How do Tea Partiers feel about the War on Terror and economic globalization?

KingOrfeo

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Several fissures in the American conservative movement have become apparent in the past decade. One is between warhawkish neoconservatives, and isolationist paleoconservatives. The latter has been most clearly represented by Pat Buchanan and his America First Party (formed out of the right wing of the defunct Reform Party) and his magazine The American Conservative. As sometimes remarked in that magazine's pages, the paleocons have found some common ground with the left, at least to the extent that they want U.S. troops out of the Middle East, and they don't want the U.S. sticking its neck out for Israel. The paleocons also economic isolationists/protectionists where the neocons are (like the neoliberals) economic globalizers; and Main Street populists where the neocons are Wall Street elitists; and strictly anti-immigration (for reasons both economic and racial/cultural), where the neocons seem sympathetic to corporate America's need for cheap immigrant labor. Throughout the Bush years, Buchanan and the paleocons were the most important dissenting voice on the right. (There is also the Constitution Party, which seems very similar to the America First Party in ideology, the difference being emphasis -- the Constitution Party is much heavier on social-religious conservatism. Including, I think, support for Israel on "Christian Zionist" principles, which might or might not be enough to keep it from ever merging with America First.)

Now, since Obama took office, the Tea Party movement has emerged as a far more important -- at any rate, far more visible and vocal -- dissenting locus of the right. They challenge the GOP establishment. They do seem to come from the same demographic/cultural base as Buchanan's paleocons. Their rhetoric is mostly based on smaller-goverment economic libertarianism and old-fashioned decentralism -- that is, they want the federal government, at any rate, drastically reduced in size and functions and cost. But, I haven't heard them say much at all about foreign or military policy. Nor immigration. Nor globalization. Nor the Wall Street/Main Street divide.

So: How do the Tea Partiers feel about these issues? Is there any consensus in the movement? Are they an ideologically different conservative movement than Buchanan's paleocons, or are they just emphasizing different elements from the same general worldview? How does Buchanan feel about them (I've never heard him comment)?
 
Also, does the Tea Party have any actual stated positions on gun rights, abortion, gay marriage, DADT, school prayer, creationism, etc.?
 
I just discovered American Conservative about a month ago. I love it. Especially Eunomia.

I've always had a bit of a soft spot for old Pat Buchanan.
 
Also, does the Tea Party have any actual stated positions on gun rights, abortion, gay marriage, DADT, school prayer, creationism, etc.?

I don't think there's any centralized Tea Party organization to promulgate views, but I wouldn't be surprised to hear that most baggers were pro-gun, anti-abortion, anti-gay marriage, anti-DADT etc.
 
I don't think there's any centralized Tea Party organization to promulgate views, but I wouldn't be surprised to hear that most baggers were pro-gun, anti-abortion, anti-gay marriage, anti-DADT etc.

Well, there is the 10-point "Contract from America" --

The Contract from America was the idea of Houston-based lawyer, Ryan Hecker. Hecker stated that he developed the concept of creating a grassroots call for reform prior to the April 15, 2009 Tax Day Tea Party rallies. To get his idea off the ground, he launched a website, "ContractFromAmerica.com," which encouraged people to offer possible planks for the contract.

Hecker told The New York Times, "Hundreds of thousands of people voted for their favorite principles online to create the Contract as an open-sourced platform for the Tea Party movement. The agenda had the imprint of everyday citizens every step of the way (in the online voting process.)" Based on the Contract with America authored by Newt Gingrich and Dick Armey, Hecker said the Republicans’ 1994 Contract with America represented the nation’s last intellectual economic conservative movement, but the new list, he said, was “created from the bottom up. It was not crafted in Washington with the help of pollsters." [66]

From the original 1,000 ideas which were submitted, Hecker reduced it to about 50 based on popularity. He then narrowed that list down to 10 items with the help of former House Republican Leader Dick Armey, whose conservative group, FreedomWorks, has established close ties with many Tea Party activists around the country.[67]

Ideas to be included in the contract were proposed and debated on a website designed for that purpose and the resulting statements were voted on online, with 454,331 votes being cast. The resulting document including the vote percentages for the statements included was posted online on April 12, 2010.[68]

The Contract lists 10 agenda items that it encourages congressional candidates to follow:[69][70]

1. Identify constitutionality of every new law: Require each bill to identify the specific provision of the Constitution that gives Congress the power to do what the bill does. (82.03%)

2. Reject emissions trading: Stop the "cap and trade" administrative approach used to control carbon dioxide emissions by providing economic incentives for achieving reductions in the emissions of carbon dioxide. (72.20%)

3. Demand a balanced federal budget: Begin the Constitutional amendment process to require a balanced budget with a two-thirds majority needed for any tax modification. (69.69%)

4. Simplify the tax system: Adopt a simple and fair single-rate tax system by scrapping the internal revenue code and replacing it with one that is no longer than 4,543 words – the length of the original Constitution. (64.9%)

5. Audit federal government agencies for constitutionality: Create a Blue Ribbon taskforce that engages in an audit of federal agencies and programs, assessing their Constitutionality, and identifying duplication, waste, ineffectiveness, and agencies and programs better left for the states or local authorities. (63.37%)

6. Limit annual growth in federal spending: Impose a statutory cap limiting the annual growth in total federal spending to the sum of the inflation rate plus the percentage of population growth. (56.57%)

7. Repeal the health care legislation passed on March 23, 2010: Defund, repeal and replace the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act. (56.39%)

8. Pass an 'All-of-the-Above' Energy Policy: Authorize the exploration of additional energy reserves to reduce American dependence on foreign energy sources and reduce regulatory barriers to all other forms of energy creation. (55.5%)

9. Reduce Earmarks: Place a moratorium on all earmarks until the budget is balanced, and then require a 2/3 majority to pass any earmark. (55.47%)

10. Reduce Taxes: Permanently repeal all recent tax increases, and extend current temporary reductions in income tax, capital gains tax and estate taxes, currently scheduled to end in 2011. (53.38%)

No Democrats have signed onto the proposal, and the contract has also met resistance from some Republicans who have instead created the "Commitment to America." Brendan Buck, a spokesman for that agenda explained that the contract is too narrow in focus, and not exactly what the Republican party would include in its own top-10 list of priorities.[71]

-- all very ridiculous and simplistic, IMO, but the focus is clear: Every plank in it is about smaller government, decentralization, deregulation, defunding. Nothing about social/moral issues. I agree, I perceive that they're always there, unmentioned, and that the opinions are mostly what you say. Though Karen Kraft expressed serious dissent on that point in this thread. In her view, the Tea Party is purely a grass-roots populist antigovernment movement. Which, I agree, it is, not in whole but in part. OTOH, the LW antigovernment types, such as (some wings of) the Greens, left-Libertarians, Anarchists, etc., don't seem to want anything to do with it; and they should want to be involved in any purely antigovernment movement.

But the really interesting question is whether the Tea Party is divided or united on foreign-policy issues, military issues, trade issues, etc., which they never seem to talk about, but which anybody they get into Congress is going to have to deal with.
 
Oreo, you really, really need to get a life...putting up identical posts on multiple websites....tsk., tsk, tsk.

Dipshit

http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=12943381


Old Today, 10:32 AM
BrainGlutton BrainGlutton is online now
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Join Date: Mar 2003
How do Tea Partiers feel about the War on Terror, immigration, and economic globalization?
Several fissures in the American conservative movement have become apparent in the past decade. One is between warhawkish neoconservatives, and isolationist paleoconservatives. The latter has been most clearly represented by Pat Buchanan and his America First Party (formed out of the right wing of the defunct Reform Party) and his magazine The American Conservative. As sometimes remarked in that magazine's pages, the paleocons have found some common ground with the left, at least to the extent that they want U.S. troops out of the Middle East, and they don't want the U.S. sticking its neck out for Israel. The paleocons also economic isolationists/protectionists where the neocons are (like the neoliberals) economic globalizers; and Main Street populists where the neocons are Wall Street elitists; and strictly anti-immigration (for reasons both economic and racial/cultural), where the neocons seem sympathetic to corporate America's need for cheap immigrant labor. Throughout the Bush years, Buchanan and the paleocons were the most important dissenting voice on the right. (There is also the Constitution Party, which seems very similar to the America First Party in ideology, the difference being emphasis -- the Constitution Party is much heavier on social-religious conservatism. Including, I think, support for Israel on "Christian Zionist" principles, which might or might not be enough to keep it from ever merging with America First.)

Now, since Obama took office, the Tea Party movement has emerged as a far more important -- at any rate, far more visible and vocal -- dissenting locus of the right. They challenge the GOP establishment. They do seem to come from the same demographic/cultural base as Buchanan's paleocons. Their rhetoric is mostly based on smaller-goverment economic libertarianism and old-fashioned decentralism -- that is, they want the federal government, at any rate, drastically reduced in size and functions and cost. But, I haven't heard them say much at all about foreign or military policy. Nor immigration. Nor globalization. Nor the Wall Street/Main Street divide.

So: How do the Tea Partiers feel about these issues? Is there any consensus in the movement? Are they an ideologically different conservative movement than Buchanan's paleocons, or are they just emphasizing different elements from the same general worldview? How does Buchanan feel about them (I've never heard him comment)?
Reply With Quote
 
From where I sit it seems to me the Tea Party is focused on replacing GOP and Democrat pols invested in the status quo of big government-ruinous spending. The other stuff isnt relevant until the pols are changed.
 
Oreo, you really, really need to get a life...putting up identical posts on multiple websites....tsk., tsk, tsk.

Dipshit

http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=12943381


Old Today, 10:32 AM
BrainGlutton BrainGlutton is online now
Guest

Join Date: Mar 2003
How do Tea Partiers feel about the War on Terror, immigration, and economic globalization?
Several fissures in the American conservative movement have become apparent in the past decade. One is between warhawkish neoconservatives, and isolationist paleoconservatives. The latter has been most clearly represented by Pat Buchanan and his America First Party (formed out of the right wing of the defunct Reform Party) and his magazine The American Conservative. As sometimes remarked in that magazine's pages, the paleocons have found some common ground with the left, at least to the extent that they want U.S. troops out of the Middle East, and they don't want the U.S. sticking its neck out for Israel. The paleocons also economic isolationists/protectionists where the neocons are (like the neoliberals) economic globalizers; and Main Street populists where the neocons are Wall Street elitists; and strictly anti-immigration (for reasons both economic and racial/cultural), where the neocons seem sympathetic to corporate America's need for cheap immigrant labor. Throughout the Bush years, Buchanan and the paleocons were the most important dissenting voice on the right. (There is also the Constitution Party, which seems very similar to the America First Party in ideology, the difference being emphasis -- the Constitution Party is much heavier on social-religious conservatism. Including, I think, support for Israel on "Christian Zionist" principles, which might or might not be enough to keep it from ever merging with America First.)

Now, since Obama took office, the Tea Party movement has emerged as a far more important -- at any rate, far more visible and vocal -- dissenting locus of the right. They challenge the GOP establishment. They do seem to come from the same demographic/cultural base as Buchanan's paleocons. Their rhetoric is mostly based on smaller-goverment economic libertarianism and old-fashioned decentralism -- that is, they want the federal government, at any rate, drastically reduced in size and functions and cost. But, I haven't heard them say much at all about foreign or military policy. Nor immigration. Nor globalization. Nor the Wall Street/Main Street divide.

So: How do the Tea Partiers feel about these issues? Is there any consensus in the movement? Are they an ideologically different conservative movement than Buchanan's paleocons, or are they just emphasizing different elements from the same general worldview? How does Buchanan feel about them (I've never heard him comment)?
Reply With Quote

See also "The Tea Party movement's overall effect on the 2010 midterms." But think carefully before posting. The intellectual standards are higher on the SDMB. miles wouldn't last a week. :cool:
 
Also, does the Tea Party have any actual stated positions on gun rights, abortion, gay marriage, DADT, school prayer, creationism, etc.?

There is no stated position on these things because the billionaires who are funding and manipulating this whole movement couldn't give a flying fuck about this stuff. They don't care about foreign policy either which is why there is no stated position on that too. Ok, they will come up with something now because they must, but they don't care. The only thing that matters is dismantling any and all government programs/agencies etc that cost these guys money. This movement is meant to ensure that these Top 1% corporate overlords and all of their progeny essentially rule this country forever. How people could so blatantly vote against their own interest, I will never understand. Well, I know its stupidity...
 
There is no stated position on these things because the billionaires who are funding and manipulating this whole movement couldn't give a flying fuck about this stuff. They don't care about foreign policy either which is why there is no stated position on that too. Ok, they will come up with something now because they must, but they don't care. The only thing that matters is dismantling any and all government programs/agencies etc that cost these guys money. This movement is meant to ensure that these Top 1% corporate overlords and all of their progeny essentially rule this country forever. How people could so blatantly vote against their own interest, I will never understand. Well, I know its stupidity...

You could not be more wrong.
 
That "contract" is just about the most naive thing I've seen in a long time.
There are some fine points in there but it's just not gonna happen.
 
That "contract" is just about the most naive thing I've seen in a long time.
There are some fine points in there but it's just not gonna happen.

Maybe the Contract With America should be finished before starting a new one.
 
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I don't think there's any centralized Tea Party organization to promulgate views, but I wouldn't be surprised to hear that most baggers were pro-gun, anti-abortion, anti-gay marriage, anti-DADT etc.

The fact of the matter is the Left cannot get a handle on what the Tea Party is, it is outside of their apparent ability to comprehend, so they begin making assumptions about what it MUST be. It MUST be seeking to control the power of government and use it against "me."

It is simply, and no more, no less, a movement focused on the idea that the Federal Government has arrogantly gone beyond the bounds of the Constitution, which it thinks it can do with impunity and without consequence. In this attitude it garners the support of many people and may schools of thought who have nothing at all in common other than the vague feeling that Washington DC needs to be taken down a peg or two (or three).

The Tea Party's simple and direct goal, reduce the powers and scope of the Federal Government and as such, it is a clear and present danger to the National Leadership of both parties who love bathing in the river of political power and controlling the actions of the "little people..."
 
The Tea Party is the Liddy and Limbaugh movement - nothing more.

One felon, one drug addict - a good start for a philosophy of governing a nation of 300 million.
 
From its inception in February 2009, the Tea Party movement has focused on three core values: (1) constitutionally limited government, (2) free markets, and (3) fiscal responsibility. These core values emerged quickly during the dramatic two-month period in early 2009 when the movement first exploded on the scene. As if from nowhere, Rick Santelli's rant on February 19, 2009 started an unlikely chain of events that brought one million Americans -- many first-time activists -- to nine hundred "Tax Day Tea Parties" around the country on April 15, 2009.

The Tea Party movement has rejected the discussion of social issues as an unwanted distraction that will hurt the movement's ability to accomplish its constitutional and fiscal objectives. I know this because I helped start the movement, and I have participated in hundreds of conferences calls where this position has been deliberated and confirmed -- both publicly and privately -- innumerable times.

Tea party activists, whether they govern their private lives by faith in God or by a purely secular morality, are united in their concern about the loss of individual rights stemming from our corrupted Constitution and our corrupt system of representation. They are dedicated to restoring the purity of our original constitutional system in order to pass on the republic intact to the next generation of Americans.

The social issues that motivated the Moral Majority in the 1970s and 1980s, and the Christian Coalition in the 1990s, are considered secondary to the preservation of the republic. The common attitude among tea party activists is that we should save the republic first, and then let traditionalists and non-traditionalists duke it out over the social issues as they see fit within the confines of the saved republic.

As Grover Norquist pointed out in his 2008 book Leave Us Alone, and as Scott Rasmussen has tracked in his polling, there are two competing ideologies of 21st-century America. The first ideology is held by the majority of mainstream Americans, who support the free-market individualism of the Tea Party movement. The second ideology is the collectivist-statist-redistributive approach supported by a minority of Americans and championed by the Democratic Party, the mainstream media, and almost all of academia.

Intellectually dishonest academics and left-wing propagandists in the news media continually paint a false picture of our movement, solely for the purpose of advancing their own failed ideology.

Michael Patrick Leahy

http://www.americanthinker.com/2010/06/bruce_bartletts_intellectually.html
 
Most other positions will fall logically from this foundation, but there will be differences between individuals.
 
I don't think there's any centralized Tea Party organization to promulgate views, but I wouldn't be surprised to hear that most baggers were pro-gun, anti-abortion, anti-gay marriage, anti-DADT etc.
"We are all Koch."

"Uh, isn't that Kosh?"

"No, we are all Koch."
 
The fact of the matter is the Left cannot get a handle on what the Tea Party is, it is outside of their apparent ability to comprehend, so they begin making assumptions about what it MUST be. It MUST be seeking to control the power of government and use it against "me."

It is simply, and no more, no less, a movement focused on the idea that the Federal Government has arrogantly gone beyond the bounds of the Constitution, which it thinks it can do with impunity and without consequence. In this attitude it garners the support of many people and may schools of thought who have nothing at all in common other than the vague feeling that Washington DC needs to be taken down a peg or two (or three).

The Tea Party's simple and direct goal, reduce the powers and scope of the Federal Government and as such, it is a clear and present danger to the National Leadership of both parties who love bathing in the river of political power and controlling the actions of the "little people..."

Soooooo? How does all that relate to the GWOT and economic globalization and all the rest of it?

Are Tea Partiers pro-GWOT for the sake of security and patriotism, or anti-GWOT because a massive military establishment is the most expensive and potentially power-abusive federal program imaginable?

Are they trade-protectionist for the sake of economic nationalism and ourjobs, or are they trade-libertarian because any trade policy is an exercise of federal power?

Are they anti-immigration for the reasons given above, or pro-open-borders because open borders are a form of liberty?

Those are all pressing issues which Tea Party candidates will have to deal with, one way or another, if they get into Congress, and deal with them first, before they can get around to dismantling the federal bureaucracy and abolishing the IRS.
 
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