How To Get To Heaven When You Die

[Tryharder62]

So the 613 mitzvot of scripture, all those rules and regulations and commandments, don't count? And all Yeshua's guidelines for living? Got it.

Yeshua told his followers to abandon their wealth and families and live communally. Those who don't aren't followers of Yeshua. Sad.

Of course they count! There is only one unpardonable sin, though. You do have to make a choice.
Why would you want to follow all His directions if you don't believe in Him. Why be ticked you aren't going to be with Him if you don't want to be. Once you believe the real work begins.

I made that choice but I don't put others down if they don't.

 

[Hypoxia]

Of course they count! There is only one unpardonable sin, though. You do have to make a choice.

The supposed biblical deity (actually a mashup of several prior gods) is lord of the Hebrews and any who wish to play a Xian game (with its polytheist trio). Other deities exist (sez so in the Decalogue) but worshippers must give Lord {JHWH} first cut of sacrifices. Nice racket.

The choice: Shall I follow a canon promoting genocide, infanticide, familial abuse, enslavement, and similar horseshit? I choose not to. I have standards.

 

[colddiesel]

The Christian God asks you to do one thing. Believe on what He did through Jesus so we can be free. That's it. Hell is just what it will be like without God. God invites us to be with him. If you don't want to be with him don't, but don't get all bent out of shape when what you ask for comes true.

If you don't believe in Hell that is your choice. That choice is what I believe a loving God gives all of us. If you don't want what Christ has to offer don't take it. Just get off your high horse and stop judging those who do and our God.

Try. Pay attention. It is not high horsemanship to point out that neither the Christians nor the Jews came up with the concept of hell. A final judgement, time in hell and the free will for men and women to make their own decisions were all drawn from Zoroastrianism.That is historical documented fact, not half baked belief.

Incidentally I think that the idea of an exclusively Christian god is utterly absurd. Any omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent God must be a god for all mankind whether or however they believe in him. To limit him to a minority group (christians)would limit him , and that is by definition impossible.

 

[colddiesel]

You are defying the evidence in favor of what you WISH were true. First you claim that the Bible doesn't say that there is a hell, then you say that the Bible does say that there is a hell. Which is it? There is plenty of evidence for Jesus and the resurrection. The bible clearly says there is a hell. I can give you the evidence, but it appears as though you don't want to be bothered with the facts.

I did not say the Bible did not mention hell - I said they pinched the idea from the Zoroastrians who had it 1000 years earlier.

And I think there is ample evidence that Jesus lived and was a great man, though much of his story in the Gospels are invented fairy tales. There is in my opinion zero credible evidence for the resurrection. It is a 2000 year old con job designed to subjugate the ignorant and naive 'believers'.

 

[Hypoxia]

and I think there is ample evidence that Jesus lived and was a great man, though much of his story in the Gospels are invented fairy tales. There is in my opinion zero credible evidence for the resurrection. It is a 2000 year old con job designed to subjugate the ignorant and naive 'believers'.

There's no corroboration of the existence of a prophet Yeshua, and his story and timeline don't match recorded history. Sad.

It's hard to have a Jesus of Nazareth when Nazareth wasn't known to exist
Nazarenes existed, followers of the Ist BCE mystic ben Nazara. It's impossible to fit the nativity with known events -- no forced census or manic Herodian infanticide, alas. It's all a plagiarized fairy tale, one of many myths of saviors who didn't pan-out.

Evidence should not matter to believers. At least they're not Scientologists.

 

[IG_88]

There's no corroboration of the existence of a prophet Yeshua, and his story and timeline don't match recorded history. Sad.

It's hard to have a Jesus of Nazareth when Nazareth wasn't known to exist
Nazarenes existed, followers of the Ist BCE mystic ben Nazara. It's impossible to fit the nativity with known events -- no forced census or manic Herodian infanticide, alas. It's all a plagiarized fairy tale, one of many myths of saviors who didn't pan-out.

Evidence should not matter to believers. At least they're not Scientologists.

Nazareth was around long before Jesus.

 

[Hypoxia]

Nazareth was around long before Jesus.

Funy, Josephus didn't mention it, even though he grew up in the village supposedly next door, and wrote of many surrounding villages, but no Naz. Empress whats-her-name, Constantine's mother, the Xian convert who convinced Conny to make her faith the official state religion of the fucking Roman Empire, went on a Holy Land tour, looking for Naz. Couldn't find it. So she picked a village and called it Naz. It's GOOD to be empress.

None of this should matter to you. Believe despite everything. Don't be weak.

 

[IG_88]

Funy, Josephus didn't mention it, even though he grew up in the village supposedly next door, and wrote of many surrounding villages, but no Naz. Empress whats-her-name, Constantine's mother, the Xian convert who convinced Conny to make her faith the official state religion of the fucking Roman Empire, went on a Holy Land tour, looking for Naz. Couldn't find it. So she picked a village and called it Naz. It's GOOD to be empress.

None of this should matter to you. Believe despite everything. Don't be weak.

Tons of little villages in those days, most unknown to all but the residents and some travellers. Archaeological evidence from the spot that goes back well before Jesus.
Just because it doesn't fit what the Bible says doesn't mean it didn't exist.
There wouldn't have been a synagogue for sure but the Bible says there was.
Things aren't black and white.

 

[Hypoxia]

Just because it doesn't fit what the Bible says doesn't mean it didn't exist.

Biblical texts are full of it-ain't-so and nonsense, so corroboration helps. No corroboration of Naz. Sad.

There wouldn't have been a synagogue for sure but the Bible says there was.
Things aren't black and white.

Xian gospel texts describe Naz as a city but say no more. But a city, not a hamlet, thus with civic conveniences and sway over the adjacent region. Cities are noted. Naz was not. Sad.

And right, reality isn't monochrome. That stuff about Yeshua being the adopted son of a 'carpenter', for instance. The word describing the cuckold Yusef better translates as 'builder', i.e. a contractor, quite middle-class. That would account for being able to afford shul for the divine bastard.

None of that clears up problems of the nativity timeline, the non-census, the non-infanticide, stuff gospels report that nobody else noticed.

BTW there is no "the bible," only varied piles of alleged biblical texts, none of which are canonical for all supposed Xians. Orthodoxoi, Roman Catholics, Assyrian and Ethiopian and Keralan congregations, Jehovah's Witnesses, Southern Baptists, Xian Identity racists, Mormons, all read rather different texts. Yow.

 

[IG_88]

Biblical texts are full of it-ain't-so and nonsense, so corroboration helps. No corroboration of Naz. Sad.

Xian gospel texts describe Naz as a city but say no more. But a city, not a hamlet, thus with civic conveniences and sway over the adjacent region. Cities are noted. Naz was not. Sad.

And right, reality isn't monochrome. That stuff about Yeshua being the adopted son of a 'carpenter', for instance. The word describing the cuckold Yusef better translates as 'builder', i.e. a contractor, quite middle-class. That would account for being able to afford shul for the divine bastard.

None of that clears up problems of the nativity timeline, the non-census, the non-infanticide, stuff gospels report that nobody else noticed.

BTW there is no "the bible," only varied piles of alleged biblical texts, none of which are canonical for all supposed Xians. Orthodoxoi, Roman Catholics, Assyrian and Ethiopian and Keralan congregations, Jehovah's Witnesses, Southern Baptists, Xian Identity racists, Mormons, all read rather different texts. Yow.

yeah on and on and on and on saying the exact same shit you always say. copy and paste posts and nothing to do with what was said.
You think you sound smart but you don't.
You're not even paying enough attention to tell that I'm not arguing for the Bible or what it says. You just spout off. Just like every other thread.
Fuck you're an insipid twat.

 

[phrodeau]

There are lots of insipid twats on both sides.

 

[Hypoxia]

Fuck you're an insipid twat.

But not an alt. And I don't believe ridiculous fantasies and horrendous doctrines. Your twatness may vary.

 

[Tryharder62]

Try. Pay attention. It is not high horsemanship to point out that neither the Christians nor the Jews came up with the concept of hell. A final judgement, time in hell and the free will for men and women to make their own decisions were all drawn from Zoroastrianism. That is historical documented fact, not half baked belief.

Incidentally I think that the idea of an exclusively Christian god is utterly absurd. Any omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent God must be a god for all mankind whether or however they believe in him. To limit him to a minority group (christians)would limit him , and that is by definition impossible.

We have to establish what Zoroaster actually taught (as opposed to what modern Zoroastrianism claims he taught). The only source for Zoroaster's teachings is the Avesta, and the oldest copies we have of the Avesta date from the 13th century AD. The late date for this collection of writings lends no support whatsoever to the idea that Christians borrowed from Zoroastrianism (the oldest copies of the Jewish Scriptures that we have today date centuries before Christ, and the oldest complete manuscripts of the Christian Scriptures we have date from the 4th century AD).

Historical documented fact.....look at the evidence.

You are right that God is a God for all mankind. He just doesn't force it down our throat. That kind of love is no love at all if it is forced.

All are welcome!

 

[Tryharder62]

Funy, Josephus didn't mention it, even though he grew up in the village supposedly next door, and wrote of many surrounding villages, but no Naz. Empress whats-her-name, Constantine's mother, the Xian convert who convinced Conny to make her faith the official state religion of the fucking Roman Empire, went on a Holy Land tour, looking for Naz. Couldn't find it. So she picked a village and called it Naz. It's GOOD to be empress.

None of this should matter to you. Believe despite everything. Don't be weak.

So what if Josephus didn't mention it? Chief Blackhawk is well noted in my area. During the War of 1812, Black Hawk had fought on the side of the British against the U.S., hoping to push white American settlers away from Sauk territory. Later he led a band of Sauk and Fox warriors, known as the British Band, against European-American settlers in Illinois and present-day Wisconsin in the 1832 Black Hawk War. After the war, he was captured by U.S. forces and taken to the eastern U.S.

It is funny no where in all the documents on Blackhawk is my town mentioned- even though other nearby towns were mentioned. The thing is my town had nothing to do with what happened. Josephus wrote a lot about the Jewish revolt and history surrounding that time period. I think Nazereth meant nothing to what history he was trying to record.

As to Helena, the only thing she proved was that Nazereth did not exist 326 years AD. She can claim another place as Nazetheth, but it doesn't change where Jesus was born 326 years earlier. Going back to my little town that is dying. Someone in the future may come here looking for my town and not find it. It doesn't change the fact that I am here now.

 

[ishtat]

We have to establish what Zoroaster actually taught (as opposed to what modern Zoroastrianism claims he taught). The only source for Zoroaster's teachings is the Avesta, and the oldest copies we have of the Avesta date from the 13th century AD. The late date for this collection of writings lends no support whatsoever to the idea that Christians borrowed from Zoroastrianism (the oldest copies of the Jewish Scriptures that we have today date centuries before Christ, and the oldest complete manuscripts of the Christian Scriptures we have date from the 4th century AD).

Historical documented fact.....look at the evidence.

You are right that God is a God for all mankind. He just doesn't force it down our throat. That kind of love is no love at all if it is forced.

All are welcome!

You do not say where you got that quotation from Tryharder but it is woefully slanted. Cold diesel's comments about the origin of a final judgement ( at the Chinvit bridge) are accurate and he is also correct that the priest Zoroaster was the first to enunciate the concept of free will. The argument you quoted rests on the age of the oldest extant document of the Avesta (ignoring the Gathas of course) However these documents were written in the Avestan language which had ceased to be a spoken language by about 1000 BC. It can be shown that by comparing Avestan with similar languages such as Old Persian and its Indo Aryan contempories that the latest period they could have been composed was between 1200 and 950 BC.

Christianity very clearly has an almost identical ethical base to Zoroastrianism and it came into Christianity via the Jews most probably when their leadership was exiled in Babylon between 589 BC and 539 BC. The Jewish concept of the Golden Rule (do unto others as you wish them to do to you) is parallel by the Zoroastrian idea that every man and woman must pursue and be accountable for their " Good thoughts, Good Words and Good Deeds.

In Babylon the Jewish leadership experienced a highly successful monotheistic Zoroastrian State. It is hardly surprising that when they returned to their homeland Ezra and Nehemiah took the best of what they had experienced and insisted after centuries of vacillation on an uncompromising Jewish monotheism. That was the tradition that Christianity became heir to.

Incidentally the earliest complete Masoretic (Jewish text) is only from the 9th century AD though comparison with the Book of Isiaiah found at the Dead Sea (200BC ) shows That their scribes were remarkably accurate. Conversely although the earliest Christian texts such as Codex Vaticanus can be dated to the late 4th century there are many earlier and substantial papyri which differ significantly from the later accepted text. Unfortunately many earliy scribes and churchmen did not hesitate to alter ( the New Testament in particular) to suit their own point of view.

Arguments about the historicity of texts can go on forever but it may be more beneficial to recognise that all faiths learned from their predecessors. I don't know how familiar you are with the Koran but the influence of Jesus as a prophet is clearly influential there as is his mother Mary as a feminine ideal.

 

[xfrodobagginsx]

Of course they count! There is only one unpardonable sin, though. You do have to make a choice.
Why would you want to follow all His directions if you don't believe in Him. Why be ticked you aren't going to be with Him if you don't want to be. Once you believe the real work begins.

I made that choice but I don't put others down if they don't.

Not placing your Faith in Christ for salvation, and not believing that He died and rose again for your sins is the unpardonable sin. Rejecting the Holy Spirit.

 

[HAL_9000]

Rejecting the Holy Spirit.

After a half bottle of gin, I read this as "Spitting on the Holy Reject".

 

[Tryharder62]

You do not say where you got that quotation from Tryharder but it is woefully slanted.

I think this area of study is interesting. I am no expert, but the documentation for Zoroastrianism seems flimsy but it is never questioned.

The oldest Zoroastrian scriptures are referred to as the Avesta or Zend Avesta . The Avesta contains the sacred texts in the Avestan language, whereas the Zend refers to their translations and explanations in Pahlavi. The Avestan language was probably spoken from the second millennium until the first half of the first millennium BC, but the Avestan scriptures, unlike the Old Testament and the Qur'an, were transmitted orally. They were finally written down many centuries later in late Sasanian times, when the oral tradition could no longer be completely relied upon. Zoroastrian treatises continued to be written in Pahlavi until the ninth and tenth centuries AD, but it is clear that by then the priests who wrote them had only a partial understanding of the Avestan texts. Much material has been lost and it is possible that only about a quarter of the Avesta of the ninth century survives today.


http://www.bl.uk/onlinegallery/sacredtexts/videvdad.html

Not placing your Faith in Christ for salvation, and not believing that He died and rose again for your sins is the unpardonable sin. Rejecting the Holy Spirit.

YES!

After a half bottle of gin, I read this as "Spitting on the Holy Reject".

Drunk reading of this thread could be dangerous. You might start worshiping me as a Goddess......why are you laughing?....it could happen!!!!!

 

[xfrodobagginsx]

Satanist Turned Christian Evangelist: Prayers blocked me from committing evil

Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2018/06/satanist-prayers-blocked-me-from-committing-evil/#eDUYpy4xjDwDsdcZ.99

 

[BoyNextDoor]

Satanist Turned Christian Evangelist: Prayers blocked me from committing evil

Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2018/06/satanist-prayers-blocked-me-from-committing-evil/#eDUYpy4xjDwDsdcZ.99

Happy with the results of your poll?

 

[Hypoxia]

Happy with the results of your poll?

Online polling is notoriously inaccurate. Door-to-dooring is marginally better. Just figure that everyone is lying and you won't be far off.

Graffiti I observed:

JESUS LIVES IN MY HEART!

Underneath:

WATCH OUT! IF HE GETS STUCK IN AN ARTERY, YOU'LL DIE!

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

Online polling is notoriously inaccurate. Door-to-dooring is marginally better. Just figure that everyone is lying and you won't be far off.

Graffiti I observed:

JESUS LIVES IN MY HEART!

Underneath:

WATCH OUT! IF HE GETS STUCK IN AN ARTERY, YOU'LL DIE!

ROTFLMAO.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

There's no corroboration of the existence of a prophet Yeshua, and his story and timeline don't match recorded history. Sad.

It's hard to have a Jesus of Nazareth when Nazareth wasn't known to exist
Nazarenes existed, followers of the Ist BCE mystic ben Nazara. It's impossible to fit the nativity with known events -- no forced census or manic Herodian infanticide, alas. It's all a plagiarized fairy tale, one of many myths of saviors who didn't pan-out.

Evidence should not matter to believers. At least they're not Scientologists.

Are you familiar with Richard Carrier? He is a strong proponent of the "Jesus Never Existed" idea and presents some solid circumstantial evidence to support his theory. To him, Jesus was a made-up celestial being that was then placed by human legend and tradition into a historical context and given a rather unprovable genealogy.

 

[phrodeau]

Satanist Turned Christian Evangelist: Prayers blocked me from committing evil

Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2018/06/satanist-prayers-blocked-me-from-committing-evil/#eDUYpy4xjDwDsdcZ.99

WND is one of the least Christian websites there is.

 

[HAL_9000]

Drunk reading of this thread could be dangerous. You might start worshiping me as a Goddess......why are you laughing?....it could happen!!!!!

Homina..homina...all hail queen TH...