she would not be looking for other relationships while we were apart. I only tried to block out the thought of this to ease the pain of the break up.

I think Ravin can give me the best advice since he has been in a very similar situation. It is very hard to think about what she has done with someone else since she means so much to me.

As for the STD situation, we are both going to get tested, and yes I am very informed about the dangers of diseases. Between the two of us, we use a condom everytime. I know it's not 100%, but its better than nothing, and we are trying to be safe. As for assuming she had other partners, I didn't think that she would go that far in such a short time (Ill say again she didn't even want to have sex that night) since she I always thought she was such an innocent person. But there is no changing the past, so I will have to live with it.

20 is always a good educated guess.

Don't knock the other advice, because inside it all lies very good things. "Don't ask what you don't want to know" is what has been said, and if you read around it and turn it into a question, you might get a better understand.

Do you really want to know?
What happens if you don't know?
How will your relationship if you know? If you don't?

I had to answer all those questions when people told me not to ask because I probably didn't want to know. As far as being naive, find me a person who isn't during a break up. Well me, but I haven't broken up with anyone (Stupid humour) but you know what I'm saying. Even more so if you are an innocent person, which I'd probably classify you as, just base on general observations.

Yes I have been here, but it does differ. You are coming off a break up trying to repair, where as I was building our trust and relationship more. Either way, I'd just ask yourself those questions because the answers will probably give you more insight into what you really want out of all this. Could be blame, to have something on her in the back of your head that you can use later. Sadly it happens. That's the questions you need to understand the answers to. If you understand that, you will be much better off.

 

[DimplesCharlie]

Hey Guy

I was in a similar situation with my first love. I had the same reaction and then realized that she really didn't have to tell me and I really had no reason to be angry and pissed since we were not a "couple" at the time. I had trouble letting it go, and then realized if I didn't, we'd not have a good relationship. So I let it go(yes it took a while and it my own dumbass fault!). We married and have had a great life together.

~C~

 

[Cathleen]

Gender deals with a lot. On a forum like this, it should always count for something. But on a subject like this, woman will in a sense side with a female because of their own values. I am not taking anything away from their advice. It's just something I have observed in my time here. That in a situation like this one, they seem to stick together. He isn't naive, or self-centered or demanding to know. He is concerned and a little scared. People here are very open about certain things, but I can probably guess there are a few people whose SO or even them have a "I don't want to know" sort of relationship. But once the seed is planted though, it is hard to turn around. As I said, I went through the same thing. I hated the thought of another man touching my girlfriend. Ok, call me self-centered, where as she would say differently. There are just certain guys who don't like that thought. I am one of them. I don't know why it bothers me sometimes, but it does. Women in this situation have generally not helped. Again, not taking away from anyone, just my own experience. They seem to say forget about it, and so on.

Look at the reactions he has got. Granted I do not know everyone as female or male, but the reaction is not justified. Granted again, some more information about his age and so on would have helped, but who is to say what he does and does not have the right to know. My girlfriend and I only met when I was 21. All her experience was before. Do I have a right to know? That line bothers me because it's not a right, it's being open and honest with someone. We speak so much here on lit about being open and honest with each other, and when someone asks about it, people jump on him. No one has the right to anything. What it needs is room to breathe. They need to talk about it. Don't tell me he should not ask. The first reply said he should get tested for STD's. Is that not a damn good reason to ask someone? I think it is.

I think Ravin's posts made excellent points. I want to disagree about women 'sticking together' but I've seen it and been part of it too many times in my life to flatly disagree. It certainly can be a factor, in my opinion.

What I firmly agree with are his thoughts about feelings - this issue is mostly about feelings. I'm far from 20 and I know jealousy isn't out of the question with me. I would feel very hurt and like DimplesCharlie said, it takes time to deal with that pain. I think that is universal to all of us and age doesn't make much difference, in fact those hurts have caused me to have stronger armour to protect me from those horrible hurts.

However, the one thing that kind of makes me upset is that we had sex before she told me about this. However, she has gone through her cycle twice since it happened, and also has not noticed anything with STD/STI symptoms. She talked to the other guy shortly afterwords asking if he has been tested and he said he had been recently and was clean, but only he knows if it is true. Also, since She and I had sex 2 weeks ago I haven't noticed anything. However this still gives me no peace of mind.

Her not telling you until after you had sex really ticks me off. It was wrong of her. I think you can be more than 'kind of' upset, she was irresponsible. I hope there's been a discussion about that gem.

For what it's worth at this point, I didn't find you to be immature at all. What I read was someone who was hurting, feeling that heartache we've all felt. As I said above I don't think age helps that, sorry to say.

I wish the best for you two, seems like all this has lots of lessons which is never a bad thing, in fact I won't be surprised if it might bring you closer, so long as you are open and honest with one another.

Welcome to Lit, Guy, glad to have you around, this has been a nice discussion - thanks.

 

[Noor]

CONGRATULATIONS!!!!!

You may now be a possible carrier for a whole host of diseases that take months to incubate and even longer before they show noticeable symptoms.

Some diseases show no obvious signs, and others, like HIV could take months before you'll even test positive for it. Then it's a long slow downward spiral. Genital Herpes can be transmitted even with a condom, and Herpes is the gift that never goes away.

If you think your dick is going to swell up and explode within two weeks or turn yellow and make strange noises you're sadly mistaken.

If you don't know your partner's history, keep it in your pants. And do yourself a favor and learn about these health issues. They've only been in the headlines since before you were born. The price of ignorance could be your death.

Okay the problem with this history stuff is it is only as good as the knowledge of the teller. So let's say I only have had relationships with virgins, and they have all been monogamous ones. So from what I would say to a new guy there would be no risks, right? But what if one of those Virgins lied or cheated later on? It is quite probably as some say 60% of males cheat, so what I might believe is the truth of my history, maybe totally untrue. On top of it, what if one of the virgins is an athlete who shot steroids with a dirty needle? This is also not as uncommon as one would like.

Or in the case of a real life friend of mine who was in a marriage for many years? He knows his wife cheated on him at least once, and he never has used a condom in his life, so anyone while his history may look better than say mine in terms of number of lovers, ect... his being a risk from my point of view is much higher, because who knows who all his ex slept with?

I think tests are the only way, everything else is merely possible fairy tales. I also think it is none of the other persons business besides whether they feel they did something risky...

 

[guy17]

Hey Guy

I was in a similar situation with my first love. I had the same reaction and then realized that she really didn't have to tell me and I really had no reason to be angry and pissed since we were not a "couple" at the time. I had trouble letting it go, and then realized if I didn't, we'd not have a good relationship. So I let it go(yes it took a while and it my own dumbass fault!). We married and have had a great life together.

~C~

I'm happy for you guys, and it does give me hope to hear something like that.

Just a couple quick questions: How long does it take to get over it, and how did you go about thinking about it, or what did you think about it during that time to let it go? What was sex like soon after you found out?

PM me if you wish the keep the details private.

 

[Ravin the Poet]

I'm happy for you guys, and it does give me hope to hear something like that.

Just a couple quick questions: How long does it take to get over it, and how did you go about thinking about it, or what did you think about it during that time to let it go? What was sex like soon after you found out?

PM me if you wish the keep the details private.

Took me a couple days really. You really just need to accept it or it will cause you more problems. But each person is different of course. She assurred me on a lot of my questions, and it wasn't like she was sleeping around with anyone. It was maybe 2-3 times, if that. Can't remember (which shows how important it is now). You really can't think anything about it to make it go away. I just got caught up in our relationship and school to really care anymore about what happened. Sex was fine. I was unexperienced so it just got better for me as time went. She wasn't that experienced either so we were basically both on par level after a few weeks.

You issue is different because you're coming back into a relationship. I wouldn't dwell on it to long. If you don't ask soon, then I would say let it go and just move on with your relationship.

Or (and this is a joke for those who think I am serious) use it as blackmail to get a threesome.

Note* the above has not worked for me, and is one of our inside little jokes we play around with.

 

[SweetErika]

Took me a couple days really. You really just need to accept it or it will cause you more problems. But each person is different of course. She assurred me on a lot of my questions, and it wasn't like she was sleeping around with anyone. It was maybe 2-3 times, if that. Can't remember (which shows how important it is now). You really can't think anything about it to make it go away. I just got caught up in our relationship and school to really care anymore about what happened. Sex was fine. I was unexperienced so it just got better for me as time went. She wasn't that experienced either so we were basically both on par level after a few weeks.

I know you're past it, Ravin, but it might help others who are bothered by their partner's experiences to look at the positives. One of those is that experience usually leads us to be better partners and lovers.

I'm certainly a hell of a lot better at relationships and sex from having multiple, various relationships; with each one, I learn a lot and get to practice my skills. I'd imagine my first partners would say I wasn't bad when we were together, but they'd note a ton of positive changes if we reconnected now.

I've always been grateful for the experience my partners have had, and sometimes have even wished the less experienced would get some more. Seeing it as a positive like that helps minimize discomfort or jealousy for me.

 

[Ravin the Poet]

I understand that, but as I said, her experience wasn't anything that was massive ahead of the game. It was something at first that helped because it got me past the nervous part. All this leads into the other side of it all and something I know we have talked about as a couple. Am I going to get to experience others. People try to reassure that experience helps, but it is generally (in these cases) one sided.

But you got to think realistic here because sorry to say, people do not think like that all the time. One is not going to think "well she has slept with 2-3-4 people. She has good experience". Not at this age, maybe at yours. (not a dig at age, just reality of it all) Maybe it deals with age, but as I have stated a few times, some guys (and girls) just do not like the thought of their other half with someone else. You can try and spin the positive, but in guy17's case, it's the negative that I feel is his issue, as was mine as well.

My girlfriend has said she wished it didn't happen with the others. That the experience was nothing special, it was just what they did as teens in her small town. She has said she has learned more from me (and my vast readings on the subject) then she could have learned with them all. Thus leading to the question, is my skills good just on her, or someone else as well.

In all my posts in this thread I have been trying to bring the reality of what actually goes on. I will say that the majority perhaps didn't think the way they do now about sex her on Lit as they did when they were in their 20's. It's not negative thinking of the reality, as I find, if you look at what is really true, you solve your problems a hell of a lot faster. In this case, thinking of my other as more experienced would not help, because it was never about experience, it was about the thought of someone else having that moment with her. As I said, generally it's a younger concept.

I hope you are not offended. This has just been one of my grips here, that we don't assess the problems based on person, but rather give them same answer to everything. Advice given a 40 year old may not work for a 20 year old.

 

[Nightbird]

Ok I confess to not reading all the posts here but I think there is a lesson to be learned.

WEAR and or USE A CONDOM!!!

Not using one can get you killed.

 

[Ravin the Poet]

Ok I confess to not reading all the posts here but I think there is a lesson to be learned.

WEAR and or USE A CONDOM!!!

Not using one can get you killed.

That actually has very little to do with what is going on.

 

[eudaemonia]

I hope you are not offended. This has just been one of my grips here, that we don't assess the problems based on person, but rather give them same answer to everything. Advice given a 40 year old may not work for a 20 year old.

Actually, my friend, getting to 40 means passing 20 first. While you've made some insightful comments to guy17, I think your dismissiveness about the experiences of others -- who, again, were 20 once -- is rather myopic. And also, a fair bit ungrateful towards some of the most helpful and wise members of this community.

As for your last comment about condom usage, that was just off the rails. And unkind. Implicit in what you and guy17 said about your respective jealousy issues has a lot to do with a former partner having unprotected sex with another man. To put it in the popular vernacular, someone else marked your hydrant, and did so in way that you might not have been able to undo, e.g. a pregnancy, an STD, emotional guilt, etc.

Jealously is about fear. Owning up to one's fears -- all of them, and being honest about whatever those fears are based on -- is the only way to get past them and get peace of mind.

 

[Nightbird]

That'll teach me for not educating myself before I open my big mouth.

That actually has very little to do with what is going on.

 

[Eilan]

I hope you are not offended. This has just been one of my grips here, that we don't assess the problems based on person, but rather give them same answer to everything. Advice given a 40 year old may not work for a 20 year old.

Oh, to be 20 again. I remember when I used to have all the answers. Le sigh.

FWIW, I recall, back in my pre-January 2005 How-To lurker days and beyond, a certain someone who was about 19 or so at the time. He used to give dating and sex advice even though he admitted that he'd never dated or had sex. Should his advice have been considered more valid to the younger folks simply because it came from someone their age? Or was it possible that the folks who'd actually been there and done that might have had more to offer?

Sure, a little knowledge is a good thing, but reading a lot about sex and relationships should never be considered a substitute for having sex or being in a relationship.

Keep in mind that as eudaemonia said, older (as in older than you) folks are often speaking from experience. They may not be giving the thread starter validation, but that doesn't mean that their advice isn't without merit.

 

[Ravin the Poet]

Actually, my friend, getting to 40 means passing 20 first. While you've made some insightful comments to guy17, I think your dismissiveness about the experiences of others -- who, again, were 20 once -- is rather myopic. And also, a fair bit ungrateful towards some of the most helpful and wise members of this community.

As for your last comment about condom usage, that was just off the rails. And unkind. Implicit in what you and guy17 said about your respective jealousy issues has a lot to do with a former partner having unprotected sex with another man. To put it in the popular vernacular, someone else marked your hydrant, and did so in way that you might not have been able to undo, e.g. a pregnancy, an STD, emotional guilt, etc.

Jealously is about fear. Owning up to one's fears -- all of them, and being honest about whatever those fears are based on -- is the only way to get past them and get peace of mind.

I have no doubts at all about the advice people give here, I am just saying sometimes it is too generic. Things that worked in 1980's don't always apply to now. We all have heard of the amazing pressures 18-22 year olds face, which compared to twenty years ago is a huge deal now. I have had many an older person tell me "This wasn't an issue when I was in my teens" about a great deal of many subjects. I don't dismiss their comments, just rather inlighten, that people do not think that way, and there is nothing you can do to change that. Take for example Sweets comment.

"One of those is that experience usually leads us to be better partners and lovers."

I agree it is sound advice, just not realistic to today’s standard of thinking of our youth. By all means if people can think that way, then more power to them, because it will make that step easier, but by reading guy17's comment, my interpretation is that he does not think like that. (I can only interpret unless he says other wise) If you found me a number of 18-22 year olds who think "my girlfriend sleeping with other people is better for me" then I will relax my statement and admit I was wrong.

My issue is not with the advice, as advice is only as good as the person giving it, but rather, the nature and reality of which the advice is given when associated with the context of the situation. Example, guy goes to party, is told that his girlfriend was hot and heavy with male X, the majority (as I won't say all) would be uncomfortable knowing that. And no amount of being told about experience is going to change that. Hence, context of the situation.

I wouldn't call it jealousy, unless you are in the position to have her leave you. I'd call it an uncomfortable feeling. It is hard to define. As for myself, I wasn't jealous, because I knew she wasn't getting back together with the others. It was an uncomfortable thought of someone else having that moment with her. I wouldn't call it jealousy.

 

[Ravin the Poet]

Oh, to be 20 again. I remember when I used to have all the answers. Le sigh.

FWIW, I recall, back in my pre-January 2005 How-To lurker days and beyond, a certain someone who was about 19 or so at the time. He used to give dating and sex advice even though he admitted that he'd never dated or had sex. Should his advice have been considered more valid to the younger folks simply because it came from someone their age? Or was it possible that the folks who'd actually been there and done that might have had more to offer?

Sure, a little knowledge is a good thing, but reading a lot about sex and relationships should never be considered a substitute for having sex or being in a relationship.

Keep in mind that as eudaemonia said, older (as in older than you) folks are often speaking from experience. They may not be giving the thread starter validation, but that doesn't mean that their advice isn't without merit.

To be 20 and have all the answers? Can be said as well for those in their 30's and 40's. You are trying to compare something dated 2 years ago to now. That is a far cry attempt to discredit me. My advice back then was known to be from someone not as experienced, hence half the time I agreed with the majority. You are trying to compare me to two years ago which I expected more from you, considering this is a talk about experience. That’s like saying

"I remember someone whom was 18 and could not hit the ball straight in golf and always put it in the water" when I am 21 now and can hit it 300 yards down the fairway.

Should his advice have been considered more valid to the younger folks simply because it came from someone their age? Or was it possible that the folks who'd actually been there and done that might have had more to offer?

You made my point right there. My advice then was generally overshadowed. Find me a person who said "I listened to Ravin." The key words in that quote are "been there and done that". I have stated in this thread I have been through this situation. So let’s add this up.

1. Been in the situation
2. Am close to the age of the person involved (gives me better context)
3. Am aware of the reality of the now a days mental male at this age, because I am one.

You wanted to bring it to this, so I will. If I was going to get advice on marriage, would I ask someone not married? Sure I would. But would their advice hold as much weight as someone who is married? No it wouldn't. So to bring back my past is again a far cry attempt to try and say in the 2-3 years since I have joined here, I have learned nothing at all. Look at my list, and tell me why I am not capable to give guy proper advice, more suited towards his own needs? So far the only reason people have given me is "I'm not as experienced". Which sorry to say, is a cop-out for not having an answer.

We all should know the differences in the mental mind of a 20 year old now, then when a 40 year old was 20. Social pressure, school shootings, higher sucicide rates and many other outside pressures that put a strain on youth. It all deals around context. If I was going to ask a about a graduate course, would I ask someone who did it 20 years ago, or someone who just completed it? Obviously, things change so I would want the most current up to date information.

Your reply makes me think you didn't read any part of when I said, because I stated I was in this same situation.

Sure, a little knowledge is a good thing, but reading a lot about sex and relationships should never be considered a substitute for having sex or being in a relationship.

I agree 100%. Probably why if you read my post back in the day, you will find me saying to new people who post often in fact, "these people (as in lit people) are very knowledgable and will help, as they have helped me" to basically sum it up. But again, trying to say I haven't experienced anything in 2 years is a little naive.

If this were a topic of what to do after 10 years of marriage, then yeah, you'd have me there. I wouldn't expect a single person to take me serious, nor would I now (at this age. I have changed a lot since I was 19, which goes along with the time I started University and soon began dating) say I know anything about the subject. I'd give advice based on context and my own judgement, but if someone came and said "I have been here, this is what happens...etc" then I would give way to them.

I again, am not trying to take away from anyone in this thread. I am just telling you, new things happen in this age, and the same thing does not always work. Even you can’t battle with context as it is an unwinable battle. I know I can’t win it either. As in my many examples, giving advice myself on marriage is ludacris considering I have never been married. If you want to bring past in this, then yeah when I was 19 I probably would have replied because, hey it’s a message board and I hate lurking. But notice in the timeline of two years I have a) not posted here for almost a year, and b) now only post in threads I actually have a clue what I am talking about. You don’t see me posting in threads about women’s needs, or marriage. Again, context of the situation which in my years of experience means a lot. Things change, I have accepted that, and ackknowledge it. Clearly you have not.

Another example, which I will close with. (and this is a true story)

40 year old works at a car plant. Has been working there for 15 years.
25 year old comes in with new degree.
25 year old gets better, higher job, though he lacks experience.

Why?

Because times have changed, and the 25 year old is now adaptable to the changed time. What worked then does not always work now and that applies to all aspects of life.

 

[Cathleen]

Ravin, I tend to agree, your points are valid I think. I'd hurt my brain if I contemplated being 20 in this day. Seems each passing generation has faced things the previous would rather not, at least in my conversations with others.

Experience does count for a lot and I'd never discount it just as you've said. But I no more know what goes on in a twenty year old mind than I know how to fly to the moon. The heart -- well, as I said before, I think those pains and hurts are universal to a point, some common ground.

When I find common ground on an issue I get the best information and advice. Pertinent information can come from many sources, IMHO.

 

[SweetErika]

I understand that, but as I said, her experience wasn't anything that was massive ahead of the game.

Which is why I said, "I know you're past it, Ravin..." My comment wasn't aimed at you or your situation specifically, it was a general observation on a different perspective that some may find helpful in dealing with jealousy/insecurity/bad feelings over their partners having other partners. The main message is: I have had negative emotions over this in the past, and finding the positives in it has helped me deal with those emotions.

Not at this age, maybe at yours. (not a dig at age, just reality of it all) Maybe it deals with age, but as I have stated a few times, some guys (and girls) just do not like the thought of their other half with someone else. You can try and spin the positive, but in guy17's case, it's the negative that I feel is his issue, as was mine as well.

It sounds like you think I'm at least a decade or three older than I actually am. I was 20 just six years ago, and am still pretty in touch with the 16-25 age group.

And, again, my point is one can almost always turn something negative into a positive, or at least find some good in it to minimize the negative. It's not spin, it's a life skill that greatly increases overall peace and happiness as we go through life.

In this case, thinking of my other as more experienced would not help, because it was never about experience, it was about the thought of someone else having that moment with her. As I said, generally it's a younger concept.

Perhaps it wouldn't help you, but it just may help someone else. In fact, I KNOW it helps someone else because it helps me!

I hope you are not offended. This has just been one of my grips here, that we don't assess the problems based on person, but rather give them same answer to everything. Advice given a 40 year old may not work for a 20 year old.

Speak for yourself. You don't know if I, or anyone else here, gives advice based on the person's most likely context, and 'give them the same answer to everything' is a gross generalization. In fact, I do think about the OP's specific situation, and often ask for more details if I don't feel I have a good enough feel for it to give my opinion. The same goes for most of the regulars.

You made my point right there. My advice then was generally overshadowed. Find me a person who said "I listened to Ravin." The key words in that quote are "been there and done that". I have stated in this thread I have been through this situation. So let’s add this up.

1. Been in the situation
2. Am close to the age of the person involved (gives me better context)
3. Am aware of the reality of the now a days mental male at this age, because I am one.
<snip>Look at my list, and tell me why I am not capable to give guy proper advice, more suited towards his own needs? So far the only reason people have given me is "I'm not as experienced". Which sorry to say, is a cop-out for not having an answer.

I don't think anyone's saying you can't give good advice, though you seem to be saying only people who are in a similar situation can give good advice. And that 'you're not X, Y and Z, so your advice isn't really applicable' bugs me because it ignores the fact that others could have relevant and helpful experiences and perspectives.

We all should know the differences in the mental mind of a 20 year old now, then when a 40 year old was 20.

Yes, many of us do know the differences, and what's on the mind of a 20 year old now. Therefore, we can offer valid advice, even if we're not inexperienced 20 year old males.

Since you seem to be fond of examples, let's say you have a 20 year old child in 30 years. Your child asks you for advice because they're having trouble coping with the fact that their partner has had other partners. I'm willing to bet you will be able to give your kid solid advice because you have some experience with similar situations, at least a basic understanding of people, relationships and that age bracket.

It doesn't matter that you're an uncool, 50 year old dad - your advice can still be just as, if not more, helpful as that from someone your kid's age because you have the basics and a good amount of life experience.

Maybe your advice works for your kid, and maybe it doesn't, but you still put a valid perspective that could work out there.

Good advice usually has little to do with factors like age and gender, and a lot to do with things like experience, perspective and knowledge. Opposing viewpoints and varying solutions can work for the same person or situation, so just because people give different advice doesn't mean it's better or worse than anyone else's advice, or that they're invalidating that other advice.